Opinions on a 223 boltgun build for my two boys

[Boltgun7443]

I would like to locate a Remington 5r or Police with a 20 inch barrel in .223 for my two young boys to shoot along with their .22s.

I say either the 5r or Police, because I feel like when they built these / or you could find them years back, they had decent barrels and you didn't have to immediately throw on an aftermarket barrel and blueprint the action to have a decent rifle. Is my theory correct? Any other ideas that could get my purchase/build/project off the ground?

I do want to stick with a 700 platform but cant find any with 20 inches.

Any leads on where I could locate at least a base rifle or ideas on a accurate .223?

Thank you...

 

[b6graham]

i'd do an origin with proof prefit and krg bravo. give them something to grow into. but that's just me

i'd also do a tikka over a r700. maybe even a bergera or howa honestly

 

[The D]

There’s going to be a smokin-ass deal on a new action from ARC in about 6 weeks.

 

[z7.jled]

my sales pitch is below: I recommend you figure out a budget and start piecing together, the new ARC action would make a badass gun and the sky is the limit for barrels nowadays and make the gun what YOU want.

i wanted a long barrel for max mv so if my kids decided to try a PRS type match, they could reasonably hit the target out to 700 without being seriously disadvantaged, but the gun needed to be light enough for a 9 year old to move it around safely



i don't have access to pictures right now but my 8 year old built (assembled) my kids 223 in the garage about a year ago - it is super fun.
ARC Archimedes (last year's Black friday sale)
PVA prefit 26" light palma (black friday)
KRG Xray (my chassis after i upgraded)
burris XTRIII 3-18 (local shop BF deal for a really good price)
TBAC DOMINUS 30 cal

my 8 year old can hit clay pigeons off a tripod and bag at 200yds, my 11 year old daughter will shoot pieces of clay pigeons at 200 using RMR 69grn bullets, once fired LC brass and RAMSHOT TAC cheap ass reload, no recoil, just about 1moa without trying

it slings 75ELDM with RAMSHOT Tac at 2850 if I remember correctly

 

[pineoak]

i'd do an origin with proof prefit and krg bravo. give them something to grow into. but that's just me

i'd also do a tikka over a r700. maybe even a bergera or howa honestly

This is an awesome path as when you want, you swap out the barrel, bolt head, and magazine for .308/6.5 using the same action.

IF you can find Tikka CTR in 24" 1:8 .223 that is the way I'd go first.

 

[yosemite_sam]

I would like to locate a Remington 5r or Police with a 20 inch barrel in .223 for my two young boys to shoot along with their .22s.

I say either the 5r or Police, because I feel like when they built these / or you could find them years back, they had decent barrels and you didn't have to immediately throw on an aftermarket barrel and blueprint the action to have a decent rifle. Is my theory correct? Any other ideas that could get my purchase/build/project off the ground?

I do want to stick with a 700 platform but cant find any with 20 inches.

Any leads on where I could locate at least a base rifle or ideas on a accurate .223?

Thank you...

Granted it was an R700 sps tactical...not a 5R or Police...but I recently bought a 16.5 inch SPS in .308 and it was hands down the worst firearm I've ever handled. Extremely disappointed. The scope holes were VERY poorly tapped. The action was rough as heck, and it squeaked when going in to battery. So gross. Remington QC is really really rough these days according to myself and many users on here.

I just bought a Howa 1500 barreled action today after extensive research and after reading the thread on here..."Tikka T3 vs Howa 1500(reliability)"

These are out of stock but maybe call up Brownells and see if they may get some in, in the near future.

HOWA 1500 BARRELED MINI ACTION 223 REM 20" THREADED HEAVY BLUE | Brownells

Howa 1500 Barreled Actions are the perfect platform for a quality precision rifle build, at an affordable cost. Every Howa Barreled ...

www.brownells.com

This action and a bell and carson stock give you an accurate, 20 inch, heavy barreled rifle, in a very nice stock... for around $800.

 

[Rob01]

i'd do an origin with proof prefit and krg bravo. give them something to grow into. but that's just me

i'd also do a tikka over a r700. maybe even a bergera or howa honestly

That's the answer. As mentioned it will grow with them when they want to go to something larger it's as easy as a bolt face and barrel change. I wouldn't buy a 700 anything now.

 

[yosemite_sam]

A couple guys have suggested builds with long barrels that look to be over $2k....before optics.

