Bartlein Barrels Update

[45-90]

I've been in manufacturing now for 40 years. Gun barrels themselves almost 30.

Here is the issue... it's not as easy as you or some others would think.

We've put more machines online over time... but you have a domino effect... we can say... lets build another rifler and we are actually toying with the idea again.... but you have to look at the whole picture... you have to look back at the whole process.... can the bore reamers and prelapping processes keep up... if you say yes... then you go back further... can the guys in contouring/lathe work keep up... if you say no... your then adding another contouring machine... and a guy to run it.... if you are adding a lathe for contour work... then you have to go back to the gun drilling.... can the gun drills keep up to feed the lathes and the whole process etc...

Actually looking at getting another gun drill as well.

You also have to look at the capital investment... is the work load going to be there a few months or a year from now etc... Yes I don't see it going anywhere.

Right now... it's not actual machine time that is the issue... it's the people time is what we are lacking. We cannot for the most part find quality people to work. One is salary... even if we agree on a starting salary.... right now the only open spots are on 2nd shift. Nobody wants to work 2nd shift. For the most part we don't have a 3rd shift so don't even go there.

At the peak of covid... we ran the shop 24 hours a day... and for several months... 7 days a week. Daytime guys started at 4am.. worked till 4pm and the 2nd shift guys came in at around 3:30pm/4pm time frame and worked till 4am. We alternated crews every other weekend so guys had time off for the weekends primarily on Sundays. Maybe 5 to 7 of us worked one Sunday and then a different group of guys worked the next Sunday. For a span of about 9 months there where 3 to 4 guys that were putting in 35 hours a week of overtime!!!!!

We hired two guys back in Nov and Dec. time frame. I interviewed another guy and we agreed on wages etc.... took about 4 weeks of going back and forth. He knew up front.... he had to start on 2nd shift. I told him there will be weeks where you can come in and work 1st shift but cannot guarantee it all the time. He plenty of experience in drilling and turning and doing finished test barrel work. He was a perfect fit... then his wife said no to 2nd shift... that killed it.

Also we are not just going to hire anyone just to throw people at the problem. That doesn't solve anything.

Later, Frank

This is a good productive discussion.

Does a small company expand to meet demand or stay in the comfort zone?

After the nuclear collapse, I started with a small company. The two owners fought over expansion and CNC equipment so much, one sold the company to the one who wanted to expand.
The new owner changed the company name and went right after the expansionist idea.
I was hired to run the New CNC lathe.
Everything went good for a few yrs, then came the layoffs. Working in a mostly empty shop on a new job, the owner came to me and said he had just financed his house to make payroll, and would really appreciate it if I didn't scrap one of these expensive copper blanks.
I assured him I would not.
That almost collapse grew into one of the most successful state of art machining centers in the state.
Huge expansions many new buildings full of CNC equipment and nice new offices.
World wide contracts, and cornered 52% of the world's market in area that I worked in, and started.
Just me and my helper made half of the first million dollar month in the company history.

How did we do it?
Work our asses off, bring new developments into the processes.
We strive to be the best, no one in the world will out work us, no one will be as productive or out think us, we are never satisfied with our excellence, tomorrow is a new day for even more accomplishments.
Be a student of your work, learn, learn, learn, and make a contribution.

The company job, IS the employees job.
Your wife will leave you on day shift as easily as she will on night shift.
Mine left on day shift... so let's get to work.

Hire that working supervisor, a hardass company team leader, a motivator, and extreme leader. The supervisor who will clean your machine sump out, while you check in material for machining, do the dirty job for his helper or fellow machinst...supervisors don't do that, or lend a hand and do part of the other guy's job when he's behind plus yours.
Never laugh at someone's mistake, it cost us all, and now you all are not allowed to have a scrap part all month...gets their attention.
Nothing better in a manufacturing or machining company, than to have people you can count on that always have your back...assemble "that team" like your life depends on it, cause financially it does.

Companies need people who will work.
Whatever it takes...do your part.

So Frank would you volunteer to take a team on the 2nd or 3rd shift and give up the day shift that you worked so hard to be on?
I did, more than a few times, about 15 yrs worth...what ever it takes to build the company.
I trained 22 machinist for this particular job on 7 years before retiring. A lot of them just won't do heavy continous work.
Certain companies have better workers when looking for laid off machinist.
HP machinist are duds ...they are lazy and Woke before Woke was invented.

Son's who's fathers owned small machine shops are good, farm kids who want something else as helpers, some former aerospace, many veterans who have it together, my supervisor was a naval officer, not real likable but did his job, kinda like me I suppose, but might I win ya over eventually. I was always an overachiever, 2nd fastest in the state track meet, but no one cares about 2nd place. Live and learn.

Bartlein as company has decisions to make. Nothing here is easy, if it was everyone else would be doing it.
It's all hard, difficult, and almost impossible.
Always keep the CNCs running they are too expensive just sitting there.
I usually run two at a time, wear them out in 5 yrs. Running 2 10 hr shifts. Making over $2500 per hr minus $1200 for material, wages, overhead.
When I volunteered to night shift other CNCs are open, I run up to 4 CNC mills, at a time voluntary... kinda.
You want production, it's one way to get it.
You have cycle time don't just stand around, grab a cup of coffee and go to work...Do Not Ever run out of coffee.
When I retired, the owner told me, "I'll probably never find another employee who works like you." My answer, " probably not".
I had higher paying offers, but declined them. Loyalty has a price, but helping build a company was priceless.
Like coming across the finish line at a State track meet first instead of second, simply the best....
How much do you want to win?...how hard are "you" willing to work?

