Sounds like a market opportunity for an enterprising individual or small business.
Rifle Scopes New Schmidt & Bender PM2 6-36x56
- Thread starter Just Macca
- Start date
Next scope I buy is a long haul so I’m doing what we all do and changing my mind 100 times before I commit. I almost called in (20% down to reserve), price I was quoted from EO is in the low $4K’s (MT turrets, need to ask about Pantone). Scopes are in production now with a completion date in late April, so I’d assume the general public would see them sometime in May/June? Any gun content YT channels/scope reviewers have one of these in hand yet?
Wow, that reticle actually looks really good. First one I have seen from S&B since the XR Gen 2 came out that I would run.
It does look a little thick. It would be nice if it was 20-25% thinner. Most shooting will be done on 20-30x and it would be nice to not cover as much target area up. Maybe a .03 or .04 thickness instead of .05.
The JTAC reticle thickness is almost perfect.
.425 Center dot with .25 line thickness.
It does look a little thick. It would be nice if it was 20-25% thinner. Most shooting will be done on 20-30x and it would be nice to not cover as much target area up. Maybe a .03 or .04 thickness instead of .05.
The JTAC reticle thickness is almost perfect.
.425 Center dot with .25 line thickness.
You bastards have ruined me on the turrets, especially @Glassaholic. I will only look at the DT II's. Carry on.
When you start spinning turrets for therapy throughout the day, you have arrived
I had it all figured out. Decided on the power, reticles, and I wasn't being too picky on the turrets or color. Made sure I had enough adjustment for the M82. 34mm tube- good. Scanned the dealers and PX. Yeah, let me read a little more on turrets just to be sure. Then;When you start spinning turrets for therapy throughout the day, you have arrived
*starts playing with different turrets in person*
*does it again*
*wonders if this is becoming an obsession*
*punches self in face*
That thing you saw streaking across the sky last night wasn't a comet, it was my computer that I launched out of the window after my eyes started bleeding.
/threadjack over.
Anyone else experienced significant parallax issues on their 6-36.
I got mine already sent to S&B once. But once back it was still terrible.
I can't get a clear picture - sharp picture past 600m. My reticule moves .2/.3 mil in all directions with small head movements.
Basically I can't shoot it.
Also the reticule seems to be in the forefront. When I adjust parallax looking through the gri2d to focus above it it is blurred . When I focus above it is blurred in through the gri2d.
Overall it is absolutely unusable.
So I've send it back.
Anyone experienced something similar?
I got mine already sent to S&B once. But once back it was still terrible.
I can't get a clear picture - sharp picture past 600m. My reticule moves .2/.3 mil in all directions with small head movements.
Basically I can't shoot it.
Also the reticule seems to be in the forefront. When I adjust parallax looking through the gri2d to focus above it it is blurred . When I focus above it is blurred in through the gri2d.
Overall it is absolutely unusable.
So I've send it back.
Anyone experienced something similar?
Have you set your diopter based on the instructions from the Hide
Most. Expensive. Fidget. Spinner. Ever.When you start spinning turrets for therapy throughout the day, you have arrived
-Stan
Have you had this issue with other scopes? And is there anything about your eyes that we should know about? Like cataracts or other eye diseases etc.
Here is one diopter adjustment version (attached).
And here is another:
www.snipershide.com
And here is another:
Tangent 5-25 or new Schmidt 6-36
Hope nobody is holding out for a tremor 3 in a 636 🤣🤣🤣 prolly be $9999.99 https://www.eurooptic.com/Schmidt-Bender-3-27x56-PM-II-High-Power-LP-TReMoR3-1-2cm-ccw-MT-II-MTC-Riflescop.aspx That Hitler meth must be hitting the perfect spot this time of year after you just finished huffing the last...
www.snipershide.com
They left the US market.
I got to play with the Hensoldt for a day a few years ago. It was light years ahead of anything available at the time and was built like a tank. It made my S&B 5-25 look like a toy. How they got that optical clarity in that short a package is beyond me. The turrets and the elevation range were in a class by themselves. If it were CCW and had a real reticle, I would have bought one
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Not sure if it’s an issue for me but my parallax from 100 to 500 is on but anything farther than that it has to be set to infinity to get a clear parallax free picture.
My diopter is set properly and this is my second S&B, first one had the same “issue”. I do wear corrective lenses when I shoot so that might be a problem not sure.
Even on infinity the picture is not sharp passed 600-700m. For sure not top tier scope sharp....
And when I move my head, the aim point move ( no rifle movement - Phoenix bipod and Lenzi rear bag).
Are you in the US? I am guessing not. If you were you could speak to S&B’s excellent Jerry who usually answers the phone (and does a bunch of the work).
Good guess. I'm in Europe ( France).
My scope went back to Germany today.
Will see if they can fix it this time....
Just for piece of mind ( maybe) .......... I now have 5 S&B 6-36,s here and all have superb focus at extended range.
We shooting at 2500mtrs the weekend gone by and were commenting on just how the S&B were giving the Swaro and Kowa spotters a run for their money!!
I must admit I doubted you when you first posted this. I talk with some fairly knowledgeable folks over at EO pretty frequently. I have been wanting this scope for quite a while, but just can't stomach the only two reticles available (GR2ID and P5FL). I have asked frequently about any news of new reticle options coming out, with the answer always being no. So after reading your post I asked them again, and they said they hadn't heard anything but I forwarded the data sheet posted here and asked them to check. A few days later (yesterday) they confirmed they can order it (4-5 months delivery) so I put in my TR2ID pre-order!
I don't know. There was a 2024 price increase, which applied to this one because it is new for '24, so it's hard to compare until the new prices for the older reticles are showing up in inventory. I don't think the price for this reticle is any different than the others, though.
