6.5 Creedmoor
- Thread starter Sportin Wood
- Start date
Yes ; I have an excellent Rifle with the capability . I also regularly shoot in wind ,as Idaho is seldom still . Practice Practice and More Practice , it apparently eventually pays off . I've also had a slight right drift but don't want to address that issue until I get a calm day .
Federal brass - twice fired
H4350 40gr
Hornady ELDM 140gr
COAL 2.800
Primer - Federal GM210M
Ruger American Predator - 22” barrel
Avg fps - 2650
SD - 7.3
ES - 18.9
Federal brass - twice fired
H4350 39.5gr
Hornady ELDM 140gr
COAL 2.800
Primer - Federal GM210M
Ruger American Predator - 22” barrel
Avg fps - 2641
SD - 16.9
ES - 49.6
One got worse and one got better. Fuck if I know lol they both shot well.
Also loaded these with the GM210M which I did not do last time.
Federal brass - twice fired
H4350 40.5gr
Hornady ELDM 140gr
COAL 2.800
Primer - Federal GM210M
Ruger American Predator - 22” barrel
Avg fps - 2692
SD - 10.1
ES - 28.3
Would love to see pics of said rifle and range
Shooting that small group in a 18-20 mph crosswind at roughly ~ 300 yards is quite a feat. Are you a secret sniper?
No, he's an ex E6, just like you...which means you have the force inside...waiting for you to discover it on the range brotha.
My apologies Sir, I forgot you were into building Aero gassers these days...
I am surprised that the group wasn't smaller...
My only superpower is shamming/skating. And running the LanceCriminal Underground
Lol.
I sure didn't have anything to do with old boy's magic rifle. . .
. . . but if I did, I sure as shit wouldn't have time to dick around on this forum cause I would stay 10yrs backlogged on those quarter minute self shucking army guns!
NO secrets , it's one of my assembled Aero Platform 6.5 CM. 22.5" barrel . A bad crown 24" was available and I had them re-cut it .
I built #4 target sheds like pictured ,because of terrain and snow you're unable to see them in the distance . 165 yd. closest ,278 yd. 340 yd. and 635 yd. Far hill is 1044- 1177 yd. with #6 #14" steel plates at various locations hung with SS aircraft cable between T posts .
I have a shooting bench with another 0-75 yd. pistol range and is pretty level ,rifle range is 90 degrees opposite direction .Otherwise I sometimes pop a sand bag on the handrail and shoot off the deck . Spring April 2022 is the Rifle which did those groups .
The New 6.5 CM fluted barrel has yet been sighted ,as I'm finishing another long overdue project first . ALL MY AR Rifles wear A2 KAK stocks ,as I've never liked hockey sticks or putters for furniture . Just ME
Attachments
Screaming Eagles 101 ,aka Chicken Men . Twice survivor AShau Valley , where you made em count as your life depended upon it .
Even a blind squirrel gets lucky and finds an acorn once in awhile
Screaming Eagles 101 ,aka Chicken Men . Twice survivor AShau Valley , where you made em count as your life depended upon it .
Even a blind squirrel gets lucky and finds an acorn once in awhile
I survived the MEPS doctor looking at my butthole...
Man that’s gotta be a world record. Most bolt guns can’t shoot that small a group at that distance, repeatedly. What’s the secret sauce to shoot a .4” group at 278 with that much of a crosswind with a gasser? How do you deal with the recoil impulse and how much time difference between shots?NO secrets , it's one of my assembled Aero Platform 6.5 CM. 22.5" barrel . A bad crown 24" was available and I had them re-cut it .
I built #4 target sheds like pictured ,because of terrain and snow you're unable to see them in the distance . 165 yd. closest ,278 yd. 340 yd. and 635 yd. Far hill is 1044- 1177 yd. with #6 #14" steel plates at various locations hung with SS aircraft cable between T posts .
