300 PRC update

[jmornoinf]

Need advice FL sizing 300 PRC Lapua Brass. Failure with two separate Redding FL Type-S dies. Can someone help me find a 300PRC FL bushing die that works? I am not going to by a third Redding die. I can't be the only one having FL resizing issue with this caliber? I hope to get more than four firings out of this expensive brass.

My story so far....
I initially mandreled/NS virgin Lapua brass following by 4x firings NS only w/no annealing. Upon the fifth firing I started to have a heavy bolt lift on opening and closing + my groups opened up...from .200 to up to an inch. The base of the brass expanded too much.

I had a buddy anneal the brass and I attempted to FL size with no luck. I got several pieces of brass stuck using imperial(with multiple seating attempts + reapplying lube). I did managed to size a couple of pieces only to cause other damage like a sharp edge formed between the bottom of the shoulder and body.

 

[LongRangeAggie]

Need advice FL sizing 300 PRC Lapua Brass. Failure with two separate Redding FL Type-S dies. Can someone help me find a 300PRC FL bushing die that works? I am not going to by a third Redding die. I can't be the only one having FL resizing issue with this caliber? I hope to get more than four firings out of this expensive brass.

My story so far....
I initially mandreled/NS virgin Lapua brass following by 4x firings NS only w/no annealing. Upon the fifth firing I started to have a heavy bolt lift on opening and closing + my groups opened up...from .200 to up to an inch. The base of the brass expanded too much.

I had a buddy anneal the brass and I attempted to FL size with no luck. I got several pieces of brass stuck using imperial(with multiple seating attempts + reapplying lube). I did managed to size a couple of pieces only to cause other damage like a sharp edge formed between the bottom of the shoulder and body.

You aren't the only one... https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/the-prc-die-problem.253223/page-18

I had the same issue and went ahead and fixed it by rechambering to Alex Wheeler's AW2 chamber. The SAMMI chamber is tight (especially with ADG and Lapua brass).

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

you might have to get custom dies made.

I've had no problems with Xcaliber barrel and Hornady dies.

 

[BCX]

300 PRC AW2 reamer will fix your brass issue as stated above... Always ck w your smith and make sure he or she is using the AW2 reamer.

 

[b2lee]

Need advice FL sizing 300 PRC Lapua Brass. Failure with two separate Redding FL Type-S dies. Can someone help me find a 300PRC FL bushing die that works? I am not going to by a third Redding die. I can't be the only one having FL resizing issue with this caliber? I hope to get more than four firings out of this expensive brass.

My story so far....
I initially mandreled/NS virgin Lapua brass following by 4x firings NS only w/no annealing. Upon the fifth firing I started to have a heavy bolt lift on opening and closing + my groups opened up...from .200 to up to an inch. The base of the brass expanded too much.

I had a buddy anneal the brass and I attempted to FL size with no luck. I got several pieces of brass stuck using imperial(with multiple seating attempts + reapplying lube). I did managed to size a couple of pieces only to cause other damage like a sharp edge formed between the bottom of the shoulder and body.

LE Wilson Bushing die....once you go with LE Wilson...you may never buy another brand of dies ever again.

 

[hafejd30]

Just tuning back in to the 300 PRC reamer issues.

How’s the barrels on the AXMC/ASR (Bartlein win tacs) usually stack up?

 

[nick338]

LE Wilson Bushing die....once you go with LE Wilson...you may never buy another brand of dies ever again.

What sets the LE Wilson dies apart? I have been using the Forster custom honed FL die and was just about to order one for a 300 PRC but I'm considering a bushing die to be able to try different neck tension.

 

[b2lee]

What sets the LE Wilson dies apart? I have been using the Forster custom honed FL die and was just about to order one for a 300 PRC but I'm considering a bushing die to be able to try different neck tension.

If you are a machinist or spent any time making parts....when you hold an LE Wilson die in your hand you will see the quality versus other dies. Every company can accidently make a die that isn't truly centered...but LE Wilson has a much lower odds of doing that.

