Is 6 ARC gas gun bolt rim too thin if you just shoot Hornady factory ammo?

[rmiked]

I have a Seekins SP10 in 6.5 CM and love it. My best friend (no AR experience) wants to get the Seekins DMR (AR15) in 6 ARC. He wants it for self defense, target shooting and whitetail deer hunting occasionally. A guy on Utube , , is arguing because the 6 ARC case head diameter is larger than 5.56, the bolt rim thickness is machined down thinner, to fit the AR15 platform? Hornady reloading manual lists a max pressure for gas 6 ARC at 52,000 psi. Bolt rifle 6 ARC max pressure at 62,000 psi. The 6 ARC looks to be an awesome round. Does Hornady load all their factory ammo to the 52,000 psi limit? And is it true the 6 ARC bolt rim is thinner? And is this a cause for concern IF you just shoot Hornady factory ammo?

 

[Ledzep]

Didn't watch the video but,

All factory 6mm ARC ammo is 52,000psi max. It is 52,000psi max to mitigate bolt thrust in an AR-15 design. This is the same thing as 6.5 Grendel (been making that since ~2005). The bolt strength issue can be solved with proper material and heat treat selection. Bolts are easier to break in the bigger diameter cartridges, but we typically only see it with bargain bin parts. Maxim, Rexus, JP, Geiselle, etc. all make good bolts that last 10,000+ rounds.

Bolt actions have bolts that are designed to take much more thrust and can handle the 'standard' 62,000-65,000psi loads. We have handbook data for that but no factory ammo is loaded to 62,000.

 

[Ledzep]

Watched the video. We (Hornady) have been explicit with the literature and videos we published about this subject since the release of the cartridge. Nothing new to see here...

52,000psi in all factory ammo and for reloading for semi-auto. 62,000psi for reloading for bolt guns.

Run 62,000psi in a "standard" AR-15 gas gun and you'll prematurely break parts.

 

[rmiked]

Thanks very much for the response. I didn’t think this could be an issue. Knowing all the factory ammo is loaded to 52,000 psi is what I was interested in. I just watched a Hornady “overview of 6 ARC” video and the gentleman said the bolt was the same as 6.5 Grendel. That’s good to know with that history. I am a huge Hornady fan and shoot Hornady factory ammo in my SP10 with great results. I am new to ARs and my friend has no experience. The 6 ARC looks amazing to me and especially if you want young hunters for the minimal recoil. A 6 ARC with 22” barrel (Seekins DMR) and the 103 ELDX looks like it would be a good deer round.

 

[Rob01]

Yup don't sweat shooting factory ammo. Got to watch out for some of the YouTube experts. LOL Been shooting 6ARC in a bolt gun for a while and got the AR itch and got a Grendel Hunter 22" upper a couple months back and with the Hornady 108 ELD-M ammo its a great shooter and soft shooting too. I am sure the Seekins will be too. All I plan to shoot in it is the Hornady 108 ELDs so with them keeping it at 52K for pressure I am not worried at all about my bolt.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

There’s a lot of retards on YouTube and they all think they’re experts.

 

[LRRPF52]

There’s a lot of retards on YouTube and they all think they’re experts.

The vast majority of guntubers are too young to have any relevant experience. They belong behind the camera and editing, not in front of it.

When I see really young guys giving out advice, I can’t take them seriously. They’re really chasing click count for ad dollars so they can pimp scrot shavers and GI Bill scammers, or VPN providers for sponsorship dollars.

If they generate enough clicks and subscriptions, then firearms companies will start sending them product to “review”. I’ve seen the “review” process agreements for some of these services and it all amounts to advertising with significant gains to be made for both parties, as long as the truth about the products is kept from customers.

Advertising is more important than the products in business program theory and practice.

However, in the firearms world, we don’t really like that model since we’re cooking-off tens of thousands of psi next to our faces or in our hands, or counting on these tools to protect ourselves, our families, placing in matches, hunting, or just exercising something fundamental to being an American.

