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The fate of the Remington 700 in 2017
- Thread starter tylerw02
- Start date
To be clear - Remington didn't blame Trump. That said, I think that a well earned reprieve from massive pushes for gun legislation has a lot to do with Trump. And a lot to do with the end of panic buying.
That said, I saw the panic buying come to an end mostly the second time we had a real push for gun control. There are only so many people who will buy 11 AR15's the second you whisper "ban, buddy, ban..." And after those folks had 55 AR15's, it was mostly over.
Also my apologies - I didn't appreciate my post might have been taken as something political and don't want to step on the sites rules there. Carry on.
That said, I saw the panic buying come to an end mostly the second time we had a real push for gun control. There are only so many people who will buy 11 AR15's the second you whisper "ban, buddy, ban..." And after those folks had 55 AR15's, it was mostly over.
Also my apologies - I didn't appreciate my post might have been taken as something political and don't want to step on the sites rules there. Carry on.
My bad as Remington really didn't blame Trump, but the credit analysts at Standard & Poor’s Global Ratings stated "This sudden drop in demand after President Trump's election has meant Remington Outdoor, the second-largest U.S. gunmaker, has suffered a “rapid” and “sharp” deterioration in sales and a similar drop in profits since January, and faces “continued softness in consumer demand for firearms.”
Link here: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-...fault-americans-buy-fewer-firearms-post-obama
My apologies to Culpepper and The King since I was also not trying to be political, only attempting to point out that Remington's problems started with their shitty products.
Link here: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-...fault-americans-buy-fewer-firearms-post-obama
My apologies to Culpepper and The King since I was also not trying to be political, only attempting to point out that Remington's problems started with their shitty products.
Or get thrown the fuck out of here by the owner, who you've badmouthed and called a liar by association. That's what.
Remington could have the premier American made assault rifle - the Remington Defense ACR. They could also have a serious contender for an AI AX in the MSR. Instead they have two RIDICULOUSLY overpriced guns they figured they could force on the military, and piss on civilian sales of the innovative things they have made recently.
Aww, look at you trying to peer pressure people into doing what you want them to do, that's just precious.
Awww and there you are acting you as though you have some authority, how adorable.
You're right there big guy anyone that doesn't share your views should be banned, effective immediately.
Aww and there you are getting angry because others don't agree with you, you poor guy.
So the readers can follow along what the gunsmith said in reference to the Howa action was "it was one of the worst actions we've ever seen".
Is that you getting angry again when others don't agree with your veiws.
And again.
And again.
Just a troll thread that's all this is you show up to insult other's choices then when ppl don't adopt your opinions you pitch a fit and suggest that they be banned.
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Please stop with this petty bullshit tiff with your best buddy P308 or take it private. You made one decent contribution to this thread and are now just trolling because you are infatuated with Pirate308. Take it to pm and leave this thread to people who actually have an opinion on the OP. Seriously, this is getting annoying.
Actually you didn’t, and won’t. But I’m your own vein, “do you care to show proof
They are well documented by individuals all over the web.
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Actually you didn’’t, and won’’t. But I’m your own vein, “do you care to show proof” that Frank is being paid to “showcase” the rifle? Do you care to show proof that this is common for action in question?
My claims are well documented by individuals all over the web. I do not need to show proof that they are true and find it ironic you’re just “trusting” that Remington QC is good and assuming I’’m a liar or trolling, but believe some YouTube dude. Seriously, you can’’t turn around without seeing poorly manufactured Remington. I’m sorry I haven’t thoroughly documented the things I’ve seen first hand with YouTube videos for you, but have personally witnessed (which is bullshit unless it’s coming from your mouth, right? Like your claim of “proof†that Frank was paid $5,000 for the review of Howa...