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

I've never really had to wait on a barrel for a long time and I only use Bartlein. Every time I've needed one, frank has either been able to get it to me quickly or pointed me to a vendor who had it in stock. I'd be thinking long and hard before I added anything, though I do think his workload will continue so it's probably a safe bet....it's still a bet and it's easy to do when it's with someone else's money. It's not so easy when it's risking your own, as well as the jobs of all those you employ, who count on you for their paychecks

 

[oldrifleman]

This is a good productive discussion.

Does a small company expand to meet demand or stay in the comfort zone?

After the nuclear collapse, I started with a small company. The two owners fought over expansion and CNC equipment so much, one sold the company to the one who wanted to expand.
The new owner changed the company name and went right after the expansionist idea.
I was hired to run the New CNC lathe.
Everything went good for a few yrs, then came the layoffs. Working in a mostly empty shop on a new job, the owner came to me and said he had just financed his house to make payroll, and would really appreciate it if I didn't scrap one of these expensive copper blanks.
I assured him I would not.
That almost collapse grew into one of the most successful state of art machining centers in the state.
Huge expansions many new buildings full of CNC equipment and nice new offices.
World wide contracts, and cornered 52% of the world's market in area that I worked in, and started.
Just me and my helper made half of the first million dollar month in the company history.

How did we do it?
Work our asses off, bring new developments into the processes.
We strive to be the best, no one in the world will out work us, no one will be as productive or out think us, we are never satisfied with our excellence, tomorrow is a new day for even more accomplishments.
Be a student of your work, learn, learn, learn, and make a contribution.

The company job, IS the employees job.
Your wife will leave you on day shift as easily as she will on night shift.
Mine left on day shift... so let's get to work.

Hire that working supervisor, a hardass company team leader, a motivator, and extreme leader. The supervisor who will clean your machine sump out, while you check in material for machining, do the dirty job for his helper or fellow machinst...supervisors don't do that, or lend a hand and do part of the other guy's job when he's behind plus yours.
Never laugh at someone's mistake, it cost us all, and now you all are not allowed to have a scrap part all month...gets their attention.
Nothing better in a manufacturing or machining company, than to have people you can count on that always have your back...assemble "that team" like your life depends on it, cause financially it does.

Companies need people who will work.
Whatever it takes...do your part.

So Frank would you volunteer to take a team on the 2nd or 3rd shift and give up the day shift that you worked so hard to be on?
I did, more than a few times, about 15 yrs worth...what ever it takes to build the company.
I trained 22 machinist for this particular job on 7 years before retiring. A lot of them just won't do heavy continous work.
Certain companies have better workers when looking for laid off machinist.
HP machinist are duds ...they are lazy and Woke before Woke was invented.

Son's who's fathers owned small machine shops are good, farm kids who want something else as helpers, some former aerospace, many veterans who have it together, my supervisor was a naval officer, not real likable but did his job, kinda like me I suppose, but might I win ya over eventually. I was always an overachiever, 2nd fastest in the state track meet, but no one cares about 2nd place. Live and learn.

Bartlein as company has decisions to make. Nothing here is easy, if it was everyone else would be doing it.
It's all hard, difficult, and almost impossible.
Always keep the CNCs running they are too expensive just sitting there.
I usually run two at a time, wear them out in 5 yrs. Running 2 10 hr shifts. Making over $2500 per hr minus $1200 for material, wages, overhead.
When I volunteered to night shift other CNCs are open, I run up to 4 CNC mills, at a time voluntary... kinda.
You want production, it's one way to get it.
You have cycle time don't just stand around, grab a cup of coffee and go to work...Do Not Ever run out of coffee.
When I retired, the owner told me, "I'll probably never find another employee who works like you." My answer, " probably not".
I had higher paying offers, but declined them. Loyalty has a price, but helping build a company was priceless.
Like coming across the finish line at a State track meet first instead of second, simply the best....
How much do you want to win?...how hard are "you" willing to work?

I totally disagree with you! The basis of your premise is right on, the application is Shit. You have no idea the market that truly exists here. You think Frank has not looked at how many barrels of his quality he could sell on an on-going basis? He said he had and looked at the basis of investment. He also knows the labor force in his area and understands the risk of bringing in new staff. If he doubled down without an on-going market that is not double its current size, it is a bust. I do not see him branching into non-barrels, but I don’t know him that well. You grew your market by diversifying, he owns a fair size piece of the existing market by being the best and ensures his business by maintaining a stable backlog. Not every business needs to grow that big or take the risks you did ( they paid off well for you!). Still not sure what sparked your tirade but I think frank has made his position pretty clear.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

I totally disagree with you! The basis of your premise is right on, the application is Shit. You have no idea the market that truly exists here. You think Frank has not looked at how many barrels of his quality he could sell on an on-going basis? He said he had and looked at the basis of investment. He also knows the labor force in his area and understands the risk of bringing in new staff. If he doubled down without an on-going market that is not double its current size, it is a bust. I do not see him branching into non-barrels, but I don’t know him that well. You grew your market by diversifying, he owns a fair size piece of the existing market by being the best and ensures his business by maintaining a stable backlog. Not every business needs to grow that big or take the risks you did ( they paid off well for you!). Still not sure what sparked your tirade but I think frank has made his position pretty clear.

this is the first and likely only time I will ever see eye to eye with you. Starting to wonder if something big is coming?