When you go LE Wilson FL bushing die...also remember to pick up a Sinclair or 21st Century mandrel die body and size appropriate mandrel. Sizing balls shouldn't be used in any brass where precision is the end goal.

I can't articulate what you can actually see and feel when you hold that LE Wilson die in your hand versus other brands. Just buy one...and you'll start converting over all other cartridges that you load for.

 

[nick338]

If you are a machinist or spent any time making parts....when you hold an LE Wilson die in your hand you will see the quality versus other dies. Every company can accidently make a die that isn't truly centered...but LE Wilson has a much lower odds of doing that.

When you go LE Wilson FL bushing die...also remember to pick up a Sinclair or 21st Century mandrel die body and size appropriate mandrel. Sizing balls shouldn't be used in any brass where precision is the end goal.

I can't articulate what you can actually see and feel when you hold that LE Wilson die in your hand versus other brands. Just buy one...and you'll start converting over all other cartridges that you load for.

I already have the mandrel and die body for use on new brass but are you saying you run the case neck of a fired case through the mandrel first and then size with the LE Wilson?

 

[Taylorbok]

I already have the mandrel and die body for use on new brass but are you saying you run the case neck of a fired case through the mandrel first and then size with the LE Wilson?

no, size the neck down with bushing die but then use an expander mandrel to set final ID and uniform the mouth. I use a bushing that leaves me .003"under bullet diameter and then a mandrel that is .002"under

 

[nick338]

no, size the neck down with bushing die but then use an expander mandrel to set final ID and uniform the mouth. I use a bushing that leaves me .003"under bullet diameter and then a mandrel that is .002"under.

Ok I just didn't know if people were using the mandrel in place of the expander ball because the LE Wilson die does not have one. I've noticed some people use the mandrel first and then the bushing to set tension and others use the bushing first and then a pass through with a mandrel that barely feels like it's passing through the neck to uniform the ID.

 

[Taylorbok]

Ya most people loading for accuracy have removed expander balls and gone to mandrels. It's supposed to be more consistent and help with concentricity. I've never measured but it did help with accuracy. I can't say I have heard anyone use a mandrel before bushing.

 

[TripleBull]

Just tuning back in to the 300 PRC reamer issues.

How’s the barrels on the AXMC/ASR (Bartlein win tacs) usually stack up?

I've bought two Bartlein barrels for my AX/MC and they have been excellent, came up to speed quickly, were easy to optimize the handloads, etc. I bought them through Mile High and had them do the chambering. Both 30". I'm getting about 3050 fps with the 230 ATips and N568. Factory 225 ELDMs ran around 3000 fps and shot great out to 2400 yards. Handloads were better, for sure.

I've tried a range of dies and use the full length bushing dies of Redding and LE Wilson, then a 21st Century mandrel die and a LE Wilson arbor seating die. I had to change my approach to finding brass, primers, powder and bullets, but my inventory grew over the last 3 years in spite of Covid. All I had to do was spend more time and effort and in some cases, dollars. I found that by driving around to small towns in CO, WY and NM, I could find quality supplies and met many gun store owners and patrons along the way. Plus I worked harder to find online sources that had the stuff in stock. All the work made the plandemic go by faster. I couldn't just sit at home all that time.

 

[hafejd30]

I've bought two Bartlein barrels for my AX/MC and they have been excellent, came up to speed quickly, were easy to optimize the handloads, etc. I bought them through Mile High and had them do the chambering. Both 30". I'm getting about 3050 fps with the 230 ATips and N568. Factory 225 ELDMs ran around 3000 fps and shot great out to 2400 yards. Handloads were better, for sure.

I've tried a range of dies and use the full length bushing dies of Redding and LE Wilson, then a 21st Century mandrel die and a LE Wilson arbor seating die. I had to change my approach to finding brass, primers, powder and bullets, but my inventory grew over the last 3 years in spite of Covid. All I had to do was spend more time and effort and in some cases, dollars. I found that by driving around to small towns in CO, WY and NM, I could find quality supplies and met many gun store owners and patrons along the way. Plus I worked harder to find online sources that had the stuff in stock. All the work made the plandemic go by faster. I couldn't just sit at home all that time.