Here is what I’ve seen personally on Remington rifles from the past five years:
Poor timing/primary extraction
Actions unable to eject
Long throats
Inconcentric chambers
Mounting holes for bases misaligned
Gritty bolts
Broken bolt handles
Off-center firing pins
Crooked recoil lugs
Bolt lugs not making contact or with minimal contact
Barrels crooked in the channel of HS Precision stocks
Accuracy on rifles greater than 3 MOA out of the box.
But I’m sure according to you, it’s all lies and Remington is perfect and everything else is crap and we are all trying to get rich. Grow up. As you can see I actually praised a recent acquisition of a Remington a few posts up. At this point, however, I wouldn’t buy a Remington I couldn’t inspect first or that wasn’t worked over by a quality Smith.
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I hope you retards bickering like this are out shooting at least and posting from your phones while the barrels cool.
I would like to know where you got this piece of info from. I know lots of gunsmiths that will work on damn near anything. Rugers, tikkas, savage, Winchester, custom actions, 700's, Ar's, 1903 Springfield's, mausers.... I find it hard to believe that a smith would say I only work on 700's.
Scott
I have come across one who would only work on 700 bolt actions. I found a different smith.
Not sure he is. That was almost 10 years ago. I wanted some work done on a Savage, and that's when I was informed of his preference.
Probly not. I don't thing he knows what gun smith means lol. I don't look for 700 smiths.
If you want to go to virtually any website and find virtually any rifle component to fit your receiver, in stock, and have virtually any gunsmith familiar (not just 'able to do it,' but familiar with, very different), then buy you a 700 and make it what you want. It's the Chevy 350 of rifle receivers. Don't buy one if you're looking for something that's gonna shoot right off the shelf. That's not its strong suit. Buy it as a blank canvas that basically every kind of paint works very well with. You guys arguing about this stuff both have a lot to learn. Each option has its strong suit. Pick which one suits you better and do your best with it.
D
Deleted member 10043
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Ya sure.
I don’t even know who’s shit you’re showing or if it’s even authentic, but it sure ain’t Frank’s.
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Well I’m surprised it took 4 pages for this to happen.
If we were all honest, and if America was a true free market economy Remington would have failed a long time ago, but they are helped by putting fees on anyone foreign and idiots with a “Buy American” mentality.
And I say this as a guy who was a hardcore Remington fan, but after getting a completely fucked 870 I mostly changed my mind, I mean it’s a shotgun how do you fuck up a tube? Remington found a way.
If we were all honest, and if America was a true free market economy Remington would have failed a long time ago, but they are helped by putting fees on anyone foreign and idiots with a “Buy American” mentality.
And I say this as a guy who was a hardcore Remington fan, but after getting a completely fucked 870 I mostly changed my mind, I mean it’s a shotgun how do you fuck up a tube? Remington found a way.
You know, I despise Remington so much even seeing two lug clone actions that are made exceptionally well immediately causes me to be turned off by a product. The new Christensen MPR for example - looks neat and seems priced about right. But...
To the original post..
I think the factory Rem 700's are a damn good option if you want a 100 yard deer rifle. Other than that, no. You have to replace everything from A-Z to make them competitive to anything else off the shelf. That isnt really "proven" imho. Just proves that everything on them is junk. When was the last time you saw any factory Remingtons win anything of merit when it comes to competitions? Ruger, Tikka, and even Savage offers much better off the shelf rifles for the entry level marksmen/hunter. It is no surprise to me, that Remington is in the state that theyre in. Sell junk, feel the consequences. Can only ride on a name for so long.
On a side note, taking nothing away from the 700 blueprint. It is a good action.
Although, 700's look nice...
I think the factory Rem 700's are a damn good option if you want a 100 yard deer rifle. Other than that, no. You have to replace everything from A-Z to make them competitive to anything else off the shelf. That isnt really "proven" imho. Just proves that everything on them is junk. When was the last time you saw any factory Remingtons win anything of merit when it comes to competitions? Ruger, Tikka, and even Savage offers much better off the shelf rifles for the entry level marksmen/hunter. It is no surprise to me, that Remington is in the state that theyre in. Sell junk, feel the consequences. Can only ride on a name for so long.
