Accuracy International Vs Custom for 6.5 Creedmoor

[Sgposin]

Hey guys getting ready to start my next build. I've always loved Accuracy International, but never owned one. I was looking at the AE Folder in 6.5 Creedmoor. Euro Optics has it for 4030.00. That got me thinking... How much would it cost to do a full custom. Here is what I came up with:

Defiance Deviant SA- 1300
J. Allen Stock loaded- 1680
Krieger Barrel- 400
Timney- 130
Smith work (Cerakote, threaded, barrel work etc.)- 750

Total 4260.00

That being said I will have a 7 month wait for the Action vs getting the AE right now. That seems to be the only real negative for the custom build. What do you guys think? What would you do?

 

[redneckbmxer24]

The reliability of an AI blows a custom out of the water. I've had both and my only regret is not buying my first AI sooner than I did, it would have saved me a lot of money and headaches.

I personally wouldn't buy an AE though, especially at that price. For the same price you can get the new AT with folding stock, double stack mags and quick change barrel. Then order your 6.5 barrel and sell the 308 barrel.

 

[Mark williams]

I just bought ae in 260 for my son and its absolute laser. Love everything about it, you woudnt go wrong!

 

[bogeybrown]

I've been pondering the same exact question, as I'm looking at $4300 or so for my next build (6.5CM on a Deviant action). Some of the new offerings are really the first things I've seen from AI that made me consider them instead of a custom.

For now I'm still leaning towards the custom, simply because I've wanted one of Marc's (Spartan Rifles) rifles for a while now. Who knows, I may end up doing the custom and lucking into a deal on someone's AI as they upgrade and doing them both.

 

[Sgposin]

The reliability of an AI blows a custom out of the water. I've had both and my only regret is not buying my first AI sooner than I did, it would have saved me a lot of money and headaches.

I personally wouldn't buy an AE though, especially at that price. For the same price you can get the new AT with folding stock, double stack mags and quick change barrel. Then order your 6.5 barrel and sell the 308 barrel.

Any word on Barrels for 6.5 being released?

 

[10fp]

not everyone likes the stiff(er) AI bolt throw.

 

[Masked]

The reliability of an AI blows a custom out of the water. I've had both and my only regret is not buying my first AI sooner than I did, it would have saved me a lot of money and headaches.

I personally wouldn't buy an AE though, especially at that price. For the same price you can get the new AT with folding stock, double stack mags and quick change barrel. Then order your 6.5 barrel and sell the 308 barrel.

I disagree with this...I mean, really?

The quality of the gun depends solely on the Gunsmith who worked on that gun.

I just finished a 300wm for arguably the same price as the new AT is...If I had JUST started building it, I would've gone for the AI but, I can still buy a new bolt/barrel and have all the work done for $700 or less...For a "swap", I just can't swap it myself.

Ultimately it comes down to what Gunsmiths you have access to. If you'd rather have a custom, go custom. If you'd rather have an AI, get an AT.

At the end of the day it's up to you but, AI has brought switch-barrel possibilities into the realm of affordability which, changes the game, a lot.

To say reliability blows a custom out of the water, though? That's just inaccurate.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Any word on Barrels for 6.5 being released?

They take the same barrels as the AW/AX so they're in stock ready to ship. AINA had a ton of them when I was down there last week.

not everyone likes the stiff(er) AI bolt throw.

The bolt lift on a AI is no stiffer than a 90 degree action. Don't make up crap.

 

[madAB]

Did you call and talk to EuroOptic about the price? I bet you could get it for a lot better price than that if you call and talk with them. They'll definitely work with you.

 

[Sgposin]

Did you call and talk to EuroOptic about the price? I bet you could get it for a lot better price than that if you call and talk with them. They'll definitely work with you.

Good to know!! Didn't know they would deal.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

To say reliability blows a custom out of the water, though? That's just inaccurate.

I've had 20-25 no expenses spared custom rifles. Out of those rifles I don't think I can fill up one hand with ones that ran flawlessly.

