Rifle Scopes New Schmidt & Bender PM2 6-36x56
- Thread starter Just Macca
- Start date
Money is an end to a means not a means unto itself
I am not Glassaholic, but I'll be doing a livestream tonight to go over my impressions.
ILya
ILya
Tangent 7-35x56
S&B 6-36x56
March 5-42x56
Razor Gen3 6-36x56
Tangent 5-25x56
I also have some top level impressions of 8-40x56, but I have not spent as much time with that one.
It will go to Youtube, Rumble, X and my website: www.darklordofoptics.com
I will probably kick it off between 7:30 and 8 Mountain Time tonight, once I get the kids situated for the evening.
ILya
Theta still king.
It better be, being it costs the equivalent of a kings ransom...
it’s got the worst spec sheet, I won’t lie: Almost as heavy as the Razor, smallest FOV, highest cost. If you have the money and IQ is what you’re after..
Reticles blow....
Only some men can be so refined as to enjoy the Gen 3XR-Fine.
Reticle is seriously the only thing holding me back from purchasing TT. Ugh
In your review you mentioned the FOV limiter in the S&B 6-36 helps with eyebox forgiveness. Is there a simple explanation on how that works?
On a more serious note, the simplest explanation comes out of simple geometry and it is a 10 second explanation if I simply sketch it out.
I'll make a note of it. I'll put together a sketch and post it.
ILya
I have briefly looked at March Majesta, but that is a very different design, it being SFP. If there is enough interest, I'll do a review of it eventually.
ILya
That's what my evaluation turned up as well, I even think the TT 7-35 is "better" than the TT 5-25 from a purely optical standpoint, but with the TT 5-25 and most of us (ELR shooters included) not needing above 25x I still think the TT 5-25 represents the better value and offers slightly wider FOV.Theta still king.
You know me and you know I love wider FOV, that said, I never felt with the TT 7-35 or the Schmidt 6-36 (USA) that these scopes were really lagging behind the likes of the wider FOV scopes I was comparing with. The TT 7-35 reminded me of my initial response when I first looked through the ZCO scopes and thought, "OMG, that is a huge sight picture!" Yes, when possible I will almost always prefer a "like for like" scope that has a wider FOV (part of why I love the March 4.5-28x52 and Vortex RG3 6-36 so much) but there was something special about the image at every magnification when looking through the TT 7-35, it is a very special scope with the best glass experience of any optic I've ever looked through, granted that comes at a cost, and a very hefty cost at that but for some having the absolute best is of utmost concern.
I will be curious to hear what ILya has to say regarding the Schmidt 6-36, it was a really good performer in my testing but I think I set my expectations a bit high for this scope as it didn't perform quite as well as I was hoping, and in some ways I thought the Vortex RG3 6-36 was even better
. I know for some those words are justification to tar and feather me but this was my experience. I am working on the potential to get a non-USA version but that's going to take a few months and I will be curious if there are differences above and beyond the field stop as sometimes just having the wider FOV gives the brain a very different impression of the IQ.
That is the new king of scopes. At least for the old farts in F-class flopped on their belly using a Ransom rest. . .
Regarding the TT 7-35 vs the S&B 6-36..
Recently i got to see the TT 7-35 ( I own 4 S&B 6-36,s and a TT 5-25 ) The TT 7-35 to be truthful....... is optically ahead of the S&B 6-36..BUT!! from my observations the S&B 6-36 is right up there , the TT 7-35 certainly not vastly superior to the S&B..
Here in Aus the pricing factor is huge between the 2. The S&B 6-36 can be had for circa AUD $6K...the TT 7-35 is circa AUD $11K !!
BUT !! if costing is of no consequence, then yep the TT 7-35 is the top performer..
Recently i got to see the TT 7-35 ( I own 4 S&B 6-36,s and a TT 5-25 ) The TT 7-35 to be truthful....... is optically ahead of the S&B 6-36..BUT!! from my observations the S&B 6-36 is right up there , the TT 7-35 certainly not vastly superior to the S&B..
Here in Aus the pricing factor is huge between the 2. The S&B 6-36 can be had for circa AUD $6K...the TT 7-35 is circa AUD $11K !!
BUT !! if costing is of no consequence, then yep the TT 7-35 is the top performer..
As Bill has suggested , i do wonder myself just how much the wider FOV of our version of the S&B 6-36 has on influencing the perceived image vs the US restricted FOV.
When looking through the TT and the S&B ..The differences in FOV is VERY apparent ... This may contribute to making the two scopes look optically closer ?
I do know from experience that a wider FOV is in general far more pleasing to the eye vs a narrower FOV.
When looking through the TT and the S&B ..The differences in FOV is VERY apparent ... This may contribute to making the two scopes look optically closer ?
I do know from experience that a wider FOV is in general far more pleasing to the eye vs a narrower FOV.
IMO the wider FOV of the non-USA Schmidt 6-36 gives it a significant advantage over most other scopes out there (even the TT 7-35), I think that has to be taken into consideration and is likely why I felt in some areas the Vortex RG3 did better than the Schmidt. Regardless, all these alpha scopes are so good I don't think there is much to argue about, at the end of the day they all offer exemplary viewing experience that will get the job done.
The Razor is nice but the glass turns into a PST once you go past 25x whereas the Schmidt is good all the way to 36x.
