New employer giving me the run around, advice wanted

[Jgunner]

Depends on your energy level and what you will be doing. Sitting at a desk or hauling concrete?

Anyways, i would say “oh, so you want to renegotiate the hours worked, i want to renegotiate the pay”.

 

[Vodoun daVinci]

I just retired after a Rage Quit due to exploitation by my former employer - they flushed me in April of 2020 due to Covid bullshit (they got *millions in PPP money by trimming their workforce by 280 people before the Program rolled out) and rode me like a post horse, stole my seniority, rehired me as a "new Employee" instead of calling me back from Lay off. In 2017 I had 3 different jobs, each one paid me more money after my employer pulled the rug out from underneath me and lied about hours, pay, and job duties. This has been a trend now for the last 5 years of so....since 2015 anyway. My experience the last 7 years of my Career/Profession is that *The Whole Fucking Game* has literally changed in 7 years. Nobody reads Resumes or checks references....they don't care what you majored in in College or that you were President of the Car Club. They wanna to steal someone from another employer. Someone with verified/turn key experience in what they want. They want verified jobs skills and experience and if you have that they will literally throw money at you and come to your terms. If you make no demands they think you are a Easy Mark and they fuck you raw.

See, the whole game is now different - they are begging for employees and simply cannot get it thru their heads that quality employees are not "Lucky" to have a job - no more beggars. Only choosers. Fuck with yer people and they'll leave ya - because they can. It's an Employees Market, not an Employers Market. Unless one is holding onto "The Old Ways" of 2015 or before.

If you haven't changed jobs in the last 8 years, you have no clue. It's not going back - the old work ethic and hiring practices are obsolete never to return. It's an Employees Market now unless you approach a job and being abused as some kind of Civic Duty to Manhood. There's a better gig out there in virtually every case.

VooDoo

 

[308pirate]

Anyways, i would say “oh, so you want to renegotiate the hours worked, i want to renegotiate the pay”.

@Jmccracken1214 pay attention to this

 

[Jmccracken1214]

Here’s where I’m at after some thought this morning.
I have a 2nd income, not enough to live on, but enough to cover bills if I don’t spend any.
I’m going to call them tomorrow morning and since they do have another plant on 8 hour shifts, tell him that the job they’re now offering me isn’t the job I applied for, nor interviewed for. If they can get me on at the other plant, awesome. If not, thanks for the offer but no thanks.

Hell, Walmart posted a online order picker job today near me for $23 an hour lol.

 

[308pirate]

Here’s wheee I’m at after some thought this morning.
I have a 2nd income, not enough to live on, but enough to cover bills if I don’t spend any.
I’m going to call them tomorrow morning and since they do have another plant on 8 hour shifts, tell him that the job they’re now offering me isn’t the job I applied for, nor interviewed for. If they can get me on at the other plant, awesome. If not, thanks for the offer but no thanks.

Hell, Walmart posted a online order picker job today near me for $23 an hour lol.

You might to add another condition: you'll take the new hours at a permanent 25% increase in pay. Meaning you keep your negotiated wage even if they put you back on 8 hrs. In writing.

 

[plong]

Anything after 8 hours should be time and a half. So 12 hour shifts? Sure. No problem. Just pay me overtime, time and time and a half for the extra 4 hours per day, or you'll be dealing with a State Fair Wage and Hour complaint. And dealing with my lawyer or Union.

That's not how it works... at least not in my state. Here its hours per week (> 40, < 40...), may want to check for your locale.

 

[Vodoun daVinci]

Yup, same here - you don't get OT until yer over 40 hours. They can literally work you 2 X 20 hour shifts and then send you home and you only get regular pay. And if you had a Holiday/Paid Day in there? It doesn't count to the 40 hour count.

VooDoo

 

[Bullfrog08]

I dont change jobs often, but my last approach was taking a vacation, starting the new job while on vacation. If it doesnt seem like a good fit, then go back to the old job. If it works out, the old employer gets the same notice I would get if they didnt need me.

