Armada vs Sequoia (2017-2020)

[Bantam1]

As a former Toyota technician I will vouch that they are typically well made and long lasting vehicles. Sure some have had issues, and Toyota has made mistakes. Like "most" Japanese companies they learn and improve. I cannot say the same for Nissan and other Japanese brands. I also agree 100% with using factory Toyota parts where it matters.

The best engine Toyota made was the 22RE paired with a 5 speed manual and a factory HD clutch. I witnessed several that had 300K-450K before they needed a rebuild. Timing chain guides like to wear out and allow the chain to cut into the timing chain cover and dump coolant into the oil pan. That typically would happen around 200K+. If you replace the chain and guides around 180k I think they would last beyond 450K. The Tacoma 4cyl seemed to be good. I left Toyota before seeing several with really high miles. The highest I witnessed was the Previa van that had 300k. Those had a Tacoma 4cyl turned sideways. Those vans had other issues that sucked to take care of, but pretty dependable despite being an ugly vehicle.

Others were good like the straight 6 in the later Land Cruisers like Alpine posted the pic of. Typically Toyota underpowers the vehicles to make them more durable. The rear drive or 4WD transmissions are solid. Not so much for the FWD, but better than most. The 3.0 V6 used in the late 80's-early 90's in the trucks and 4 Runner were garbage but they could last assuming you liked doing head gaskets. They were also way underpowered to the point it wasn't better than the 22RE.

The only other car I have personally seen with over 400K miles was a Mercedes Diesel from the early 80's. The customer refused to fly so he drove everywhere. It was all original except tires and bulbs. Gutless wonder, but it was durable.

 

[plh]

As a former Toyota technician I will vouch that they are typically well made and long lasting vehicles.

Any thoughts/recommendations on the last LC Model? Bought new for $83k in '21 as a final travel vehicle for me and the missus.

 

[Bantam1]

I have been out of that game for many years now. I can only read others comments on the durability and reliability of the new models. I left the Toyota world in 2000 to build race cars and trucks. Now I work for a large fishing tackle manufacturer.

 

[Alpine 338]

Any thoughts/recommendations on the last LC Model? Bought new for $83k in '21 as a final travel vehicle for me and the missus.

Are you aware of the climate control fresh air / recirculating air door potential issue?

Need to verify you don't have an issue, then lock your glove box every time you take it in for service.

PM me, and I'll give you the details.

 

[n2ishun]

As a former Toyota technician I will vouch that they are typically well made and long lasting vehicles. Sure some have had issues, and Toyota has made mistakes. Like "most" Japanese companies they learn and improve. I cannot say the same for Nissan and other Japanese brands. I also agree 100% with using factory Toyota parts where it matters.

The best engine Toyota made was the 22RE paired with a 5 speed manual and a factory HD clutch. I witnessed several that had 300K-450K before they needed a rebuild. Timing chain guides like to wear out and allow the chain to cut into the timing chain cover and dump coolant into the oil pan. That typically would happen around 200K+. If you replace the chain and guides around 180k I think they would last beyond 450K. The Tacoma 4cyl seemed to be good. I left Toyota before seeing several with really high miles. The highest I witnessed was the Previa van that had 300k. Those had a Tacoma 4cyl turned sideways. Those vans had other issues that sucked to take care of, but pretty dependable despite being an ugly vehicle.

Others were good like the straight 6 in the later Land Cruisers like Alpine posted the pic of. Typically Toyota underpowers the vehicles to make them more durable. The rear drive or 4WD transmissions are solid. Not so much for the FWD, but better than most. The 3.0 V6 used in the late 80's-early 90's in the trucks and 4 Runner were garbage but they could last assuming you liked doing head gaskets. They were also way underpowered to the point it wasn't better than the 22RE.

The only other car I have personally seen with over 400K miles was a Mercedes Diesel from the early 80's. The customer refused to fly so he drove everywhere. It was all original except tires and bulbs. Gutless wonder, but it was durable.

I worked for them too....way back when :/
The 18RC and 20R were much better than even the 22RE, they both used double row timing chains unlike the single row 22RE.

