LMT .308 MWS

[jpach]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Ive shot mine at steel otu to 600 with no problem and rocks at 700 with no problem, and those were just BS handloads I put together really quick. Im sure with better development and hotter loads it can go a bit further no problem.

 

[Prairie Dog Dundee]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

According to JMB balistics the M118LR at 2471 fps is going 1241 fps at my altitude and still packing 600 ft. lbs of energy.

 

[verdugo60]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

At what distance, dundee?

 

[Prairie Dog Dundee]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: verdugo60</div><div class="ubbcode-body">At what distance, dundee? </div></div>

Sorry. 1000 yards.

 

[verdugo60]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

No problem, thanks. Wow, so still supersonic at 1k. So, with that in mind, will someone shoot some steel at a thousand and give us the range report?

 

[jpach]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prairie Dog Dundee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">According to JMB balistics the M118LR at 2471 fps is going 1241 fps at my altitude and still packing 600 ft. lbs of energy. </div></div>

Info like this is great. It really pisses off the guys who say you NEED 24" for 308. Of course longer is better for velocity, but for overall practital use with a .308 AR, 16" works quite well.

 

[RG in Idaho]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: verdugo60</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So with the 16" Chrome barell, what kind of longer distance accuracy and velocity are you guys getting? It's great that its shooting so tight at 100, but KY shooter, you said past 500 the 16" isn't doing it? Anyone else, shot these between 500-900 yds? </div></div>

A cross post but relevant;



Did a little chrono work a while back.

175smk, 45gr Varget, CCI BR2, Win Brass, 2.815 OAL, I could see the group developing and pulled a couple of fliers so I knuckled down and shot this 100yd group. Not too shabby off of a rolled up blanket!

The load shot so well that I decided to take it out to 1k. Two sighters in the same spot then 13 rounds between a 36" gong and a 20"gong. 39.75 MOA to get to 1K.

Some 16" data, since it seems to be scarce online. All ten shot averages;

Load listed above = 2498fps, For comparison, this shoots @ 2695fps in my 24" FN SPR A3G
150 Hornady fmj-bt, 45.5 Varget, LC brass = 2629fps
150 Hornady fmj-bt, 46 Varget, LC brass = 2680fps
150 Hornady fmj-bt, 46.5 Varget, LC brass = 2683fps
150 SP, Fed Power Shock Factory =2612fps

These were shot @ 2900' alt, 80deg F, Don't use the Varget load in anything with less case capacity than Winny brass. Don't forget the standard reloading safety disclaimer.

 

[verdugo60]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Sorry, I don't see how its a cross post? Anyways TH, you are from Boise huh? I'm from nampa. Where do you shoot at? I like the para range, they had a great lrtr match this summer. I'm a member if you ever want to meet up and shoot some steel out there. Maybe you could bring your lmt?

 

[Postal0311]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Rumor is that LMT is no longer planning to offer a 20 inch .308 barrel due to the negligible gains and less desirability over the 16 inch barrel.

 

[problemchild]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Rumor is that LMT is no longer planning to offer a 20 inch .308 barrel due to the negligible gains and less desirability over the 16 inch barrel. </div></div>

Yeah and it would weigh the same as a Main Battle Tank.

How bout a 16" or 18" fluted 5R?

 

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

You build a monlithic rail and a huge barrel extension and then you worry about a couple of inches of barrel steel?

Got a bunch of different ammos in and I'm looking to take my MWS to the range on Thursday.

I'd really like to get a 18inch 5R barrel. I know that 16 inches isn't that much of a velocity loss, but muzzle blast is increased, n'est-ce pas? I wouldn't mind the 18inch or even a 20inch barrel to get a rifle length gas systems in the gun.

It ain't all just about external ballistics.

 

[RG in Idaho]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: verdugo60</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry, I don't see how its a cross post? Anyways TH, you are from Boise huh? I'm from nampa. Where do you shoot at? I like the para range, they had a great lrtr match this summer. I'm a member if you ever want to meet up and shoot some steel out there. Maybe you could bring your lmt? </div></div>

I'm a member there as well. I'm sure we can arrange something...

 

[Highground]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

For those looking for barrels, I received an email response from LMT yesterday indicating that .308 barrels will not be available until after the first of the year, as they are busy filling orders.