Thank you

Planning to use Redding type S FL with .003 under bushing. Then 21st century turning (.002) mandrel. Redding comp seater

 

[Jefe~]

A little background. I had decided a while back to do to 300PRC build, but I would not commit to a build\purchase until I had all the components to load for it. Fast forward to this past weekend and I managed to score 8lbs of Retumbo at a local show. My intent is to push 230 Bergers or maybe some A-Tips. Does anyone foresee any issues with using Retumbo here or should I look for a different powder? I am new to 300 PRC but not handloading. Any and all input is welcome. Thanks -

 

[b2lee]

Retumbo will work...but not the best in any barrel I've had...or my friends have. I run RL-26....if under 28" then try H1000.... N565/568 is my back up powder.

 

[Jefe~]

Retumbo will work...but not the best in any barrel I've had...or my friends have. I run RL-26....if under 28" then try H1000.... N565/568 is my back up powder.

Many Thanks! I will start looking for RL-26/H1000 Anyone want to trade powders?

 

[Pete Cefalu]

Retumbo will work...but not the best in any barrel I've had...or my friends have. I run RL-26....if under 28" then try H1000.... N565/568 is my back up powder.

Hi b2lee, I'd love to know your background, as you seem to be one of the more logical/ sensible members I trust in this forum.
I too just put a 300PRC build(conversion) into action with a 30" M24 Bartlien bbl.
I have every powder except 7997 available for this case and the 250 A-tips.
I started with the Hornady 11th edition load data chart and charged a case with each listed MV for their 24" bbl.
I chrono'd them and have a consistent average of 65fps additional velocity using the 7828ssc.
I expected a min. of 100fps gain. I do live in S. Fla. at sea level and temps have cooled off (some) to 85F.
My goal is to stay supersonic out to 2K with this 7.5 gain twist bbl. without signs of overpressure on the Lapua brass.
Any advise or consideration is appreciated.

 

[b2lee]

Hi b2lee, I'd love to know your background, as you seem to be one of the more logical/ sensible members I trust in this forum.
I too just put a 300PRC build(conversion) into action with a 30" M24 Bartlien bbl.
I have every powder except 7997 available for this case and the 250 A-tips.
I started with the Hornady 11th edition load data chart and charged a case with each listed MV for their 24" bbl.
I chrono'd them and have a consistent average of 65fps additional velocity using the 7828ssc.
I expected a min. of 100fps gain. I do live in S. Fla. at sea level and temps have cooled off (some) to 85F.
My goal is to stay supersonic out to 2K with this 7.5 gain twist bbl. without signs of overpressure on the Lapua brass.
Any advise or consideration is appreciated.

Hello btuse,

My recent background is....I'm a 1 mile benchrest shooter and 1k benchrest while trying to do as many ELR comps as I can. I work a job that sometimes pushes 70+ hours a week. I only really ever get to shoot at a match.

So, you have a 30" barrel. You will find some of the faster powders like H1000 will show a slower velocity in the 30" because the kaboom ran out of juice and the pressure spike is waning and the friction of the bullet in the barrel are starting to over come the pressure....thus slowing you down. It's like the inverse of powders like Retumbo in a shorter barrel where you get to a point where no matter how much powder you add....you don't get any more velocity because the powder isn't burnt before it leaves the barrel...usually manifesting itself in a nice fireball.

We like to match powder burn rate, powder density, and powder energy to our specific cartridge. Aka, we want the powder to burn the entire length down the barrel with our particular projectile. We don't want any wasted powder flashing off at the muzzle. We want the powder to fill as much of the air space in the brass as possible so when we tilt the round on its side you don't change the potential initial pressure by how the powder lays in the case. You don't want an air pocket at the back...between the powder and the primer flash hole when doing high angle shooting. (problem with the 300nm) We want a powder that gets a safe initial pressure spike of 65k psi or less and falls off slowly.