I have a shooting bench with another 0-75 yd. pistol range and is pretty level ,rifle range is 90 degrees opposite direction .Otherwise I sometimes pop a sand bag on the handrail and shoot off the deck . Spring April 2022 is the Rifle which did those groups .
The New 6.5 CM fluted barrel has yet been sighted ,as I'm finishing another long overdue project first . ALL MY AR Rifles wear A2 KAK stocks ,as I've never liked hockey sticks or putters for furniture . Just ME
Luv me A2 stocks, simple as. Love me snow too.NO secrets , it's one of my assembled Aero Platform 6.5 CM. 22.5" barrel . A bad crown 24" was available and I had them re-cut it .
I built #4 target sheds like pictured ,because of terrain and snow you're unable to see them in the distance . 165 yd. closest ,278 yd. 340 yd. and 635 yd. Far hill is 1044- 1177 yd. with #6 #14" steel plates at various locations hung with SS aircraft cable between T posts .
I have a shooting bench with another 0-75 yd. pistol range and is pretty level ,rifle range is 90 degrees opposite direction .Otherwise I sometimes pop a sand bag on the handrail and shoot off the deck . Spring April 2022 is the Rifle which did those groups .
The New 6.5 CM fluted barrel has yet been sighted ,as I'm finishing another long overdue project first . ALL MY AR Rifles wear A2 KAK stocks ,as I've never liked hockey sticks or putters for furniture . Just ME
Actually, I just looked up some posted benchrest records across a few easily researched links.
Looks like the current 300 international benchrest record for (10) shots at 300 yards is .669 in HB class. That's 1.5x the size of the (20) shot group a few posts ago!
internationalbenchrest.com
So @Ex E6 brotha...you might want to be investing in attending some various matches with your Aero build. Chances are you can not only be the next record holder, but also get paid for it. Or maybe you could post some videos and teach the rest of us your secrets. Ain't nobody else here can throw 20 rounds into a .139 MOA group!
Looks like the current 300 international benchrest record for (10) shots at 300 yards is .669 in HB class. That's 1.5x the size of the (20) shot group a few posts ago!
Group Records
internationalbenchrest.com
So @Ex E6 brotha...you might want to be investing in attending some various matches with your Aero build. Chances are you can not only be the next record holder, but also get paid for it. Or maybe you could post some videos and teach the rest of us your secrets. Ain't nobody else here can throw 20 rounds into a .139 MOA group!
You know what ironic and difficult for Me anyway , is doping wind that gusts or varies over distance and terrain . Here it's nearly steady ,so practicing which I do a great deal of has made it easier . Calculations tell Me to hold 0.8 Mil ,or 8.7" into the wind and 0.4 Mil drop or 4.5" . My Rifles are zeroed normally at 225 yd. . I belong to shooting range where it's flatter and measured distances are marked ,yet aren't exact , So I took MY laser range finder and marked near exact distances and using the bench ,sighted most of them from that distance . So calculations are slightly different for ME . Recoil out of a 6.5 CM gas gun ?
I started hunting in early 60's and 1964 purchased a commercial 7mm Rem Mag . With the exception of Military service ,I've shot that and other .338 Win , .338 LM every single year those produce recoil . I honestly can't tell much difference between 5.56X45 ,6.5 CM and 7.62X51 any longer .When I shoot for precision I loop in the zone and generally fire .45 sec. - 1 minute between rounds . Sometimes I'll fire #5-10 shots within a minute ,then allow barrel to cool . I've not noticed drifting or climb ,aka stringing with MY loads doing this . However most certainly have with factory cheap crap .
Here's a group I shot back in early 90's at a LEO demonstration ,using Winchester white box crap and MY hand loads same POA .
One fouler fired intentionally low left quadrant . Using a bone stock Bushmaster 5.56X45mm 20" CR lined no less XM-15 E2 other than Nikon Monarch scope . Off the dirt without mat or support ,just sling choke and every shot dirt flew believe Me .
