Bulletseeker Mach 4 doppler chrono

Got mine weeks ago.
Two of my mates ordered about two weeks ago and are still waiting on them though.
FWIW - From some of the EXLRS posts on IG and SSDs website, seems they are at the EXLRS Hot Shoot 2022 through today (Italy). I also can't find any of the Euro sites carrying the Mach4 with product listed In Stock.

Solid Solution Design Hot Shoot 2022

I'm on the fence awaiting the IoS App and some feedback from US shooters as to the FPS accuracy vs, for example, the LR.
 
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FWIW - From some of the EXLRS posts on IG and SSDs website, seems they are at the EXLRS Hot Shoot 2022 through today (Italy). I also can't find any of the Euro sites carrying the Mach4 with product listed In Stock.

Solid Solution Design Hot Shoot 2022

I'm on the fence awaiting the IoS App and some feedback from US shooters as to the FPS accuracy vs, for example, the LR.

It seems the inital stocks sold out fast (no wonder as Labradar was nowhere to be had) , i got mine from Reloader.cz that has the European distribution rights

I assume ''Shooter CZ'' is actually Reloader.cz head honcho Pavel

 
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B514FB95-B575-444D-976A-0ED81F314117.jpeg

Now just waiting.. still haven’t received shipping information. Has anyone got theirs yet??
 
I have received my parabolic adapter for the Bulletseeker and I hope that it would resolve the problems with AR-15 rifles, which I posted before.

Meanwhile, for all those who were waiting like me the release of the iOS version of the app, I suggest to contact directly Klara from Bulletseeker.com: [email protected]

She can provide access to the working beta-version of the app, until the final version is released. She proved to be very supportive!
 
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And then you add a 10'' can with tuner and a brake , and it seems i will need to use my old Magnetospeed mount to get BS4 out of the suppressor's shade.

301404793_1140994373154416_9071172567682449299_n (1).jpg


Just laying it out to see how it would look . Fugly ,but as long as it works who cares.
302646963_1028691047802126_4390732541628724921_n.jpg
 
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And then you add a 10' can with tuner and a brake , and it seems i will need to use my old Magnetospeed mount to get BS4 out of the suppressor's shade.

View attachment 7946198

Just laying it out to see how it would look . Fugly ,but as long as it works who cares.
View attachment 7946200
Dude, a 10 foot can is a bit long. Maybe you can trim it down??
 
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Anyone else notice issues while using a suppressor?

I'm in the market for a new chrono, and I shoot suppressed almost always. Looking to likely side-mount on some KRG chassis as wells as mount on the bottom of some Manners EH-1 stocks. Barrels are from 22" to 26" with 7" to 9" cans. Anyone have similar set-ups that they can comment on?
 
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Some findings after a lot of experimentation and communication from the engineering team (their support has been fantastic):

1) If the device is located directly below/behind the muzzle, there will always be an upwards ramp at the start of the detection curve. As explained to me, this ramp is directly correlated with the angle of the device with respect to the projectile. The angle of the first few detections tends to understate the velocity in the initial portion of the reading out of the muzzle (the first 8-12” or so).

2) When detections are poor, this ramp can have a significant impact on the mean velocity calculation.

3) You can use the sliders on the graph (when examining each individual shot) to exclude poor detections from the mean velocity calculation.

4) The key issue is that with poor positioning, you get shit-all detections. This means that if you have a low threshold of detections, its safer to just reposition your device and delete the poorly detected shot.

5) The number of detections that constitutes a sufficiently robust number, is correlated with the actual velocity. For rimfire, you might expect to get a higher number of detections for a good position. For a faster centrefire, fewer. If you're seeing less than 50 detections, you might as well scrap the shot.

6) The angle and height of the device do matter for consistent measurement - but they have a bigger impact on detections. If you're getting a solid number of detections, if you were to induce a little bit of an angle with the Bulletseeker but still get good detections, it doesn't have a material impact on velocities captured (it'll be within single digit mean differences between the two positions). On the other hand, if moving the device means shit detections - well you might expect 10-20 fps differences.

