Range Report Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

[MDM]

I was able to shoot the first rounds through my new build today and it looks promising. It's deer season here, so this was just a quick test with 3 shot groups, so don't ream me.

Specs
Savage 110 action
27" McGowen bull contour 8 twist
Choate Tactical
Vortex Viper 6.5x20x44

All loads are Varget with 123 Scenars .005 off the lands. Temp 30.deg 2-3 mph light breeze.

37.0g Vel. 2879, 2886, 2861 ES - 18
37.2g Vel. 2886, 2904, 2892 ES - 18
37.5g Vel. 2917, 2911, 2917 ES - 5
37.8g Vel. 2930, 2923, 2930 ES - 7
38.1g Vel. 2969, 2936, 2943 ES - 33
38.4g Vel. 2976, 2976, 2976 ES - 0 WOW!

It was a short little test, but I got some good info. Think I will pick the 3 best for ES and move out to 300yds.

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Here's a question: I didn't have any pressure issues as far as ejector marks or primer flattening. However, I did have stiff bolt lift a few times. One round at 37.5g, one round at 37.8, and one round in the 38.4 group. It wasn't consistent because there was no sticky bolt lift in the 38.1 charge. It left me scratching my head, but the brass looked good on everything. This was twice fired brass too. I didn't know what to make of it.

 

[shadow4]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

The sticky bolt may have more to do with the brass being fired in another chamber, then chambered in your rifle (not all chambers are the same dimensions). I have gotten brass stuck in chambers before from using somebody elses once fired brass (even after I FL sized it).

Your 37.8gr load is at the same velocity that I found my "pet load" for my 6.5x47 (same bullet), except it required 38gr for me using a 25" barrel. Looks like your 6.5L is as easy to load for as mine was

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shadow4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The sticky bolt may have more to do with the brass being fired in another chamber, then chambered in your rifle (not all chambers are the same dimensions). I have gotten brass stuck in chambers before from using somebody elses once fired brass (even after I FL sized it).

Your 37.8gr load is at the same velocity that I found my "pet load" for my 6.5x47 (same bullet), except it required 38gr for me using a 25" barrel. Looks like your 6.5L is as easy to load for as mine was

</div></div>
That's interesting. My brass was second hand twice fired brass that I FL sized.

 

[264Charlie]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Really the sticky bolt might just be the Savage weak extraction. I watch guys shoot them in comps and the all look like they are uppercutting the bolt.

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

5 shots at 265yds...just a fuzz over .5" I think it likes 37.8g of Varget. I need some better weather for some more extensive testing. It was 20 degrees and cold.

 

[steve123]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Nice group!

 

[JL]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Not too bad!

 

[cmh2007]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

ok, im seriously thinking about going to academy, and buying a 350 dollar model 700 short action adl. but the thing is i am wanting to chamber it in something low recoil that my wife can shoot long distance with me. she is a little sensitive to recoil. from everything i have read, this is the cartridge to have to cover those bases.

now the questions begin,
first, how much does it cost to feed this thing (i hand load)
second, how bad is the recoil compared to a .308 and a 6mm remington
would it be worth it to go shorter barrel length? say 22-24 inch?

 

[Jedi]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Short barrels are just more practical
i shoot a 20" 6.5x47 n 123gr bullets, thou i mostly run a can on it....1k no probs
recoil is BB gun like with can on, without about same as my AR

 

[Trevor300wsm]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: seaaggie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">ok, im seriously thinking about going to academy, and buying a 350 dollar model 700 short action adl. but the thing is i am wanting to chamber it in something low recoil that my wife can shoot long distance with me. she is a little sensitive to recoil. from everything i have read, this is the cartridge to have to cover those bases.

now the questions begin,
first, how much does it cost to feed this thing (i hand load)
second, how bad is the recoil compared to a .308 and a 6mm remington
would it be worth it to go shorter barrel length? say 22-24 inch? </div></div>

First off, you may want to start your own thread instead of camping out on this guy's.
As for your post, the $349 ADL is a great buy to build off of. The 6x47 or the 6.5x47 would be a nice round for your wife to shoot, or you could just get her a .223. Lots of people shoot the .223 to 1000yds. The recoil of a 6.5x47 is very light, stick a break on it and it's all but unnoticed. I compare mine to shooting a .223, or less. If your wife can't handle that she may need to start off with a .22lr and work up. "Feeding" the 6.5 is not too bad after the initial investment on the Lapua brass, it's about $95-$110 per 100 depending on where you buy. 37-39 gr of Varget is cheap and so are CCI450's. Bullets are your own choice obviously.

