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Sidearms & Scatterguns Glocks Work. Period. End of Story.
- Thread starter Centuriator
- Start date
You could load better than that yourself, just use solid copper or brass "target" projectiles, or highly frangible varmint rounds, but the problem is the 5.7 is really tricky to load for and you have to do it really carefully as it's prone to a kaboom if you get anything wrong just a bit in reloading.
The 5.7 FN is a novelty...if you want one, great, get one. Because 'Merica.
Had a great range day, put 700 rounds downrange through my 19X, my 17G5, 34MOSG5 and my G175 with threaded barrel, shooting suppressed. Fun times. Consistently cleared Bill drills on a B-8 target from 7 yards in 2.5-3 seconds, from "surrender" position...fun times.
Had a great range day, put 700 rounds downrange through my 19X, my 17G5, 34MOSG5 and my G175 with threaded barrel, shooting suppressed. Fun times. Consistently cleared Bill drills on a B-8 target from 7 yards in 2.5-3 seconds, from "surrender" position...fun times.
Glocks may not innovate. But they were the first commercially successful striker fired pistol. They work. The striker system is genius. But it has some drawbacks as well. The trigger will never be like a custom 1911. But with work (some polishing, spring swaps etc) they can get better. Also the stock sights have to go. I have replaced the triggers and the sights on all my glocks and they are worlds better than stock. I have a 17 and a 34. I have probably 8-9000 rounds thru each. I probably haven’t cleaned the 17 but 3-4 times. Gotta love that. Hahaha
A friend I shot idpa with had a Springfield 1911. He had more malfunctions in competitions that anyone ever.
I have a Nighthawk 1911. Hard to compare the two. The nighthawk was 3200 bucks. The trigger is like a wet dream and it’s accurate at long range. But. Between the two the glock is more “practical” and handy.
I can reload double stacks faster although I’m more accurate with the heavy 1911.
But in the end. A pistol is the least lethal weapon I own. So. Don’t kid yourself. If you need lethality don’t draw your pistol. Regardless of the brand.
A friend I shot idpa with had a Springfield 1911. He had more malfunctions in competitions that anyone ever.
I have a Nighthawk 1911. Hard to compare the two. The nighthawk was 3200 bucks. The trigger is like a wet dream and it’s accurate at long range. But. Between the two the glock is more “practical” and handy.
I can reload double stacks faster although I’m more accurate with the heavy 1911.
But in the end. A pistol is the least lethal weapon I own. So. Don’t kid yourself. If you need lethality don’t draw your pistol. Regardless of the brand.
"A pistol is the least lethal weapon I own. So. Don’t kid yourself. If you need lethality don’t draw your pistol. Regardless of the brand."
That comment is simply stupid.
That comment is simply stupid.
We’re naturally going to align with what is familiar with being “best”
Previous generations grew up shooting 1911s. I learned to shoot with a G17. No matter what pistol I try, the glock feels most natural. It doesn’t make it better or worse than anything else. Some times it’s the best choice for a situation, other times no.
I keep glocks for carry, home defense and 3gun shooting. It’s simple, reliable and accurate enough. I can drop it in a dump bucket without having to deal with a safety.
I use steel frame DA/SA guns (CZ Shadow and Tanfoglio Stock 2)for USPSA. The heavier gun and light S/A trigger is more forgiving for more difficult/longer shots.
Previous generations grew up shooting 1911s. I learned to shoot with a G17. No matter what pistol I try, the glock feels most natural. It doesn’t make it better or worse than anything else. Some times it’s the best choice for a situation, other times no.
I keep glocks for carry, home defense and 3gun shooting. It’s simple, reliable and accurate enough. I can drop it in a dump bucket without having to deal with a safety.
I use steel frame DA/SA guns (CZ Shadow and Tanfoglio Stock 2)for USPSA. The heavier gun and light S/A trigger is more forgiving for more difficult/longer shots.
Well not suppose to sell to public but several years ago I sold thousands of rounds of AP, AP tracers and subsonic 5.7 ammo. Probably should have kept some but was getting $5 a round for it!!
Think about the comment...There are different tools for different purposes. Which is why there is a whole world of tools made.
