Re: Loads fo Subsonics- All Cals
Originally posted by Denz:
Well after pulling a few searches of subsonic loads I found most had good results with TrailBoss. I took DavefromGA’s load of 9.3 and adjusted for it my rifle. A Gap SP .308 20”rock 1-11 with shadow can. Here’s what I loaded
Case: LC90
Powder: TrailBoss 9.6
Bullet: 180 RN Hornady
Primer: CCI 250
Loaded with Lee Deluxe Dies, Powder dropped using a lee perfect powder measure only weighed 1st and last round (50 total).
Here’s a pic of the target at 200yrds. I think it works…
Orginally posted by Rijndael:
I'm running a 20" Schneider 5P 1:11.
9.6 was definitely a sweet spot for me as well.
9.6 Trailboss
FGMM Brass
Sierra 180
210M Primer
A 4 shot group was sub minute.
Originally posted by MtMisfit:
FGMM Brass
180gr Speer RN
CCI 200
COAL 2.810
11.5gr Trail Boss is giving me 1056fps avg from my 20" 700VS.
9.6gr gives me 1140 with 150gr RN.
The 170gr FP are somewhere in between.
I tried 9.5gr as a starting load with the 180's and was in the low 800fps range.
glad I have a chrono.
Orginally posted by KS:
Denz, those are some damn fine groups at 200yds! I would be happy with those at 100yds. I must be doing something wrong.
This was my first attempt to loading subs for my AAC Cyclone. It was WAY quiet. I wanted to load to about 1050fps. I played w/ the charge to get there. I was encouraged w/ the 50yds groups but dissapointed at 100yds. I did NOT adjust the OAL trying to tighten the groups up. I checked the targets for keyholing at 5yds, 25yds, and 100yds. All were nice and round. After that I screwed the can on and went for it.
Sierra 170gr (30-30 rond nose, flat based bullet)
10.0gr TrailBoss
210M's
IMI brass
OAL 2.70"
10.0grs averaged 1069fps
11.0grs averaged 1106fps
It shot 1/2" at 50yds. Average 1069fps for 10rds.
100yd opened up to about 2".
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
I have some Sierra 200mk's. Do you think they would be worth a try (with TrailBoss) or should I stick to the roundnose bullets?
BTW, TrailBoss is some STRANGE lookin' powder!
thanks,
Keith
Here is what I am shooting them in.
KMW built:
308 Win.
Surgeon action
Krieger barrel, 24", 1-10" twist
Badger Ordnance bottom metal
Shilen trigger
McMillan A5, adj cheek Piece, 33% each of OD green, black, and tan, flush cups
Badger Ordnance rings
US Optics SN-3, T-Pal, EREK, green illuminated Type 1 reticle
AAC Cyclone can
Ops Inc. brake
Originally posted by Mike Reynolds:
This is my first post here, I have spent some time just reading. I do not have any experience with trail boss, I have been using Unique for a few years now. I have never had any signs of pressure problems and my loads have been very accurate out to 200 yds. It is very important to weigh each charge, I have tried just using a thrown charge but velocity was all over the place. Load specs below:
LC brass
Magnum primers
190 gr SMK
9 gr Unique
I do not do any thing special for case prep and I was getting around 1060 fps out of my 26 inch, 1-10 twist barrel. I just started using the Lapua 200 gr subsonic bullets with good accuracy results.
Originally posted by REM700MAN:
this is second hand info, so try at your own risk
.308
10.5 gr of trailboss
180 gr sierra
i was looking for the same thing and i think that is what someone posted that they use
good luck
Originally posted by JasonK:
Here's some info from another site, this guy is very into the low power loads.
HERE'S THE BLUE DOT POST.....READ ON
Now to address this topic...on 223 gopher loads...with Blue Dot..
This info ought to keep you busy, but you need to load one at a time if you are loading the slower velocity loads, so that you do not double charge your load...all of these loads have proven safe in my 223s,
Blue Dot Range Report: 223 Caliber ( Full )
Bullet Weights Tested:
1. 35 grain Hornady V Max
2. 40 grain Hornady Vmax
3. 45 grain Sierra SP
4. 50 grain Sierra SMP
5. 52 grain Sierra Boat Tail Match
6. 55 grain Winchester FMJ
Rifle Used: Ruger 77 Mk 2, VT 26 inch Barrel, Stainless Steel First yr Model
Case: Lake City Surplus, previously fired
Primer: Remington 6 ½
Powder: Blue Dot
Charge Weight Tested: 4 grains to 14 grains.