On a side note, taking nothing away from the 700 blueprint. It is a good action.
Although, 700's look nice...
Howdy all. Just swam through all this thread's BS, found it all very interesting. Who doesn't love a dick measuring contest?
I was hoping to be the first to bring it up, but Rhyno hit it here. Contrary to popular belief, the American mentality is not all gone. Dad's who grew up shooting 700's, and still have the same one their father gave them for their 12th birthday, are buying that same model for their kids today. Outdoor Life and Field and Stream have been expanding their advertising (and market) base, but the classics are still classics. Case in point, two of my (younger) cousins refuse to hunt with anything other than lever actions. Why, because they are nuts and somehow still stuck in 1894. In that market, hunting, I would predict Remington is doing, and will continue to do, fine. Winchester had some more publicly-recognized issues, which is why the 70 may have taken a hit for a few years, but as far as I know their rifles today are as adequate as any other for minute-of-deer. Whatever, not the basis of this discussion.
For myself, when I started looking for precision rifles I was open to many brands. I looked hard at Tikka, Weatherby/Howa, and even Savage to some extent. Tikka didn't offer a heavy barrel in the caliber I wanted (7mm-08), ditto for Howa, and the HCR hadn't taken off yet. My budget didn't fit a custom rig, or even rebarreling any of the above actions, and my knowledge level didn't support me building a Rem-Age on my own, although I'm looking that way for my next project. Lo and behold, I found a Frankenstein rifle, with an old-ass 700 action and a new SPS Varmint barrel, screwed into an HS stock. 900 smacks later (plus transfer and tax), it was at my LGS. It has it's quirks, but if the gunsmith had screwed the barrel on correctly I'm guessing it would be exactly perfect. It shoots lights-out with my load and I've been able to build and grow with it. I am content.
Remington, for a long while, was the "plug-and-play" action of choice for people like us. That's how my rifle came to exist in the first place, that's how probably over half the frequenters of this site got their start. They took as AAC-SD, threw it in a B&C, or HS, or KRG, and then blueprinted it, swapped the barrel, had the bolt milled and added a cool knob, etc, whatever.The "problem" I'm seeing is brands are coming out with rifles for a very specific market, in fan-boy chamberings because that's what's hot right now. How many NEW, COOL, SHINY 6.5 CM rifles have come out in the past 3-4 years? They are making success off the quick and easy route, because there is no argument that it isn't the smart route. And dammit, so are the ammo manufacturers (looking at you, Prime).
Remington made its success and name before these times. Government contracts gave it lasting credibility with the M40 and M24. From there, gunsmiths and then custom builders took the actions and made their own changes to it, to improve on what was "better" at the time. After that, it was only a matter of time until knock-off actions came about, and all of a sudden people think the original ain't what it used to be. Lest we forget, imitation is the highest form of flattery. Sure, "QC issues!" the peanut gallery cries. I understand. All things considered, that's a fairly minor fix to one of, if not the most, successful rifles and actions to date. Admittedly knowing nothing of their company leadership I would say better management, fresh idea-thinker-uppers, and a competent accountant could pull them out of their present funk.
A similar case, me thinks, could be made against Leupold. For a long time they were the star of the show. Then they lost favor among the masses as new brands came out with new products. Until very recently, people were complaining against Leupold's arguable lack of innovation, comparatively small magnification ranges, non-Tier One glass, and overall "Meh" appeal. Many other brands got their piece of the optics world with NEW SHIT. Vortex comes to mind, partially because I am a fan boy, but look at what they've put out over the past 5 years with their higher-end lines. And they are far from the only ones! Meanwhile Leupold sat, hoping the Mark 4 would carry it through. It obviously didn't, and now Leupold, recognizing that, has been expanding their line in the recent past to fill the gaps. Thermals, red dots, greater magnification ranges and some product placement with para-military alphabet-soup organizations has resurrected them from the dead. Halle-fricken-lujah.