I know many guys who own Barretts, Serbus, etc. These are rifles of incredible power and potential, but to call them the "most lethal" will have to depend on situation. The M82 would certainly be one of the most lethal weapons in a sniper fight. But not so in an urban, peacetime setting. You can't carry a Rem. 700 or even an AR carbine discreetly and still be able to bring it into battery fast enough to deal with an emergency situation, such as an active shooter in a shopping center. But a Glock or 1911 in my jacket can. In the hands of a moderately skilled pistol shooter a well aimed 9mm or .45 is just as effective as a rifle round out to 50 yards. And A LOT of things happen within 50 yards on a day to day basis. A rifle will have far more penetrating power than a pistol, but if an active shooter with body armor were to go on a rampage and I am able to draw my CCW and anchor him with a headshot, the result is all the same. And as a regular citizen in peacetime, I would not normally be carrying a rifle around.
In the mid-later years of the Old West, a lot of towns and settlements passed ordinances barring the carrying of rifles, shotguns and even pistols in their limits. So what did a lot of folks, both law abiding citizens and outlaws do? They simply swapped out the barrels of their Colts and other six-shooters with cut down snubnose barrels, turning them into VERY effective and VERY deadly belly-guns and vest pistols. Many a cheating card player or aggressive drunkard met their demise from being shot at close range inside a saloon with one of those. Many names and descriptions engraved on tombstones all over the West are still here as a testament to just how deadly pistols were. It wouldn't have mattered if those people were killed with Winchesters, sawed off shotguns, or a .44 Colt Army. Dead is dead. Once yer' gone, ya ain't coming back.
If you want lethality.............Train with the weapons you are most comfortable with AND MOST PRACTICAL for use in the situations you normally inhabit. There is no such thing as any gun being "more lethal" than another. Guns do 3 things. They function. They fail. And they rust. A man's skill at handling them is what makes them deadly. Texas pistol fighter John Wesley Hardin has killed a lot of heavily armed opponents in his day, some of them carrying rifles. But Old Wes' was simply more skilled, more cunning, and more brutal than they were.
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Don’t necessarily agree with your comment “There is no such thing as any gun being “more lethal” than another.” I understand you need to train and be proficient with your weapon but you are much more likely to die from a rifle/shotgun wound than a pistol wound-70-80% of people shot by pistols survive. Not everyone is a deadly gun fighter like John Wesley Hardin. In fact in stressful life and death situations most will be lucky to get a couple of shots on target. Look how many times the police shoot to hit some one a handful of times. I’ll take my rifle to gun fight over any pistol all day everyday. But the first rule of any gun fight is to bring a gun which as you pointed out would most likely be a pistol in our everyday life’s.
You know, people that say “Glocks Work. Period. End of Story” are folks that weren’t there for the Gen 3 MIM extractor debacle.
And they weren’t there for the Gen 4 double recoil spring jamtasms,
They weren’t there for the 6x reduction in accuracy the OD Green Gen3s had versus the black ones.
They have never drawn their pistol and been served notice that their polymer rear sight was gracing the pavement somewhere with its presence.
I have had 22 glocks. 6 of them had some problem.
8 HK pistols, 2 of which had some problem.
11 cz pistols, all of which had SOME part in them that was shockingly poorly made, and 2 with problems.
2 steyr pistols, both of which required major factory service.
15 1911s, 5 with problems, two of them very major.
5 smith and wesson’s, none with problems.
People that think Glock is Flawless lack extensive experience with their guns - and people that think they are trash lack extensive experience with everyone else’s guns.
And to correct a statement on glocks numbers, it is estimated that between 10 and 20 million glocks exist. No official numbers exist. It is considered the number one selling pistol.
And they weren’t there for the Gen 4 double recoil spring jamtasms,
They weren’t there for the 6x reduction in accuracy the OD Green Gen3s had versus the black ones.
They have never drawn their pistol and been served notice that their polymer rear sight was gracing the pavement somewhere with its presence.
I have had 22 glocks. 6 of them had some problem.
8 HK pistols, 2 of which had some problem.
11 cz pistols, all of which had SOME part in them that was shockingly poorly made, and 2 with problems.
2 steyr pistols, both of which required major factory service.
15 1911s, 5 with problems, two of them very major.
5 smith and wesson’s, none with problems.
People that think Glock is Flawless lack extensive experience with their guns - and people that think they are trash lack extensive experience with everyone else’s guns.
And to correct a statement on glocks numbers, it is estimated that between 10 and 20 million glocks exist. No official numbers exist. It is considered the number one selling pistol.
"They weren’t there for the 6x reduction in accuracy the OD Green Gen3s had versus the black ones."
You think that is bad, FDE Glocks shoot 6 foot groups at 7 yards.
You think that is bad, FDE Glocks shoot 6 foot groups at 7 yards.