Each powder has unique physical and chemical traits that we have to adjust for. Even the same powder from lot to lot....or the same powder loaded on the bench on days of extreme humidity change.

When it comes to the 300PRC...give me a high BC, heavy for caliber bullet that is very consistent from one bullet to the next and let me drive it from 2880fps to 3000fps and I'm a happy man. I find 2900fps and a 245gr EOL is my happy spot.


I'm supersonic to 2,000 yards. I've found the 230 A-tip, 245 EOL and the 250 A-tip to transition to transonic and subsonic out to 2500yds very accurately. I've won matches out to 2500yds with my 300PRC. It's not the best selection for that distance....but out to 2000yds I'll take it over most things. I also pull barrels for comp at around 1200 to 1400 rounds on them.

Have a great day,

B2

 

[Jefe~]

Hello btuse,

My recent background is....I'm a 1 mile benchrest shooter and 1k benchrest while trying to do as many ELR comps as I can. I work a job that sometimes pushes 70+ hours a week. I only really ever get to shoot at a match.

So, you have a 30" barrel. You will find some of the faster powders like H1000 will show a slower velocity in the 30" because the kaboom ran out of juice and the pressure spike is waning and the friction of the bullet in the barrel are starting to over come the pressure....thus slowing you down. It's like the inverse of powders like Retumbo in a shorter barrel where you get to a point where no matter how much powder you add....you don't get any more velocity because the powder isn't burnt before it leaves the barrel...usually manifesting itself in a nice fireball.

We like to match powder burn rate, powder density, and powder energy to our specific cartridge. Aka, we want the powder to burn the entire length down the barrel with our particular projectile. We don't want any wasted powder flashing off at the muzzle. We want the powder to fill as much of the air space in the brass as possible so when we tilt the round on its side you don't change the potential initial pressure by how the powder lays in the case. You don't want an air pocket at the back...between the powder and the primer flash hole when doing high angle shooting. (problem with the 300nm) We want a powder that gets a safe initial pressure spike of 65k psi or less and falls off slowly.

Each powder has unique physical and chemical traits that we have to adjust for. Even the same powder from lot to lot....or the same powder loaded on the bench on days of extreme humidity change.

When it comes to the 300PRC...give me a high BC, heavy for caliber bullet that is very consistent from one bullet to the next and let me drive it from 2880fps to 3000fps and I'm a happy man. I find 2900fps and a 245gr EOL is my happy spot.


I'm supersonic to 2,000 yards. I've found the 230 A-tip, 245 EOL and the 250 A-tip to transition to transonic and subsonic out to 2500yds very accurately. I've won matches out to 2500yds with my 300PRC. It's not the best selection for that distance....but out to 2000yds I'll take it over most things. I also pull barrels for comp at around 1200 to 1400 rounds on them.

Have a great day,

B2

Thank you for taking the time respond to this!

 

[nick338]

Hello btuse,

My recent background is....I'm a 1 mile benchrest shooter and 1k benchrest while trying to do as many ELR comps as I can. I work a job that sometimes pushes 70+ hours a week. I only really ever get to shoot at a match.

So, you have a 30" barrel. You will find some of the faster powders like H1000 will show a slower velocity in the 30" because the kaboom ran out of juice and the pressure spike is waning and the friction of the bullet in the barrel are starting to over come the pressure....thus slowing you down. It's like the inverse of powders like Retumbo in a shorter barrel where you get to a point where no matter how much powder you add....you don't get any more velocity because the powder isn't burnt before it leaves the barrel...usually manifesting itself in a nice fireball.

We like to match powder burn rate, powder density, and powder energy to our specific cartridge. Aka, we want the powder to burn the entire length down the barrel with our particular projectile. We don't want any wasted powder flashing off at the muzzle. We want the powder to fill as much of the air space in the brass as possible so when we tilt the round on its side you don't change the potential initial pressure by how the powder lays in the case. You don't want an air pocket at the back...between the powder and the primer flash hole when doing high angle shooting. (problem with the 300nm) We want a powder that gets a safe initial pressure spike of 65k psi or less and falls off slowly.