You have a terrible Razor or I have an amazing one, yes, the IQ does fall off some after 25x but "turns into PST" is definitely not the experience with mine. At 30x my RG3 was neck and neck with Schmidt, at 35x/36x it actually bested the Schmidt slightly on my resolution charts.
With mine it’s not even close past 25x. It won’t resolve a 1mm thick line past 30x at 100 yards. The Schmidt resolves it like it’s right there in front of your face.
Interesting...... as that was one of the major positive aspects of the S&B 6-36 that stood out when I viewed the first one.
Right up to 36x is usable and very well defined.
Most other optics I have and or viewed have fallen off as you approach max mag.....the worst being the ZCO 8-40.
Right up to 36x is usable and very well defined.
Most other optics I have and or viewed have fallen off as you approach max mag.....the worst being the ZCO 8-40.
Now you have me curious, might try to grab another RG3 and another Schmidt at some point. Not saying the Schmidt was bad by any means but the RG3 was slightly better at top mag. The Tangent absolutely crushed them all at 35x, I was expecting to see falloff but it was like it kept getting better the more I increased the magnification, that was very surprising to say the least.
Maybe like you said you have an exceptional Razor and I have an exceptional Schmidt.
I already apologized. Sorry lads, we can both just delete our posts and get this back on track.
This arrived yesterday, the color is RAL7005, which is quite interesting. The scope also has the TR2ID reticle. According to EuroOptic, @Euro.Connor, this is currently the only S&B RAL7005 scope in the country and it's currently the only S&B TR2ID reticle in the country (in a private collection, S&B USA probably has all sorts of cool stuff on hand). Apparently this scope is 1 of 10 that was made for a military contract, and out of those 10 scope, this is the only 1 in private hands. Apparently the other 9 scopes are still with some military somewhere being tested. @Euro.Connor can add what information he knows about these unique scopes and other S&B scopes that might be produced in the RAL7005 color.
Here's the scope and reticle, apparently it's the only S&B RAL7005 and only TR2ID reticle in the country:
I have an extremely rare set of prototype OPS AWP gray titanium scope rings that are a little bit darker than the RAL7005 color, but they look great with the scope!
I've owned a few dozen S&B scopes, and I still have most of them on various clone builds. Every single one of my S&B scopes is black, except for a handful of scopes in RAL8000. The RAL7005 makes things interesting, and less monotonous. After seeing this scope, I'd really like to see S&B release some other colors. I'd really like to have a S&B Short Dot in RAL6003 green for my Tac Ops Green Hornet!
Here's the RAL7005 next to RAL8000 and regular old black:
I purchased this scope earlier this week when @Euro.Connor called and said that he had an extremely unique scope available. I had absolutely no use for a gray scope, but I figured that I probably had some rifle that I could use it on. I bumped a military surplus S&B 4-16x42 off of my B&T APR308S, and I really like the new scope on this rifle! Hopefully I can take it to the range sometime soon:
Below is a link to some history on the military S&B 4-16x42 scopes. I've owned a few of these scopes and a short turret version is currently on a MARSOC M40A3 clone. Now that I've replaced the tall turret 4-16x42 scope that was on the B&T rifle, I have no idea what to do with that surplus S&B scope. Put it on a Mk11? Sell it?
https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...e-of-schmidt-and-bender-4-16x42-pmii.6708142/
Here's the scope and reticle, apparently it's the only S&B RAL7005 and only TR2ID reticle in the country:
I have an extremely rare set of prototype OPS AWP gray titanium scope rings that are a little bit darker than the RAL7005 color, but they look great with the scope!
I've owned a few dozen S&B scopes, and I still have most of them on various clone builds. Every single one of my S&B scopes is black, except for a handful of scopes in RAL8000. The RAL7005 makes things interesting, and less monotonous. After seeing this scope, I'd really like to see S&B release some other colors. I'd really like to have a S&B Short Dot in RAL6003 green for my Tac Ops Green Hornet!
Here's the RAL7005 next to RAL8000 and regular old black:
I purchased this scope earlier this week when @Euro.Connor called and said that he had an extremely unique scope available. I had absolutely no use for a gray scope, but I figured that I probably had some rifle that I could use it on. I bumped a military surplus S&B 4-16x42 off of my B&T APR308S, and I really like the new scope on this rifle! Hopefully I can take it to the range sometime soon:
Below is a link to some history on the military S&B 4-16x42 scopes. I've owned a few of these scopes and a short turret version is currently on a MARSOC M40A3 clone. Now that I've replaced the tall turret 4-16x42 scope that was on the B&T rifle, I have no idea what to do with that surplus S&B scope. Put it on a Mk11? Sell it?
https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...e-of-schmidt-and-bender-4-16x42-pmii.6708142/
Absolute beauty! Definitely a one of a kind optic! As always, its a pleasure to work with you!
Thats looks really good!
I have one coming in same configuration but with the P5FL reticle, supposedly also overrun from a military contract.
Damn, I really like that new reticle. Kind of back to basics.
Possibly 15 or 16 scopes? But @Euro.Connor is the person to ask about that one, hopefully he'll have an answer for us. The RAL7005 is very unique, and I like the scope color more and more. If there's going to be a limited edition batch available in the future, I highly recommend picking one up if you like the color. It really starts to grow on you, even if the RAL7005 scope is mounted to a black rifle. If someone had a gray rifle, maybe something like a pre-Mk13 with a gray stock, the RAL7005 scope will look even better!