You can clearly see 200 Yd. with bulk 55 gr. Winchester bullets 25.5 gr. BlC-2 ,I ran #3 groups of #5 shots which a dime covered ,after firing that laughable string wonder of white box Winchester crap . Purpose of demonstration was to show how hand loading was a huge advantage in accuracy .
The Sheriff's Dept. made Me an Honorary Swat member and boy did I make a lot of ammo for a number of years .
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Can you recommend a ultra sonic cleaner? Also what you use for solution?Yeah ,I kind of figured eventually they'd have to come out ,otherwise not much point in reloading
I don't always wet clean . Most of the time especially pistol cases ,9mm .45 even .44 Mag . I'll just de prime and toss em into the big Dillon vibratory ,with a mixture of walnut shells , plastic triangle , tethedrons with pieces of Polishing Compound .
Makes pretty sparkling cases . I also have SS pin and tumbler . Yet nothing I've ever come up with cleans more thoroughly inside and out faster or better than that 3 transducer commercial ultrasonic .
So when the gang has been real dirty ,into the ultrasonic ,then the dryer or if necessary partial annealing ) measure and trim ? . Then either Vibratory or Pin tumbler . Depending upon degree of shiny I choose .
I prep Large volumes of cases and often vacuum pack #250 - 500 packs as I do K's . Once or twice a year . Ultrasonic baths are mostly for gas guns as they definitively are dirtier in nature
You know what ironic and difficult for Me anyway , is doping wind that gusts or varies over distance and terrain . Here it's nearly steady ,so practicing which I do a great deal of has made it easier . Calculations tell Me to hold 0.8 Mil ,or 8.7" into the wind and 0.4 Mil drop or 4.5" . My Rifles are zeroed normally at 225 yd. . I belong to shooting range where it's flatter and measured distances are marked ,yet aren't exact , So I took MY laser range finder and marked near exact distances and using the bench ,sighted most of them from that distance . So calculations are slightly different for ME . Recoil out of a 6.5 CM gas gun ?
When I shoot for precision I loop in the zone and generally fire .45 sec. - 1 minute between rounds . Sometimes I'll fire #5-10 shots within a minute ,then allow barrel to cool . I've not noticed drifting or climb ,aka stringing with MY loads doing this . However most certainly have with factory cheap crap .
Here's a group I shot back in early 90's at a LEO demonstration ,using Winchester white box crap and MY hand loads same POA .
One fouler fired intentionally low left quadrant . Using a bone stock Bushmaster 5.56X45mm 20" CR lined no less XM-15 E2 other than Nikon Monarch scope . Off the dirt without mat or support ,just sling choke and every shot dirt flew believe Me .
You can clearly see 200 Yd. with bulk 55 gr. Winchester bullets 25.5 gr. BlC-2 ,I ran #3 groups of #5 shots which a dime covered ,after firing that laughable string wonder of white box Winchester crap . Purpose of demonstration was to show how hand loading was a huge advantage in accuracy .
The Sheriff's Dept. made Me an Honorary Swat member and boy did I make a lot of ammo for a number of years .
My good Sir,
You are well on your way to earning "legendary" status. I look forward to future contributions of yours.
What sheriffs department?You know what ironic and difficult for Me anyway , is doping wind that gusts or varies over distance and terrain . Here it's nearly steady ,so practicing which I do a great deal of has made it easier . Calculations tell Me to hold 0.8 Mil ,or 8.7" into the wind and 0.4 Mil drop or 4.5" . My Rifles are zeroed normally at 225 yd. . I belong to shooting range where it's flatter and measured distances are marked ,yet aren't exact , So I took MY laser range finder and marked near exact distances and using the bench ,sighted most of them from that distance . So calculations are slightly different for ME . Recoil out of a 6.5 CM gas gun ?
When I shoot for precision I loop in the zone and generally fire .45 sec. - 1 minute between rounds . Sometimes I'll fire #5-10 shots within a minute ,then allow barrel to cool . I've not noticed drifting or climb ,aka stringing with MY loads doing this . However most certainly have with factory cheap crap .