The tone I'm getting from the OP is affordable family fun, and something that is still handy/tactical(he mentioned looking for a factory rifle with a 20 inch barrel)...not exactly an expensive PRS rifle.

But lets hear from him what his budget and use looks like beyond shooting a 20 inch .223 with his boys.

 

[pineoak]

I get that, but personally I've learned that 223 doesn't do as well with shorter barrels and needs all the help it can for longer ranges/wind

As the boys improve, performance will matter to them evn if not competing

even if his boys are seven, they will grow overtime and will be able to make use of equipment that is not just bottom end basic

Might pay more upfront but they're starting with quality equipment that is easy to adapt and grow into, and there's no re-buying a new one when they move to 308 or 6.5

But people have different budgets and different priorities

 

[yosemite_sam]

We're not sure what the OP's shooting distance is, aside from the fact that he asked help finding a 20 inch barreled .223...which is the barrel length for the M16...so if he wants to shoot past 300 yards then, yes he should probably run something longer.

 

[Rob01]

We're not sure what the OP's shooting distance is, aside from the fact that he asked help finding a 20 inch barreled .223...which is the barrel length for the M16...so if he wants to shoot past 300 yards then, yes he should probably run something longer.

A lot of people ask for things they think they want and will work until it's discussed here and they see that money is better spent for the long term elsewhere or the specs they wanted weren't the best either. That is why people who have done this a long time are trying to help and not just put up a link or throw iout a rifle name.

 

[yosemite_sam]

A lot of people ask for things they think they want and will work until it's discussed here and they see that money is better spent for the long term elsewhere or the specs they wanted weren't the best either. That is why people who have done this a long time are trying to help and not just put up a link or throw iout a rifle name.

I am trying to help the OP fulfill his specs...others are trying to present other options. I am very sorry if it came off that I am not trying to help, or that others interpretations of what the OP could do aren't valid.

I have learned some things in this thread and I appreciate other people's viewpoints. I can see from your viewpoint that a person asking about a R700 factory action(not being up on QC issues) might have some things to learn. I was one of those people not long ago at all. I have not been on this forum since 2001, and I am sorry if I came off as confrontational.

I appreciate the wisdom and perspective.

 

[pineoak]

Everyone in this thread has been polite and clearly has the OP's best interest at heart

We all have different experiences and it's wonderful that we can share them with the OP and each other

Ultimately, it's his money and he'll do what he wants with it

We're just chipping in ideas. Clearly everyone is just trying to help

Y'all know he's going to buy a Cabela's special Savage for $400 right? .223 on the cheap

I had one and the bore was not concentric with the barrel. But if it's just for fun, it's the cheapest way in.

For $1000, a Tikka or Bergara would probably be better value

 

[redneckbmxer24]

i'd do an origin with proof prefit and krg bravo. give them something to grow into. but that's just me

i'd also do a tikka over a r700. maybe even a bergera or howa honestly

This, or the new ARC action.

For what Remington 700's have been selling for you wouldn't be much more out of pocket to go this route. When the barrel is torched you order another prefit instead of sending the action out and spending $1000 in machine work plus the cost of a barrel blank to have it trued, installed, threaded, etc.

 

[jbuck88]

I wouldn't hesitate to get a 5r in 223. If I seen one tomorrow in a gunshop for a decent price I'd probably walk out with it. The 5r's had a reputation for shooting very well and shouldn't be confused with the bottom of the line SPS.

Realistically it would be a chore to burn the barrel out of a 223 bolt gun, so I wouldn't worry too much about that part of the equation.

 

[Codiekfx400]

How old are the boys? What is the desired length of pull?

 

[michealj88]

Used, from the local pawn shops, Cabelas, Bass Pro, Sheels and Gun Broker if you’re willing to pay new prices for used. In the last month I’ve seen 3 Remington 700’s in 223 locally, one was an older PSS that was in rough shape, but listed for a great price. I agree, a custom actioned rifle is definitely the way to go if you want to spend the money, but I wouldn’t hesitate to pick up another 700 with the intentions to shoot it until it’s time to have it built. I’ve had good luck with mine and I know there are plenty of happy Remington 700 owners out there, just like there are happy Tikka owners, CZ owners and custom built rifle owners.

My 12yo daughter absolutely loves shooting mine and has no problem ringing steel at 600 yards with it.

 

[diggler1833]

I have a 20" factory 700 SPS Tactical in .223. It is/was one of the most surprising purchases I've ever made (and I realize that I got lucky for once).