Im not giving anyone two weeks notice, until they start giving terminated employees two weeks.

 

[x2cross]

I work 4-10's, and It's be hard for me to go back to an 8hr work week. That extra day off really makes your weekend waay nicer. Plus I save a trip driving to work(60 miles one way)

 

[zeroz]

Do what you want but I think arguably you could spend more time with the family working the 12's. That extra day off could be well spent with the fam as opposed to the extra couple hours each night. Plus you could get all your errands done while they're at school instead of on the weekends when they're home, etc.

 

[BullGear]

Do what you want but I think arguably you could spend more time with the family working the 12's. That extra day off could be well spent with the fam as opposed to the extra couple hours each night. Plus you could get all your errands done while they're at school instead of on the weekends when they're home, etc.

As many of you know, I'm on dialysis and the techs work 3 12 hour shifts on a normal work week. Realizing they are on their feet for most of those 12 hours, they talk about using 1 of their days off as a day to recharge. So, their time off isn't as easy as one might suspect. Sometimes they are scheduled to work on a Saturday, so their time off can be broken up with just Sunday as a weekend rest day.

I've worked 12 hours shifts (5-6 days a week) before and I have to say those weren't my favorite times working on the railroad. When we were moved to 12 hour shifts, it was because of an emergency or a planned construction event. Which meant they you were humping almost the entire 12 hours. I think I would have liked 4 10 hour shifts, but they were never offered to me.

But retirement isn't a bad option either.....

 

[Vodoun daVinci]

I have friends "about my age" that did the 12 hour a day thing 50-60+ hours a week for years/decades. They thought they loved it back in The Day and to be fair I wished I'd have earned that kind of money. I have been a 9 hour a night sleep person for my whole life. I do not eat opportunistically (whatever is available) drink my 2 quarts of water every day and when others were at The Shop at 6 am gettin' it dun I was in the gym or dojo getting a progressive/adaptive workout instead of being worked like a dog.

My point (with minimal Virtue Signaling) is that all my buds who are 66 YO and now retired look like they have been hit by several buses. They can't sleep, they can't walk, they have multiple surgeries, morbidly obese, haven't seen nor used Mr. Winky in 15 years, and couldn't run a flight of stairs if Death were chasing them. I'm still right in the middle of my BMI index, can still do 100 push ups (in a row) and my Medical Practitioner tells me I'm way more healthy and fit than her patients that are 20 years younger and work 5 X 12 "for the money".

There is Way more to Life than another 12 hour shift. If yer cool with it you can have mine. I'm looking forward to another 30ish years and I'm really loving retirement at 66. My buds not so much...but they don't worry about money either and they got that going for them.

VooDoo

 

[Jmccracken1214]

As many of you know, I'm on dialysis and the techs work 3 12 hour shifts on a normal work week. Realizing they are on their feet for most of those 12 hours, they talk about using 1 of their days off as a day to recharge. So, their time off isn't as easy as one might suspect. Sometimes they are scheduled to work on a Saturday, so their time off can be broken up with just Sunday as a weekend rest day.

I've worked 12 hours shifts (5-6 days a week) before and I have to say those weren't my favorite times working on the railroad. When we were moved to 12 hour shifts, it was because of an emergency or a planned construction event. Which meant they you were humping almost the entire 12 hours. I think I would have liked 4 10 hour shifts, but they were never offered to me.

But retirement isn't a bad option either.....

Thats how both jobs I used to work those hours were. Get home, eat shower sleep, wake up and dont really want to do a whole lot except relax.. Next day, can't plan too much cus I have to hit the hay early to wake up early and pull a 12 hr shift.

I love money as much as the next person and thankful to be in the position I am in. Im by no means rich, or even close to a 6 figure salary, but I do well enough to buy most toys when I want them, a nice house and my wife can stay at home with our kids.
It was the birth of our 2nd child that really made me realize, for whatever reason, F' busting my ass all the time, tomorrow isnt promised, Id rather spend the time at home.