Each powder has unique physical and chemical traits that we have to adjust for. Even the same powder from lot to lot....or the same powder loaded on the bench on days of extreme humidity change.

When it comes to the 300PRC...give me a high BC, heavy for caliber bullet that is very consistent from one bullet to the next and let me drive it from 2880fps to 3000fps and I'm a happy man. I find 2900fps and a 245gr EOL is my happy spot.


I'm supersonic to 2,000 yards. I've found the 230 A-tip, 245 EOL and the 250 A-tip to transition to transonic and subsonic out to 2500yds very accurately. I've won matches out to 2500yds with my 300PRC. It's not the best selection for that distance....but out to 2000yds I'll take it over most things. I also pull barrels for comp at around 1200 to 1400 rounds on them.

Have a great day,

B2

I believe the high angle problem with the 300 Norma was alleviated with N570. Some say it's more temp sensitive than some powders but I haven't seen any extreme velocity changes shooting from 20 degrees up to 90. I think Bryan Litz likes N565 a little more for stability but I haven't tried it the Norma.

I'm back to testing my 300 PRC with the Berger 220 and N568 but don't have a lot of data yet. I don't have the barrel length to run the heavies.

 

[Pete Cefalu]

Hello btuse,

My recent background is....I'm a 1 mile benchrest shooter and 1k benchrest while trying to do as many ELR comps as I can. I work a job that sometimes pushes 70+ hours a week. I only really ever get to shoot at a match.

So, you have a 30" barrel. You will find some of the faster powders like H1000 will show a slower velocity in the 30" because the kaboom ran out of juice and the pressure spike is waning and the friction of the bullet in the barrel are starting to over come the pressure....thus slowing you down. It's like the inverse of powders like Retumbo in a shorter barrel where you get to a point where no matter how much powder you add....you don't get any more velocity because the powder isn't burnt before it leaves the barrel...usually manifesting itself in a nice fireball.

We like to match powder burn rate, powder density, and powder energy to our specific cartridge. Aka, we want the powder to burn the entire length down the barrel with our particular projectile. We don't want any wasted powder flashing off at the muzzle. We want the powder to fill as much of the air space in the brass as possible so when we tilt the round on its side you don't change the potential initial pressure by how the powder lays in the case. You don't want an air pocket at the back...between the powder and the primer flash hole when doing high angle shooting. (problem with the 300nm) We want a powder that gets a safe initial pressure spike of 65k psi or less and falls off slowly.

Each powder has unique physical and chemical traits that we have to adjust for. Even the same powder from lot to lot....or the same powder loaded on the bench on days of extreme humidity change.

When it comes to the 300PRC...give me a high BC, heavy for caliber bullet that is very consistent from one bullet to the next and let me drive it from 2880fps to 3000fps and I'm a happy man. I find 2900fps and a 245gr EOL is my happy spot.


I'm supersonic to 2,000 yards. I've found the 230 A-tip, 245 EOL and the 250 A-tip to transition to transonic and subsonic out to 2500yds very accurately. I've won matches out to 2500yds with my 300PRC. It's not the best selection for that distance....but out to 2000yds I'll take it over most things. I also pull barrels for comp at around 1200 to 1400 rounds on them.

Have a great day,

B2

Hey man, thanks a bunch. If sharing your wealth of knowledge on the topic paid real dollars, I'll bet you could quit that 70 hour/wk job. I'm leaning towards working up next test pack with N570, as I had great results with 560 in my win mag. Best of luck to you in upcoming matches.
Thanks again.
OK, after reading again, I'm understanding "You will find some of the faster powders like H1000", meaning I should go up the burn chart, not down(so a little faster burning); in which case I should go up the burn chart to 565 or RL26.