 

[Postal0311]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

What optics are you all using on your MWS?

I am currently running a Super Sniper 10x, but intend to move to something else. I am curious what other scopes are being used for what other applications.

 

[Prairie Dog Dundee]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What optics are you all using on your MWS?

I am currently running a Super Sniper 10x, but intend to move to something else. I am curious what other scopes are being used for what other applications. </div></div>

SS 3-9 with A2 stock for DM application.

[imgimg]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

 

[problemchild]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Testing the JP brake out. Less overall recoil than the PWS brake but its a quicker impulse. The PWS brake is a slower impulse but more of it. Overall I cannot decide which I like better. I was able to drill a 200 yd target never moving off center mass.

Top of target is 1 bullet per second, bottom is 2 bullets per second. The drop is 4.5" at 200 yds and I was not compensating for that.

 

[Postal0311]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

What round ProblemChild?

 

[saryan]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Man this thing is tempting. Im thinking 16" 308 for most stuff, 20"-22" 6.5 Creedmore for longer range work.

 

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

LMT MWS with chrome barrel
PRS Stock
Heavy Buffers AR10 Rifle spring and buffer
A2 Reciever Extension from Grant
Larue integrated bipod adaptor with Harris Bipod
Premier 3-15 MIL-Dot (A bit more scope than needed, but I'm putting it on my longest range rifle till I get a bolt gun (AIX or the new Remmy)
Looking to swap in my G-Trigger, maybe a offset red dot, Magpul trigger guard and MBUS, and figure out a sling for this heavy bastard.
Looking to run some multiple ammo samples thru it in the next few days. Going to try it at Hoser's Praire Dog and Rifle matches- I want there to be no mistaking when a target gets hit.

 

[bubbapug1]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Thats great load data, thanks.

 

[jpach]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What optics are you all using on your MWS?

I am currently running a Super Sniper 10x, but intend to move to something else. I am curious what other scopes are being used for what other applications. </div></div>

As several others here, I am using the SS 3-9x. I MAY swap it for a Vortex PST if they ever release them , but the 3-9 is more than enough so far. The 3-9 is perfect for my requirements (though a cool PST reticle would be nice).

 

[saryan]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jpach</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What optics are you all using on your MWS?

I am currently running a Super Sniper 10x, but intend to move to something else. I am curious what other scopes are being used for what other applications. </div></div>

As several others here, I am using the SS 3-9x. I MAY swap it for a Vortex PST if they ever release them , but the 3-9 is more than enough so far. The 3-9 is perfect for my requirements (though a cool PST reticle would be nice). </div></div>

They will.....

 

[RG in Idaho]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What optics are you all using on your MWS?
</div></div>

Leupy MK4 3.5-10X40 in a NF Unimount.

 

[verdugo60]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

K RG, I'm gonna be going out of country for a.week, but when I get back maybe we can meet up in Parma, I would love to handle that stick, and meet a hide buddy. Did you happen to shoot the LRTR match this summer?

 

[verdugo60]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Uh, and by that I mean shoot rifles. Ha, just thought about my phrasing, and didn't want to get mocked by all the amateur comedians on the hide!

 

[RG in Idaho]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: verdugo60</div><div class="ubbcode-body">K RG, I'm gonna be going out of country for a.week, but when I get back maybe we can meet up in Parma, I would love to handle that stick, and meet a hide buddy. Did you happen to shoot the LRTR match this summer? </div></div>

No, I did not shoot the Summer LRTR. I did shoot the offsite match in the Spring.

 

[Blaster4]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

I took mine out today to test for function. I ran Hornady 168 BTHP and 168 AMAX through it...both factory loaded.

I first sighted in with the iron sights at 100yds and it held a solid 2MOA with both loads...although the groups were about 3 inches right...elevation was dead on. My aiming point was smaller than the front sight post so that didn't help.

I then mounted a S&B 1.5-6 ShortDot on it and was holding 1MOA with both loads. I believe this can be improved upon with a better stock and grip.