Weather: Sunny, NO clouds, 80 degrees, NO wind,
Altitude: 2000 ft
Humidity: Very Low
Field Results:
35 grain Hornady V Max:
4 grs: 1284 fps
5 grs: 1488 fps
6 grs: 1862 fps
7 grs: 2163 fps
8 grs: 2392 fps
9 grs: 2636 fps
10 grs: 2722 fps
11 grs: 3076 fps
12 grs: 3205 fps
13 grs: NO Reading
14 grs: 3518 fps
15 grs: NO Reading, Too hot, Extractor Marks, Scrapped Case
16 grs: NO Reading, Too Hot Blew Primer
Hornady 40 grain Vmax:
4 grs: 1161 fps
5 grs: 1538 fps
6 grs: 1798 fps
7 grs: 2148 fps
8 grs: 2243 fps
9 grs: 2539 fps
10 grs: 2771 fps
11 grs: 2956 fps
12 grs: 3013 fps
13 grs: 3218 fps
14 grs: 3375 fps
Sierra 45 grain SP
4 grs: 1239 fps
5 grs: 1447 fps
6 grs: 1688 fps
7 grs: 1880 fps
8 grs: 2118 fps
9 grs: 2363 fps
10 grs: 2553 fps
11 grs: 2811 fps
12 grs: 2875 fps
13 grs: 3008 fps
14 grs: 3164 fps
Sierra 50 grains SMP
4 grs: 1064 fps
5 grs: 1345 fps
6 grs: 1624 fps
7 grs: 1788 fps
8 grs: 2033 fps
9 grs: 2257 fps
10 grs: 2466 fps
11 grs: 2655 fps
12 grs: 2779 fps
13 grs: 2882 fps
14 grs: 3038 fps
Sierra 52 grain Boattail Hollow Point Match
4 grs: 1061 fps
5grs: 1460 fps
6 grs: 1632 fps
7 grs: 1916 fps
8 grs: 2142 fps
9 grs: 2225 fps
10 gr: NO Reading
11 grs: 2673 fps
12 grs: 2782 fps
13 grs: 2879 fps
14 grs: 3012 fps
Winchester 55 grain FMJ
4 grs: 896 fps
5 grs: 1264 fps
6 grs: 1568 fps
7 grs: 1825 fps
8 grs: 1994 fps
9 grs: 2201 fps
10 grs: 2328 fps
11 grs: 2453 fps
12 grs: 2677 fps
13 grs: 2821 fps
14 grs: 2915 fps
Notes:
1. IN the evaluation of the 223, I came further to the conclusion of the versatility of the 223 in the use of training new shooters, and for a very versatile varmint caliber.
2. Essentially the 223 can be loaded to the specs of a 22 Long rifle, a 218 Bee, a 221 Fireball, a 222 Remington, a 22 Hornet, and a 22 Win Mag., while allowing the shooter to be able to pick the type of bullet that he prefers.
3. Bullets were limited to use of 35 grains to 55 grains. Heavier bullets will not serve any purpose unless a 223 is to be used for deer hunting. I do not believe that their would be a significant difference in the use of a 55 grain bullet vs a 60 grain bullet.
4. The recoil on the lighter loads using 4 to 6 grains of powder had minimal recoil if any at all. These would be ideal for young shooters being trained.
5. Noise level on the lighter loads ( 4 to 6 grains) were on par with a rim fire. An increase in noise level was very noticeable above 7 grains, but still very acceptable. ( No sounding like a rim fire any more)
Noted Observations:
1. It was noted but not considered part of the testing, with a tree used as a back stop for some of the testing, that all bullets ( 45 to 55 grains)penetrated thru the tree at a distance of 20 yds.
2. The diameter of the tree was measured at 5 inches.
3. The 40 grain Vmax loads failed to penetrate the tree at loads above 10 grs, above 2771 fps. However at 10 grains and less, the bullets penetrated thru the tree and did a large amount of damage ( like turning the wood into tooth picks) on the exit side of the tree. The penetration stopped at the 5 grain load.
Some of the Author’s Conclusions:
1. I learned some significant items beyond the versatility of the 223 with the bullets tested, but focusing on its use in the field, got some ideas.
2. A light rifle such as a Winchester Featherweight or Rugers Compact model with a 16.5 inch barrel or the Ultra Light with a 20 inch barrel would make a good combo with the use of Blue Dot.
3. Since the powder is burned cleanly in the first 10 to 12 inches of barrel, the shorter barrels are not handicappiing velocity in the lighter shorter rifles.
4. The penetration of the 40 grain Vmax into the tree did make me ponder the use of those plastic tip varmint rounds as potential loads for small deer for youth shooters. Just like my observations in the larger calibers, the plastic tipped bullet seem to do a lot more damage, at velocities under 2700 fps. The Vmax surprised me. This is a decision any shooter will have to test on his own and make their own decisions. I am just passing on that I saw potential merit in the application.
5. Although one has to weigh out the potential of Plastic Tipped Varmint bullets on bigger game like deer and antelope, some of these loads in real life use, utilizing Barnes’s X bullets in 22 caliber I can recommend. They make a 45 grain, 50 grain and 53 grain bullet. The way I saw much better penetration and more damage in wood, at the lower range velocities, 2200 to 2700 fps, this would make a good deer load in many parts of the USA, and recoil is minimal.
I did not test any bigger bullets as I feel that those tested would be represent the best potential with the powder. 60, 63, 64, 65 grain bullets and then the larger match bullets did not give what I considered useful velocity when I have shot them before with Blue Dot, in respect to their field design uses.
My personal most often used Blue Dot/223 loads are...
14.5 grains with a 40, to 46 grain bullet
14 grains with a 50 grain bullet ( Speer TNT highly recommended)
13.5 grains with a 55 grain bullet.. ( don't use SPSX Hornady's in a rifle with a one in 9 twist as this may vaporize it coming out the barrel, the SPSX is too fragile for one in 9 twists, except at pretty low velocities..
It takes a lot to overheat your barrel, it reduces recoil substantially ( it won't cycle ARs!).. it will also greatly reduce vibration down synthetic stocks, which medical studies are indictating a cause of hearing loss in high volume shooters....
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