 

[b2lee]

I use RL-26....my back up is N565 or N568. I prefer RL-26 but it is a dirty powder and requires more effort for me to clean my barrels. It also has a snap for recoil that some people don't like. You won't know what I'm talking about....until you feel it.

 

[918v]

You aren't the only one... https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/the-prc-die-problem.253223/page-18

I had the same issue and went ahead and fixed it by rechambering to Alex Wheeler's AW2 chamber. The SAMMI chamber is tight (especially with ADG and Lapua brass).

How does making the chamber bigger solve the hard sizing / brass sticking in the die / brass shaving issue?

 

[Pete Cefalu]

A little background. I had decided a while back to do to 300PRC build, but I would not commit to a build\purchase until I had all the components to load for it. Fast forward to this past weekend and I managed to score 8lbs of Retumbo at a local show. My intent is to push 230 Bergers or maybe some A-Tips. Does anyone foresee any issues with using Retumbo here or should I look for a different powder? I am new to 300 PRC but not handloading. Any and all input is welcome. Thanks -

I started a max load test with 250 A-Tips and Retumbo with new Lapua brass and 30" 1:7.5 (.5"GT) bbl.
I had no over pressure signs whatsoever with the following:
77.0- 2821
77.5(Horny max)-2835
77.8- 2857
88F at sea level in sauna conditions. I've since loaded a box with 78.0gr for a more accurate test, as my target MV is 2850 which I expect to drop off a bit as winter approaches(70F). I know you mentioned 230, but I built around the 250's and run the 230's in my Win Mag. Hope this helps.

 

[LongRangeAggie]

How does making the chamber bigger solve the hard sizing / brass sticking in the die / brass shaving issue?

 

[jmornoinf]

I solved my sizing 300 PRC issue by ordering four different FL Bushing dies...not the preferred COA.

I originally had 2x Redding dies and both of them were attempting to size the base area at .5275- .528(too small). I destroyed several pieces of brass and was very frustrated. Prior to that I was NS only with great success until the 4th firing. Redding reworked the dies by polishing them out free of charge(3 day turn around).

I then ordered a LE Wilson and RCBS die and problem solved. Both dies size the cases to the exact spec by barrel requires.

 

[Pete Cefalu]

View attachment 7978951

Thanks, very informative and interesting. Do you know if the tolerance indifference is related to other PRC brass as well?

 

[LongRangeAggie]

Thanks, very informative and interesting. Do you know if the tolerance indifference is related to other PRC brass as well?

You're welcome, it's an interesting thread if you have a chance to read it. Are you asking if there are the same issues with brass other than ADG?

 

[Pete Cefalu]

You're welcome, it's an interesting thread if you have a chance to read it. Are you asking if there are the same issues with brass other than ADG?

Yes. I could not chamber new Lapua brass until I FL sized them. No biggie, just curious, as I have 3 hundo of Peterson long coming. I sent a Lapua dummy round to gunsmith and was surprised when it wouldn't chamber. I'm kinda new here, where is the thread?

 

[LongRangeAggie]

Yes. I could not chamber new Lapua brass until I FL sized them. No biggie, just curious, as I have 3 hundo of Peterson long coming. I sent a Lapua dummy round to gunsmith and was surprised when it wouldn't chamber. I'm kinda new here, where is the thread?

That is odd, you should be able to chamber new brass without FL sizing.
People seem to be having the issue with all brands, but mostly with ADG/Lapua/Peterson.
Here is the thread: https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/the-prc-die-problem.253223/

 

[category_theory]

That is odd, you should be able to chamber new brass without FL sizing.
People seem to be having the issue with all brands, but mostly with ADG/Lapua/Peterson.
Here is the thread: https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/the-prc-die-problem.253223/

I posted about this very issue here: Link
Had resend in my barrel to my smith…. Said he used a Sammi spec reamer but took another though or two off the shoulder. Now new Lapua brass and fired Lapua brass are almost exactly the same….. and I can obviously now chamber new Lapua brass.