 

[45-90]

I totally disagree with you! The basis of your premise is right on, the application is Shit. You have no idea the market that truly exists here. You think Frank has not looked at how many barrels of his quality he could sell on an on-going basis? He said he had and looked at the basis of investment. He also knows the labor force in his area and understands the risk of bringing in new staff. If he doubled down without an on-going market that is not double its current size, it is a bust. I do not see him branching into non-barrels, but I don’t know him that well. You grew your market by diversifying, he owns a fair size piece of the existing market by being the best and ensures his business by maintaining a stable backlog. Not every business needs to grow that big or take the risks you did ( they paid off well for you!). Still not sure what sparked your tirade but I think frank has made his position pretty clear.

You are welcome to your opinion...as am I

 

[oldrifleman]

You are welcome to your opinion...as am I

Both valid sir

 

[demarpaint]

This is a good productive discussion.

Does a small company expand to meet demand or stay in the comfort zone?

After the nuclear collapse, I started with a small company. The two owners fought over expansion and CNC equipment so much, one sold the company to the one who wanted to expand.
The new owner changed the company name and went right after the expansionist idea.
I was hired to run the New CNC lathe.
Everything went good for a few yrs, then came the layoffs. Working in a mostly empty shop on a new job, the owner came to me and said he had just financed his house to make payroll, and would really appreciate it if I didn't scrap one of these expensive copper blanks.
I assured him I would not.
That almost collapse grew into one of the most successful state of art machining centers in the state.
Huge expansions many new buildings full of CNC equipment and nice new offices.
World wide contracts, and cornered 52% of the world's market in area that I worked in, and started.
Just me and my helper made half of the first million dollar month in the company history.

How did we do it?
Work our asses off, bring new developments into the processes.
We strive to be the best, no one in the world will out work us, no one will be as productive or out think us, we are never satisfied with our excellence, tomorrow is a new day for even more accomplishments.
Be a student of your work, learn, learn, learn, and make a contribution.

The company job, IS the employees job.
Your wife will leave you on day shift as easily as she will on night shift.
Mine left on day shift... so let's get to work.

Hire that working supervisor, a hardass company team leader, a motivator, and extreme leader. The supervisor who will clean your machine sump out, while you check in material for machining, do the dirty job for his helper or fellow machinst...supervisors don't do that, or lend a hand and do part of the other guy's job when he's behind plus yours.
Never laugh at someone's mistake, it cost us all, and now you all are not allowed to have a scrap part all month...gets their attention.
Nothing better in a manufacturing or machining company, than to have people you can count on that always have your back...assemble "that team" like your life depends on it, cause financially it does.

Companies need people who will work.
Whatever it takes...do your part.

So Frank would you volunteer to take a team on the 2nd or 3rd shift and give up the day shift that you worked so hard to be on?
I did, more than a few times, about 15 yrs worth...what ever it takes to build the company.
I trained 22 machinist for this particular job on 7 years before retiring. A lot of them just won't do heavy continous work.
Certain companies have better workers when looking for laid off machinist.
HP machinist are duds ...they are lazy and Woke before Woke was invented.

Son's who's fathers owned small machine shops are good, farm kids who want something else as helpers, some former aerospace, many veterans who have it together, my supervisor was a naval officer, not real likable but did his job, kinda like me I suppose, but might I win ya over eventually. I was always an overachiever, 2nd fastest in the state track meet, but no one cares about 2nd place. Live and learn.

Bartlein as company has decisions to make. Nothing here is easy, if it was everyone else would be doing it.
It's all hard, difficult, and almost impossible.
Always keep the CNCs running they are too expensive just sitting there.
I usually run two at a time, wear them out in 5 yrs. Running 2 10 hr shifts. Making over $2500 per hr minus $1200 for material, wages, overhead.
When I volunteered to night shift other CNCs are open, I run up to 4 CNC mills, at a time voluntary... kinda.
You want production, it's one way to get it.
You have cycle time don't just stand around, grab a cup of coffee and go to work...Do Not Ever run out of coffee.
When I retired, the owner told me, "I'll probably never find another employee who works like you." My answer, " probably not".
I had higher paying offers, but declined them. Loyalty has a price, but helping build a company was priceless.
Like coming across the finish line at a State track meet first instead of second, simply the best....
How much do you want to win?...how hard are "you" willing to work?

That's a great rare story of success. The problem is you have to find the right people, and that's the daunting task in all of this. A stumbling block that can destroy a business if not carefully and perfectly monitored. People are funny, you can make and sell 100 barrels, 99 of which are flawless and have 99 satisfied customers. The one bad barrel can cause more harm to the company rep than the good rep the 99 made. It's not impossible to expand, it is extremely difficult. Your boss nailed it when he said he'd never find another employee like you, Frank probably won't either.

 

[RUN8]

Hell it’s hard enough to find business owners who are dedicated enough to succeed, much less employees who have that kind of drive.

I don’t claim to have that drive any more.

My employer has made it amply clear to the peons who man the trains, build and maintain the track, dispatch, and do all the other activities that keep the RR working that they hate all of us. Now we hate them too. We don’t do favors anymore, it only results in worse days at work for us with no return favors; just more scorn.

Only 14 more years to retirement. I’m in it for my family and me now, my efforts to be proactive and helpful were not rewarded so why bother?

 

[Thump_rrr]

This is a good productive discussion.

Does a small company expand to meet demand or stay in the comfort zone?

After the nuclear collapse, I started with a small company. The two owners fought over expansion and CNC equipment so much, one sold the company to the one who wanted to expand.
The new owner changed the company name and went right after the expansionist idea.
I was hired to run the New CNC lathe.
Everything went good for a few yrs, then came the layoffs. Working in a mostly empty shop on a new job, the owner came to me and said he had just financed his house to make payroll, and would really appreciate it if I didn't scrap one of these expensive copper blanks.
I assured him I would not.
That almost collapse grew into one of the most successful state of art machining centers in the state.
Huge expansions many new buildings full of CNC equipment and nice new offices.
World wide contracts, and cornered 52% of the world's market in area that I worked in, and started.
Just me and my helper made half of the first million dollar month in the company history.