Here's a group I shot back in early 90's at a LEO demonstration ,using Winchester white box crap and MY hand loads same POA .
One fouler fired intentionally low left quadrant . Using a bone stock Bushmaster 5.56X45mm 20" CR lined no less XM-15 E2 other than Nikon Monarch scope . Off the dirt without mat or support ,just sling choke and every shot dirt flew believe Me .
You can clearly see 200 Yd. with bulk 55 gr. Winchester bullets 25.5 gr. BlC-2 ,I ran #3 groups of #5 shots which a dime covered ,after firing that laughable string wonder of white box Winchester crap . Purpose of demonstration was to show how hand loading was a huge advantage in accuracy .
The Sheriff's Dept. made Me an Honorary Swat member and boy did I make a lot of ammo for a number of years .
You mean to tell me there’s no difference in recoil pulse between a large frame gasser and a bolt rifle? Especially between one chambered in 556 or 6.5?
What's your load data for that Aero barrel?NO secrets , it's one of my assembled Aero Platform 6.5 CM. 22.5" barrel . A bad crown 24" was available and I had them re-cut it .
I built #4 target sheds like pictured ,because of terrain and snow you're unable to see them in the distance . 165 yd. closest ,278 yd. 340 yd. and 635 yd. Far hill is 1044- 1177 yd. with #6 #14" steel plates at various locations hung with SS aircraft cable between T posts .
I have a shooting bench with another 0-75 yd. pistol range and is pretty level ,rifle range is 90 degrees opposite direction .Otherwise I sometimes pop a sand bag on the handrail and shoot off the deck . Spring April 2022 is the Rifle which did those groups .
The New 6.5 CM fluted barrel has yet been sighted ,as I'm finishing another long overdue project first . ALL MY AR Rifles wear A2 KAK stocks ,as I've never liked hockey sticks or putters for furniture . Just ME
I've had excellent results with : https://www.ebay.com/itm/235537263060
You just need to determine the size which fits your needs .
As for solution well homemade ; Gallon solution : I prefer Tide 1 Tbsp. , Dawn Ultra , 2 Tbsp. , 3 Tbsp. Citranox ( or powdered citric acid ) White vinegar 5 ounces can also be substituted .
What I do is different from what others do : My ultrasonic is large enough to allow a Pyrex baking dish to set inside the tank . I place cases in it , then fill dish with cleaning solution ,surrounded by plain water. I also never run my ultrasonic longer than 3-4 minutes in that solution . I remove Pyrex dish strain and drain solution through a filter and it returns to the gallon jug . Baking soda water solution ,cases quick dunk ,remove and rinse in plain water . I then toss my cases into de-ionized water where they set for a spell . While I clean up and setup my drying station . I then place cases in a mesh bag shake em around and toss them into the drying tub .
It may sound like a lot of trouble but it's NOT ,it's like doing laundry yeah it's a pain but doing it twice a year isn't the end of the world .
I ONLY do really filthy cases and if doing normal fired rounds I'll dilute solution 50% . I've been using same solution for #4 years now .
First photo original once fired cases 1942-43 M2 .30 Cal. and 1954-56 7.62X51mm . Both set to the weather 65 years before I obtained them . I've gotten #50 firings out of one of My Garands and didn't lose a single case . Partial annealed every 4 Th. firing .
Although low due to a stripped pinion ,all #8 are there out of a 1943 Springfield matching #'s Garand battle Rifle at 165 yd.
Learning to shoot Magnum Rifles most certainly didn't hurt MY aiming ability .
Pin tumble last photo on left group ,ultrasonic on right group .clean is clean . Polished jewelry is in vibratory or long time pin tumbling .
My chambers have NO eyes and could care less as long as ammo is Clean and they seem content
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You don’t have to get your brass shiny clean inside and out. Guy actually lube inside the necks when they do and add another step. A simple tumble in some corn media does just fine. I am not OCD and load very accurate ammo on tumbles brass. I saw when those pin tumblers came and out what everyone had to do with drying etc and said nah. I like my life easier instead of harder for only a perceived benefit.