It averaged .502 MOA for a 5x5 aggregate on the old Sniper's Hide targets with the 69gr SMK over Re-15, and threw a ton of .4s with the 68gr Hornady over Varget. I originally had it in a McM A5, which got sold due to a divorce. It sits in a H-S Precision that's fully adjustable now because I used it as a trainer for my wife and M-I-L.

Unfortunately, the accuracy started falling off with the occasional flier. I thought maybe I had developed a flaw in my reloading process, but a check with a borescope showed heavy pitting in the last 14" of that barrel. Somehow something must have got in there, yet none of my other rifles had any corrosion issues. Maybe my in laws did something wierd with it when they had the rifle in their possession from 2014 to 2018.

Either way, I'm going to sink the money to get it trued up and rebarreled. While I'm at it, I'm going to ditch the H-S stock for a KRG Bravo (didn't exist back then). If I didn't already have the action, I'd definitely start with an Origin though.

My 7 year old daughter shot it last summer when she was 6 (it'll still put 4 of 5 into 3/4 minute...then the flier). Watching her smile after she smacked my aiming dot on steel at 160 yards was awesome.

I will always have a .223 trainer in the safe.

 

[stevieb92]

I have a 20" factory 700 SPS Tactical in .223. It is/was one of the most surprising purchases I've ever made (and I realize that I got lucky for once).

It averaged .502 MOA for a 5x5 aggregate on the old Sniper's Hide targets with the 69gr SMK over Re-15, and threw a ton of .4s with the 68gr Hornady over Varget. I originally had it in a McM A5, which got sold due to a divorce. It sits in a H-S Precision that's fully adjustable now because I used it as a trainer for my wife and M-I-L.

Unfortunately, the accuracy started falling off with the occasional flier. I thought maybe I had developed a flaw in my reloading process, but a check with a borescope showed heavy pitting in the last 14" of that barrel. Somehow something must have got in there, yet none of my other rifles had any corrosion issues. Maybe my in laws did something wierd with it when they had the rifle in their possession from 2014 to 2018.

Either way, I'm going to sink the money to get it trued up and rebarreled. While I'm at it, I'm going to ditch the H-S stock for a KRG Bravo (didn't exist back then). If I didn't already have the action, I'd definitely start with an Origin though.

My 7 year old daughter shot it last summer when she was 6 (it'll still put 4 of 5 into 3/4 minute...then the flier). Watching her smile after she smacked my aiming dot on steel at 160 yards was awesome.

I will always have a .223 trainer in the safe.

I agree with finding a 20 inch 700 SPS Tactical in .223. I also have an Origin that is my PRS comp rifle. If you've got the cash, go for the Origin route, but don't discount one of these. My SPS Tactical in .223 has been a fantastic shooter. I mounted it in a Stocky's laminate aluminum chassis stock with a Triggertech Special trigger and I couldn't be happier with it. Mine is still shooting great.

 

[Haney]

Another vote for the .223 Tactical with 20" barrel . I have one that came with a great bore and is a fine shooter . Through the years I have put a better trigger and stock on it . This was my Son's first centerfire bolt gun , watching him progress with a nice shooting R 700 brought me joy . I have it back now , and just recently put a new mag/BM kit in it just for something different . Makes it nice when my fingers are froze .

 

[yosemite_sam]

Take a gooood look at the SPS if you find one. Like I said, the one I got was the most poorly made/ finished firearm I’ve ever handled. Yeah sure it shot but dang it was ROUGH to cycle, and any ejected brass was very rough looking as well. I couldn’t tolerate that in a brand new firearm I paid $730 for.

I know older SPS may be ok but going bankrupt doesn’t seem to help the fit and finish of your firearms.

 

[mi650]

I had an SPS 4 or 5 years ago. I did manage to get an MOA group out of it, once.

 

[supercorndogs]

Used, from the local pawn shops, Cabelas, Bass Pro, Sheels and Gun Broker if you’re willing to pay new prices for used. In the last month I’ve seen 3 Remington 700’s in 223 locally, one was an older PSS that was in rough shape, but listed for a great price. I agree, a custom actioned rifle is definitely the way to go if you want to spend the money, but I wouldn’t hesitate to pick up another 700 with the intentions to shoot it until it’s time to have it built. I’ve had good luck with mine and I know there are plenty of happy Remington 700 owners out there, just like there are happy Tikka owners, CZ owners and custom built rifle owners.