 

[SilentStalkr]

Do what you want but I think arguably you could spend more time with the family working the 12's. That extra day off could be well spent with the fam as opposed to the extra couple hours each night. Plus you could get all your errands done while they're at school instead of on the weekends when they're home, etc.

Possibly, but it depends on the person. From my experience, as you get older and have more family obligations then it really doesn’t work out that way. Not to mention most people use that extra day to relax and it winds up sort of being a wasted, nonproductive day. Not to mention, if your kids do anything outside of reg school then someone needs to be there to take them, pick them up, encourage them and be a father figure. Hard to do if you work all the time or don’t have someone to do those things for you while you are at work. This gets into tho whole deal about the family unit being destroyed sbd it taking effect on society deal tho. That’s another conversation but you see where I’m going.

As many of you know, I'm on dialysis and the techs work 3 12 hour shifts on a normal work week. Realizing they are on their feet for most of those 12 hours, they talk about using 1 of their days off as a day to recharge. So, their time off isn't as easy as one might suspect. Sometimes they are scheduled to work on a Saturday, so their time off can be broken up with just Sunday as a weekend rest day.

I've worked 12 hours shifts (5-6 days a week) before and I have to say those weren't my favorite times working on the railroad. When we were moved to 12 hour shifts, it was because of an emergency or a planned construction event. Which meant they you were humping almost the entire 12 hours. I think I would have liked 4 10 hour shifts, but they were never offered to me.

But retirement isn't a bad option either.....

Yep. This. Hell because I’m salary I already work my ass way more than they pay me for. One of those things where like the op the said sbd we agreed upon certain things when hired but then they changed. Not all their fault as unexpected things came up with both party’s but it wasn’t cool. Still happens from time to time but it has been way better in the past couple months. But occasionally those 100 hour weeks which is 60hrs I don’t get paid for do pop up. And that shit is for the birds.

No idea what happened to that quote but I’m not fixing it. Lol.

 

[Jmccracken1214]

UPDATE:
I called the big boss this morning, no answer, so I left a voice mail. A few hours later, I got a text from him "Hey Jon, Im out of town, is everything ok?"
So I sent what I wanted to say through text, even though I'd rather verbally discuss this stuff... Told him basically, I gave the job offer and its changes some thought and since it's not what I applied for, or interviewed for, I wouldnt be able to take that offer, but if he could move me into the other position that is 8 hour days, that I also applied for, I'd love to move forward and work for the city.......

I waited all day, never got a response, I checked my phone at 6:30 and noticed he read the text at 5pm and never said a word back to me.

Fuck em.

 

[BullGear]

UPDATE:
I called the big boss this morning, no answer, so I left a voice mail. A few hours later, I got a text from him "Hey Jon, Im out of town, is everything ok?"
So I sent what I wanted to say through text, even though I'd rather verbally discuss this stuff... Told him basically, I gave the job offer and its changes some thought and since it's not what I applied for, or interviewed for, I wouldnt be able to take that offer, but if he could move me into the other position that is 8 hour days, that I also applied for, I'd love to move forward and work for the city.......

I waited all day, never got a response, I checked my phone at 6:30 and noticed he read the text at 5pm and never said a word back to me.

Fuck em.

If he didn't read the message until 5pm, he didn't have a chance to talk to HR. I would give it until noon on Monday.

 

[Jmccracken1214]

If he didn't read the message until 5pm, he didn't have a chance to talk to HR. I would give it until noon on Monday.

That is true, but I feel he could have atleast sent me some sort of response, a yes, no, fuck you would be better than no reply at all.

 

[37L1]

That is true, but I feel he could have atleast sent me some sort of response, a yes, no, fuck you would be better than no reply at all.

At this point, it's best you move on.

 

[BullGear]

That is true, but I feel he could have atleast sent me some sort of response, a yes, no, fuck you would be better than no reply at all.

He wouldn't do that. He has to play the silent game until he gets the answer from HR. If he's a good boss, he's not going to say NO, if there's a chance. He's not going to say YES until he gets that approval from HR. He probably doesn't want to address the issue at all until he has a clear answer. Don't sweat it until Monday afternoon.

