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Random people on the internet, most of them never having seen combat, will tell you all about the shortcomings.are there any real short comings with existing platforms that required a new rifle?......or is this just the Army wanting to spend money?
Yeah that’s all I need is a nine hour video on POU of SAWC of the 6.8 vs the 5.56 from a guy who thinks SFP leupold with fixed duplex reticles are the shitGive one to Nutnfancy so he can break it...
They’re not?Yeah that’s all I need is a nine hour video on POU of SAWC of the 6.8 vs the 5.56 from a guy who thinks SFP leupold with fixed duplex reticles are the shit
....is there a reason they didnt just rechamber existing M4s in 6.8?.....
are there any real short comings with existing platforms that required a new rifle?......or is this just the Army wanting to spend money?
Doubt it. The 77gr is plenty lethal and euros know most engagements are under 200so then will the Sig 277 Fury be the next NATO round?
The 277 fury is a 308 win sized cartridge…....is there a reason they didnt just rechamber existing M4s in 6.8?.....
are there any real short comings with existing platforms that required a new rifle?......or is this just the Army wanting to spend money?
FIFYIt's SIG, they'll probably have 15 recalls in three years.
If a little recoil bothers them... maybe, just maybe, being part of a killing machine was the wrong career path.Another minor detail.
Giving a weapon that has "kick" to a regular army kid these days.....
That shit just won't fly.
Wanna bet we'll hear about the general soldiers being afraid of it ?
Peer adversaries with modern body armor was a primary driver of the programIf a little recoil bothers them... maybe, just maybe, being part of a killing machine was the wrong career path.
I wonder how it shakes out against modern body armor and penetration of light armor. Wasn’t that part of the reason for the change?
Compared to M855 I wonder how it performs? It sound like its got a little more thump than an M2 AP 30-06 round.
Was going to say something to the effect about how much they paid out on the back end.Not to mention the interoperability of parts already in inventory. SIG has been greasing a lot of palms lately.
Yeah that’s all I need is a nine hour video on POU of SAWC of the 6.8 vs the 5.56 from a guy who thinks SFP leupold with fixed duplex reticles are the shit
Well one of the biggest issues is weight. Standardish m4 load out is 7 mags. Could you imagine lugging around 7 mags of 7.62 with 70 less rounds and still weighing more? The new ones are using polymer cased ammo which lowers the weight considerablyhow much difference is there between M4 and the new rifles? size, weight, capacity, etc.. seems like a big jump from small to large frame in addition to a new caliber. why didnt they ever make that jump with 308 rifles? I imagine the reasons why they didnt would be the same.
thats what Im thinking. polymer case in high pressure round? with stainless head isnt saving that much. either way it is heavier than an M4 with less ammo capacity and more recoil. soldiers better learn to shoot and make those shots count. kinda makes everyone a designated marksman. Its basically same a SR25 or SCAR17 only chambered in 277FUBAR.Well one of the biggest issues is weight. Standardish m4 load out is 7 mags. Could you imagine lugging around 7 mags of 7.62 with 70 less rounds and still weighing more? The new ones are using polymer cased ammo which lowers the weight considerably
Yes, 20k PSI difference....is there a reason they didnt just rechamber existing M4s in 6.8?.....
are there any real short comings with existing platforms that required a new rifle?......or is this just the Army wanting to spend money?
20 rnds of polymer .277 is around the same weight as a 30 rnd of 5.56.Well one of the biggest issues is weight. Standardish m4 load out is 7 mags. Could you imagine lugging around 7 mags of 7.62 with 70 less rounds and still weighing more? The new ones are using polymer cased ammo which lowers the weight considerably
Exactly my point. Now you can carry an effective larger caliber load out atvthe same weight as 55620 rnds of polymer .277 is around the same weight as a 30 rnd of 5.56.
The polymer cases save about 30% in weight. As an estimated guess, 7.62x51 cartridge weights around 380 grains. So 30% of that is 266grains x20= 5320View attachment 7854879
An m855 weighs around 190 grains. 190 x30=5700
View attachment 7854880
So the weight is comparable. Thought yes 70 less round(140 vs 210) But with a cartridge with nearly 3x the amount of energy, much longer effective range and a flatter trajectory.
Look at it in total energy delivered. 277 is around 3000ftlbs, 556 is around 1200 ftlbs. So a full load out of .277 delivers a total of 420,000ftlbs of muzzle energy. Full load out of 5.56 delivers around 252,000ftlbs.
.277 load out puts a shit ton more energy at muzzle and has a much higher bc so carriers that energy further.
Again with the AR15 cartridges? WTF? The 277 Sig Fury has a 308win or 6/6.5 creedmoor size case.6mm ARC
never has a soldier said, 'I'll take 30% less ammo so I can have a flatter shooting round with more energy when 90% of global engagements are inside 300 meters20 rnds of polymer .277 is around the same weight as a 30 rnd of 5.56.
The polymer cases save about 30% in weight. As an estimated guess, 7.62x51 cartridge weights around 380 grains. So 30% of that is 266grains x20= 5320View attachment 7854879
An m855 weighs around 190 grains. 190 x30=5700
View attachment 7854880
So the weight is comparable. Thought yes 70 less round(140 vs 210) But with a cartridge with nearly 3x the amount of energy, much longer effective range and a flatter trajectory.
Look at it in total energy delivered. 277 is around 3000ftlbs, 556 is around 1200 ftlbs. So a full load out of .277 delivers a total of 420,000ftlbs of muzzle energy. Full load out of 5.56 delivers around 252,000ftlbs.
.277 load out puts a shit ton more energy at muzzle and has a much higher bc so carriers that energy further.
Don't waste your time. No one seems to understand it's a completely different platform size, I gave up trying to explain it to people a while ago.Again with the AR15 cartridges? WTF? The 277 Sig Fury has a 308win or 6/6.5 creedmoor size case.
I have a marine friend I grew up with who was in Iraq multiple tours starting in late 2003 telling me that he wished he had something more powerful than 5.56.never has a soldier said, 'I'll take 30% less ammo so I can have a flatter shooting round with more energy when 90% of global engagements are inside 300 meters
And how high are you on your pain meds...Appears someone has never weighed an empty case.
A loaded 308 is about twice the weight of a 223 +/- whatever.
Somehow miraculously making the case different drops the weight substantially ?
WTF?????
Go weigh an empty 308 case and then come back and kiss my ass
You *might* be saving 15 grains per round at most by switching to either a steel based brass case or a steel based polymer case.
Maybe.
In conclusion.
Ya ain't saving shit for weight with a different case because the case weighs fuck all to begin with.
lol, I can get 50 guys on the phone that would say fk u to that, MORE is always better.I have a marine friend I grew up with who was in Iraq multiple tours starting in late 2003 telling me that he wished he had something more powerful than 5.56.
Afghanistan... troops were outranged by goat fuckers with mosian’s.
So yeah there are sum.
bigger all around, heavier, less ammo into the fray but hey, desk clearks are telling me that I can now kill haj at 600meters because 5.56 is only effective to 300meters. lolDon't waste your time. No one seems to understand it's a completely different platform size, I gave up trying to explain it to people a while ago.
Bet bet you can get 50 dudes on the phonelol, I can get 50 guys on the phone that would say fk u to that, MORE is always better.
the 77gr fks shit up! we don't need a new caliber
77gr is part of P11 STRAC. So it is programmed for all the SOF units that shoot guns.
It is available. I stated it in true intent. It is STRAC'd, programmed, and allotted annually.
This is what you said:
but only about 2% of the Army has access to that and I wasn't one of them in my early days. Even now, all of SOF doesn't get 77 gr all the time.
It is not true.