How did we do it?
Work our asses off, bring new developments into the processes.
We strive to be the best, no one in the world will out work us, no one will be as productive or out think us, we are never satisfied with our excellence, tomorrow is a new day for even more accomplishments.
Be a student of your work, learn, learn, learn, and make a contribution.

The company job, IS the employees job.
Your wife will leave you on day shift as easily as she will on night shift.
Mine left on day shift... so let's get to work.

Hire that working supervisor, a hardass company team leader, a motivator, and extreme leader. The supervisor who will clean your machine sump out, while you check in material for machining, do the dirty job for his helper or fellow machinst...supervisors don't do that, or lend a hand and do part of the other guy's job when he's behind plus yours.
Never laugh at someone's mistake, it cost us all, and now you all are not allowed to have a scrap part all month...gets their attention.
Nothing better in a manufacturing or machining company, than to have people you can count on that always have your back...assemble "that team" like your life depends on it, cause financially it does.

Companies need people who will work.
Whatever it takes...do your part.

So Frank would you volunteer to take a team on the 2nd or 3rd shift and give up the day shift that you worked so hard to be on?
I did, more than a few times, about 15 yrs worth...what ever it takes to build the company.
I trained 22 machinist for this particular job on 7 years before retiring. A lot of them just won't do heavy continous work.
Certain companies have better workers when looking for laid off machinist.
HP machinist are duds ...they are lazy and Woke before Woke was invented.

Son's who's fathers owned small machine shops are good, farm kids who want something else as helpers, some former aerospace, many veterans who have it together, my supervisor was a naval officer, not real likable but did his job, kinda like me I suppose, but might I win ya over eventually. I was always an overachiever, 2nd fastest in the state track meet, but no one cares about 2nd place. Live and learn.

Bartlein as company has decisions to make. Nothing here is easy, if it was everyone else would be doing it.
It's all hard, difficult, and almost impossible.
Always keep the CNCs running they are too expensive just sitting there.
I usually run two at a time, wear them out in 5 yrs. Running 2 10 hr shifts. Making over $2500 per hr minus $1200 for material, wages, overhead.
When I volunteered to night shift other CNCs are open, I run up to 4 CNC mills, at a time voluntary... kinda.
You want production, it's one way to get it.
You have cycle time don't just stand around, grab a cup of coffee and go to work...Do Not Ever run out of coffee.
When I retired, the owner told me, "I'll probably never find another employee who works like you." My answer, " probably not".
I had higher paying offers, but declined them. Loyalty has a price, but helping build a company was priceless.
Like coming across the finish line at a State track meet first instead of second, simply the best....
How much do you want to win?...how hard are "you" willing to work?

I am nearing my 60’s and own a small mechanical contracting company with a partner.
We decided over a decade ago that we will stay small with around 6 employees because if we expand to the next level it would need to be around 25 employees to make any economic sense due to the higher overhead brought on by the additional positions required to run a company of that size. Additionally in my business all clients are net 60 days so you are financing millions of dollars at any given moment.

Making that step is more of a quality of life step than anything else and there is nothing wrong with that.
I know too many guys that dropped dead before they got to retirement.

 

[demarpaint]

I am nearing my 60’s and own a small mechanical contracting company with a partner.
We decided over a decade ago that we will stay small with around 6 employees because if we expand to the next level it would need to be around 25 employees to make any economic sense due to the higher overhead brought on by the additional positions required to run a company of that size. Additionally in my business all clients are net 60 days so you are financing millions of dollars at any given moment.

Making that step is more of a quality of life step than anything else and there is nothing wrong with that.
I know too many guys that dropped dead before they got to retirement.

Years ago I experimented with expanding from time to time. What I learned was there was a sweet spot, meaning lets say I typically ran a four man crew, I learned that crew was the most profitable and efficient. Once we got to lets say a six man crew I became a full time baby sitter. That meant any work that I was getting done wasn't getting done, and I had a higher payroll with less profit. We added a truck and another four man crew which my brother ran, successfully, however keeping a workload for eight men wasn't easy, and at times more of a headache than it was worth. I found jobs for the good men on that crew and dissolved it. Small businesses that want to expand have to find that sweet spot, it isn't as easy as hiring more help. Today a lot of people feel they're entitled to a paycheck just for showing up. They feel hey I'm here you have to pay me. I'm glad those days are long gone.

 

[45-90]

That's a great rare story of success. The problem is you have to find the right people, and that's the daunting task in all of this. A stumbling block that can destroy a business if not carefully and perfectly monitored. People are funny, you can make and sell 100 barrels, 99 of which are flawless and have 99 satisfied customers. The one bad barrel can cause more harm to the company rep than the good rep the 99 made. It's not impossible to expand, it is extremely difficult. Your boss nailed it when he said he'd never find another employee like you, Frank probably won't either.

When I started my apprenticeship, I worked with a few guys that had served in WW2 born in the early 1920s.
They went to college on the GI bill, most served in the military, a few my age were back from Vietnam, thinking they might want to be machinist.
Many lived through the Great Depression.
These were tough SOBs, becareful cause they'd threaten to kick your ass if you touched their tool box without permission.
You had to prove yourself worthy of being an apprentice.
After you become a journeymen 5 yrs of training and a couple at yrs at school and have paid your dues, you became one of the club, a Union machinist.
I was the youngest journeyman, All these guys are dead now except one.. . I worked with most of these guys 24 yrs, no one in this group ever quits. They have your back, they are never late for work, they don't call in sick... you are expected do the same.
After 15 yrs I became their team leader, it was an honor to work with these men.