 

[cmh2007]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

i was just asking about his and other's experiences with this cartridge.

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

My rifle is heavy at about 15 lbs. Recoil is 22-250 like. I was actually thinking about putting a break on it just so I could see hits at close range, but it is shooting so good, I don't want to tear it apart. I should be able to see hits at 500 and on with no problem. I can see hits at 300 sometimes. Lapua brass and bullets are expensive initially. I'm going to try some 123 amax's as an alternative to the 123 lapua's. So far, this has been the easiest rifle I've ever loaded for, everything has been .5 moa or better with several under .25 moa.

 

[jbailey]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

MDM-

That is obliviously a very nice shooting rifle, congrats.

Question:
Have you tried any of the heavier 6.5's, e.g. 142 SMK, 130 & 140 VLD, 140 Amax?

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Haven't tried any of the 140 grain bullets and I probably won't. With this build, my intention was to shoot the 120's all along. I would like to try the 130 Bergers maybe, but haven't been able to find them anywhere. I'm going to try the 123 Amax and if I can get that to perform similarly to the Scenar's I will go with them simply because they are so cheap and I've heard they do pretty well on game should I happen to get a chance to pop a yote.

 

[mavrick10_2000]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

With the speed you can get out of the 123 scenars and the BC I don't blame you for not wanting to go heavier, there's not much benefit IMO.

That load even at 38 ish should be safe in 103* temps, I've tested them. When the Berger's start shipping again somewhere between 37-37.5gr is usually a sweet spot. Sounds like you have a good balance of freebore and the 27" barrel reduces pressures as well, you might be able to get a little bit more powder and velocity than with my 25" barrel. Just remember those VLD's are really long. The 6.5 VLD's are supposed to be at dealers by the end of the month ish.

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Decided to tested the 140 amax with Reloader 17 yesterday and ran into a problem, but a good problem - all of the 3 shot groups could be covered with a dime with anything from 40-41g.

40g avg 2807
40.3 avg 2830
40.6 avg 2879
40.9 avg 2902
41.5 - one shot was 2949 and a slight ejector smudge but primers were still good and bolt was not sticky, probably nothing since all was virgin brass but I decided to test from 40-41g because I would like to save a little barrel life and I have no need to run that fast.

I loaded about 10 rounds at 40.9g to shoot at an 8" steel plate I had at 560yds. Once I rung that a few times, I shot a 3 shot group on paper at 560yds that measured 1.9" not sure but I think that is about .34 MOA. I will move on to five shot groups next time and just go with the load that gives me the best ES and SD since they all shot very well at 100yds.
I'm just wondering if my loads will change in the summer heat since its only about mid 50s now.

Since my original posting, I had a Badger Thruster brake installed and what a difference.

 

[yourotherleft]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Great report!

 

[aggiesig]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

I hope my .260 shoots that well when complete here in the next month or so!

 

[jbailey]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

RL17 is temp sensitive, so yes, you will probably see more MV as it warms up.

H4350 is a good powder that is less temp sensitive. Guys are getting pretty good MV w/ it, 50-75fps slower than RL17.

For what it is worth, I shoot 38.2gr RL15 under a Berger 140gr LR-BT. It does 2865fps (ES 12fps) out of my 26" Hart chambered with the 0.1814" freebore reamer from Pacific (work done by Walker Custom Rifles). My Berger's are 0.010" off lands. Like you, I saw good accuracy over a wide node (from 37.0 to 38.6 gr - I saw first signs of pressure (ejector mark) at 38.6).

 

[notquiteright]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

I'll second the use of H4350 as a year round powder that is much better at holding safe pressures over powders like RL15.

You can still run RL15 if you back the charge down either year round or have summer/winter loads.

Old timers using IMR often did that, IMR was really temp sensitive compared to more modern powders being developed.

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

I thought R15 was supposed to be more temp sensitive than R17. That said, I never experienced any velocity spikes or sensitivity with R15 in my 6br. I'm going to try 4350 as well though.

 

[notquiteright]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

My bad-
I meant 17.

Alot depends on where you shoot. Seems south of the Mason Dixon can show which powder can be temp sensitive than above it.

One guy I shot with was from around Boston and swore by IMR. In New Mexico he swore at it!

Good Luck

 

[jbailey]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Based on my experience of using both RL15 and RL17 as well as observing others using it, RL17 is more temp sensitive. I have observed that RL17 does funny things in really cool or really hot weather, whereas RL15's temp variance is pretty predictable (something like 1*F = 0.5fps from 0 to 100). RL17 is not a powder to use year round if you are a F-class shooter or long-range hunter. Both tend to be on the dirty side as well.