 

[Jmccracken1214]

He wouldn't do that. He has to play the silent game until he gets the answer from HR. If he's a good boss, he's not going to say NO, if there's a chance. He's not going to say YES until he gets that approval from HR. He probably doesn't want to address the issue at all until he has a clear answer. Don't sweat it until Monday afternoon.

Well, my start date was Monday. They didn’t tell me all the changes until Tuesday of this week. Figure we Are both cutting it close to be having changes made

 

[BullGear]

Well, my start date was Monday. They didn’t tell me all the changes until Tuesday of this week. Figure we Are both cutting it close to be having changes made

Report for your assigned time. I do believe you said you had already quit your previous job and are no longer working. You lose nothing by reporting for duty. Your first few hours will be with HR signing paperwork. Hash out the issues then. Walk away if the answers don't work for you.

But you've gotta do what's best for you. I'm just hitting all of the proper steps one should take.

 

[Jmccracken1214]

Report for your assigned time. I do believe you said you had already quit your previous job and are no longer working. You lose nothing by reporting for duty. Your first few hours will be with HR signing paperwork. Hash out the issues then. Walk away if the answers don't work for you.

But you've gotta do what's best for you. I'm just hitting all of the proper steps one should take.

I’ve already done all the paperwork, got my badge made, drug test…. Monday is day 1 of the job.
I get what you’re saying, but I think I’ll just pass on this circus. Maybe a different department down the road.

 

[SilentStalkr]

UPDATE:
I called the big boss this morning, no answer, so I left a voice mail. A few hours later, I got a text from him "Hey Jon, Im out of town, is everything ok?"
So I sent what I wanted to say through text, even though I'd rather verbally discuss this stuff... Told him basically, I gave the job offer and its changes some thought and since it's not what I applied for, or interviewed for, I wouldnt be able to take that offer, but if he could move me into the other position that is 8 hour days, that I also applied for, I'd love to move forward and work for the city.......

I waited all day, never got a response, I checked my phone at 6:30 and noticed he read the text at 5pm and never said a word back to me.

Fuck em.

Man, I hope it all works out for you in the end.

 

[Jmccracken1214]

Man, I hope it all works out for you in the end.

Yea me too, I’m sure it will. Now is prime time for a job, if push comes to shove, atleast I can about how out and close me eyes and walk into a store that is hiring,

 

[gigamortis]

I've gotten up and left out of new hire orientations quite a few times in my working years. When the company starts moving the goalposts right after they hire you, that's a sign to drop them as fast as you can and look elsewhere. A few of my new hire orientations have popped up with last minute non-compete agreements, draconian safety rules, and more stupid crap devised by those that have never worked with their hands in a trade.

One new hire orientation I was in was being orated by one of the safety cops of the plant. He announced a plant rule that all shirt tails must be tucked in. That's when I got up and said I'm no longer interested. He then said, "So, you don't like to be safe around moving equipment?" I replied "If your shirt tails must be tucked in for safety, then your machine guarding must be seriously lacking." He asked me if I realized that the 5 of us getting orientation that day were selected out of 5000+ resumes for these high paying positions. I replied "Oh good! - Lucky for you there are at least 4,995 more potential suckers waiting right outside that gate to come work here."

Out the door I went.

 

[shields shtr]

I work 4-10's, and It's be hard for me to go back to an 8hr work week. That extra day off really makes your weekend waay nicer. Plus I save a trip driving to work(60 miles one way

I work in the construction industry and this is becoming the norm. In theory, would seem to work great. The problem is, human nature seems to kick in and (4) 10 hour days is more like (3) 10s and about a 5 or 6. After lunch time, production is in the gutter or most folks have bailed. It adds up over time and I see it consistently.

I have always been a goal oriented type person and liked to set task specific goals when I work. I never really adhered to a typical shift type work schedule. Sometimes I worked really long days and weeks, other times I accomplished my tasks or goals in less time. It has served me well over the years.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

I work in the construction industry and this is becoming the norm. In theory, would seem to work great. The problem is, human nature seems to kick in and (4) 10 hour days is more like (3) 10s and about a 5 or 6. After lunch time, production is in the gutter or most folks have bailed. It adds up over time and I see it consistently.