The ERGO grip might be nice for AR15's but this is a big and heavy rifle which would do better with a MAGPUL MIAD or similar grip. The ERGO was just too narrow and too smushy...plus the grip cap kept popping out after every 2-3 shots. The SOPMOD stock has tog o as well...this rifle is 10 pounds...please put a substantial stock on it. I am going to replace it with a UBR or a standard A2...I'm not sure but I'm leaning towards the UBR. You can't shoot the SOPMOD in the prone very well at all...my rear bag would depress the latch and the whole stock would shorten up during recoil...not good.

Although adding a heavy stock to this rifle will make it heavier overall...the added weight in the back will counter balance the tank like front end so it will be handier.

I also want to pick up one of those BattleComp brakes or maybe a Surefire.

Only thing else to add was that this rifle is not hand loader friendly...by that I mean your brass will not thank you for running through that gun...LOL. Seems like the case deflector put a small dent in the side of each case...not a big deal for me but some might care. I will say though that ejection was excellent and by that I mean it sent the 168 BTHP's in a nice pile at 3'oclock and the 168 AMAX's in a nice pile at 2 o'clock. No hiccups of any kind were experienced in the 100 rounds I put through it today.

Some perspective...the M40A1 I used in the late 90's was only 1MOA out to 1K. We would put a 1" square pasty on a target and at 100yds moved the group over until we hit 3 shots somewhere in the pasty...touching was good enough. This rifle can at least do that...how far out it will do that...I don't know since I haven't run it that far yet.

I do wish that I was issued this rifle back then. As a spotter I would have killed to have been able to engage the farther targets with the same ammo as the bolt gun...and still have enough firepower to break contact and provide security for my teammate.

I don't have any of the Hornady Superformance at this time but when I do I will run it and see how it fairs. I might try some 155 AMAX's as well...maybe some TAP ammo, too...but I'm going to wait until my S&B 1-8 ShortDot shows up to do anymore accuracy testing.

Oh one more thing...I would not use a single point sling on this bad boy...that one attachment point will be screaming...LOL.

be safe, shoot well

Respectfully,

--KJ

 

[saryan]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KJDrake</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I took mine out today to test for function. I ran Hornady 168 BTHP and 168 AMAX through it...both factory loaded.

I first sighted in with the iron sights at 100yds and it held a solid 2MOA with both loads...although the groups were about 3 inches right...elevation was dead on. My aiming point was smaller than the front sight post so that didn't help.

I then mounted a S&B 1.5-6 ShortDot on it and was holding 1MOA with both loads. I believe this can be improved upon with a better stock and grip.

The ERGO grip might be nice for AR15's but this is a big and heavy rifle which would do better with a MAGPUL MIAD or similar grip. The ERGO was just too narrow and too smushy...plus the grip cap kept popping out after every 2-3 shots. The SOPMOD stock has tog o as well...this rifle is 10 pounds...please put a substantial stock on it. I am going to replace it with a UBR or a standard A2...I'm not sure but I'm leaning towards the UBR. You can't shoot the SOPMOD in the prone very well at all...my rear bag would depress the latch and the whole stock would shorten up during recoil...not good.

Although adding a heavy stock to this rifle will make it heavier overall...the added weight in the back will counter balance the tank like front end so it will be handier.

I also want to pick up one of those BattleComp brakes or maybe a Surefire.

Only thing else to add was that this rifle is not hand loader friendly...by that I mean your brass will not thank you for running through that gun...LOL. Seems like the case deflector put a small dent in the side of each case...not a big deal for me but some might care. I will say though that ejection was excellent and by that I mean it sent the 168 BTHP's in a nice pile at 3'oclock and the 168 AMAX's in a nice pile at 2 o'clock. No hiccups of any kind were experienced in the 100 rounds I put through it today.

Some perspective...the M40A1 I used in the late 90's was only 1MOA out to 1K. We would put a 1" square pasty on a target and at 100yds moved the group over until we hit 3 shots somewhere in the pasty...touching was good enough. This rifle can at least do that...how far out it will do that...I don't know since I haven't run it that far yet.

I do wish that I was issued this rifle back then. As a spotter I would have killed to have been able to engage the farther targets with the same ammo as the bolt gun...and still have enough firepower to break contact and provide security for my teammate.

I don't have any of the Hornady Superformance at this time but when I do I will run it and see how it fairs. I might try some 155 AMAX's as well...maybe some TAP ammo, too...but I'm going to wait until my S&B 1-8 ShortDot shows up to do anymore accuracy testing.