For some reason, the firearms industry attracts a lot of very egocentric people who get very emotional about their decisions. Examples: .45 vs 9mm, 12 GA for HD vs AR, bolt vs semi, M14 vs AR-15, AK vs AR-15, etc. Gun stores historically have been really toxic gate-keeper fronts acting involuntarily as pre-crime bottlenecks for Americans to access their rights, and beer-bellied clerks with low IQs are happy to let the serfs know it. Precious few FFL retail fronts are operated by competent, friendly owners and staff.

This culture has permeated into the manufacturer side, most of whom are painfully aware of the adage, “Want to know how to make a small fortune? Invest a large fortune in the firearms business."

So the more cutthroat types of people are some of the ones who do well because they’re not afraid to screw over their employees and customers to make a profit. So of course they will pay shills on YouTube to pimp their trash, and the shills will happily cash-in, as they have spouses too.

Everyone talks about the ethics of maintaining their soul until they’ve been put in a position to sell it for a tempting price with a wife harping on them to make the deal.

This is one of the reasons why so many people loved Paul Harrell. I never got the impression at all that he was shilling for anyone, but instead would explore topics with curiosity and logical methodology.

For the younger guys that do put in a lot of reps that are unusual for their age, they are climbing that first hill much faster than most, but it’s still the first hill. Once you crest it after about 20 years, you see there’s a valley and then a new mountain range you couldn’t see beyond. The climb is never over and you’ve just begun.

 

[ClangClang]

The vast majority of guntubers are too young to have any relevant experience. They belong behind the camera and editing, not in front of it.

When I see really young guys giving out advice, I can’t take them seriously. They’re really chasing click count for ad dollars so they can pimp scrot shavers and GI Bill scammers, or VPN providers for sponsorship dollars.

If they generate enough clicks and subscriptions, then firearms companies will start sending them product to “review”. I’ve seen the “review” process agreements for some of these services and it all amounts to advertising with significant gains to be made for both parties, as long as the truth about the products is kept from customers.

Advertising is more important than the products in business program theory and practice.

However, in the firearms world, we don’t really like that model since we’re cooking-off tens of thousands of psi next to our faces or in our hands, or counting on these tools to protect ourselves, our families, placing in matches, hunting, or just exercising something fundamental to being an American.

For some reason, the firearms industry attracts a lot of very egocentric people who get very emotional about their decisions. Examples: .45 vs 9mm, 12 GA for HD vs AR, bolt vs semi, M14 vs AR-15, AK vs AR-15, etc. Gun stores historically have been really toxic gate-keeper fronts acting involuntarily as pre-crime bottlenecks for Americans to access their rights, and beer-bellied clerks with low IQs are happy to let the serfs know it. Precious few FFL retail fronts are operated by competent, friendly owners and staff.

This culture has permeated into the manufacturer side, most of whom are painfully aware of the adage, “Want to know how to make a small fortune? Invest a large fortune in the firearms business."

So the more cutthroat types of people are some of the ones who do well because they’re not afraid to screw over their employees and customers to make a profit. So of course they will pay shills on YouTube to pimp their trash, and the shills will happily cash-in, as they have spouses too.

Everyone talks about the ethics of maintaining their soul until they’ve been put in a position to sell it for a tempting price with a wife harping on them to make the deal.

This is one of the reasons why so many people loved Paul Harrell. I never got the impression at all that he was shilling for anyone, but instead would explore topics with curiosity and logical methodology.

For the younger guys that do put in a lot of reps that are unusual for their age, they are climbing that first hill much faster than most, but it’s still the first hill. Once you crest it after about 20 years, you see there’s a valley and then a new mountain range you couldn’t see beyond. The climb is never over and you’ve just begun.

Quoting this for posterity. Very well said. A+

 

[KyleR1985]

The genesis of the cartridge gives me a lot of faith that bolt integrity won’t be an issue.

The incentives of the folks involved in the most important use cases, very much run counter to premature equipment failure.