-
Having trouble using the site?
Contact support
Is it worth keeping a 308 around?
- Thread starter swampbuck
- Start date
Wind @ 1000 with a 208 grain loaded long is the same as the 6CM 108gr or 6.5CM 147gr. Energy is better with the 208 over the 147 by over 200 ft/lbs @ 1000 yds, or over 400 ft/lbs @ 500 yds. 308 is still relevant with a modern projectile in front of modern powder, especially in a medium or long action.
No .30-06?I love my 308's. But then again I also like 45ACP 1911, S&W Revolvers, Ruger 1022, and Gen3 Glocks..
308 in a long action for a greater overall length. ie loaded longer than 2.8”
Might as well go 30-378, 300 norma, or any other 30 overbore. I’m with you on that if we are trying to squeeze performance out of a 30 cal barrel. Recoil management gets progressively harder, so there is always a trade-off. I know shooting my 300wm prone with no brake, after 40 rounds my elbows were bloody. Used to duct tape them before shooting, lol. But the idea is still valid, I wanted a 338 lapua action to load that 300wm out to the lands and maximize case capacity, without losing the functionality of a repeater. I was single-feeding at 3.617” oal, .05 off the lands.
Unless there are rule changes allowing different calibers F-TR will always have the .308 and the .223; both shot without a muzzle break and only rests used are bipod and rear bag. The .308 may not be as ballistically refined as other cals, however, an awful lot can be learned from shooting the .308. Especially with a bare barrel.
Another ballistically obsolete cal, .22LR, still has quite the following, why's that?
Another ballistically obsolete cal, .22LR, still has quite the following, why's that?
Last edited:
6.5 creedmoor is obsolete by the standard that something is better than it. In Short Action you have 6.5 PRC, 300 WSM, 6Creed. In long action every thing with Magnum, Lapua or Norma in its name. Crappy Creed lived a short life...
If the only thing that makes something "Obsolete " is better performance exist then everything is obsolete except for the newest fastest what ever that is today.
If the only thing that makes something "Obsolete " is better performance exist then everything is obsolete except for the newest fastest what ever that is today.
I've got a brace of .308s myself. I know that it automatically costs me multiple cool points everytime I log on here.
While I lament the fact that I'm missing out on the opportunity to increase my post count by not being able to participate nearly as much in the threads about barrel erosion and replacement, the cartridge still meets 100 percent of my needs on the ranch (hunting to 400 yards and a stockpile of surplus ammo for 'stuff'). Then again I'm also a dinosaur as I'll drop coin on an old S&W or Colt revolver everytime over a Gucci Glock. Oh, and yes, I primarily hunt with an old .30-06.
This is not a crack at the much more efficient cartridges that exist nowadays. I readily acknowledge their advantages in almost every way. Still, I think that there are few cartridges more well-rounded than the old .308 (and .30-06) when it comes to killing ability, powder efficiency, and barrel life.
Everyone's mileage will vary.
While I lament the fact that I'm missing out on the opportunity to increase my post count by not being able to participate nearly as much in the threads about barrel erosion and replacement, the cartridge still meets 100 percent of my needs on the ranch (hunting to 400 yards and a stockpile of surplus ammo for 'stuff'). Then again I'm also a dinosaur as I'll drop coin on an old S&W or Colt revolver everytime over a Gucci Glock. Oh, and yes, I primarily hunt with an old .30-06.
This is not a crack at the much more efficient cartridges that exist nowadays. I readily acknowledge their advantages in almost every way. Still, I think that there are few cartridges more well-rounded than the old .308 (and .30-06) when it comes to killing ability, powder efficiency, and barrel life.
Everyone's mileage will vary.
I certainly understood when I signed up here that this was not a cast bullet site. I was looking for conversation regarding precision rifle shooting in real world conditions and the denizens here fill the bill.