7) For the moment, the only way to do all these tweaks is by going into the individual shot data. Also make sure you have set it to capture all the data and not just the mean, otherwise this is all lost to your app. Capturing all the data means you need at least a 2-3 second gap between shots. I’ve provided some suggestions that immediate user feedback regarding the quality of detections and automated positioning of the left and right sliders based on an algorithm will lead to better user experience.

8) The parabolic adapter helps cut through muzzle blast but it also means that detections are about 2-3m in front as opposed to the reading about 1m in front without the adapter.

9) I’ve found that trial and error is necessary to find the best device position. That said if you’re getting good detections using a fixed position on your rifle - great this is the optimal scenario to be in as you can guarantee repeatable consistency.

I feel like more testing (and validation from others) is needed before this can be crowned a LabRadar killer but I’m enjoying the device so far. Again - really happy with the support of the team so far.
 
I hope BS works out. It seems if it was this easy LabRadar would’ve just made their giant contraption with all its nuances into an egg roll sized package by now but I’m no engineer 🤣
 
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Some findings after a lot of experimentation and communication from the engineering team (their support has been fantastic):

1) If the device is located directly below/behind the muzzle, there will always be an upwards ramp at the start of the detection curve. As explained to me, this ramp is directly correlated with the angle of the device with respect to the projectile. The angle of the first few detections tends to understate the velocity in the initial portion of the reading out of the muzzle (the first 8-12” or so).

2) When detections are poor, this ramp can have a significant impact on the mean velocity calculation.

3) You can use the sliders on the graph (when examining each individual shot) to exclude poor detections from the mean velocity calculation.

4) The key issue is that with poor positioning, you get shit-all detections. This means that if you have a low threshold of detections, its safer to just reposition your device and delete the poorly detected shot.

5) The number of detections that constitutes a sufficiently robust number, is correlated with the actual velocity. For rimfire, you might expect to get a higher number of detections for a good position. For a faster centrefire, fewer. If you're seeing less than 50 detections, you might as well scrap the shot.

6) The angle and height of the device do matter for consistent measurement - but they have a bigger impact on detections. If you're getting a solid number of detections, if you were to induce a little bit of an angle with the Bulletseeker but still get good detections, it doesn't have a material impact on velocities captured (it'll be within single digit mean differences between the two positions). On the other hand, if moving the device means shit detections - well you might expect 10-20 fps differences.

7) For the moment, the only way to do all these tweaks is by going into the individual shot data. Also make sure you have set it to capture all the data and not just the mean, otherwise this is all lost to your app. Capturing all the data means you need at least a 2-3 second gap between shots. I’ve provided some suggestions that immediate user feedback regarding the quality of detections and automated positioning of the left and right sliders based on an algorithm will lead to better user experience.

8) The parabolic adapter helps cut through muzzle blast but it also means that detections are about 2-3m in front as opposed to the reading about 1m in front without the adapter.

9) I’ve found that trial and error is necessary to find the best device position. That said if you’re getting good detections using a fixed position on your rifle - great this is the optimal scenario to be in as you can guarantee repeatable consistency.

I feel like more testing (and validation from others) is needed before this can be crowned a LabRadar killer but I’m enjoying the device so far. Again - really happy with the support of the team so far.

BS4 was always meant as a fixed firearm mounted chrono , I imagine hitting the right spot off a small tripod is a mayor PITA. My experience so far is of the solid mount ,no issues there . But i imagine with suppressor i might get issues, i have to test and see if it can measure without the parabolic adapter.


296105609_1968763263322023_557296153411508928_n.jpg


Extra large parabolic reflektor , It seems there are 2 different designs in the wild.

296921900_1968763319988684_3701183179977167510_n.jpg


Both seen in BS4 web shop

786b1e_3e3a0e7ef3144e21b075533138dd9050~mv2.jpg
 
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It'd be cool if this thing works. But...

1. Needs a mounting solution for bolt-guns without pic rails all over them. Maybe an extended pic arm that can attach to bipod rail and extend out toward muzzle. Or a non-rotating sling stud mount (since most rifles have a sling attachment point at end of stock).
2. Hanging off barrel defeats the freakin' purpose. Might as well just stick with Magnetospeed.
3. If it needs a parabolic adapter to work better, why isn't that parabolic adapter already part of the design? Don't wanna buy more crap to make the first POS work in the first place.
4. Needs Apple support
 
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So is there a usd retailer that has this and or a price in usd or just the 860 euro?
If you go into the order module on SSD's website and designate you are a US buyer, their system shows you the price in USD.