I have always been a goal oriented type person and liked to set task specific goals when I work. I never really adhered to a typical shift type work schedule. Sometimes I worked really long days and weeks, other times I accomplished my tasks or goals in less time. It has served me well over the years.

I've never done shift work and have always been salary or work for myself. Some folks just like the shift work life style and some don't fit it well. It's all about being happy in your life and family. I have a tendency to over work and I come by it honestly, but I can guarantee when I'm old and my grand kids stop coming to see me, I won't say "I sure wish I'd worked a little more", and now days, I try to make sure I won't say "I sure wish I'd spent more time with my family". It's absolutely a workers market right now and will be for a while. EVERY OUTFIT I KNOW is looking for people, but not just warm bodies, people who want to work and if you are one, you can get paid and treated well for it.

That said, hard times are coming so getting some savings together and paying off debt is very important.

 

[spamassassin]

When someone behaves like:

You have to be a special kind of person to not see that as an indication of future behavior. You have an offer in writing which you countersigned. They can't just alter the agreement unilaterally. Tell the new boss GFY and find somewhere better.

 

[BullGear]

When someone behaves like:

You have to be a special kind of person to not see that as an indication of future behavior. You have an offer in writing which you countersigned. They can't just alter the agreement unilaterally. Tell the new boss GFY and find somewhere better.

Tell me why they can't? Is there a law that states they can't do this? It can be wrong (morally) but it's not illegal. This kind of stuff goes on all the time. As an ex-owner of a medium sized company, I did it myself. A business isn't static. Things change all the time, even with personnel. Say someone quit and your new employee is better suited to fill this position instead of the position he was hired for. If both positions are the same pay grade, as an owner/manager of the company, it's your duty to fill the more needed position with the new with the new employee.

However, the short notice is lacking in professionalism. A call from HR should have been made informing the new employee of the change. This gives the new employee the opportunity to agree to the change in hours. If the new employee doesn't like the change, the company then has a dilemma of rescinding the offer or placing the new employee in the original position/hours of employment.

But nowhere in this situation, is there any law being violated. The employer has every right to move employees into positions that suit the company's needs.

 

[Jmccracken1214]

Tell me why they can't? Is there a law that states they can't do this? It can be wrong (morally) but it's not illegal. This kind of stuff goes on all the time. As an ex-owner of a medium sized company, I did it myself. A business isn't static. Things change all the time, even with personnel. Say someone quit and your new employee is better suited to fill this position instead of the position he was hired for. If both positions are the same pay grade, as an owner/manager of the company, it's your duty to fill the more needed position with the new with the new employee.

However, the short notice is lacking in professionalism. A call from HR should have been made informing the new employee of the change. This gives the new employee the opportunity to agree to the change in hours. If the new employee doesn't like the change, the company then has a dilemma of rescinding the offer or placing the new employee in the original position/hours of employment.

But nowhere in this situation, is there any law being violated. The employer has every right to move employees into positions that suit the company's needs.

You’re correct and I get that a company has to do what they need to do, things change. But the employee has the same right to reject the changes, if they want.
I get shit happens, but there’s been a lack of comms with this city since day 1. Id like to say someone dropped the ball, but I don’t think anyone ever “had the ball” to begin wjth.
They knew at my interview 3 weeks ago that they were going to this shift and lied to my face, promised me the posted hourly shift and then waited 4-5 days before I start to change something, for the 2nd-3rd time.

I spoke with someone at Walmart yesterday and I think I’ll check out that order picker job. For $20-$23 an hour, the option of 3 shifts, 3 12’s, 4 10’s or 5 8’s, seems like a pretty easy gig for decent money. If I don’t like it, I can roll on.

 

[Pharmseller]

Show up for work and work the shift they give you.

Get paid.

Look for the job you want while you have a job.