I could go on, look at Glock. When was the last time you saw someone posting a panty-dropping pic of a factory G19 on Instagram? New Gen 5? C'mon, no one gives a shit. These days it's all about who's slide you are running, which trigger, barrel, red dot, light? Comp? Wait, you DIDN'T EVEN stipple it? Chump. "Stock" has become synonymous for "not cool," "not good enough" for the cool kids. In that wake, CZ P-10c. M&P 2.0. Silencerco. PPQ. P320, as long as you don't drop it. New offerings with new innovation providing new competition. And you know what? I'm sure Glock won't be dying anytime soon. Glocks (and sure, 1911's) became the "plug and play" of the pistol world, and yet other brands still grew up from their apparent hegemony. It is suffering the same fate as the Remington 700, but I guarantee no one will throw away a perfectly good Gen 3. If you are, let me know.
Combining these two analogies, and wrapping up this way-longer than anticipated rant, Remington provided the platform which paved the way for modern precision shooting. There's no argument against that. However, due to QC issues, a failure to stay ahead of the times, and a few failed projects that didn't meet market demands as hoped for, Remington has been, for lack of a better term, shitting the bed. New kids have taken over the block. Can Remington regain it's reign as top dog? It would be difficult, with the quality of offerings on the market today. But, like Leupold, there's still a chance to stay relevant. Because of new offerings providing more market-specific based options, is it going to go the way of the dodo by FY2019? I doubt it.
The best part? Their largest market base doesn't even know they are getting what WE think of as a second-rate rifle, so they have time to correct their mistakes.
I was hoping to be the first to bring it up, but Rhyno hit it here. Contrary to popular belief, the American mentality is not all gone. Dad's who grew up shooting 700's, and still have the same one their father gave them for their 12th birthday, are buying that same model for their kids today. Outdoor Life and Field and Stream have been expanding their advertising (and market) base, but the classics are still classics. Case in point, two of my (younger) cousins refuse to hunt with anything other than lever actions. Why, because they are nuts and somehow still stuck in 1894. In that market, hunting, I would predict Remington is doing, and will continue to do, fine. Winchester had some more publicly-recognized issues, which is why the 70 may have taken a hit for a few years, but as far as I know their rifles today are as adequate as any other for minute-of-deer. Whatever, not the basis of this discussion.
For myself, when I started looking for precision rifles I was open to many brands. I looked hard at Tikka, Weatherby/Howa, and even Savage to some extent. Tikka didn't offer a heavy barrel in the caliber I wanted (7mm-08), ditto for Howa, and the HCR hadn't taken off yet. My budget didn't fit a custom rig, or even rebarreling any of the above actions, and my knowledge level didn't support me building a Rem-Age on my own, although I'm looking that way for my next project. Lo and behold, I found a Frankenstein rifle, with an old-ass 700 action and a new SPS Varmint barrel, screwed into an HS stock. 900 smacks later (plus transfer and tax), it was at my LGS. It has it's quirks, but if the gunsmith had screwed the barrel on correctly I'm guessing it would be exactly perfect. It shoots lights-out with my load and I've been able to build and grow with it. I am content.
Remington, for a long while, was the "plug-and-play" action of choice for people like us. That's how my rifle came to exist in the first place, that's how probably over half the frequenters of this site got their start. They took as AAC-SD, threw it in a B&C, or HS, or KRG, and then blueprinted it, swapped the barrel, had the bolt milled and added a cool knob, etc, whatever.The "problem" I'm seeing is brands are coming out with rifles for a very specific market, in fan-boy chamberings because that's what's hot right now. How many NEW, COOL, SHINY 6.5 CM rifles have come out in the past 3-4 years? They are making success off the quick and easy route, because there is no argument that it isn't the smart route. And dammit, so are the ammo manufacturers (looking at you, Prime).