Got mine yesterday. The pics show how it looks mounted on my SRS. Haven't shot it yet. Will report back when I have data.
 

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Awesome stuff man! Did you just get the area419 arca adapter and screw it on?
I had the Area 419 adapter on a bipod that I don't use very often, so I took the adapter off the bipod and put it on the BS Mach4. It's really slick if you have a full-length arca rail on your rifle. You can put the BS and your bipod wherever it works best for you. I have the RRS R-Lok arca rail so everything locks in nicely.
 
I had the Area 419 adapter on a bipod that I don't use very often, so I took the adapter off the bipod and put it on the BS Mach4. It's really slick if you have a full-length arca rail on your rifle. You can put the BS and your bipod wherever it works best for you. I have the RRS R-Lok arca rail so everything locks in nicely.
Ya I have the same thing lol got a accutac bipod with the 419 arca and a atlas with it so I think I'll just pull it off the atlas cause I never use it
 
The iOS beta app is available for use right now. You just need to contact the Bulletseeker team for a link.
Hello from France

Here is the link to ask for the beta IOS App:

https://forms.wix.com/860d7401-54a1-43d1-a271-c77dfb433907:2d287abb-d479-41c8-8cfc-90db1bca8ecb

or you can scan the following QR code.

CCEA50AE-EBA6-4C74-A931-5D3F9BA886F7.png

You will have to enter some details on the query, then you will receive by email your link to the Bulletseeker IOS App for evaluation.

« Thanks For Requesting the iOS APP for BULLETSEEKER
Please install the APP ''testflight'' This APP is directly from Apple.
With this APP you can install the BULLETSEEKER MACH4 App.
https://developer.apple.com/testflight/
THEN install the BULLETSEEKER APP via the included link. »
 
I got to the range today to try the BS. Everything set up easily. The BS connected to the Android tablet immediately. The system worked as advertised. I shot it on a DT SRS with a 300WM conversion kit. I would definitely get the parabolic lens if you get the unit. It worked best with the lens on, at least on the 300WM. The velocity was consistent with other chrono speeds for the loads I was shooring. I have a Magnetospeed and my son has a Labradar. The BS is much easier to use and is more consistent than either one of them. If it keeps running the way it did today, I won't be using the MS or the LR again....it's that good.
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I got to the range today to try the BS. Everything set up easily. The BS connected to the Android tablet immediately. The system worked as advertised. I shot it on a DT SRS with a 300WM conversion kit. I would definitely get the parabolic lens if you get the unit. It worked best with the lens on, at least on the 300WM. The velocity was consistent with other chrono speeds for the loads I was shooring. I have a Magnetospeed and my son has a Labradar. The BS is much easier to use and is more consistent than either one of them. If it keeps running the way it did today, I won't be using the MS or the LR again....it's that good.View attachment 7961764View attachment 7961765View attachment 7961766
Were you able to test it with a suppressor?
 
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First I've seen of this kind, is there a proper working demo ?
Mark & Sam After Work did a review just a week ago or there abouts.
Watch the vid where he compares the Bullet seeker velocities against a Labradar. Didn't seem to good to me &, combined with the Bulletseekers own repeatability data as <1%, I don't see it as a serious contender.
Possibly Mark had some trouble with it some how. I hope so because it seems a nice little unit otherwise.
 
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Has anybody actually connected the BS to the IOS app? I’m getting a notification on my phone that the BS wants to connect to the phone, but I need to type in the code that’s on the BS. Of course there is nothing to be seen on the BS except for a on/off button and a USBC charging port, so I don’t know what code to use…
 
Man if this has come out at under $500, it would have been tough competition for magnetospeed, and the larger Labradar overkill for most. Still a tough $900 to spend on a chronograph. Any news on a US distributor?
 
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Has anybody actually connected the BS to the IOS app? I’m getting a notification on my phone that the BS wants to connect to the phone, but I need to type in the code that’s on the BS. Of course there is nothing to be seen on the BS except for a on/off button and a USBC charging port, so I don’t know what code to use…

In the manual, page 4, item 4, says the pin is 224466.