A big reason I use the .308 has to do with its ability to utilize cast bullets. I keep a few pounds of Lapua brass and a few hundred SMK's on hand but the vast majority of my shooting is done with recycled wheel weights trundling along at 1,600 fps. A 1 in 10 or 1 in 12 twist .30 caliber barrel will handle cast up to nearly full velocity if the caster/reloader is knowledgable, but I have little use for HV loading as I mostly shoot mild steel targets at 80 to 300 yards. By buying wisely, I can shoot for about 10 cents per round.
I own my own ranges and can shoot whenever I want as I am also retired. I am working on a flat topped pyramidal mound to shoot from so I have a target rail at 500 yards. I enjoy reading about "real" long range shooting and while I may never purchase a "cutting edge" rifle I know the guys that are pushing the envelope are the innovators of the shooting world.
A day at the range with a few other old guys discovering the world of Mil-Dot scopes and playing in the wind is very enjoyable. We are all hoping to get another 10 years out of our aging carcasses.
A big reason I use the .308 has to do with its ability to utilize cast bullets. I keep a few pounds of Lapua brass and a few hundred SMK's on hand but the vast majority of my shooting is done with recycled wheel weights trundling along at 1,600 fps. A 1 in 10 or 1 in 12 twist .30 caliber barrel will handle cast up to nearly full velocity if the caster/reloader is knowledgable, but I have little use for HV loading as I mostly shoot mild steel targets at 80 to 300 yards. By buying wisely, I can shoot for about 10 cents per round.
I own my own ranges and can shoot whenever I want as I am also retired. I am working on a flat topped pyramidal mound to shoot from so I have a target rail at 500 yards. I enjoy reading about "real" long range shooting and while I may never purchase a "cutting edge" rifle I know the guys that are pushing the envelope are the innovators of the shooting world.
A day at the range with a few other old guys discovering the world of Mil-Dot scopes and playing in the wind is very enjoyable. We are all hoping to get another 10 years out of our aging carcasses.
Great point — in fact I’d say the .308 outclasses the 6.5CM in hunting applications inside 400yds (where the VAST majority of hunting is done). Heavier projectiles with more energy and frontal area and the ballistic advantages take a couple hundred yards to exceed an MOA anyway. If an elk’s 200yds away from me I’ll take the .308 every time...and this is coming from someone who likes the Creed a lot.
I stopped using my 308 for a very long time 12-15years. One day I took her out with some 175fggm and 178Hor match. Recoil was significantly higher than the braked 6.5 I had been shooting or the 243's I used before that one. Shot well out to 650 that day and started shooting it more often. Today it is first out of the truck at the range I might shoot 30rds of 6.5 most days 20 or whatever to get dope for a condition I don't have. Once I have that I will shoot the 308 the rest of the session.
For students, it is all I let them use. It shows flaws much quicker than the smaller calibers. It shoots the same day in and day out, and it shoots box ammo great.
I'm a big fan of the 147 in the creed for certain but I don't think I will ever dump the 308 or let it sit for the amount of time I did ever again.
For students, it is all I let them use. It shows flaws much quicker than the smaller calibers. It shoots the same day in and day out, and it shoots box ammo great.
I'm a big fan of the 147 in the creed for certain but I don't think I will ever dump the 308 or let it sit for the amount of time I did ever again.
I sold my .308 a couple years ago and now regretting that decision..
Here’s a good one for a thought experiment: Henry Long Ranger.
.308 or 6.5 Creed.
Can make good arguments for both and can’t decide. Would def go .308 for pigs or def 6.5 for deer, but not sure what I want it for. Been thinking this over for awhile now...
.308 or 6.5 Creed.
Can make good arguments for both and can’t decide. Would def go .308 for pigs or def 6.5 for deer, but not sure what I want it for. Been thinking this over for awhile now...