 

[918v]

View attachment 7978951

That does not answer the question

 

[abn31c]

That does not answer the question

You are correct, I'm on my 3rd 300 prc barrel, the best luck I've had is with early hornady brass. I'm done with it, too many issues from brass to reamers. Making the chamber bigger is not a fix that makes sense to me.

 

[category_theory]

Ok…. So who’s “fault” is this? Lapua’s? For making brass that’s not fitting to “Sami”? Sami’s? Hornady’s? Etc. ? Where did the measurement / tolerances snafu happen? I dealt with this issue w Lapua brass and new barrel but it’s since been fixed.

 

[918v]

It’s the fault of people who come up with solutions in search of problems.

 

[category_theory]

It’s the fault of people who come up with solutions in search of problems.

Huh? What people?

 

[918v]

The people who decided the 300 PRC was necessary.

 

[b2lee]

Huh? What people?

Probably thought he was in the 6GT thread

 

[georgelza]

Hello btuse,

My recent background is....I'm a 1 mile benchrest shooter and 1k benchrest while trying to do as many ELR comps as I can. I work a job that sometimes pushes 70+ hours a week. I only really ever get to shoot at a match.

So, you have a 30" barrel. You will find some of the faster powders like H1000 will show a slower velocity in the 30" because the kaboom ran out of juice and the pressure spike is waning and the friction of the bullet in the barrel are starting to over come the pressure....thus slowing you down. It's like the inverse of powders like Retumbo in a shorter barrel where you get to a point where no matter how much powder you add....you don't get any more velocity because the powder isn't burnt before it leaves the barrel...usually manifesting itself in a nice fireball.

We like to match powder burn rate, powder density, and powder energy to our specific cartridge. Aka, we want the powder to burn the entire length down the barrel with our particular projectile. We don't want any wasted powder flashing off at the muzzle. We want the powder to fill as much of the air space in the brass as possible so when we tilt the round on its side you don't change the potential initial pressure by how the powder lays in the case. You don't want an air pocket at the back...between the powder and the primer flash hole when doing high angle shooting. (problem with the 300nm) We want a powder that gets a safe initial pressure spike of 65k psi or less and falls off slowly.

Each powder has unique physical and chemical traits that we have to adjust for. Even the same powder from lot to lot....or the same powder loaded on the bench on days of extreme humidity change.

When it comes to the 300PRC...give me a high BC, heavy for caliber bullet that is very consistent from one bullet to the next and let me drive it from 2880fps to 3000fps and I'm a happy man. I find 2900fps and a 245gr EOL is my happy spot.


I'm supersonic to 2,000 yards. I've found the 230 A-tip, 245 EOL and the 250 A-tip to transition to transonic and subsonic out to 2500yds very accurately. I've won matches out to 2500yds with my 300PRC. It's not the best selection for that distance....but out to 2000yds I'll take it over most things. I also pull barrels for comp at around 1200 to 1400 rounds on them.

Have a great day,

B2

probably one of the best explanations I've read in a very long time, thank you, thank you.
makes me understand why I'm being nudged by friends in my 24" barrel to go H1000 and/or N565.
and why my friend with his Savage Elite Precision and the 30" barrel swears by Retumbo.
and why the wife better not become aware that I'm already looking at rebarreling to 28" ... simple reason for not longer... my gun safe won't hold a rifle longer, with a brake on it...

G

 

[Emerson0311]

probably one of the best explanations I've read in a very long time, thank you, thank you.
makes me understand why I'm being nudged by friends in my 24" barrel to go H1000 and/or N565.
and why my friend with his Savage Elite Precision and the 30" barrel swears by Retumbo.
and why the wife better not become aware that I'm already looking at rebarreling to 28" ... simple reason for not longer... my gun safe won't hold a rifle longer, with a brake on it...