When I was hired by a small struggling company, who purchased a new CNC lathe that needed to be up and running there was already a difference in the quality of the employee, I was older now, one of the old guys.
But I brought my work ethics with me...it shouldn't have stood out because it seemed normal to me... but by now it was becoming unusual to work hard for your company, take pride in your work, take charge of the job, your competition is the whole world, but so is your market.

We did assemble good team but it was much harder this time, lots of people quit, got dismissed, had poor work ethic, but there were enough of us that made a difference, that hung together and turned an almost failed small one owner machine shop into a successful manufacturing corporation, competing world wide... it takes years of hard work, along with some hard times, and a few set backs, but there is nothing finer than a team of machinist and helpers working together to build a successful company.
Today's people not so much...they are waiting on the "new plan" robots to do the work, and a personal monthly income check from the government for just being alive.

 

[demarpaint]

When I started my apprenticeship, I worked with a few guys that had served in WW2 born in the early 1920s.
They went to college on the GI bill, most served in the military, a few my age were back from Vietnam, thinking they might want to be machinist.
Many lived through the Great Depression.
These were tough SOBs, becareful cause they'd threaten to kick your ass if you touched their tool box without permission.
You had to prove yourself worthy of being an apprentice.
After you become a journeymen 5 yrs of training and a couple at yrs at school and have paid your dues, you became one of the club, a Union machinist.
I was the youngest journeyman, All these guys are dead now except one.. . I worked with most of these guys 24 yrs, no one in this group ever quits. They have your back, they are never late for work, they don't call in sick... you are expected do the same.
After 15 yrs I became their team leader, it was an honor to work with these men.

When I was hired by a small struggling company, who purchased a new CNC lathe that needed to be up and running there was already a difference in the quality of the employee, I was older now, one of the old guys.
But I brought my work ethics with me...it shouldn't have stood out because it seemed normal to me... but by now it was becoming unusual to work hard for your company, take pride in your work, take charge of the job, your competition is the whole world, but so is your market.

We did assemble good team but it was much harder this time, lots of people quit, got dismissed, had poor work ethic, but there were enough of us that made a difference, that hung together and turned an almost failed small one owner machine shop into a successful manufacturing corporation, competing world wide... it takes years of hard work, along with some hard times, and a few set backs, but there is nothing finer than a team of machinist and helpers working together to build a successful company.
Today's people not so much...they are waiting on the "new plan" robots to do the work, and a personal monthly income check from the government for just being alive.

You were taught by some of the best, and people who had good work ethics. Your last line says it all: "Today's people not so much...they are waiting on the "new plan" robots to do the work, and a personal monthly income check from the government for just being alive." Especially the personal monthly income check from Uncle Sam part of it.

 

[Baron23]

This is a good productive discussion.

Does a small company expand to meet demand or stay in the comfort zone?

After the nuclear collapse, I started with a small company. The two owners fought over expansion and CNC equipment so much, one sold the company to the one who wanted to expand.
The new owner changed the company name and went right after the expansionist idea.
I was hired to run the New CNC lathe.
Everything went good for a few yrs, then came the layoffs. Working in a mostly empty shop on a new job, the owner came to me and said he had just financed his house to make payroll, and would really appreciate it if I didn't scrap one of these expensive copper blanks.
I assured him I would not.
That almost collapse grew into one of the most successful state of art machining centers in the state.
Huge expansions many new buildings full of CNC equipment and nice new offices.
World wide contracts, and cornered 52% of the world's market in area that I worked in, and started.
Just me and my helper made half of the first million dollar month in the company history.

How did we do it?
Work our asses off, bring new developments into the processes.
We strive to be the best, no one in the world will out work us, no one will be as productive or out think us, we are never satisfied with our excellence, tomorrow is a new day for even more accomplishments.
Be a student of your work, learn, learn, learn, and make a contribution.

The company job, IS the employees job.
Your wife will leave you on day shift as easily as she will on night shift.
Mine left on day shift... so let's get to work.

Hire that working supervisor, a hardass company team leader, a motivator, and extreme leader. The supervisor who will clean your machine sump out, while you check in material for machining, do the dirty job for his helper or fellow machinst...supervisors don't do that, or lend a hand and do part of the other guy's job when he's behind plus yours.
Never laugh at someone's mistake, it cost us all, and now you all are not allowed to have a scrap part all month...gets their attention.
Nothing better in a manufacturing or machining company, than to have people you can count on that always have your back...assemble "that team" like your life depends on it, cause financially it does.

Companies need people who will work.
Whatever it takes...do your part.

So Frank would you volunteer to take a team on the 2nd or 3rd shift and give up the day shift that you worked so hard to be on?
I did, more than a few times, about 15 yrs worth...what ever it takes to build the company.
I trained 22 machinist for this particular job on 7 years before retiring. A lot of them just won't do heavy continous work.
Certain companies have better workers when looking for laid off machinist.
HP machinist are duds ...they are lazy and Woke before Woke was invented.

Son's who's fathers owned small machine shops are good, farm kids who want something else as helpers, some former aerospace, many veterans who have it together, my supervisor was a naval officer, not real likable but did his job, kinda like me I suppose, but might I win ya over eventually. I was always an overachiever, 2nd fastest in the state track meet, but no one cares about 2nd place. Live and learn.