Remington made its success and name before these times. Government contracts gave it lasting credibility with the M40 and M24. From there, gunsmiths and then custom builders took the actions and made their own changes to it, to improve on what was "better" at the time. After that, it was only a matter of time until knock-off actions came about, and all of a sudden people think the original ain't what it used to be. Lest we forget, imitation is the highest form of flattery. Sure, "QC issues!" the peanut gallery cries. I understand. All things considered, that's a fairly minor fix to one of, if not the most, successful rifles and actions to date. Admittedly knowing nothing of their company leadership I would say better management, fresh idea-thinker-uppers, and a competent accountant could pull them out of their present funk.
A similar case, me thinks, could be made against Leupold. For a long time they were the star of the show. Then they lost favor among the masses as new brands came out with new products. Until very recently, people were complaining against Leupold's arguable lack of innovation, comparatively small magnification ranges, non-Tier One glass, and overall "Meh" appeal. Many other brands got their piece of the optics world with NEW SHIT. Vortex comes to mind, partially because I am a fan boy, but look at what they've put out over the past 5 years with their higher-end lines. And they are far from the only ones! Meanwhile Leupold sat, hoping the Mark 4 would carry it through. It obviously didn't, and now Leupold, recognizing that, has been expanding their line in the recent past to fill the gaps. Thermals, red dots, greater magnification ranges and some product placement with para-military alphabet-soup organizations has resurrected them from the dead. Halle-fricken-lujah.
I could go on, look at Glock. When was the last time you saw someone posting a panty-dropping pic of a factory G19 on Instagram? New Gen 5? C'mon, no one gives a shit. These days it's all about who's slide you are running, which trigger, barrel, red dot, light? Comp? Wait, you DIDN'T EVEN stipple it? Chump. "Stock" has become synonymous for "not cool," "not good enough" for the cool kids. In that wake, CZ P-10c. M&P 2.0. Silencerco. PPQ. P320, as long as you don't drop it. New offerings with new innovation providing new competition. And you know what? I'm sure Glock won't be dying anytime soon. Glocks (and sure, 1911's) became the "plug and play" of the pistol world, and yet other brands still grew up from their apparent hegemony. It is suffering the same fate as the Remington 700, but I guarantee no one will throw away a perfectly good Gen 3. If you are, let me know.
Combining these two analogies, and wrapping up this way-longer than anticipated rant, Remington provided the platform which paved the way for modern precision shooting. There's no argument against that. However, due to QC issues, a failure to stay ahead of the times, and a few failed projects that didn't meet market demands as hoped for, Remington has been, for lack of a better term, shitting the bed. New kids have taken over the block. Can Remington regain it's reign as top dog? It would be difficult, with the quality of offerings on the market today. But, like Leupold, there's still a chance to stay relevant. Because of new offerings providing more market-specific based options, is it going to go the way of the dodo by FY2019? I doubt it.
The best part? Their largest market base doesn't even know they are getting what WE think of as a second-rate rifle, so they have time to correct their mistakes.
I don't know how it looks going forward. Personally, I'm more inclined to try a Ruger American than a M700 for a "budget" piece together build. For a factory rifle I look to Tikka or Sako. However, I think the M700 still leads in the aftermarket. Tikka, Ruger, Howa, etc.. I think are catching up, though.
well said boyscout.
i keep choosing the 700 because there is so much available for it right now, as in i need something quick and gotta run to the LGS and get a full length rail, right now. people will say and have said in this thread, "but is that really a reason to keep using the 700?" umm...yes, absolutely. parts availability is a viable reason for any hobby. "it's a waste of money to upgrade it!". well, i'd be spending more money to buy another T4 in tikka, and KRG, and scope rails and triggers, when i already have that stuff for the 700 SA. plus, every time i pull the trigger, it's a $1. so this whole hobby is a waste of money.