Let's think about this.

AI is building rifles, testing the hell out of them and then building thousands of the same gun. A gun smith is building a rifle from parts a customer specs. They are at the mercy of the parts. The testing is a basic function test and accuracy testing, they don't and can't put thousands of rounds through a platform to look for quirks. Some rifles built to the same specs (GAP crusader for example) are going to have a lot of T&E, and a lot more on a user level.

Too many times I've done the back and forth game trying to get a custom I spec'd to run right. I won't make that mistake again.

 

[Guy Montag]

The reliability of an AI blows a custom out of the water.

Blows MOST customs out of the water, but far from all of them.

 

[Masked]

I've had 20-25 no expenses spared custom rifles. Out of those rifles I don't think I can fill up one hand with ones that ran flawlessly.

Let's think about this.

AI is building rifles, testing the hell out of them and then building thousands of the same gun. A gun smith is building a rifle from parts a customer specs. They are at the mercy of the parts. The testing is a basic function test and accuracy testing, they don't and can't put thousands of rounds through a platform to look for quirks. Some rifles built to the same specs (GAP crusader for example) is going to have a lot of T&E, and a lot on a user level.

Too many times I've done the back and forth game trying to get a custom I spec'd to run right. I won't make that mistake again.

I've had an MRAD, had an Intervention -- I've blown more money on big manufacturer guns than I have customs.

It took me a LONG time to find a smith I trusted enough to do a custom rifle for me...Ironically, he's 7 miles from my doorstep.

That being said, my custom rifle has blown the Mrad out of the water...Target for target. There was just nowhere to shoot the Chey-tac...Which was money blown on my own gunwhore mentality but, again -- Not all factory rifles are the same.

I'm not disagreeing with the fact that the AT changes the game, I completely concur with that but, this rifle does not replace customs...Or shoot better than all customs.

If I want George to build me a custom 300wm, GAP is going to build that rifle with as much, if not more care than AI...It's going to shoot the same...The only issue with that rifle, is me.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

I don't care how accurate it is. My AI's have all been as accurate as my customs. I have a factory 700P that is just as accurate but you won't see me shooting a match with it because I don't trust it to run right. I care that the rifle runs like it's supposed to.

It's always the people who compare rifles as to how accurate they are that also excuse malfunctions.

 

[Guy Montag]

It's always the people who compare rifles as to how accurate they are that also excuse malfunctions.

Thousands of rounds through my X-Ray without a hiccup, so much for your "reliability" argument.

 

[Mirnyx]

To say reliability blows a custom out of the water, though? That's just inaccurate.

Is this even debatable? There's some good customs and quality smiths but AI's just get it done. Bottom line, if the lights go out, aliens invade, or zombies attack; I'm grabbing the AI over any custom or worked over factory action.

 

[LRJammer]

Is this even debatable? There's some good customs and quality smiths but AI's just get it done. Bottom line, if the lights go out, aliens invade, or zombies attack; I'm grabbing the AI over any custom or worked over factory action.

Agreed. When conditions are bad enough to make even the highest end customs puke, the AI just keeps hammering with as good or better accuracy.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Thousands of rounds through my X-Ray without a hiccup, so much for your "reliability" argument.

I was referring to the poster comparing the accuracy of a MRAD (which isn't known for stellar accuracy) to his custom.

I stand behind what I said and there are many that will agree. I use to think AI's were overhyped until I shot one and then bought one.

 

[Masked]

Is this even debatable? There's some good customs and quality smiths but AI's just get it done. Bottom line, if the lights go out, aliens invade, or zombies attack; I'm grabbing the AI over any custom or worked over factory action.

I'm grabbing my custom.

GAP gets it done. As does SAC...As do hundreds of other gunsmiths.

Saying the AI rules them all is a bit of a joke...Not knocking AI, knocking the opinion that a custom is not equal to an AI...