Bartlein as company has decisions to make. Nothing here is easy, if it was everyone else would be doing it.
It's all hard, difficult, and almost impossible.
Always keep the CNCs running they are too expensive just sitting there.
I usually run two at a time, wear them out in 5 yrs. Running 2 10 hr shifts. Making over $2500 per hr minus $1200 for material, wages, overhead.
When I volunteered to night shift other CNCs are open, I run up to 4 CNC mills, at a time voluntary... kinda.
You want production, it's one way to get it.
You have cycle time don't just stand around, grab a cup of coffee and go to work...Do Not Ever run out of coffee.
When I retired, the owner told me, "I'll probably never find another employee who works like you." My answer, " probably not".
I had higher paying offers, but declined them. Loyalty has a price, but helping build a company was priceless.
Like coming across the finish line at a State track meet first instead of second, simply the best....
How much do you want to win?...how hard are "you" willing to work?

Somebody give this guy a gold star for his forehead….he clearly needs affirmation.

 

[Frank Green]

So Frank would you volunteer to take a team on the 2nd or 3rd shift and give up the day shift that you worked so hard to be on?

Been there and done that... and still do it if need be. Can't tell you how many times came in at 6am and worked till 1am the next morning.

We just made a run of 20mm barrels for another order. One barrel takes 18 hours of rifling time!!!!!! Those dozen or so 20mm's we just did was the equivalent of making 100+ .30cal barrels. Each of these 20mm blanks started out weighing 98# each. As we shipped them they weighed 75#. Just drilling the initial hole down each blank took out 6.5# of steel.

The first time we ran 20mm barrels... I did all the drilling, all the bore reaming and the rough turning to the contour. When they got to rifling... Tracy started one... let's say at 6am. When that barrel finished... he put another one in and stayed to about 10pm that night.... I went home at 5pm... came back in at 3am the next morning.... when Tracy left to go home... he paused the rifling machine. I came in at 3am double checked size to see where the barrel was at... turned on the oil to bleed the air out of the rifling machine and hit the go button again... we ran them like that till that job got done and back then we didn't even have a 2nd shift. This first batch the barrels took about 14 hours each. Groove spec's sizes where a little different from the ones we just finished a couple of weeks ago. Those needed a different tool, different groove depth and lengths were different.

Pretty much goes for all the guys here.... if we sit everyone down and tell them what we are up against and we need to get a specific job done etc... they will all pull together.

My #2 son worked here for several years. About a year + ago he wanted to go into construction and work outside. Anyways during covid he came up to me and said... I need to tell someone something but don't know who to talk to. I said... say what you got to say. He said it's summer now and I don't want to work 55-60 hours a week anymore/for awhile. Tells me he wants to do some fishing. I said... Riley take off. He said he didn't want anyone to be mad at him. I said... no one is mad at ya. Your still getting in 50 hours + by early Friday morning. You want to leave early on Friday and not come in on Saturday... we all get it.

 

[Thump_rrr]

Anyone know where I can find a #7 MTU in 6.5 1-7-1/2” or 1-8”?

 

[Frank Green]

Anyone know where I can find a #7 MTU in 6.5 1-7-1/2” or 1-8”?

Try Southern Precision Rifles?

He normally orders the M24/M40 contour which is pretty close to the MTU. The M40 is 1.2" breech x 3" with a .900" muzzle.

The MTU is 1.250" x 2.750" with a .930" muzzle.

Can't think of anyone that would have a MTU in stock.

 

[oldrifleman]

Try Southern Precision Rifles?

He normally orders the M24/M40 contour which is pretty close to the MTU. The M40 is 1.2" breech x 3" with a .900" muzzle.

The MTU is 1.250" x 2.750" with a .930" muzzle.

Can't think of anyone that would have a MTU in stock.

This is really close to a heavy varmint. When I was looking for an MTU talked to Greg at SPR, he told me the HV was so very close. I listened and got one.

 

[lash]

Try Southern Precision Rifles?

He normally orders the M24/M40 contour which is pretty close to the MTU. The M40 is 1.2" breech x 3" with a .900" muzzle.

The MTU is 1.250" x 2.750" with a .930" muzzle.

Can't think of anyone that would have a MTU in stock.

This is really close to a heavy varmint. When I was looking for an MTU talked to Greg at SPR, he told me the HV was so very close. I listened and got one.

I’ve used all three of these a number of times and am fine with any of them when I’m looking. I do trust Greg and Russ though.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

Hell it’s hard enough to find business owners who are dedicated enough to succeed, much less employees who have that kind of drive.

I don’t claim to have that drive any more.

My employer has made it amply clear to the peons who man the trains, build and maintain the track, dispatch, and do all the other activities that keep the RR working that they hate all of us. Now we hate them too. We don’t do favors anymore, it only results in worse days at work for us with no return favors; just more scorn.

Only 14 more years to retirement. I’m in it for my family and me now, my efforts to be proactive and helpful were not rewarded so why bother?

I have a client right now who retired from the railroad. He has told me of how deep the culture of waste and all is many times. They obviously make it known that they don't want anyone doing any innovation or changing anything and they don't care if it wastes millions. Bad culture, like government culture.

 

[oldrifleman]

I’ve used all three of these a number of times and am fine with any of them when I’m looking. I do trust Greg and Russ though.

Me too, they are the best and Always keep their word.

 

[45-90]

Bruno

Anyone know where I can find a #7 MTU in 6.5 1-7-1/2” or 1-8”?

Bruno Shooters Supply has the #7 MTU in 6.5 8.5 twist 27" 1 instock. $9.95 shipping on barrels.