When you find the job you want, quit your old job.

It ain’t rocket surgery.

 

[BullGear]

You’re correct and I get that a company has to do what they need to do, things change. But the employee has the same right to reject the changes, if they want.
I get shit happens, but there’s been a lack of comms with this city since day 1. Id like to say someone dropped the ball, but I don’t think anyone ever “had the ball” to begin wjth.
They knew at my interview 3 weeks ago that they were going to this shift and lied to my face, promised me the posted hourly shift and then waited 4-5 days before I start to change something, for the 2nd-3rd time.

I spoke with someone at Walmart yesterday and I think I’ll check out that order picker job. For $20-$23 an hour, the option of 3 shifts, 3 12’s, 4 10’s or 5 8’s, seems like a pretty easy gig for decent money. If I don’t like it, I can roll on.

You do what you want. But if you think a job at Walmart is best for your career path, then by all means apply at Walmart.

 

[Vodoun daVinci]

49 years of Life/Work experience has proven to me that companies that do this don't need people of my Interest, Aptitude, and Experience set. I don't lie or misrepresent my Goodies to get a job and if the potential employer (I have had a few like that) feels that it's perfectly fine to lie and trap you into taking a job that was misrepresented then they need to be told to get stuffed. I worked a gig in 2017 for exactly 3 months....we all knew what my skill/interest/aptitude set was - I'm a Field Service Specialist. I fix busted shit and I'm very, very good at it. I don't pull wire on new construction where there is no heat, no power, and no bathroom and I don't carry ladders and climb like a monkey all day. I don't work "whatever shift is available and assigned" and I don't deal with "mandatory unscheduled overtime". So if you trapped me and my skills in a lie to get a guy to do that you can look forward to me Rage Quitting when I have had enough of that. I'm 66 and I did all that shit when I was in my 20's and 30's and moved up and on. I didn't work 3 jobs to pay my own way thru college to get a degree in Electronics Engineering to tote ladders and pull wire at 66 YO.

This is why the job market is fucked. People don't *WANT* to be manipulated and lied to at work. They can (and are) working jobs that suit and fit them - there are more jobs that need skilled and dedicated workers than there are workers to fill the jobs and to deal with this employers seem to feel that they have to bully or cheat people/lie to them. I still get 3 offers a week and they all start with a lie coming from an HHR/Head Hunter who's job is on the line if they don't fill these positions. Glad to be out of it - good luck to those who have to work another 20 years. I have no idea how this is gonna pan out but it ain't gonna be pretty.

VooDoo

 

[zeroz]

Good call, Wally World sounds awesome.

 

[dustingaunder]

My brother was an assembler at Walmart at night part time for some extra play money. He built bicycles and grills and stuff. Wasn’t too bad. Also wasn’t too long they wanted him to do stocking and other stuff and work goofy shifts and extra time. Extra money wasn’t worth it after a short time and he bounced.

 

[308pirate]

That is true, but I feel he could have atleast sent me some sort of response, a yes, no, fuck you would be better than no reply at all.

You need to wait until at least end of day monday, if not even end of day Tuesday.

There are certain things that "the boss" isn't the boss of.

Listen to @BullGear

 

[Jmccracken1214]

Good call, Wally World sounds awesome

My brother was an assembler at Walmart at night part time for some extra play money. He built bicycles and grills and stuff. Wasn’t too bad. Also wasn’t too long they wanted him to do stocking and other stuff and work goofy shifts and extra time. Extra money wasn’t worth it after a short time and he bounced.

If I get it, it won’t be permanent, I’ve done retail in the past and it sucks. But for now, it’ll be good pay for simple work. I’ve got a friend at another city, very close to home that can get me a job whenever one pops up. I’d like to get on at a local city since they’ll recognize my time in the military towards retirement and with time off saved over the years, I can retire after 22 years with a 30 year pension.

 

[308pirate]

You have an offer in writing which you countersigned. They can't just alter the agreement unilaterally. T

Oh yes they can. 99% of the people signing employment papers do not read all of it.