G

Folding chassis. Don’t mention that to the wife either…

 

[Jefe~]

I started a max load test with 250 A-Tips and Retumbo with new Lapua brass and 30" 1:7.5 (.5"GT) bbl.
I had no over pressure signs whatsoever with the following:
77.0- 2821
77.5(Horny max)-2835
77.8- 2857
88F at sea level in sauna conditions. I've since loaded a box with 78.0gr for a more accurate test, as my target MV is 2850 which I expect to drop off a bit as winter approaches(70F). I know you mentioned 230, but I built around the 250's and run the 230's in my Win Mag. Hope this helps.

Thank you for the intel!
I have ordered the Berger 245's but no telling when they will get here.
I have also added H1000 to my store

 

[338LM]

What does your sizing dies measure at the base (mouth) dimension of the die? I know it is hard to measure with the radius at the bottom but if you can try to measure it at the tangency of the radius/body I would appreciate it.

 

[Pete Cefalu]

probably one of the best explanations I've read in a very long time, thank you, thank you.
makes me understand why I'm being nudged by friends in my 24" barrel to go H1000 and/or N565.
and why my friend with his Savage Elite Precision and the 30" barrel swears by Retumbo.
and why the wife better not become aware that I'm already looking at rebarreling to 28" ... simple reason for not longer... my gun safe won't hold a rifle longer, with a brake on it...

G

I also have several friends with the savage elite and 30" bbl that were roasting me and my 26", which is why I went with a 30". My safes also wont allow it to stand up straight. But I run the Area 419 sidewinder self timer which is a tool-less removal to switch over to a can. They sell a protector cap for the muzzle adapter which is how I stow it. Suppressor and brake stay in the bag. JAT

 

[Pete Cefalu]

Thank you for the intel!
I have ordered the Berger 245's but no telling when they will get here.
I have also added H1000 to my store

Yeah, from what I understand, Berger does a production run about twice a year, maybe more depending on demand.
I also max load tested the H1000 with the Horny 250's (30" bbl)
75.7: 2853
76.0: 2870(published max)
76.5: 2830
I'll be loading a box up soon with the 76.0 and run them out to 1300 before I head out to the mile/2000 range.

 

[georgelza]

Folding chassis. Don’t mention that to the wife either…

wife knows what the rifle and the scope costed... not the rest of all the supporting gear, which was actually about 2x the rifle/scope cost...
even I"m surprised...
G

 

[georgelza]

I can see why to buy say 2000 bullets and enough powder to match... and #1, availability and fck cost just Tina... my piggy bank laughs at me.
but then we have some guys around that laugh at not doing it, they'd sommer do it for 2 years supply if they find stock.
G

 

[georgelza]

Curious, was / is being nudged to N565... but looking at the numbers for N570, it looks better.
For now it will be either ELDM 225gr or 230 A-Tip's down a 24" barrel.

comments.
G
... off topic, sort of, was surprised to see neither N565..N570 or any of the Vihtavuori powders listed in the Hornady reloading manual (10th edition).

 

[category_theory]

Curious, was / is being nudged to N565... but looking at the numbers for N570, it looks better.
For now it will be either ELDM 225gr or 230 A-Tip's down a 24" barrel.

comments.
G
... off topic, sort of, was surprised to see neither N565..N570 or any of the Vihtavuori powders listed in the Hornady reloading manual (10th edition).

Did you check VVs website? They are obviously listed there for 300 prc. I am in the process of testing both n570 and n560 w Berger 220 LRHT. That said the number VV lists for 560 seem low to me…. GRT simulation shows pretty low pressures for the recommended max charge…. Anyone directly use this combo? I’m pushing the 220s from a 30” barrel…. Have yet to test the rounds too though.

 

[georgelza]

Did you check VVs website? They are obviously listed there for 300 prc. I am in the process of testing both n570 and n560 w Berger 220 LRHT. That said the number VV lists for 560 seem low to me…. GRT simulation shows pretty low pressures for the recommended max charge…. Anyone directly use this combo? I’m pushing the 220s from a 30” barrel…. Have yet to test the rounds too though.

from VV. PS: these numbers are by them stated as for a 26" barrel, you will notice N570 is quite a bit higher at all the loads.

G