1911 is a broad, generic term for a firearm that has been manufactured contionusly for 107 years in dozens of countries by countless manufacturers. To discredit, or credit the whole bunch in one group is not a logical claim.
I like the Glock. That said I own and shoot others. I like them all. I could care less if my EDC is ugly or not. My gen1 g19 has 13,459 rounds through it. I’ve never had a malfunction of any kind or have I ever cleaned or oiled this gun. On the other hand I have my duty g22 malfunction on the range and replaced the recoil spring all better. No gun is unsalable but my glock is my EDC.
When the first generation Armalite AR-15 came into production and the whole argument to adapt it for military use started, the rifle and it's cartridge was clowned on to no end.
60 years later......The M-16 class of rifles is still the main service arm of US military forces and dozens of other countries worldwide. Even China has an AR platform that is used by the PLA Marines chambered in both 5.56 and 5.8.....And the AR is THE rifle of the armed citizen in the US. It is not going away anytime soon.
Same deal with Glocks. It is a design that has been proven in combat and competition for the last 50 years. The King in a few posts above stated that 10 to 20 million of them has been sold already. That is a testament to success right there.
It is more about the design than the brand. If by some highly unusual means that Glock goes bankrupt, another purchaser will readily take up the slack and continue production. If it is good, there will be a market for it.
My 5.5" barrel Ruger SAA, one of my most trusty carry guns, is current production. Chambered in .357 Mag. And rated for +P and ++P ammunition in Ruger's literature. But the design of the gun is well over 150 years old. Colt has not been producing the SAA line of wheelguns since the 1950's. But today more than 5 companies are building them and they are selling very successfully, though the price on some of them have gone up steeply. But they are still affordable, reliable and effective.
Even if the Glock firm decides to stop production of it's handgun line, which is HIGHLY unlikely...Somebody else may just purchase the patent and rights to the design and continue to manufacture them, just like all those AR manufacturers are doing currently.
Never owned a Glock (shot a few) and after this thread I doubt I ever will. Not that they suck, (not a fan of their trigger) but the way you guys go on and on (fucking 5 pages really) you could make a dick go limp on a porn set.
I'm looking forward to picking up a new Glock Model 45 tomorrow at my FFL dealer.
Here is a piece of candy for you, kiddo. Now run along and let the grown ups talk. As for your personal issues, they made meds for it.
If in 107 years the Glock is still serving a useful purpose, I'm sure they will still be making them. After all, they still make 1911 handguns because people still use them, like them, get all romantic about them, obsess over them, even though they are antiquated and have long since been replaced by more reliable higher capacity, easier to use, maintain and shoot handguns like, well, you know....the Glock.
You prove my point. Most the grownups left this conversation about page 3. Glock didn't give me a bad feeling about Glock. You did.
Glock did start the polymer gun industry, and for that I am grateful. Polymer is a lot cheaper, lighter than metal frames.
Oh, my....boo-hoo for you. Sounds like you need some testosterone and a tissue. And I found yet another snowflake to use the "IGNORE" function with. And....click...he's gone. LOL.
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I'm no mathematician but 2019 - 1982 does NOT equal 50.
IRT the design, again, Glock did not invent the operating system, the tilting barrel design was invented by JMB and has been in use since the early 1900's.
What Glock did was use different material to make the damn thing. He was not the first to make a polymer handgun, he was, however, the most successful. Got lots of free advertising from the press at the time too, but that's ok.
There is nothing revolutionary about a Glock, there never was. It is evolutionary, as any modern firearm is. Whether it is in design, materials or caliber.
THAT is precisely the reason why I discourage gun snobbery and useless infighting based on design and origin. It becomes one great pissing contest...And to my knowledge, pissing contests do not really achieve anything. It does not make us better shooters.
Everything that we have today are a culmination of designs that began around 1836 and with some minor evolution in material and making, essentially is the same. The guns that we use, no matter how advanced they are, are still solid missile projectors powered by a chemical combustion propellant system, whether it is a nitrate based black powder or nitrocellulose based smokeless powder. Ergonomics, grip feel, and ease of pointing/target acquisition are matters of personal opinion. I have owned, carried, and shot plenty of handguns over the years, ranging from the Colt Model 1848 "Dragoons" to the Smith & Wesson M&P line. There are some which I like, and there are some which I would not pick as a "number 1". But all of them are effective weapons in their respective environments, and in a case of emergency, I can pick up any of those guns and use them with decisive and deadly effect. That is the beauty of having an open mind and the willingness to learn all aspects of the field, as the great warrior-thinker Musashi stressed.