 

[Mirnyx]

Thousands of rounds through my X-Ray without a hiccup, so much for your "reliability" argument.

Is your X-ray a worked over 700 or built on a custom action?

 

[poison123]

I'm grabbing my custom.

GAP gets it done. As does SAC...As do hundreds of other gunsmiths.

Saying the AI rules them all is a bit of a joke...Not knocking AI, knocking the opinion that a custom is not equal to an AI...

*Cough* An AI with a GA Precision Barrel.....does kinda rule them all

 

[poison123]

Is your X-ray a worked over 700 or built on a custom action?

Its a TacOps.....so its a Rem700.

 

[Mirnyx]

Saying the AI rules them all is a bit of a joke...Not knocking AI, knocking the opinion that a custom is not equal to an AI...

Again, there are some great custom rifles and quality smiths. I'll concede customs give up nothing to AI in the accuracy department and in many cases offer better fit and finish. I'm confident the AI will still be functional when the custom gives up the ghost.

 

[AEROMechanic]

I'm grabbing my custom.

GAP gets it done. As does SAC...As do hundreds of other gunsmiths.

Saying the AI rules them all is a bit of a joke...Not knocking AI, knocking the opinion that a custom is not equal to an AI...

In the reliability department AI sits on top, whether you wish to aknowledge it or not is irrelevant.

 

[Guy Montag]

Is your X-ray a worked over 700 or built on a custom action?

Reworked 700, and like all of Mike's guns it's scary accurate and built for the Apocalypse!

I'm a huge AI fan and will sing their praises along with everyone, but what TacOps does to a Remington action has redefined what I thought possible.

 

[Sgposin]

Well I currently have a .308 with the exact custom specs I listed in my opening post, so having looked into the AT and reading the AT Thread, I'm going to go with it. At this point I will probably wait until they sell it with the 6.5 Creed barrel (as Mile high said they would) and maybe add some more as time goes by.

Thanks for all the input!

 

[tho98027]

I'm sure the AI is a more reliable rifle in harsh enviroments: wet, dry/dusty, icy conditions. I would love to eventually have an AI , but there are other rifles I would much rather have. I would easily take that custom build with the j allen stock and defiance action over the AI anyday.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Reworked 700, and like all of Mike's guns it's scary accurate and built for the Apocalypse!

I'm a huge AI fan and will sing their praises along with everyone, but what TacOps does to a Remington action has redefined what I thought possible.

So you have a custom R700 with a soldered on bolt handle, a weak extractor, and a weak bolt release? And you're telling me it's as reliable as a rifle with a solid handle, a M16 type extractor, and a side bolt release.... RIGHT.

There's a lot of smiths that build R700's with benchrest accuracy, but that doesn't mean it's tough nor reliable.

 

[BoilerUP]

I'm a poor Savage owner and recreational shooter that excuses malfunctions, so excuse my ignorance.

How many top tactical match shooters are running AIs?

There is little debate as to their ruggedness...but for the typical hobbiest or match shooter who will never need the weapon to defend life, is there really a NEED? I mean, do custom builds go down all the time in matches due to failures? That's what this thread might lead one to believe.

 

[rrflyer]

Not many.

AI makes a great rifle but the malfunctions I've seen in rifle comps are rarely rifle related. In fact it seems failures in a bolt gun as a whole are pretty dang rare

Feeding issues caused by ammo loaded to long is probably the most common.

There's guys that have shot way more than me though.

 

[Guy Montag]

So you have a custom R700 with a soldered on bolt handle, a weak extractor, and a weak bolt release? And you're telling me it's as reliable as a rifle with a solid handle, a M16 type extractor, and a side bolt release.... RIGHT.

There's a lot of smiths that build R700's with benchrest accuracy, but that doesn't mean it's tough nor reliable.

I didn't realize until you told me how unreliable and flimsy my TacOps rifles are, thanks for the pro tip.

Should I expect a problem after 10,000 rounds, or am just lucky so far?