Here's the email I received with what's necessary for the IOS app.

APP for BULLETSEEKER​
Here are the details:
Please install the APP ''testflight'' This APP is directly from Apple.
With this APP you can install the BULLETSEEKER MACH4 App.
https://developer.apple.com/testflight/

THEN install the BULLETSEEKER APP via this link :
https://testflight.apple.com/join/9NJLSL3b
 
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These are really great innovations in the market.

Question about this market. It appears the bulletseeker only reads muzzle velocity, a single value if you will is derived from the data it gathers?

Does anyone know if AndiScan is the same - a single Muzzle Velocity data point?

This seems to be a differentiator the labradar holds on to - giving multiple velocity readings down range - giving one the ability to calculate BC, albeit limited to 100yds with a 7mm projectile. I haven't invested in any, but this capability was one thing I had looked forward to, especially with 22lr to provide better data for ballistics solutions, etc.

I'd invest in larger system capable of velocity readings out to several hundred yards for 5mm projectiles. If one could be made this small even better. I'd buy a small, convenient, rifle mounted setup like this even without that for half the price of current market. I'd pay 1500 for one (large or small) that could reach out to 200+ yards with 22 caliber projectiles.
 
These are really great innovations in the market.

Question about this market. It appears the bulletseeker only reads muzzle velocity, a single value if you will is derived from the data it gathers?

Does anyone know if AndiScan is the same - a single Muzzle Velocity data point?

This seems to be a differentiator the labradar holds on to - giving multiple velocity readings down range - giving one the ability to calculate BC, albeit limited to 100yds with a 7mm projectile. I haven't invested in any, but this capability was one thing I had looked forward to, especially with 22lr to provide better data for ballistics solutions, etc.

I'd invest in larger system capable of velocity readings out to several hundred yards for 5mm projectiles. If one could be made this small even better. I'd buy a small, convenient, rifle mounted setup like this even without that for half the price of current market. I'd pay 1500 for one (large or small) that could reach out to 200+ yards with 22 caliber projectiles.
Ya everything has drawbacks like the labradar is huge bulky you gotta aim it at the target... but it reads at the target as well.. this is simple to install use tiny but only picks up muzzle
 
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I just read another about profiling BCs and trajectories using modern methods - in the comments it specifically talks about the higher end lab equipment used by the industry. Some made by the same company but apparently the lab-radar data down range is very questionable and not seen as suitable for this. Viewed by the industry scientists as only good for MV.

Of course this is compared to 100k+ radar systems, so the labradar may be better than nothing for down range data - but NOT considered good data relative to the trajectory/bc profiles the lab systems can build.

Article here if anyone is interested, the comments from the author in the dicussion are what really pulled back the curtain on the tech used in the industry:
https://precisionrifleblog.com/2019/06/30/personalized-drag-models-the-final-frontier-in-ballistics/

I will likely pick up one of these small doppler systems for MV when the price comes down, really great the capability is now available on a commodity IC. Be interested to see how this market progresses in the next few.
 
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I just read another about profiling BCs and trajectories using modern methods - in the comments it specifically talks about the higher end lab equipment used by the industry. Some made by the same company but apparently the lab-radar data down range is very questionable and not seen as suitable for this. Viewed by the industry scientists as only good for MV.

Of course this is compared to 100k+ radar systems, so the labradar may be better than nothing for down range data - but NOT considered good data relative to the trajectory/bc profiles the lab systems can build.

Article here if anyone is interested, the comments from the author in the dicussion are what really pulled back the curtain on the tech used in the industry:
https://precisionrifleblog.com/2019/06/30/personalized-drag-models-the-final-frontier-in-ballistics/

I will likely pick up one of these small doppler systems for MV when the price comes down, really great the capability is now available on a commodity IC. Be interested to see how this market progresses in the next few.
The only way price goes down is if Caldwell has them made in China
 
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The only way price goes down is if Caldwell has them made in China
Based on what? The price of the IC's being used?

It's very common for a breakout products like this, especially one offered by niche manufacturers breaking into a market with agility before big players can jump in, to come down significantly in price as the dust settles due to several factors including scales of economy, etc.
 
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