The Previa had a problem with the balancer getting loose and wobbling, killing the snout of the crankshaft.
There was one that was super bad and the customer begged me to do something.
Against my better judgement, I welded the balancer to the crank and had to use a bunch of dripping wet rags behind it to keep from melting the crank seal. That guy drove that van for at least another 100k miles after that.

I also had a customer that was a blood delivery company like I'm sure you see on the road.
They had a 22RE pickup that had 440,000 miles (+/-) in 1 year....not kidding a bit.
It had never had the spark plugs changed, they were innies instead of outies (the tips).
The vehicle ran at least 23.5 hours a day, every day, only stopping to change drivers or fill the gas tank.

My step brother had a old Volvo "Amazon" (122 if I remember right) that had 650,000+ miles on it when he sold it.
I know the new owner put at least another 100k on it, original engine, clutch, trans, rear end.
You might remember those old dogs, had a tape style speedometer that extended from left to right (kinda hard to 'splain).
Best I could find....starts at about 1 minute in...

 

[plh]

Are you aware of the climate control fresh air / recirculating air door potential issue?

Need to verify you don't have an issue, then lock your glove box every time you take it in for service.

PM me, and I'll give you the details.

PM sent, thanks!!

 

[Tokay444]

Nissan are French now, and the French make terrible cars. Toyota is still Japanese and make more product domestically than about any other big brand. The choice is clear.

 

[BytorJr]

I guess my biggest issue with my current Sequoia is that the paint isn't so great (knew that going in) but the brakes really worry me carrying any kind of heavy load (and I've not towed a car with it due to that) and I'm not 100% sold on the transmission. Just passed 180K. I've had it for 50k.

I just did all new brakes and brake lines this summer - Toyota TRD pads (but not rotors). Still not a great braking vehicle...even for 5500 lbs. My guess is the master cylinder was undersized in the Gen I Sequoias.

Damn Land Cruiser prices have skyrocketed and finding a non-ragged out Gen II Sequoia with < 100K is hard to do around here. Most have been kid haulers and have "kid stains" everywhere. Other issue with the LC is I'm not sure I can get all my steel target shit in one - (4 to 5) stands, 2x4, plates for some pistol practice (that's not a quality issue though).

 

[Alpine 338]

I think with what you need it to do, a gen 2 Sequoia would be better than the LC. The Sequoia/Tundra have better brakes, and some of the hard core LC guys are putting the Tundra brakes in their LC's. Plus the Sequoia has a slightly longer wheelbase and wider stance, which would be better for towing.

 

[BCP]

I guess my biggest issue with my current Sequoia is that the paint isn't so great (knew that going in) but the brakes really worry me carrying any kind of heavy load (and I've not towed a car with it due to that) and I'm not 100% sold on the transmission. Just passed 180K. I've had it for 50k.

I just did all new brakes and brake lines this summer - Toyota TRD pads (but not rotors). Still not a great braking vehicle...even for 5500 lbs. My guess is the master cylinder was undersized in the Gen I Sequoias.

Damn Land Cruiser prices have skyrocketed and finding a non-ragged out Gen II Sequoia with < 100K is hard to do around here. Most have been kid haulers and have "kid stains" everywhere. Other issue with the LC is I'm not sure I can get all my steel target shit in one - (4 to 5) stands, 2x4, plates for some pistol practice (that's not a quality issue though).

A couple others I'd throw out there would be a used subaru or a ford raptor. Subarus have decent ground clearance, good AWD, the wagons have tons of storage, made in Japan, economical, safe etc. Raptor you get a big engine, fox shocks, big tires, locking diff, good resale. The old V8 models use the 6.2 which is a fleet motor so they last awhile if maintained.

 

[Alpine 338]

A couple others I'd throw out there would be a used subaru or a ford raptor. Subarus have decent ground clearance, good AWD, the wagons have tons of storage, made in Japan, economical, safe etc. Raptor you get a big engine, fox shocks, big tires, locking diff, good resale. The old V8 models use the 6.2 which is a fleet motor so they last awhile if maintained.

Raptor suspension is not set up for hauling heavy cargo or towing.

 

[BCP]

Raptor suspension is not set up for hauling heavy cargo or towing.