 

[redneckbmxer24]

How many top tactical match shooters are running AIs?

Until AI starts sponsoring shooters you probably aren't going to see a whole lot, there are a few people shooting AI's though.

 

[Asperly Aimless]

With the sweet price and easy barrel change ability I would choose the AI AT FOR ME.

I have a few customs built on SPR actions and I do not regret them one bit. I hunt my guns hard, with many week/multiweek hunting/camping trips every year. Most of it is tent camping in primitive camping areas. My SPR customs have been snowed on, sleeted on, covered in dust/grit, and one even took a long slide and bounce down a hill side. They have all run flawlessly despite adverse conditions. Never an issue. They all have SAMMI chambers, and are cut to maximize stock magazine length loaded rds. Every night out camping I would just wipe them down with a piece of cloth, maybe give them some love with the OTIS, and call it a day. At least one of SPR's sees the range at least once a week. The amount of 6mm barrels I've burned up in .243 winchester is a bit ridiculous.

I say that to show that not all customs are shit, and that they can be/are reliable. I would put user error as the top reason guns "go down".

That being said, I'll say I have always wanted an AI, but never found them worth the cost of a few grand over a custom...until now. Ruggedness is part of my reason for buying an AI, but it is not the main reason. Accuracy and easy barrel/caliber changes at the same price of a custom WITHOUT the 6 month nail biting wait are my main reasons. I'm a patient person, and I'm lucky to have a local smith who can turn around a full build for me in two months, but at the end of the day if I want to change barrels I've got to use the barrel vice and action wrenches to do it.

With the AI AT I just loosen a bolt, unscrew barrel, screw in barrel, and done. Once the AT's start shipping, and I get one, my smith is on stand by to cut me two barrels in .243 winchester and one in 338 Federal. It's going to be awesome.

Choose a rifle based off of your NEEDS and WANTS and you'll be happy.

 

[LRJammer]

In the reliability department AI sits on top, whether you wish to aknowledge it or not is irrelevant.

Well said, and agreed.

 

[Mirnyx]

I'm a poor Savage owner and recreational shooter that excuses malfunctions, so excuse my ignorance.

How many top tactical match shooters are running AIs?

There is little debate as to their ruggedness...but for the typical hobbiest or match shooter who will never need the weapon to defend life, is there really a NEED? I mean, do custom builds go down all the time in matches due to failures? That's what this thread might lead one to believe.

I doubt you'll see many of the "top" tactical match shooters running AI's until they make a lightweight variant and sponsor a team.

What is a hobby shooter? In my mind you're a hobby shooter unless you're a military sniper, law enforcement sniper, or earn your living entirely from shooting matches. That makes most of us hobby shooters so why would any of us NEED customs or high-end factory rifles? There's plenty of discussion, pics, and videos of customs failing at matches right here on the hide. How often do you hear about AI's failing?

 

[Masked]

I doubt you'll see many of the "top" tactical match shooters running AI's until they make a lightweight variant and sponsor a team.

What is a hobby shooter? In my mind you're a hobby shooter unless you're a military sniper, law enforcement sniper, or earn your living entirely from shooting matches. That makes most of us hobby shooters so why would any of us NEED customs or high-end factory rifles? There's plenty of discussion, pics, and videos of customs failing at matches right here on the hide. How often do you hear about AI's failing?

Again, with a custom rifle you have a LCD - That's the Smith.

If a bad smith makes your rifle, regardless of what it is, AI or GAP or SAC, it's going to be bad.

So if I get a good custom and you get a bad AI, it is what it is.

That being said, as a hobby shooter, why in the hell do you need a rifle with 3 barrel swaps? -- And just because it's convenient, doesn't answer the question.

 

[Asperly Aimless]

That being said, as a hobby shooter, why in the hell do you need a rifle with 3 barrel swaps? -- And just because it's convenient, doesn't answer the question.

Because this is America and you buy what you want, not what you need.