 

[Thump_rrr]

Bruno

Bruno Shooters Supply has the #7 MTU in 6.5 8.5 twist 27" 1 instock. $9.95 shipping on barrels.

Thanks, the only problem with that barrel is the twist rate of 1-8.5”.
At sea level, in cold weather (0°F) with the Lapua 139 Scenar the stability is marginal (1.35).
With my current 1-7.5” twist at 0°F the stability is 1.73 with a 1-8” twist it is 1.52

If I was at an elevation of 3,000ft I wouldn’t have any issues with the 1-8.5” twist.

 

[Thump_rrr]

This is really close to a heavy varmint. When I was looking for an MTU talked to Greg at SPR, he told me the HV was so very close. I listened and got one.

Nothing in stock at the moment in any of the 3.

 

[carbonbased]

Hard work, loyalty, going above and beyond, sacrifice, etc goes both ways! Not to mention appropriate pay (ahem) for the level of effort or risk taken (including the risk to the marriage, kids, and other relationships).

Biz owners should realize that many, many, many firms offer none of these things to employees (but nonetheless expect them in return); employees who can often be dismissed at a moment’s notice in the USA at will (whim? Lol).

Let’s take a large corp example, say, in finance. Low level, non-managerial worker makes $150,000; CEO makes $16m. Worker to CEO pay is 1:107.

Worker:CEO ratio of 1:107
Hours worked/week: 40:4280?

I’ll stop the comparo there, but you get the drift. One can think about this in terms of autonomy, choice of work hours, vacation time, whatever metric you want.

So, if you expect an employee to care almost as much as the biz owner, you need to go way, way, way above and beyond the typical employer’s effort & compensation (material or otherwise).

Or you sift and sift and sift for those suckers who will kill themselves for you, if for no other reason than for a pat on the back.

 

[brianf]

Hard work, loyalty, going above and beyond, sacrifice, etc goes both ways! Not to mention appropriate pay (ahem) for the level of effort or risk taken (including the risk to the marriage, kids, and other relationships).

Biz owners should realize that many, many, many firms offer none of these things to employees (but nonetheless expect them in return); employees who can often be dismissed at a moment’s notice in the USA at will (whim? Lol).

Let’s take a large corp example, say, in finance. Low level, non-managerial worker makes $150,000; CEO makes $16m. Worker to CEO pay is 1:107.

Worker:CEO ratio of 1:107
Hours worked/week: 40:4280?

I’ll stop the comparo there, but you get the drift. One can think about this in terms of autonomy, choice of work hours, vacation time, whatever metric you want.

So, if you expect an employee to care almost as much as the biz owner, you need to go way, way, way above and beyond the typical employer’s effort & compensation (material or otherwise).

Or you sift and sift and sift for those suckers who will kill themselves for you, if for no other reason than for a pat on the back.

Go take the run of the mill upper management at Tesla and see if he can create space-x

Take a branch manager at Chase and see if he can run JP Morgan like Diamond does.

Take anyone in Google and see if they can run it like bezos had.

Rude to say and some people just won’t admit it..the reason a CEO makes 1-107..is because he’s worth every worker bee X 10.

If not every company in every country in every market makes the same mistake and is purposefully throwing money at people who don’t deserve it.

And no CEO works 40 hours.

 

[RUN8]

Go take the run of the mill upper management at Tesla and see if he can create space-x

Take a branch manager at Chase and see if he can run JP Morgan like Diamond does.

Take anyone in Google and see if they can run it like bezos had.

Rude to say and some people just won’t admit it..the reason a CEO makes 1-107..is because he’s worth every worker bee X 10.

If not every company in every country in every market makes the same mistake and is purposefully throwing money at people who don’t deserve it.

And no CEO works 40 hours.

Are some CEO's or C suite guys and gals rock stars who deserve the pay based on what they bring to the shareholders, customers, and employees? Yep for sure, and they are worth every damn penny whether they work 100 hours a week, or 30 minutes in between holes of golf.

Is every CEO or C suite dweller a rock star though? Nope. There are plenty of complete shitters who do a mediocre job at best, and a bad job at worst. In fact probably more turds than real performers out there. The methods of these turds are pretty easy to identify. Lacking the skills and vision to innovate, or even refine existing business operations to grow the business and better serve all parties involved; the turd CEO and C suite commonly resort to the low hanging fruit of cost cutting at the expense of everyone but themselves and their bonus to make PE ratios or operating ratios look pretty so the stock price goes up in the near term so they can pump and dump it on their way out the door. A really good recent example of this is any recent Class 1 RR CEO, or the last CEO of Stellantis (or whatever they're called this week).

It baffles me that corporate boards of directors don't do a better job of structuring CEO compensation that is more restrictive of things like exercising stock options. I wonder if better results would be had if some of these clowns were forced to sit on any stock they receive as compensation or bonus for say 10-15 even 20 years? Make them take a long term view of the health and financial position of the company they are leading, and force them to carefully consider the long term consequences of their decisions.

 

[lash]

Are some CEO's or C suite guys and gals rock stars who deserve the pay based on what they bring to the shareholders, customers, and employees? Yep for sure, and they are worth every damn penny whether they work 100 hours a week, or 30 minutes in between holes of golf.

Is every CEO or C suite dweller a rock star though? Nope. There are plenty of complete shitters who do a mediocre job at best, and a bad job at worst. In fact probably more turds than real performers out there. The methods of these turds are pretty easy to identify. Lacking the skills and vision to innovate, or even refine existing business operations to grow the business and better serve all parties involved; the turd CEO and C suite commonly resort to the low hanging fruit of cost cutting at the expense of everyone but themselves and their bonus to make PE ratios or operating ratios look pretty so the stock price goes up in the near term so they can pump and dump it on their way out the door. A really good recent example of this is any recent Class 1 RR CEO, or the last CEO of Stellantis (or whatever they're called this week).