My 12yo daughter absolutely loves shooting mine and has no problem ringing steel at 600 yards with it.

View attachment 8057048

My XCR long range has been a hammer for over 5k rounds. I finally gave up on shooting it out, and pulled the barrel for a 28" 1 in 7 twist I had in the safe. I got tired of being stuck with a 1 in 9, although I mostly shot 53 and 55 v-max out of it. I shot the 77 SMK well also.

The pictured target was 420y off the shooting sticks from a high kneel.

Its crazy to look back at pictures and think how many different scopes that rifle has had on it. I think the first scope i had on it was a burris XTR 3-12, or an SWFA 10x.

I have seen some really good prices on custom actions and really inflated price for Remington 700s. Don't over pay.

 

[briang7511]

Went down this road with my daughter. Started out with a .22lr, after a few trips i got her a .223. After an hour of shooting her .223 she says DAD i want to shoot your guns. Truth is she just wanted to do whatever i did. She mostly shot my stuff after that. She is 18 now and and no interest in shooting. Just my experience.

 

[Longshot231]

I did a .223/5.56 bolt action rifle build for my kid. Had I to do it over again, I think a nice flat-top AR-15 with a good scope and bipod would have been the better and cheaper option.

To prevent wasteful mag-dumps, make them pay for the ammunition with their allowance money. The importance of making every shot count will be foremost in their minds.

 

[jlorensen]

I went a less expensive route for my kids. When my daughter was 10, we assembled a How's 1500 .223 with a 20" barrel. Bought a Boyd's At-One so we could adjust the fit as she grew, and had a local smith bed it. It shoots great with 69gr SMKs and she's been on steel out to 400yds. So far, it's been a nice rifle.

For my son, we went the AR route.....I had an old DPMS, from which we robbed the lower, and we threw a 20" upper on top. We run Hornady Black 62gr ammo through it, and it shoots just under a minute.....my son spends most of his time shooting clay targets off the 100yd berm though. We did upgrade the trigger, the OEM unit was pretty bad.

If I had to give advice, I'd say think about this 2 ways.......go the route of buying 2 rifles (if they stay interested, they will each want their own, probably), or, grab something you will enjoy in case they loose interest (I learned this lesson after chopping down and fitting a very nice Browning over/under for my daughter that now sits in my safe collecting dust).

Good Luck.....and by the way, nice work getting your kids into shooting!

 

[MakeSawdust]

If you can afford it, build a custom with an action that has swappable bolt heads and prefit barrels. Put a TT Diamond in it and drop it in a bravo. That gun can grow with them intovwhatever they need it to be. If they stop shooting, you have a pretty nice gun to use as a hunting or training rifle. If you don't have a reason to keep it, the resale value is there.

 

[The D]

If you can afford it, build a custom with an action that has swappable bolt heads and prefit barrels. Put a TT Diamond in it and drop it in a bravo. That gun can grow with them intovwhatever they need it to be. If they stop shooting, you have a pretty nice gun to use as a hunting or training rifle. If you don't have a reason to keep it, the resale value is there.

 

[whak_a_woodchuck]

I've owned both 5R and T3 Tactical (8 twist 20"). Tikka was more aaccurate with 40-69gr bullets, shot cheap 55gr bulklreloads better and is lighter. So, down the road the Remmy went. Don't get me wrong, it was still a great gun, but the Teeker did what I wanted in a smaller package.

 

[swampbuck]

Thread 'REDUCED - NIB Remington 700 223 1-8' https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/reduced-nib-remington-700-223-1-8.7157984/

 

[swampbuck]

I don't know gasrat but just thought you might want to see this.

 

[Aimsmall55]

i'd do an origin with proof prefit and krg bravo. give them something to grow into. but that's just me

i'd also do a tikka over a r700. maybe even a bergera or howa honestly

BONE STOCK HOWA MINI 1500 action with a dose of N540 and a 77 grain matching. I only bought this one because I couldn’t find the LTR version in Remington 700 but man am I happy with this. Put a NX8 and a SAS arbiter on it and my 10 year old loves it. So does the old man. Lol.

 

[bpair]

My small framed 9 year old shoots a 21” 223 Ackley rem varmint contour. XLR chassis completely collapsed fits him well. It’s on an older nice remington action that I already had. If I were to start over and build one from scratch, I would do the Bighorn or Nucleus route for the prefit barrels and have multiple calibers.