I picked up one of these last year in 6.5 creedmoor. Need to get it scoped and out to the range. I'd just go with the 6.5 at this point since it's not something you be using day in and day out. Lever guns are more of fun thing to me, not something I'd be going crazy with trying to get that perfect loading.
hmm, not sure how we weren't overrun by deer before 6.5CM came around.
i guess i am spoiled by my dad's .308 lever gun. nothing else really bothers me at all. i can shoot hundreds of rounds of .308 from my gas gun.
the creedmoor is too mainstream. I have a 6.5 kreiger bbl sitting around, and I might make a 6.5x55 AI. mayba a 6.5-06 AI
6.5-06 AI....ooooh I like that idea. If I’d had known just how good .280 AI is, I’d have never bought a 7mm Mag. Wonder if it’d need a longer barrel being decently overbore — the 7mag really needs 24”+ to work its magic.
hmm, not sure how we weren't overrun by deer before 6.5CM came around.
Oh I know — I’ve dropped deer with .308 and 6.5 Grendel, and .308 is overkill. If it were for deer only I’d go 6.5CM and save the recoil, but clearly I’ve been turned into a wimp by these little metric cartridges ha. It’s a fun thought exercise for a potential purchase though.
Curious to hear how you like it when you get to breaking her in.
For stuff large enough to fill a couple upright freezers, and for stuff large enough to eat you - these 150 grainers sure get the job done up to 350yds or so. They work best while wearing worsted wool, rather than Crye tactical nylons.
I just bought a TRG-22 in 308 off of a member here (well, I'm waiting for him to tell me to pay) to add to my 308 collection.
I honestly have no reason to switch over to 6.5CM for the shooting I do. Up to 600yds the 308Win is fine and beyond that I have a 300WM SRS A1.
I've been trying for years to justify moving away from 308 but I just can't convince myself to do it. For people just starting out or only wanting a single rifle I tell them go 6.5CM.
I honestly have no reason to switch over to 6.5CM for the shooting I do. Up to 600yds the 308Win is fine and beyond that I have a 300WM SRS A1.
I've been trying for years to justify moving away from 308 but I just can't convince myself to do it. For people just starting out or only wanting a single rifle I tell them go 6.5CM.
I keep my 308 bolt gun around because shooting 180 grain soft points with some trailboss behind them through my Omega is just plain fun. It puts a smile on my face every time. As far as shooting distance, I haven't done it in years.
I reload 2 .308’s both with 26” tubes. The Rem 700 has a 1/10 twist heavy bbl and the Sako TRG 1/11 1/4. They both shoot one hole groups with the same loads. I use IMR 4064 on 175 SMK’s, and Varget on 165, 168 Barnes. I use both powders on 155 LaPua Scenars. Giving the cartridge volume restriction I’d probably opt for 155 Scenars for longer shots at 1000+ yards. Years ago I’d take long shots well past 400 yards hunting but old age and bad legs took all the fun out of tracking. I also load 175 Gr Berger’s Hunting projectiles with 42.1 Gr IMR 4064.
I shoot 175 7.62x51 NATO Federal GMM (AB39) and it’s shoots the same as FGMM 175 308. The AB39 is just a tad hotter
Hell, I still have 2 30.06, a 300 Savage and both a bolt and AR10 in .308 . Will always have them .
I'd keep it, but I'm also not able to shoot major distance much at the moment. I usually buy rifles to hunt with in the mountains. So deer, elk and bear. I have a bolt 270 and 30.06 which seem to kill things just fine. Also, ammo is never an issue regardless of where I travel. I also have a 1886 in 45-70 incase a fucking T-Rex comes out of the bushes, plus hunting with iron sights out to 200 yrds is quite satisfying.
Shoot what you like, having said that I have never heard an old shooter complaining that they didn't sell something. Plenty lament what they did sell.
Shoot what you like, having said that I have never heard an old shooter complaining that they didn't sell something. Plenty lament what they did sell.