NO I was speaking of gas guns and generalized . I also own a fair # of Bolt Rifles ,but no longer own real BR Rifles .
A few of MY Bolts are accurate enough . Here's a dandy little 1955 Remington Model 722 . 222 aka Triple Deuce and it's a fine prairie dog shooter . Recoil actual and perceived can be negated to an extent depending upon butt stock and weight ,along with cushioning and or dampeners installed .
Point is not all is equal between Rifles but sure can be made to seem the same . San Diego County .
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Again it depends upon the level of cleanliness one desires . I only clean really dirty brass one time chemically ,as 65 years of setting to the weather on a Military range dirt mud and God only knows what else got on them , made them undesirable . So when 10's of K's of WWll and Korean .30 Cal. cases came up for sale not many wanted them . Yet I knew they could be cleaned ,what I was unaware of was there durability in reloading .
I would have never bet on #50 reloads on 1942-43 SL & LC Military brass . Yet when I began testing them , I became a believer without a single torn rim or case separation . Good cases are difficult to come by reasonably for M1 Garands these days . Garands extractors are Not gentle nor are M14's .
Back in the day MCAS Camp Pendleton , I could work a deal and get Match ammo . Unfortunately when Clinton screwed up surplus sales ,that went bye bye . I nearly cried when I realized how many tons of M2 .30 Cal. Match 1962-1968 ,along with M118LR ,M852 were dumped into a 40 ft wide X 400 Yd X 20 ft. deep trench . There were scads of artillery shells powder bags ,as the magazines were being cleaned out and updated . So Ordnance was told and instructed to Burn it all . Served the bastards right ,caught the Base on fire !.
As I was a contractor for the Base and knew some of the Brass so to speak ,I was given a case of mixed 1962-68 173 gr. Match .30 Caliber . However unable to purchase any and that Gift was prior to the order of destruction .
As far as the ultra sonic goes, I'd be more using it for bolt carriers, rimfire silencers and the like. For what I do I am happy with standard corn cob tumbling. Even some of my bolt gun brass doesn't get tumbled all that much.
Very interesting stuff on the old brass though. I recent aquired two variations of 7.62x51
LC match. One kind has a strange verticle line scoring band around the side of some of the cases. Probably old MG brass I assume.
Very interesting stuff on the old brass though. I recent aquired two variations of 7.62x51
LC match. One kind has a strange verticle line scoring band around the side of some of the cases. Probably old MG brass I assume.
You know what ironic and difficult for Me anyway , is doping wind that gusts or varies over distance and terrain . Here it's nearly steady ,so practicing which I do a great deal of has made it easier . Calculations tell Me to hold 0.8 Mil ,or 8.7" into the wind and 0.4 Mil drop or 4.5" . My Rifles are zeroed normally at 225 yd. . I belong to shooting range where it's flatter and measured distances are marked ,yet aren't exact , So I took MY laser range finder and marked near exact distances and using the bench ,sighted most of them from that distance . So calculations are slightly different for ME . Recoil out of a 6.5 CM gas gun ?
When I shoot for precision I loop in the zone and generally fire .45 sec. - 1 minute between rounds . Sometimes I'll fire #5-10 shots within a minute ,then allow barrel to cool . I've not noticed drifting or climb ,aka stringing with MY loads doing this . However most certainly have with factory cheap crap .
Here's a group I shot back in early 90's at a LEO demonstration ,using Winchester white box crap and MY hand loads same POA .
One fouler fired intentionally low left quadrant . Using a bone stock Bushmaster 5.56X45mm 20" CR lined no less XM-15 E2 other than Nikon Monarch scope . Off the dirt without mat or support ,just sling choke and every shot dirt flew believe Me .
You can clearly see 200 Yd. with bulk 55 gr. Winchester bullets 25.5 gr. BlC-2 ,I ran #3 groups of #5 shots which a dime covered ,after firing that laughable string wonder of white box Winchester crap . Purpose of demonstration was to show how hand loading was a huge advantage in accuracy .