It baffles me that corporate boards of directors don't do a better job of structuring CEO compensation that is more restrictive of things like exercising stock options. I wonder if better results would be had if some of these clowns were forced to sit on any stock they receive as compensation or bonus for say 10-15 even 20 years? Make them take a long term view of the health and financial position of the company they are leading, and force them to carefully consider the long term consequences of their decisions.

Bingo on the first paragraph.

For the second question paragraph, the reason the boards allow this is because everybody is inside trading and only once every 10-20 years is there a stooge/goat chosen to put away in a country club prison for a bit to keep the peasants from rebelling.

 

[carbonbased]

Go take the run of the mill upper management at Tesla and see if he can create space-x

Take a branch manager at Chase and see if he can run JP Morgan like Diamond does.

Take anyone in Google and see if they can run it like bezos had.

I'm going to set aside arguments about how it is not surprising that rich dudes wind up running rich companies (Elon: born extremely rich. Jamie Diamond: dad was an EVP at American Express, born into a family of finance and banking professionals).

However, I agree with you that some leaders are indeed extraordinary. Steve Jobs comes to mind, as was his icon, Edward Land (Polaroid). Jeff Bezos is no slouch, either. Someone like Dwight D. Eisenhower, however, was a managerial genius on an entirely different level than those folks. I mean, for his part in WWII alone. Yet what was his salary?

My argument is not that CEOs ought to be paid only 2x better than their average worker; extraordinary leaders can command extraordinary compensation.

But we are well past the point of profane. See below.

Rude to say and some people just won’t admit it..the reason a CEO makes 1-107..is because he’s worth every worker bee X 10.

The 1:107 is actually comically low compared to the top disparities. And we're not talking about some genius CEOs that have literally came from nothing and have created some entirely new thing.

Below is a worker:CEO pay ratio aggragator (linked above). The worst offender is NU Skin with an eye-popping 1:10,377 ratio, but Abercrombie & Finch is 1:6076, Mattel is 1:3620, and so on.

If you click on the S&P 500 tab, the disparities go down a bit. For example, Coke is, ahem, merely, at 1:1799.

You cannot be really telling me that these CEO dudes of not-amazing companies are worth 1800x to 10,377x more than their average worker. I mean, c'mon.

And no CEO works 40 hours.

Yeah, I wasn't saying that.

I do have a bunch of sympathy for small businesses…their profit margins are not Apple's and they're usually on that razor's edge come payday.

In a nutshell, getting decent workers is sort of like dating. If the chick in the bar (i.e. the biz) laments to her friends that she can't find a good man, the first place to start is to take a good long look in the mirror. Maybe she really is a chaste Playboy Playmate but is surrounded by bums.

But she could also be hideously ugly, demand sexual loyalty but gives none back, and she shuts her legs the second the marriage vows are read (i.e. no raises, ever).

To attract good workers you too have to be attractive yourself, as a company, in some way.

 

[Rob01]

Who gives a fuck! One dude starts this bullshit and you guys keep at it. Bartlein is running great as it has been for years. Its putting out great products as fast as it can and continuing to run as it has to make it successful. It’s not changing to some nuclear power plant worker’s whim because he thinks he knows better. No need to debate how business works. Has nothing to do with this post. Go to the pit and start a business post.

 

[carbonbased]

So, in other news, I have lots of sympathy for Bartlein and they are awesome in my book! No complaints. I just have to plan better lol

 

[RIGREG]

Who gives a fuck! One dude starts this bullshit and you guys keep at it. Bartlein is running great as it has been for years. Its putting out great products as fast as it can and continuing to run as it has to make it successful. It’s not changing to some nuclear power plant worker’s whim because he thinks he knows better. No need to debate how business works. Has nothing to do with this post. Go to the pit and start a business post.

Thank you!

I have every piece my two M40A1 builds except for barrels and slings. I’m patiently looking forward to my two barrels from Frank. Quality, reputation and up front expectations are good enough for me.

As far as business, I have no idea. I get paid the 1st and 15th every month. Thanks for paying your taxes.

Greg

 

[brianf]

..true it’s a barrel thread ..we can have business talk in another thread

Yeahhhh Bartlein

 

[LeftyJason]

Frank at least is consistent in his business stuff (I feel this is a good thing). He is saying the same things that make sense and that he has his priorities straight as the beginning of the thread many years ago.

 

[carbonbased]

Frank at least is consistent in his business stuff (I feel this is a good thing). He is saying the same things that make sense and that he has his priorities straight as the beginning of the thread many years ago.

Totally. 45-90 got me us slip slidin’ & away, hey!



I’m stupid for going down that log chute!

 

[Frank Green]

Thank you!

I have every piece my two M40A1 builds except for barrels and slings. I’m patiently looking forward to my two barrels from Frank. Quality, reputation and up front expectations are good enough for me.

As far as business, I have no idea. I get paid the 1st and 15th every month. Thanks for paying your taxes.

Greg

Thanks Greg!

I've got a barrel in that run for the M40A1's as well again... it will have the rougher finish vs my GAP build (which I'm happy with) and I'll take the new/next barrel here and put it on that 40X I have and have GAP supply all the other parts again and put it together for me.

 

[anon]

Thanks Frank and everyone at Bartlein, and your stocking vendors too.

My last Bartleins have been AI finished barrels from Mile High.