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

I think I finalized my tactical loads with the 140 amax today. 27" McGowen Bull 40.5g H4350 .015 jump COAL 2.745" If anyone could run a simulation in QL for me on this I would appreciate it, wondering what the predicted pressure is. Primers and bolt lift good, but a slight ejector mark that I'm attributing to virgin brass. All 4 shot groups.

13 shot string. AVG. Velocity 2766. ES 17 SD 6.4
2760
2760
2766
2760
2766
2760
2772
2766
2777
2777
2766
2772
2760
I should have pushed it up to 41g to see what happened, I'd like to get to 2800, but I would like to see what QL says my pressure is at.

 

[jbailey]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Besides the awesome accuracy, why are the AMaxs jumping 0.015"? Also, what bullet is your chamber reamed for - 123gr or 140gr length? If its a 123 gr length freebore, you are probably not maximizing your powder capacity with that jump. If its a 140gr length freebore, you probably are good on capacity. If you tried jamming the AMaxs you might see velocity go up without adding any powder, although honestly those groups are so good that I'm not sure why you want to see another 30fps.

 

[jbailey]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

sorry, double tap.

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

No particular reason for the jump other than I didn't want to jam the bullets in a tactical set up. QL says I'm at 64,200 psi and Lapua's max pressure listed for the case is 63,000, but I'm not concerned about that since the brass is so damn strong. I've still got room for about .5g before the powder begins to compress and that will likely increas a tad when all the brass is fireformed. Pressure would likely increase if I start jamming them.

I still need to shoot the above loads on paper out to 300 atleast to check the vertical, but I would think it should be OK since the ES and SD are good.

 

[JWV]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Very Nice, do you have it bedded into the stock or just using the Choate v-block?

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JWV</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Very Nice, do you have it bedded into the stock or just using the Choate v-block? </div></div>
I bedded it with Devcon before I sent the first round thru it.

 

[JWV]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Nice, I just bedded mine with JB weld. I am hitting the range Sunday. Although, I do not have the aftermarket barrel on mine yet. I am hoping it still shoots half as good as yours.

 

[Casey Simpson]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

James, if you'll use the OCW method of finding your load with RL 17 your charge will not be susceptible to ambient temperature fluctuations.

 

[jbailey]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Casey Simpson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">James, if you'll use the OCW method of finding your load with RL 17 your charge will not be susceptible to ambient temperature fluctuations. </div></div>

That's a good point Casey. I developed my load w/ a ladder at 500yds, followed by a OCW test at 200 and 400 of the high end node ID'ed from 500yd ladder. I'm generally happy with the load and with RL 15, so I'm not really motivated to redevelop w/ RL 17. I do have 1000 130gr VLDs on order w/ JLK, and once those arrive, I will probably develop that with H4350, just because I like what I hear about that powder's relatively clean burning nature.

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

James, I'll second the vote for 4350 and its clean burning properties. I cleaned my brake after each testing session. 50 rounds of R17 and the brake was 3 to 4 times dirtier than 50 rounds of H4350.

 

[Casey Simpson]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

My clean powder buddy loves Vv powder, and for this round you're in business. Check out the Vv powder load data for this round.

 

[Alan Griffith]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

I love it when a "search" comes up with stuff like this. I'd like to ad my results.

Took possession of my 2nd 6.5x47 last October. It's a lighter (8 lb 10 oz) hunting rifle in 6.5x47 on a Pierce action and #3.1 Broughton barrel.

I started with Rel 17 and CCI 450's. Both the Berger 140 VLD and 140 Partition did well in ladder's @ 360ish yds. I focused first on the Partition as I had 500 of them on my bench. Ended up with this.

Wanted to move over to the 140 VLD with it's .612 BC. The 140 Part only has a .490 BC. My 140 VLD ladder looked like this. Several good nodes, then topping out at 3021 fps with 43.5 gr in 21 deg F temps. Their was just a hint of pressure via sticky bolt lift. This was fine as #9 and #10 is what I wanted to focus on.

I settled on 42.1 gr for 2965 fps and 8 SD (I jotted down the wrong powder charge, 2906 fps and 7 Sd on the target thus they are incorrect). This was at 70 deg F.

Yesterday I ran a 600 yd primer test having discovered several months back with the 140 Part that the Fed 205m primer gave lower ES/SD. In my big Surgeon/AICS sniper rifle (17+ lbs) I shoot the 130 VLD with 40.8 H4350 and CCI 450's. Great load giving 10-shot sub 1/2 moa single digit SD's all day, every day! But for Rel 17, the Fed 205m is tops.