I was thinking more for an offroad hunter/shooter mobile, if you tow a lot of stuff eventually you will want a 3/4 ton even an old one for the suspension and bed capacity.

 

[Bantam1]

I worked for them too....way back when :/
The 18RC and 20R were much better than even the 22RE, they both used double row timing chains unlike the single row 22RE.

The Previa had a problem with the balancer getting loose and wobbling, killing the snout of the crankshaft.
There was one that was super bad and the customer begged me to do something.
Against my better judgement, I welded the balancer to the crank and had to use a bunch of dripping wet rags behind it to keep from melting the crank seal. That guy drove that van for at least another 100k miles after that.

I also had a customer that was a blood delivery company like I'm sure you see on the road.
They had a 22RE pickup that had 440,000 miles (+/-) in 1 year....not kidding a bit.
It had never had the spark plugs changed, they were innies instead of outies (the tips).
The vehicle ran at least 23.5 hours a day, every day, only stopping to change drivers or fill the gas tank.

My step brother had a old Volvo "Amazon" (122 if I remember right) that had 650,000+ miles on it when he sold it.
I know the new owner put at least another 100k on it, original engine, clutch, trans, rear end.
You might remember those old dogs, had a tape style speedometer that extended from left to right (kinda hard to 'splain).
Best I could find....starts at about 1 minute in...

The worst thing I had to deal with on the Previa was the stupid SAD shaft, especially on the AWD models. Dumbest design ever. I never had the balancer issue on any during my years. Just the magic straw sounding mufflers and the SAD shaft rubber isolators going bad. Oh and the sliding door rollers going bad.

I didn't work on any 18RE motors. The 20RE here and there, but I don't remember them having the double row chain. Maybe there was a change on the later engines, or they had been replaced by the time I got into them? We were in a more affluent area so we didn't see a lot of the older stuff. It was rare when one would come in outside of the original Land Cruiser here and there or maybe an older Cressida.

Auto Trader had a few trucks that were 22RE converted to propane. Those had a lot of miles on them and never needed anything outside of basic maintenance.

The Toyota Tech center was close to the dealership I worked at. I spent a lot of time working with the techs we would call when we couldn't figure out the hard problems. They also came to the dealership a lot to test things and look at vehicles with higher mileage. The Avalon wind noise reduction kits came out of our testing and measuring for example. We were also the first dealership to do the frame replacements and coil bucket reinforcement weld in supports for Tacoma when they had the issues/recall. Those tech center techs were good. Working with those guys is the only thing I miss from my Toyota days.

I spent a little time with the TRD guys when they were local. We helped with the supercharger development for the Tacoma/4 Runner and they were trying to make one for the V6 Camry and Avalon. I don't know if they ever got that one finished as I had left by that time.

 

[LMTMWS]

Interesting. Never heard anybody defend Land Rover’s reliability. Has something changed? I do realize they have a cult following like the Land Cruiser. Keep in mind I’m looking for a longer wheelbase because of the towing.

The difference is that the Land Cruiser deserves the following. I drove around factory Landcruisers, G5s, suburbans, Mercedes cars, BMW cars with factory LVL 7 armor, Hiluxes, Tahoes, Expeditions, and some others that had been retrofitted with LVL 7 armor all over in Afghanistan and Iraq for about 15 years. The Landcruisers and Hiluxes were by far the only ones that actually lasted.

 

[BytorJr]

The difference is that the Land Cruiser deserves the following. I drove around factory Landcruisers, G5s, suburbans, Mercedes cars, BMW cars with factory LVL 7 armor, Hiluxes, Tahoes, Expeditions, and some others that had been retrofitted with LVL 7 armor all over in Afghanistan and Iraq for about 15 years. The Landcruisers and Hiluxes were by far the only ones that actually lasted.

Yes, I agree. LC deserves the reputation. Land Rover...does too...just not a positive one . Fan of Toyota trucks; but not so much their FWD cars. Transmission weak from the two my sister has owned (then again, I question whether she could destroy a battleship).

 

[BCP]

I wish that we could get the retro clunky looking landcruiser/hilux trucks here in the USA. Like the Landcruiser 79.