 

[Sgposin]

because this is america and you buy what you want, not what you need.

merica!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Asperly Aimless]

I see I got off subject of the OP. He was asking about the AE. I apologize for waxing eloquent about the AI AT.

To answer the OP: Custom allows you to build the rifle to YOUR specs, exactly how you want it. No compromise. AE is ready to roll out of the box, but you may compromise on what YOU want in order to use it. It all comes down to what you want.

 

[ridenrunwv]

Most I know that have the money to buy whatever and use customs instead just don't like the weight or ergonomics of the Accuracy International Chassis.

 

[strike33]

I'll agree with that... the chassis is the only thing that turns me off of the AI, I've never felt comfortable behind it at least not the thumbhole. and the AX doesn't sit well with me either. if I could get the the barreled action into another chassis or a Manners I'd be golden

 

[Sgposin]

Actually I started it with the AE. I was only aware of the new MC ($$$$), not the AT. After looking at the AT it seems like a no brainer. But I may just throw a monkey wrench in this whole thread and look at the DTA SRS. Also for everyone, I can see the plus in a custom (your rifle your way) or a AI/DTA which both have proven to be extremely reliable. The truth is 95% of my shooting will be at the range so short of catastrophic malfunctions, I'm not too worried about it. As I said I have a custom, so that is the biggest reason I'm leaning toward AI or DTA. I think we can all agree that all the rifles we are talking about are top notch.

 

[Roddd]

For the OP, I'd call EuroOptic or Mile High and see how low they will go on an AE. The release of the new systems will drive the prices of the "old" guns down significantly. I think now is the time to strike on one. You'll be most pleased with your purchase.

 

[Rthur]

Not really wantin to join the pissin contest but here is some info. While at Rifles Only a few years ago they had an AI that had over 110k rounds on the action. I believe Frank said it was on it's 12-13 barrel or better. This may be an exceptional example for them but then again it may not.
There may be some rem 700 or clones out there with this many rounds but haven't seen them yet.

R

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Again, with a custom rifle you have a LCD - That's the Smith.

If a bad smith makes your rifle, regardless of what it is, AI or GAP or SAC, it's going to be bad.

So if I get a good custom and you get a bad AI, it is what it is.

That being said, as a hobby shooter, why in the hell do you need a rifle with 3 barrel swaps? -- And just because it's convenient, doesn't answer the question.

I've yet to see one of these bad AI's. So have you experienced one or just talking out of your rear again?

Not really wantin to join the pissin contest but here is some info. While at Rifles Only a few years ago they had an AI that had over 110k rounds on the action. I believe Frank said it was on it's 12-13 barrel or better. This may be an exceptional example for them but then again it may not.
There may be some rem 700 or clones out there with this many rounds but haven't seen them yet.

R

I doubt a 700 would make it to that. I put 5-10k through a 700's and they're were damn near worn out. I could see 20k but there's no way a 700 is getting close to that without a shit load of fixes.

 

[groundhogbuster]

Both my buddies with AI rifles in 6.5CM won't touch my Beanland 260 build for accuracy. Pretty close but they just won't do it, at least from 100-1k. The good thing is my latest build was just built off a 700 and for the Krieger, blueprint, PTG lug, Trued, HSP stock cut out and bedded, threaded and capped, and it didn't cost me even half of $4000. Do you wanna Hammer, or a Hammer with all the bells and whistles? I have went full custom, with Mcm stocks, Kelbly action, in my BR guns, but getting a super accurate rifle can be accomplished with much less $. Just ask Jon, (and the member on here) about the 22-250 that Jon set the barrel back on. Jon said it would out shoot most of the full blown custom builds he has saw.