The Sheriff's Dept. made Me an Honorary Swat member and boy did I make a lot of ammo for a number of years .
Did you just say you zero at 225yds?
Why are you measuring angles in inches?
So, whoever laid out your range put the targets in the wrong places, and you pay for that?
Did the swat guys give you a pin and salute you when they made you an honorary member? (Asking for my friend @Paparock)
No difference in felt recoil between different cartridges because you shoot so much?
Understood ,that's why I clarified I only do real dirty brass that way . Regular reloaded or factory brass , I dump cases in wash water agitate 20-30 minutes then tumble force dry . Time 2-2.5 hr. total . Works for ME .
1:14 would be MY Guess ( I've never actually checked it ) it runs , .52- .55 ( never put anything heavier in it ,NO reason just haven't ) really well and somewhere I read 1:12 twist were also available but I've never confirmed it either . 24" & 26" were available ,this is 24" .
Did you just say you zero at 225yds?
Why are you measuring angles in inches?
So, whoever laid out your range put the targets in the wrong places, and you pay for that?
Did the swat guys give you a pin and salute you when they made you an honorary member? (Asking for my friend @Paparock)
No difference in felt recoil between different cartridges because you shoot so much?
I simply listed known drift and drop according to MY book . I use Mil scopes for the most part but not always .
No salute although I'm Ex Military . Knowing many of the local sheriffs it was simply a good will gesture , Nothing official .
I sight ALL MY Rifles save for .17 .22 RF at 225 yd. ,as I've hunted since early 60's and 80 % of animals I've taken have been within that range. So closer lower hold . IF I'm shooting distances ,then drop and wind calculations are simply adjusted for MY zero . No real difference if 100, 200 , 225 ,300 yd. zero it's just math .
I was Never LEO . Rather a General Contractor and later and R&D Chemist ,who worked in Aerospace ,as a Composites Engr.
I run almost exclusively VV powders now . Checked one of MY books and see where I started at 43.5 gr. with H4350 and worked up a tad over 45 gr. but nothing more conclusive . So I figure it didn't work out for My Rifles .
That’s the original 120 AMAX loading below so I would start a little lower and work up.
That is interesting, a buddy gave me a box of AMax 120gr and it called for 39.9gr of Varget.
As I said that’s the original loading from 2008 as you can see in the serial number. They used H4350 for a few years and then started changing the powder used. It’s been a few powders over the years including Varget as they slowed it down as the 120 turned into more of a mid range load.
I do not but I just loaded some single charges under those to find pressure with Varget and Superformance. I will post results when I get a chance.
That’s awesome that you recall that from 2008!
Is there a reason hardly anyone runs 120’s.
Seems like 140gr is the norm now.
I was asking because that box of AMax was one ragged hole from my surgeon and I was hoping to replicate it.
Well it was new and I took a bunch of pics of the first lots sent out. Just kept them around for reference. Also if you look it references a 28” barrel which was also changed to 24” as that is what most factory rifles where coming out as at the time.
As to the 120 weight bullets I can only guess and say the lower BC hurts it in comparison to heavier bullets for long range. At mid range they can be fine. They will still work out at longer ranges as I have shot them in matches out last 1000 but they get pushed around a little more by the wind.
I am sure you can replicate it with Varget or any of the similar powders up to H4350 burn rate.
I was speaking generally, not you situation in particular. Asking the thread
Over the last 6 or 8 months I switched from 147gr ELD-M to 140gr ELD-M in my 26" Savage.
I have settled on 42.4gr H4350 and I get, consistently, 2830 fps average and a .6 moa average over close to 500 rounds.
I will be taking this round to a long range precision rifle course this summer where we can shoot out to 1240 yds to see how it works.
I have settled on 42.4gr H4350 and I get, consistently, 2830 fps average and a .6 moa average over close to 500 rounds.
I will be taking this round to a long range precision rifle course this summer where we can shoot out to 1240 yds to see how it works.