Last edited:
I feel like we are getting a little into the weeds here. I don't think many would argue that (particularly in a precision setting) that .308 is the best round, but the question was, is it worth keeping one around? In my opinion the utility of having a .308 as a secondary gun around would outweigh the opportunity cost of not selling it off. If you are enfranchised with a system that can swap barrels at home and have a .308 pipe, why not keep it in the back of the safe? Or some budget .308 bolt gun that shoots decent but cant hold a candle to your main rig.
Its nice to have options.
Its nice to have options.
By that logic a bow is just as good as a rifle for long range shots becuase plenty of people put food on the table with a bow. Dumb
in each scenario you mentioned, there are much better tools for the job.
The math doesnt lie. There is zero reason to own a 308 and even less in a long range precision platform. Barrel round count is ireveleven when its costs $3k+ to even shoot out a barrel in ammo then add all other costs.
First round hit probaility goes up dramatically with better chambers. Everyone here who shoots knows this.
IF you like to handicap yourself in something that is already inherently difficult, enjoy wasting money and missing targets.
Nato doesnt mean jack shit and the us military is already moving away from it as fast as possible. New sws are in 300nm and onlyhave the cuck 308 barrel due to range restrictions. In the last 10 years the army was moving to 300wm due to the anemic 308 and getting outranged by the enemy.
MK48 is already get swapped to 6.5cm for SOCOM and eventually it will trickle down to big army. Less weight, increased energy at range, significantly increased hit probability and less recoil. Adds a few hundred meters of effective range as well.
Shit I bet I have no less than 20 -308/30-06 and they ain’t going anywhere. Flame away. Now if I’m going to shoot competition I use my 25cm or 6cm. There’s always a “better caliber” out there. I still use my 308 to deer and pig hunt with. I don’t need the latest greatest to shoot animals at 200 yards
Cool story, bro. You spend your money, I’ll spend mine. I’m not out to win PRS matches, I’m out to have fun.
And while a rifle may he better than a bow, plenty of guys shoot bows for fun. I’m not an “operator,” so if I’m having a good time and learning, I’m happy.
i shoot a bow too but im not going to sit here and say its just as good as a better tool.
has nothing to do with winning matches. Missing targets is not fun. The costs are similar so why not use a significantly better tool for the job. If your a hunter, dont you want a cleaner kill with less risk? why waste my time shooting steel and missing what could and should be hits.
learning is faster with better tools. Inferior Equipment is just another challange to overcome. Take 2 brand new shooters and give them 30 minutes of instruction. One has a .308 and one has a 6.5. Now have them hit a target at 1k. Which one is more likely to hit?
has nothing to do with winning matches. Missing targets is not fun. The costs are similar so why not use a significantly better tool for the job. If your a hunter, dont you want a cleaner kill with less risk? why waste my time shooting steel and missing what could and should be hits.
learning is faster with better tools. Inferior Equipment is just another challange to overcome. Take 2 brand new shooters and give them 30 minutes of instruction. One has a .308 and one has a 6.5. Now have them hit a target at 1k. Which one is more likely to hit?
The one who can read wind and has better dope.
Like I said, you do you, broham. I’m not going to argue with you over something neither of us will change our minds on. The .308 is agreat legacy round. The 6.5CM is a great current round. Both work. Yay! In my case, my FN’s chromelined barrel will last forever, saving me the expense of replacing the barrel every 3K rounds. I’m happy.
Is having a .308 bolt gun worth it? To me the answer is Yes...(you asked) If you wore out the barrel, get another .308 barrel. Sure it's not as flat shooting as some of the newer cartridges but the .308 is generally available just about everywhere. As far as reloading, the .308 does have a largest bullet selection available being made by many of the top bullet companies both here in the U.S. and in Europe. Besides you could always use that .308 as a "backup" rifle if you go hunting, to a match or if a friend is in need to borrow one. Ultimately it's your call, not mine.
You’re right, the math doesn’t lie.