 

[LRJammer]

Actually I started it with the AE. I was only aware of the new MC ($$$$), not the AT. After looking at the AT it seems like a no brainer. But I may just throw a monkey wrench in this whole thread and look at the DTA SRS. Also for everyone, I can see the plus in a custom (your rifle your way) or a AI/DTA which both have proven to be extremely reliable. The truth is 95% of my shooting will be at the range so short of catastrophic malfunctions, I'm not too worried about it. As I said I have a custom, so that is the biggest reason I'm leaning toward AI or DTA. I think we can all agree that all the rifles we are talking about are top notch.

After reading so much about DTAs, I was able to climb behind one at a shooting school last year and put some rounds down range. While I do love an AI and hope to have one of my own some day, I was really not impressed with the DTA. Just felt awkward to me. To each his own, one has to be comfortable with his gear to find happiness.

 

[Masked]

I've yet to see one of these bad AI's. So have you experienced one or just talking out of your rear again?

I've yet to see you make an intelligent statement so, I guess we're even.

It doesn't matter if you've seen one or not. Saying they don't exist is a fabrication of reality. It's a lie. There are always anomalies, always.

The most important factor with any gun is the smith.

If AI employs a bad smith, you get a bad rifle.

If I employ a bad smith, I get a bad rifle.

If I choose a smith from Tacticalrifles.net, there's a 99% chance that rifle will be a piece of shit.

If I get a GAP from George, there's a 100% chance my rifle will shoot THE EXACT SAME AS YOUR AI.

Does that make one or the other better? Absolutely not. What it does is it changed the onus from the manufacturer to the smith.

Will AI have less chance of failure? Absolutely.

I'm moving on, you clearly don't have a grasp on reality...I will be buying an AT but, I will still grab my 300wm 99% of the time because my custom rifle has proven itself well beyond that AT.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

I've yet to see you make an intelligent statement so, I guess we're even.

It doesn't matter if you've seen one or not. Saying they don't exist is a fabrication of reality. It's a lie. There are always anomalies, always.

The most important factor with any gun is the smith.

If AI employs a bad smith, you get a bad rifle.

If I employ a bad smith, I get a bad rifle.

If I choose a smith from Tacticalrifles.net, there's a 99% chance that rifle will be a piece of shit.

If I get a GAP from George, there's a 100% chance my rifle will shoot THE EXACT SAME AS YOUR AI.

Does that make one or the other better? Absolutely not. What it does is it changed the onus from the manufacturer to the smith.

Will AI have less chance of failure? Absolutely.

I'm moving on, you clearly don't have a grasp on reality...I will be buying an AT but, I will still grab my 300wm 99% of the time because my custom rifle has proven itself well beyond that AT.

I was down at AI recently, I didn't see any bad rifle...

Dave Tooley chambers AINA barrels from Bartlien blanks. AI CNC's there actions in the UK. They come here and one of a few armorers tighten down a barrel and a few screws and send them out the door. It's not rocket science.

Like I said, please show me a bad AI. Accuracy isn't everything, this whole ordeal is about reliability yet you keep beating around the bush thinking any given custom is just as good as an AI because it prints the same group on paper... That isn't so.

 

[Mirnyx]

Again, with a custom rifle you have a LCD - That's the Smith.

If a bad smith makes your rifle, regardless of what it is, AI or GAP or SAC, it's going to be bad.

So if I get a good custom and you get a bad AI, it is what it is.

That being said, as a hobby shooter, why in the hell do you need a rifle with 3 barrel swaps? -- And just because it's convenient, doesn't answer the question.

Smiths are one variable and you're right, a good one will certainly impact the finished product. Who's debating that? Let's be honest, we're debating actions here; Not barrels; Not stocks; Not smiths; Not accuracy.

AI makes a purpose built action and trigger that thrives in hard use environments. Tell me how the 700 clones have evolved for hard use environments. Better materials? "Tactical" features? Tighter tolerances? They certainly aren't pieces of shit but to say they stand equal with an AI, I don't see how anyone can draw that conclusion.

I don't need a rifle with 3 barrel swaps. I also don't need a flush toilet, running water, or most of the shit I've acquired in life either. So yes, just because does answer the question.