Same results with the 140 VLD. A 10-shot string av 2975 fps gave a 16 ES/5 SD with the Fed 205match primer in 65 deg temps.

No pics of the 600 yd targets as the wind was switchy between 4 and 8 o'clock and the horizontal is not pretty but the vertical was 4-1/2". Not great but doable enough for me to persue a bullet seating depth test in the near future.

Hope I was able to add something to a fine cartridge.

Alan

 

[TexasShadow]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

6.5x47 Lapua is my favorite cartridge.My stick lays down 1/4 moa all day long.My best 5 shot group was .682 inches at 500M.Great Round!

 

[Hasgun Willtravel]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

MDM,

I run a 6.5x47 with 142 SMK with 41.0 of H4350, 3 years running, great load.

As far as your sticky bolt lift, if you purchased once fired brass, get a body sizer die, you will need one after 3-4 firings on the brass, or at least I did. Body sizer fixed all issues, since even after FL sizing, the bolt close still had a bit of a feel to it.

Love this little cartridge.

 

[MDM]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Now that I look back at my group pics with the 123's, they don't seem that good compared to what the 140 amax will do. I've settled on the 140 amax with 40.3g H4350. I FL size everytime and anneal every 2x. I've since layed out a steel course on my dads farm with many targets from 240 out to 1110yds. This cartridge could make a shooter out of anyone I think.

I also put together an identical rifle, sans stock, for my dad and it shoots equally well. His shows pressure sooner than mine is all. We are shooting 39.5g in his. Honestly though, any charge we tried with the 140 amax was .5 moa and under. Both rifles are far more accurate than either of us can shoot. I'll admit though, with practice every week, those first round hits at 800yds and out are becoming expected rather than a surprise nowadays. I just love this round.

I will be trading out the Viper for a new SS 5x20x50HD from the group buy when they come out - then the rifle will be complete.

 

[jbailey]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Guys-

Take a look at this thread for some thoughts on a potential bullet that rocks in 6.5x47L, the 130gr JLK:

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2470119#Post2470119

I haven't started loading it for my x47L, but I have a buddy that has done a good bit. In theory, the 130gr JLK can easily go ~3000fps from the x47L w/ 26" barrel and carries a similar BC to the 142gr SMK - with ballistics like that, the x47L can nearly rival the 6.5x284...

 

[Hasgun Willtravel]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

Effectively destroying one of the big advantages of this cartridge,..barrel life. If you want to do that shoot a .243 or a 6.5x284.


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JamesBailey</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Guys-
In theory, the 130gr JLK can easily go ~3000fps from the x47L w/ 26" barrel and carries a similar BC to the 142gr SMK - with ballistics like that, the x47L can nearly rival the 6.5x284...


</div></div>

 

[jbailey]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: HasgunWilltravel</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Effectively destroying one of the big advantages of this cartridge,..barrel life. If you want to do that shoot a .243 or a 6.5x284.

</div></div>

HasgunWilltravel-
thanks, that is a good point. I did look at some of the barrel life models and found the following:

There will be a slight decrease in barrel life because the smaller bullet adds a bit more powder capacity, but we are talking only a grain more powder, which, according to barrel life models, only decreases the barrel life by ~ 100 rounds.

On the other major variables - bore capacity, powder heat potential, and pressure - these are all the same (0.264" = constant, powder heat potential = constant as we are using same powder, and pressure = same Kinetic energy at muzzle = same pressure). On the pressure, read the discussion on the math around estimated muzzle velocity from that link I supplied above.

If a bullet is clearly superior in the field, a decrease of ~100 rounds of barrel life is worth it. I'm still doing work to determine if I like the 130gr JLK, so I really appreciate this discussion! I do love the 6.5x47 cartridge - its a great compromise...

 

[Hasgun Willtravel]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

That's much better than I predicted. I currently have around 3700 rounds of 142SMK @ 2875 down the tube, and is still plenty less than an MOA rifle. This is truley a fantastic cartridge.

 

[jbailey]

Re: Range Report 6.5x47 Lapua

HasgunWilltravel-
Here is the barrel life model I'm using:
http://www.accurateshooter.com/technical-articles/excel-formula-predicts-useful-barrel-life/

Clearly this model doesn't say anything about how hard you run a gun - 10 rounds in 1 minute a whole lot worse than 10 rounds in 1 hour - but I think it is something of a useful tool for back-of-envelope thinking.

I am at 600 rounds w/ the 140gr Berger LR-BT doing 2865 with RL-15. I'm going to start using H4350 so I'm looking over bullet options.