Is the TR2iD an illuminated reticle? If so, what part and is it daylight visible?
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S&B usually has this info in the pdf. Sorry don't have the link but check their homepage.
The GR2ID is daytime bright in 6-36 so I’d imagine the TR2ID would be as well, these scopes usually share the same illumination modules.
Attachments
This new reticle looks great. For those that have done it, is it best to have a reticle swap done or sell one’s older optic and purchase a new one with the desired reticle. Purchased my 6–36 through EuroOptic with the P5FL reticle, but prefer the TR2ID layout.
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I have an 'old' S&B PM II 4-16 that I bought in '99 for my work rifle that was being built. It's now '24, I'm retired and working for an agency that bought 4 NF ACTAR's, a few years ago, for their SWAT rifles. I'm now working on those rifles (was at the range today with them, along with my 'old' sniper rig #1 w/the S&B and my newish #2 with a Razor HD III) and was shocked at the difference between the S&B and the NF. The S&B, for my eyes, has WAY better glass!!!
So basically the same dots and 2 mil tree lines, looks identical to GR2ID so I feel pretty confident brightness will be the same as well, which is to say it can be seen during daytime but dots are harder to see than illuminated lines.
6-36 has an internal elevation travel of 41 mils minimum according to the spec sheet, so you might even be able to get away with 70-74 MOA of cant in the mount and dial up to 39.5 mils of elevation depending on the turrets you choose.
That being said, keep in mind that how much you can actually dial up from zero is limited not only by the total erector travel of the scope but also by the turrets chosen, whichever limit is hit first.
The DT27 turrets limit you to 27 mils of dialing up from zero, the DT35 turrets limit you to 35 mils, the DTII+ turrets limit you to 30.5 mils, and the MT turrets limit you to 39.5 mils of dialing. If you're going to be dialing lots of elevation, the MT turrets are the best choice, followed by the DT35 turrets, although the hash marks on the DT35 are rather close together and hard to read for some people.
Just be aware that the image quality will generally suffer if you are too much out of centre for your 100 yards zero.
^well the 100 yard image quality will suffer but the 1200 yard image will be maximized
Yep, all depends on your intended usage, and if you have to dial near the upper or lower limits of the elevation you might have to deal with reduced optical clarity or other weird image artifacts like vignetting when near the upper or lower travel limits.
For example, on my S&B 5-25s that vignette starting within about 6.5 mils of the elevation travel limits, for rifles that are typically used for closer ranges I pick a mount combo that keeps them at least 7 mils above the lower elevation travel limit at the 100y zero so I never have to see the vignetting at the normal ranges/uses when I'm looking through the scope.
For rifles that get used for longer ranges and the scopes get dialed up a lot and are set up with a lot of cant in the mounts, that often means you have to live with some image clarity issues at closer ranges when you aren't dialed up and the elevation travel is at the lower limit, then have a clarity "sweet spot" close to the optical center of the scope when you're dialed for say 800-1500y, and then maybe have to deal with some clarity issues creeping back in when you're shooting way out there and have the elevation travel maxed out.
Some scopes handle image quality better that others when dialed near the elevation travel limits; not sure how the S&B 6-36 handles that situation as I still haven't looked through one.
Totally agree, though I'd say the 6-36x feels like a real generational improvement in a number of areas. The image clarity through the full magnification and erector cell movement is really impressive. Still, I'm patiently waiting for the results of @Glassaholic's testing and metrics.
I mean…..only if you’re….Compromising
Kidding. Kind of.
My Tangent/ZCOs are still good optically at the far extents, and based on comments in this thread, I’d expect this S&B to perform just as well.
Yes, the Schmidt 6-36x56 did really well even to max elevation with only slight degradation of IQ from optical center, not something most would notice unless you are really looking for it.
Looks like EuroOptic has posted the new 6-36 options with the TR2ID reticle. Unfortunately at this time it does not look like the DT II+ is available.
Edit…It does appear they do have the DT II+. Price is 4820.
Edit…It does appear they do have the DT II+. Price is 4820.
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I have been waiting for this option.
I'm not overly fond of the DT35 turret. I do admit that I have never tried it but the low-profile design seems to be less ergonomic than the DT II+
I have both. you want the DTii+ unless you need the extra 5 MRAD of elevation which is why I have it on my 375CT/50BMG
I think the DT27 and DT35 were designed for semi-autos with scope mounted devices in mind. The original Bundeswehr G28 contract required a low-profile elevation turret and capped windage, which explains the custom S&B 3-20x designed for the rifle. S&B carried that idea forward with the DT27 turret made initially for the Ultra Short line. The DT35 came a little while later annd adds more elevation while retaining the double turn format, but my god those clicks are really close together for my old eyes.
DT27 and DT35 are totally useable on a precision bolt gun, but not as handy as DT II+ and vice versa on semi-auto. The MT II turrets will always give you the most elevation because they’re multi turn, but they’re also 0.5cm adjustments and some people get lost too easily on them compared to DT turrets.
Side note: with one of my Steiners I learned one of the advantages of capped windage - hanging too close over the ejection port can erode the windage marks.
DT27 and DT35 are totally useable on a precision bolt gun, but not as handy as DT II+ and vice versa on semi-auto. The MT II turrets will always give you the most elevation because they’re multi turn, but they’re also 0.5cm adjustments and some people get lost too easily on them compared to DT turrets.
Side note: with one of my Steiners I learned one of the advantages of capped windage - hanging too close over the ejection port can erode the windage marks.
So July...that may work out as that is when I think I will be buying my AXSR