Like the math that says a .308 can put more energy on game at 200yds than a comparable short action 6.5 like the Creedmoor or .260
Or the math that says, ceteris paribus, you’ll get more powder burn out of the same barrel length or the same burn out of a shorter barrel with .308 relative to the comparable 6.5s
Or the math that says you can get 180-147=33 more grains of bullet available from common factory loads with the .308 compared to the 6.5s if you’re looking for more mass
Or the math that says a fixed cost (barrel) plus a variable cost (ammo) equals a total cost that’s absolutely higher if the first is larger and the second is held equal (and we all know you can shoot .308 cheaper than 6.5CM). That fact doesn’t change just because you feel it’s irrelevant and decree it so.
So there are four reasons to own a .308, in addition to plenty others mentioned in this thread. Note that those are before you even get into the non-math ones.
Again, I love the Creed, but I like .308 too and saying there’s no reason to own one is more than a little obtuse. Of course it’s not perfect for everything; the beauty of the caliber is that it’s damn good at a LOT of things.
I don’t know how I can physically hear a grating tone in your posts...but jeez can I ever. Could you try being less...that? Is it so hard to not pick shit with anyone on a single thread that you reply to? Have you thought about trying, just to say you can?
Ahhhh, now I’ve figured it out: you’ve been on this site for like a month and have more posts than I do in a dozen years. So you’re someone who found a new online forum to bluster around during your covid boredom.
Last edited:
My first rifle I bought was a Remington 700 VSSF in 308 caliber about 25 years ago. I still have it and it stil shoots very accurate at 300m. 10 shots 1/2 MOA or less.
I shoot Laua 155 grs Silver Scenars at 2800 ft/s. I just cranked it up with a AICS stock and because it shoots so good I putted a S/B scope 5-25x56 on it with a MSR reticle.
A small mistake about the reticle because the reticle lines are a bit thicker.If you shoot 300 m or 400m you don't need 6.5 CRM.Indeed the barrel life of a 308 is much longer than a 6.5.
A 308 is a lot of fun.Forgiving when you reload.Not fancy.A lot of components .I will always keep a 308 in my gunsafe. A Belgian sportshooter.
I shoot Laua 155 grs Silver Scenars at 2800 ft/s. I just cranked it up with a AICS stock and because it shoots so good I putted a S/B scope 5-25x56 on it with a MSR reticle.
A small mistake about the reticle because the reticle lines are a bit thicker.If you shoot 300 m or 400m you don't need 6.5 CRM.Indeed the barrel life of a 308 is much longer than a 6.5.
A 308 is a lot of fun.Forgiving when you reload.Not fancy.A lot of components .I will always keep a 308 in my gunsafe. A Belgian sportshooter.
I know AIs are expensive but situations like this are where the barrel swap capability really shines.
I have a custom .308 bolt action with S&B scope, bipod, etc. I ended up selling it and buying a $1000 barrel in .308 for my AX. Now I just swap the barrel whenever I want to use it.
I have a custom .308 bolt action with S&B scope, bipod, etc. I ended up selling it and buying a $1000 barrel in .308 for my AX. Now I just swap the barrel whenever I want to use it.
$351, Bob.
(gotta get to that Showcase Showdown!)
edited to contribute an actual response:
I understand the thought of “I don’t reach into the safe for this one as much.” There are a number of rifles like that in my safe, and sometimes it annoys me that they take up space. I’ve got a Rem 600 in .308 that I often think of selling to fund another project or purchase, but I keep hanging on to it. Part of it is for sentimental value because I got it from my grandfather, and some is because it’s an accurate, light hunting rifle.
I love my 6.5 CM, but I’m in Texas, and the .308 will put more energy down range for any in-state hunting scenario I’m in. If that isn’t the case for you, then .308 won’t hold that sway.
I will argue that a .308 is a great jack-of-all-trades rifle, and it’s worth keeping one just to have more caliber/ammo options. As other people have said, you could also put another .308 barrel on the rifle you’re talking about and keep it as a loaner rifle for friends, or a dependable back-up rifle if you go on a big hunting trip.
Last edited:
