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Another way to say it could be "Obama kept their shitty company in business and now they have to deal with a realistic market."
Remington blaming Trump reminds me of the old saying, "if you're looking for an excuse, anyone will do."
Or get thrown the fuck out of here by the owner, who you've badmouthed and called a liar by association. That's what.Take another approach huh, yeah or what?
My apologies to Culpepper and The King since I was also not trying to be political, only attempting to point out that Remington's problems started with their shitty products.
ignorance is all that keeps people wedded to Remingtons today. Remington's offerings for our market are fucking laughable.
Or get thrown the fuck out of here by the owner, who you've badmouthed and called a liar by association. That's what.
I don't give a shit about what a gunsmith on a video says.
Seems to make perfect sense to you? Well then you have no sense.
There is no fucking "system.
Not that I give a fuck, really.
Aww, look at you trying to peer pressure people into doing what you want them to do, that's just precious.
Awww and there you are acting you as though you have some authority, how adorable.
You're right there big guy anyone that doesn't share your views should be banned, effective immediately.
Aww and there you are getting angry because others don't agree with you, you poor guy.
So the readers can follow along what the gunsmith said in reference to the Howa action was "it was one of the worst actions we've ever seen".
Is that you getting angry again when others don't agree with your veiws.
And again.
And again.
Just a troll thread that's all this is you show up to insult other's choices then when ppl don't adopt your opinions you pitch a fit and suggest that they be banned.
I've already answered your first question. I've stated my points of view more than once if you want to seek out that information then go back and re-read though the thread. The smith's credentials can be found in the video. Video's measuring actions for run out are boring content that few want to watch who would pay a gunsmith for such a video anyway? The smiths video doesn't showcase a firearm either I've shown proof of channels charging manufactures to endorse firearms but I've never seen proof of manufacturers paying gunsmiths to produce action run out ads. I would have thought you could have answered this for yourself.
Do you care to show proof of the 700's QC issues which you're claiming to have seen, and are basing the context of your OP off of or are you just shit posting?
I've already answered your first question. I've stated my points of view more than once if you want to seek out that information then go back and re-read though the thread. The smith's credentials can be found in the video. Video's measuring actions for run out are boring content that few want to watch who would pay a gunsmith for such a video anyway? The smiths video doesn't showcase a firearm either I've shown proof of channels charging manufactures to endorse firearms but I've never seen proof of manufacturers paying gunsmiths to produce action run out ads. I would have thought you could have answered this for yourself.
Do you care to show proof of the 700's QC issues which you're claiming to have seen, and are basing the context of your OP off of or are you just shit posting?
Most gunsmiths refuse to work on anything but a 700. So yeah, there's a reason they still exist. It's a stupid reason, but it's there.
I would like to know where you got this piece of info from. I know lots of gunsmiths that will work on damn near anything. Rugers, tikkas, savage, Winchester, custom actions, 700's, Ar's, 1903 Springfield's, mausers.... I find it hard to believe that a smith would say I only work on 700's.
Scott
I have come across one who would only work on 700 bolt actions. I found a different smith.
I wanna know how he stays in business
Scott
Not sure he is. That was almost 10 years ago. I wanted some work done on a Savage, and that's when I was informed of his preference.
Actually you didn’’t, and won’’t. But I’m your own vein, “do you care to show proof” that Frank is being paid to “showcase” the rifle? Do you care to show proof that this is common for action in question?
My claims are well documented by individuals all over the web. I do not need to show proof that they are true and find it ironic you’re just “trusting” that Remington QC is good and assuming I’’m a liar or trolling, but believe some YouTube dude. Seriously, you can’’t turn around without seeing poorly manufactured Remington. I’m sorry I haven’t thoroughly documented the things I’ve seen first hand with YouTube videos for you, but have personally witnessed (which is bullshit unless it’s coming from your mouth, right? Like your claim of “proof†that Frank was paid $5,000 for the review of Howa...
Here is what I’ve seen personally on Remington rifles from the past five years:
Poor timing/primary extraction
Actions unable to eject
Long throats
Inconcentric chambers
Mounting holes for bases misaligned
Gritty bolts
Broken bolt handles
Off-center firing pins
Crooked recoil lugs
Bolt lugs not making contact or with minimal contact
Barrels crooked in the channel of HS Precision stocks
Accuracy on rifles greater than 3 MOA out of the box.
But I’m sure according to you, it’s all lies and Remington is perfect and everything else is crap and we are all trying to get rich. Grow up. As you can see I actually praised a recent acquisition of a Remington a few posts up. At this point, however, I wouldn’t buy a Remington I couldn’t inspect first or that wasn’t worked over by a quality Smith.
Totally off topic, but what's the idea with the bizarre punctuation? ’ ’ ’???
Ya sure.
I don’t even know who’s shit you’re showing or if it’s even authentic, but it sure ain’t Frank’s.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
What make you think I missed the point? Because I answered a silly question with a silly answer. Sorry.
Why buy a remington, tikka, savage, howa, ruger? because they are cheap and my budget can't make a sako, AI, Desert Tech, MRAD. Or maybe so we can make erroneous arguments about which one is a "better buy." "Because I made a smarter choice than you." Who knows. This thread comes up every few months. Then a bunch of brand puffing and bull shit stories show up.... Then I laugh some more.....
If we were all honest, and if America was a true free market economy Remington would have failed a long time ago, but they are helped by putting fees on anyone foreign and idiots with a “Buy American” mentality.
adding to what others have said already, the 700 will be around for a long time due to it's core demographic, the fudds. i was at the range on sunday, the day before rifle season in PA. as long as the rifle hits a pie plate at 100 yards, it's good to go for the fudds. "look at that! i put 2 bullets in the same hole!" and then he stopped shooting. umm... what about all of the other hits that give you a 5" group??? mean while, he was 2" high and 3" left with his "2 bullet hole" pure luck group.
Howdy all. Just swam through all this thread's BS, found it all very interesting. Who doesn't love a dick measuring contest?
I was hoping to be the first to bring it up, but Rhyno hit it here. Contrary to popular belief, the American mentality is not all gone. Dad's who grew up shooting 700's, and still have the same one their father gave them for their 12th birthday, are buying that same model for their kids today. Outdoor Life and Field and Stream have been expanding their advertising (and market) base, but the classics are still classics. Case in point, two of my (younger) cousins refuse to hunt with anything other than lever actions. Why, because they are nuts and somehow still stuck in 1894. In that market, hunting, I would predict Remington is doing, and will continue to do, fine. Winchester had some more publicly-recognized issues, which is why the 70 may have taken a hit for a few years, but as far as I know their rifles today are as adequate as any other for minute-of-deer. Whatever, not the basis of this discussion.
For myself, when I started looking for precision rifles I was open to many brands. I looked hard at Tikka, Weatherby/Howa, and even Savage to some extent. Tikka didn't offer a heavy barrel in the caliber I wanted (7mm-08), ditto for Howa, and the HCR hadn't taken off yet. My budget didn't fit a custom rig, or even rebarreling any of the above actions, and my knowledge level didn't support me building a Rem-Age on my own, although I'm looking that way for my next project. Lo and behold, I found a Frankenstein rifle, with an old-ass 700 action and a new SPS Varmint barrel, screwed into an HS stock. 900 smacks later (plus transfer and tax), it was at my LGS. It has it's quirks, but if the gunsmith had screwed the barrel on correctly I'm guessing it would be exactly perfect. It shoots lights-out with my load and I've been able to build and grow with it. I am content.
Remington, for a long while, was the "plug-and-play" action of choice for people like us. That's how my rifle came to exist in the first place, that's how probably over half the frequenters of this site got their start. They took as AAC-SD, threw it in a B&C, or HS, or KRG, and then blueprinted it, swapped the barrel, had the bolt milled and added a cool knob, etc, whatever.The "problem" I'm seeing is brands are coming out with rifles for a very specific market, in fan-boy chamberings because that's what's hot right now. How many NEW, COOL, SHINY 6.5 CM rifles have come out in the past 3-4 years? They are making success off the quick and easy route, because there is no argument that it isn't the smart route. And dammit, so are the ammo manufacturers (looking at you, Prime).
Remington made its success and name before these times. Government contracts gave it lasting credibility with the M40 and M24. From there, gunsmiths and then custom builders took the actions and made their own changes to it, to improve on what was "better" at the time. After that, it was only a matter of time until knock-off actions came about, and all of a sudden people think the original ain't what it used to be. Lest we forget, imitation is the highest form of flattery. Sure, "QC issues!" the peanut gallery cries. I understand. All things considered, that's a fairly minor fix to one of, if not the most, successful rifles and actions to date. Admittedly knowing nothing of their company leadership I would say better management, fresh idea-thinker-uppers, and a competent accountant could pull them out of their present funk.
A similar case, me thinks, could be made against Leupold. For a long time they were the star of the show. Then they lost favor among the masses as new brands came out with new products. Until very recently, people were complaining against Leupold's arguable lack of innovation, comparatively small magnification ranges, non-Tier One glass, and overall "Meh" appeal. Many other brands got their piece of the optics world with NEW SHIT. Vortex comes to mind, partially because I am a fan boy, but look at what they've put out over the past 5 years with their higher-end lines. And they are far from the only ones! Meanwhile Leupold sat, hoping the Mark 4 would carry it through. It obviously didn't, and now Leupold, recognizing that, has been expanding their line in the recent past to fill the gaps. Thermals, red dots, greater magnification ranges and some product placement with para-military alphabet-soup organizations has resurrected them from the dead. Halle-fricken-lujah.
I could go on, look at Glock. When was the last time you saw someone posting a panty-dropping pic of a factory G19 on Instagram? New Gen 5? C'mon, no one gives a shit. These days it's all about who's slide you are running, which trigger, barrel, red dot, light? Comp? Wait, you DIDN'T EVEN stipple it? Chump. "Stock" has become synonymous for "not cool," "not good enough" for the cool kids. In that wake, CZ P-10c. M&P 2.0. Silencerco. PPQ. P320, as long as you don't drop it. New offerings with new innovation providing new competition. And you know what? I'm sure Glock won't be dying anytime soon. Glocks (and sure, 1911's) became the "plug and play" of the pistol world, and yet other brands still grew up from their apparent hegemony. It is suffering the same fate as the Remington 700, but I guarantee no one will throw away a perfectly good Gen 3. If you are, let me know.
Combining these two analogies, and wrapping up this way-longer than anticipated rant, Remington provided the platform which paved the way for modern precision shooting. There's no argument against that. However, due to QC issues, a failure to stay ahead of the times, and a few failed projects that didn't meet market demands as hoped for, Remington has been, for lack of a better term, shitting the bed. New kids have taken over the block. Can Remington regain it's reign as top dog? It would be difficult, with the quality of offerings on the market today. But, like Leupold, there's still a chance to stay relevant. Because of new offerings providing more market-specific based options, is it going to go the way of the dodo by FY2019? I doubt it.
The best part? Their largest market base doesn't even know they are getting what WE think of as a second-rate rifle, so they have time to correct their mistakes.
I don't know anything about the meaning of how many digits are on a serial number or letter prefixes/suffixes, so I avoid them all and buy something else to be safe.
Three Howas in a row since 2000, three damned good shooters that needed nothing done except turning a screw on the trigger housing to lighten up the force needed to break the shot.
All good points. In fact, it’s almost a question of “who doesn’t make a better factory rifle today than Remington?” Mossburg?
so Mossberg is worst?
Why would you buy a 700 today?
I like the Remington 700 actions...
But what would I know ?
Mike R.
Tac Ops
Why would you buy a 700 today?
I like the Remington 700 actions...
But what would I know ?
Mike R.
Tac Ops