Oh one more thing...I would not use a single point sling on this bad boy...that one attachment point will be screaming...LOL.

be safe, shoot well

Respectfully,

--KJ </div></div>
Good report. Thanks!

 

[Postal0311]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Agree on the Ergo grip, had the base on mine pop out. Ended up replacing it with an trusty A2 grip.

Anyone here have the stainless barreled model?

 

[Blaster4]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

I honestly have no idea why they put that grip and that stock on this rifle.

I figure the UBR will be able to fit the dual role I see this weapon being used for.

You can shorten it up for CQB and then extend it out for that proper scope picture for the DMR role.

--KJ

 

[phxfa]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Dont bother with the Hornady Superformance loads. you'll be popping primers

 

[Blaster4]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

well I'll run them through and see...as soon as they get here that is.

--KJ

 

[Postal0311]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Anyone else find that their MWS has egged FCG pin holes?
Youtube video showing egged trigger pin hole.

 

[rifleman0321]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Wow, that sucks.

 

[saryan]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Anyone else find that their MWS has egged FCG pin holes?
Youtube video showing egged trigger pin hole.
</div></div>
Would like to hear more about this.

 

[spr1]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

On the egged out holes, is that a gun with the newer Bolt Carrier? Also, are they the factory FCG parts?
That is certainly a problem.....

 

[saryan]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Couldnt take it anymore....joining the club. I work on a range and reload so I should have some good reports shortly.

 

[jpach]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Anyone else find that their MWS has egged FCG pin holes?
Youtube video showing egged trigger pin hole.
</div></div>

Havent heard of it, that doesnt look too good.

An issue that I havent brought up yet is the pistol grip screw hole in the lower receiver. Mine seems to have been drilled off center so it was a HUGE pain in the ass trying to install a MIAD.

I actually had to take a drill to my MIAD and make a partial hole connecting to the main one in order for the screw to go into the off-set hole in the receiver.

Not a huge deal but also not something I would expect from LMT. I mean, even when I tried installing the factory grip it was hard to put it back on since the hole was off. Whoever put it on at the factory definitely knew that the hole was drilled incorrectly.

That being said, my LMT is still awesome and Im 100% happy with it!

 

[rifleman0321]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: spr1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">On the egged out holes, is that a gun with the newer Bolt Carrier? Also, are they the factory FCG parts?
That is certainly a problem..... </div></div>

Hmmm. Went and checked the one I got last week... Egged holes just like the vid. Nothing so bad you would really notice- unless you went looking for it. Mine is one with the new carrier......

 

[Postal0311]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: spr1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">On the egged out holes, is that a gun with the newer Bolt Carrier? Also, are they the factory FCG parts?
That is certainly a problem..... </div></div>

New BCG, factory parts never messed with. (other then that I replaced the grip w/ an A2)

 

[bubbapug1]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

How is the recoil on this gun?

 

[problemchild]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Anyone else find that their MWS has egged FCG pin holes?
Youtube video showing egged trigger pin hole.
</div></div>

Yes mine is doing the same thing. Egg holes or over sized? I have an rma to send it in but IM having so much fun with it I dont want to send it away for 2 weeks.

I installed the G trigger and it came with 2 pins one was oversized for "worn" holes. I was told the LMT hole was 1.553 yet the G trigger pin that was 1.558 slid in with no resistance. With the oil on the pin it does the same thing as yours. It makes my 1st stage a bit gritty. I also have a pretty bad gas leak around the front block/tube and its getting the handguards and barrel coated in gas black. I have an rma for that as well. The leak causes a FTJ (fail to eject) every once in a while.

Guess those checklists they send out with the gun are just window dressing because someone isn't doing their job!

Time to send it in......

 

[Postal0311]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Yes problemchild, you are right it is not an "egged" hole, but one that is too large. I used the wrong terminology.

I contact LMT, they said they won't do anything unless I send the rifle back to the dealer I purchased it from, and the dealer contact them.

Fun Fun Fun, from now on I will no longer recommend the MWS to anyone and will actively recommend against it when I talk to people about it.

 

[problemchild]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yes problemchild, you are right it is not an "egged" hole, but one that is too large. I used the wrong terminology.