BTW that was my mistake regarding how many years Glocks have been in production. That's what happens when you are trying to write and pay for stuff at the local convenience store at the same time.
I enjoy watching Glock-haters, 1911 Fudd/snobs, and other assorted keyboard warriors go into melt down when Glocks are discussed. I hope this pushes this to page 6.
I hope this pushes this to page 6.
The equivalent of ugly girl porn? At least post some Zev stuff so its worth a second look.Thread needs more porn:
I don't care how well they function, Glocks are hard to look at.
I enjoy watching folks make fools of themselves defending a cheaply made inanimate object. A Glock is neither good or bad, it just a simple, cheaply made, mass produced impliment.
Why it is worthy of discussion more than a disposable diaper or plastic straw I have no idea but it is fun to watch the fan boys foam at the mouth defending it.
Keep It rolling...
Why it is worthy of discussion more than a disposable diaper or plastic straw I have no idea but it is fun to watch the fan boys foam at the mouth defending it.
Keep It rolling...
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I don’t even reload and have had some kabooms. Never in a glock though. I did watch someone wonder what the fuck was wrong with their .40 SW glock, and they found out they had stuffed a mag of 9 in it. the accuracy was shit but it actually ran through the whole mag.
I am a part-time black powder gunsmith and I have seen PLENTY of perfectly good guns that were fucked up because someone did not know what they were doing, at all.
One of the most memorable cases I worked on was an Uberti 1851 Navy that had a shredded cylinder, ballooned and bent basepin and loosened loading lever because the person had thought that filling the chamber halfway with Red Dot and the rest of the charge with Pyrodex would make the bullet travel at super-high velocity.
He was lucky he had just one chamber loaded for his little "test" when the revolver went kaboom, or he would have gotten fragments of the cylinder embedded in his hands and face. I was surprised that a regular No. 10 cap can even ignite Red Dot on the first pop. The chamber that fired was completely opened up. The force of it all actually pulled the cylinder pin 2 millimeters out of the frame, ballooned up the barrel wedge retainer and sent the barrel and loading lever assembly flying downrange some ways.
I drilled out the retaining pin at the back of the frame, then removed the basepin. I got a new one from VTI Gun Parts and coated the threads and the inside of the pin recess with JB Weld before threading it in for a permanent set. Had to get the barrel and the new wedge also lined up before the epoxy set. Everything worked out though, and with the new cylinder in place, I was able to hit 6 clay birds with 6 shots on the first go at 30 yards.
If that had been a Remington or another full-frame pistol, the whole gun would have been FUBAR since the upward force of the exploding chamber would have fucked the topstrap beyond repair. The receiver and internal action on that 1851 was able to be salvaged fortunately.
Almost ALL firearms are packed with advisory notices stating "READ FIRST BEFORE ATTEMPTING TO USE". If you don't know what you are doing, or even hesitant, STOP. Because you are 99% certainly about to make a mistake. What is so hard to understand about that?
I was the first guy in my area to get a G22 when they first came out. Very first IPSC match with it I won by a huge margin because I had major power factor and 16 rounds on tap! Back then it seemed everyone's 1911's were malfunctioning at least a few times a match and of course they had to do more mag changes throughout the match.
Practicing for the next match, "with lead bullets" in my reloads, those reloads felt like they were 10mm power instead. I was sure I had made no more than medium loads but I ignored the recoil. Close to the end of my session, telling myself I'll stop at the end of this mag full, my G22 blew up in my hands!
I contacted Glock, told the truth, and they were nice enough to sell me another at their cost.
Only a month later there came out a article in a gun magazine stating "don't shoot lead bullets in Glocks". There had been a rash of G22's blowing up apparently. A lead ring would build up in front of the chamber causing ever increasing pressures.
Learned a hard lesson and the new pistol worked great for years with 180 FMJ's until I sold it.
Practicing for the next match, "with lead bullets" in my reloads, those reloads felt like they were 10mm power instead. I was sure I had made no more than medium loads but I ignored the recoil. Close to the end of my session, telling myself I'll stop at the end of this mag full, my G22 blew up in my hands!
I contacted Glock, told the truth, and they were nice enough to sell me another at their cost.
Only a month later there came out a article in a gun magazine stating "don't shoot lead bullets in Glocks". There had been a rash of G22's blowing up apparently. A lead ring would build up in front of the chamber causing ever increasing pressures.
Learned a hard lesson and the new pistol worked great for years with 180 FMJ's until I sold it.
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