all of he chassis i have are SA 700 (couple T4s, KRG W3, soon to be xray). i have extra rails, triggers, a few barreled actions in different configurations. if i feel like swapping something, it's pretty easy. i have been considering going to tikka, but for me to retool everything it would be too much money, AGAIN lol.
on the other hand, my wife wanted a 30-06. with out question i got her the tikka i mentioned earlier. i don't have any 700 long action stuff, and she wants it light as possible, so she has no plans to upgrade the stock in the near future.
i'm not a 700 fan boy or am i trying to defend the 700. this is just my experience. if i was just starting out now, i'd be going tikka. 6 years ago when i was getting into this hobby, the 5R was the shit. "drop that bitch into a mcree and throw a pst on it and you'll be good to go!" they said. now, PSTs are junk, mcree sucks, and the 5R is a joke lol. i think that has more to do with the evolution of the hobby, this site, and the products.
adding to what others have said already, the 700 will be around for a long time due to it's core demographic, the fudds. i was at the range on sunday, the day before rifle season in PA. as long as the rifle hits a pie plate at 100 yards, it's good to go for the fudds. "look at that! i put 2 bullets in the same hole!" and then he stopped shooting. umm... what about all of the other hits that give you a 5" group??? mean while, he was 2" high and 3" left with his "2 bullet hole" pure luck group.
i keep choosing the 700 because there is so much available for it right now, as in i need something quick and gotta run to the LGS and get a full length rail, right now. people will say and have said in this thread, "but is that really a reason to keep using the 700?" umm...yes, absolutely. parts availability is a viable reason for any hobby. "it's a waste of money to upgrade it!". well, i'd be spending more money to buy another T4 in tikka, and KRG, and scope rails and triggers, when i already have that stuff for the 700 SA. plus, every time i pull the trigger, it's a $1. so this whole hobby is a waste of money.
all of he chassis i have are SA 700 (couple T4s, KRG W3, soon to be xray). i have extra rails, triggers, a few barreled actions in different configurations. if i feel like swapping something, it's pretty easy. i have been considering going to tikka, but for me to retool everything it would be too much money, AGAIN lol.
on the other hand, my wife wanted a 30-06. with out question i got her the tikka i mentioned earlier. i don't have any 700 long action stuff, and she wants it light as possible, so she has no plans to upgrade the stock in the near future.
i'm not a 700 fan boy or am i trying to defend the 700. this is just my experience. if i was just starting out now, i'd be going tikka. 6 years ago when i was getting into this hobby, the 5R was the shit. "drop that bitch into a mcree and throw a pst on it and you'll be good to go!" they said. now, PSTs are junk, mcree sucks, and the 5R is a joke lol. i think that has more to do with the evolution of the hobby, this site, and the products.
adding to what others have said already, the 700 will be around for a long time due to it's core demographic, the fudds. i was at the range on sunday, the day before rifle season in PA. as long as the rifle hits a pie plate at 100 yards, it's good to go for the fudds. "look at that! i put 2 bullets in the same hole!" and then he stopped shooting. umm... what about all of the other hits that give you a 5" group??? mean while, he was 2" high and 3" left with his "2 bullet hole" pure luck group.
This is the real truth here. For every 1 member on the hide who is an avid precision rifle shooter and looking to put 5 shots into a sub 1/2" hole, there are dozens (if not hundreds) of other gun owners who just want to shoot a plain rifle a couple times a year or so. To these shooters who don't spend countless hours researching on the forums, buying a 5R 700 with a threaded bolt knob and muzzle is the cream of the crop There's absolutely nothing wrong with this, its just what it is.
Ah, the Fudd's. These are the same people that get onto me about shooting elk over 400 yards. They say it's unethical. I say, it sure is when you only pull out your rifle once a year to make sure it hits a pie plate. Indeed, they will continue to buy Remington.