I contact LMT, they said they won't do anything unless I send the rifle back to the dealer I purchased it from, and the dealer contact them.

Fun Fun Fun, from now on I will no longer recommend the MWS to anyone and will actively recommend against it when I talk to people about it. </div></div>

Thats BS. Call and ask for Gene and ask for an RMA. Tell him several people are posting about this issue.

PM me for my number if you like.

How will they swap out the lower with the serial and registration?

 

[Postal0311]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Mr. Swanson tells me that LMT will only check out the rifle if I send it back to my dealer, and have them send it to LMT.

I sent Gene back a long email detailing all the issues I have had with LMT over the years.

In the free states(or the freer ones) you can send a firearm right to the dealer for service (no FFL required), and they can mail a replacement to your door. Dunno how it is in the state that LMT is based in. Perhaps thats why they are requesting it from a dealer. I know both S&W and Glock have replaced damaged or defected firearms and mailed the new one right to me(fed law allows it).

 

[problemchild]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Hmm...

They never asked where I live. I live in the Peoplez Republik Of Kalifornia. Not a "free state" for sure.

I would call back and ask for the Karl Lewis or his secretary or someone who can give you a yes and rma. Gene is in R&D by the way. Here are the players by name..........

http://www.lewismachine.net/about.php

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mr. Swanson tells me that LMT will only check out the rifle if I send it back to my dealer, and have them send it to LMT.

I sent Gene back a long email detailing all the issues I have had with LMT over the years.

In the free states(or the freer ones) you can send a firearm right to the dealer for service (no FFL required), and they can mail a replacement to your door. Dunno how it is in the state that LMT is based in. Perhaps thats why they are requesting it from a dealer. I know both S&W and Glock have replaced damaged or defected firearms and mailed the new one right to me(fed law allows it). </div></div>

 

[Postal0311]

Re: LMT .308 MWS


I have finally received a RMA number. Ugh, its going to cost a bit to ship that heavy rifle back to LMT.

Turns out they won't do transfers there, so you will have to have any replacements shipped to an FFL.

So I have to pay shipping on the rifle + should it need to be replaced, I get to pay a transfer fee.

Anyways, if you reading this thread and thinking about buying a LMT MWS, take my advice and buy something else.

 

[problemchild]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Im sure they will fix it. When it comes back fixed ask for a refund for your costs, or maybe a credit for spare parts. I would not mind having a spare bolt.

Have you fired the rifle yet? I really like the way it shoots and am very happy with it except for the two problems listed.


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Postal0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I have finally received a RMA number. Ugh, its going to cost a bit to ship that heavy rifle back to LMT.

Turns out they won't do transfers there, so you will have to have any replacements shipped to an FFL.

So I have to pay shipping on the rifle + should it need to be replaced, I get to pay a transfer fee.

Anyways, if you reading this thread and thinking about buying a LMT MWS, take my advice and buy something else. </div></div>

 

[Postal0311]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

Problemchild, I have about 200 round through the rifle.

First used some DAG surplus, couldn't get better then 6+ MOA out of it, so I use it for close range shooting clay pigeons on a berm. Very fun and very controllable. Friends, Dad, and I liked being able to do quick and easy double taps with the MWS.

Using a Super Sniper 10x, I fired two 5 round, and 1 four round <1.5 MOA groups at 100 yards. That my last shots in the last time I had it out. (Using Black Hills 168BTMHP) Rifle can most likely do better, but I need practice and am the weak link. If I ever shoot this thing again I will try some 10 round groups to post here.

I'd love the MWS, if it weren't for the issues I am having with it, and the issues I have had with LMT in the past.

 

[Prairie Dog Dundee]

Re: LMT .308 MWS

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KJDrake</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I honestly have no idea why they put that grip and that stock on this rifle.

I figure the UBR will be able to fit the dual role I see this weapon being used for.

You can shorten it up for CQB and then extend it out for that proper scope picture for the DMR role.

--KJ </div></div>

I put an A2 on mine and am much happer with the fit and feel. I will be checking out the Troy Battle Ax stock when it comes out. http://store.troyind.com/Battle_Ax_CQB_Stock_Black_p/sbut-sw1-00bt-00.htm