Remington can’t even get the little things right, things that I assume wouldn’t take much to fix but they refuse to do so.
bolt handle engaging the extraction cam, I don’t think I’ve ever seen one that does (though I haven’t looked at older ones besides my 40x 22)
primer cratering, have they always done this? Can’t imagine it would take a whole lot to implement a fix for this.
Triggers
Throats, quit making them a mile long.
bolt handle engaging the extraction cam, I don’t think I’ve ever seen one that does (though I haven’t looked at older ones besides my 40x 22)
primer cratering, have they always done this? Can’t imagine it would take a whole lot to implement a fix for this.
Triggers
Throats, quit making them a mile long.
You're implying that Remington's issues are due primarily to a lack of innovation. I would disagree with that, although I think your points about Leupold and Glock are all solid. But the reason Leupold and Glock aren't near bankruptcy is because they don't have the same issues as Remington. Remington is failing because they've failed to innovate AND because competitors have come out with guns that perform better, are made to higher quality standards, and are less expensive. You can't say the same about the last 3 for Glock and Leupold. Glock and Leupold have both upheld their end of the bargain on the quality front, and they're doing just fine. Sure, they don't have the same market share as they used to. But that's because of their lack of innovation. Neither are nearing bankruptcy because of that.
Give me any $300 Remington and I'll show you a $300 Savage or Ruger that shoots better, probably has a better trigger, has much better overall build quality, and has less reliability issues. Honestly, I'd prefer a $300 Mossberg to a $300 Remington (unless you're only buying a receiver to build with, which is unnecessary with today's factory offerings). Same at $500 with a mid-level Savage or low-end Tikka. Give me a Remington at anything above $800 and the Tikka CTR is superior in every way possible. At no price point is Remington tops in performance, build quality, or reliability (much less all three). Capitalism favors those who offer the best product at the best price. When you fail to offer a good product or a good price, you're going to be left behind. And Remington is finding that out the hard way.
All good points. In fact, it’s almost a question of “who doesn’t make a better factory rifle today than Remington?” Mossburg?
Now that there is a real possibility that Remington will default, will the 700 start to slip into oblivion? If Remington goes under, and nobody purchases them, what is the fate of the 700? I suppose the clones will keep the aftermarket alive and the countless 700s on the market will still be there.
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Maybe the Remington big brains don't give a shit because they're about to unveil their version of the x-ray gun from the movie Eraser. And corner the defense market.
All bs aside from QC issues they need to update their barrel twists in the worst way for some of the product line up for starters.
Mismanagement tends to piss off the workers also so when nobody cares about them they stop caring about the company and the work, and shit flows out the factory door.
Best business plans and expertise can fall on their face when nobody likes you. A market share of people that want everything for nothing isn't good either since you can only cut corners so much too keep people happy until it bites back.
Maybe Remington is to big to just vanish overnight but the Mauser was once the go too action for builds as well but times changed. Maybe Remington is starting down that dusty trail as well.
All bs aside from QC issues they need to update their barrel twists in the worst way for some of the product line up for starters.
Mismanagement tends to piss off the workers also so when nobody cares about them they stop caring about the company and the work, and shit flows out the factory door.
Best business plans and expertise can fall on their face when nobody likes you. A market share of people that want everything for nothing isn't good either since you can only cut corners so much too keep people happy until it bites back.
Maybe Remington is to big to just vanish overnight but the Mauser was once the go too action for builds as well but times changed. Maybe Remington is starting down that dusty trail as well.
Just picked up a new to me Remington 700 5 digit receiver in pristine shape yesterday.....
when Im done I will have a rifle you wont be able to buy COTS and anyone here would likely lust for.
The key is to Remove Remington from the equation, which as noted questions what the future of Remington is and who buys these things at Dick's.
"We" are not Remingtons "counter sales" customer typically and what Remington provides will shoot better than most of "Us" as well as the typical "counter sales" customer.
Remington is trying to meet a price point for the "counter customer" that needs a rifle for a limited hunting season period than will sight in at some point during the year.
What they are failing to respond to is that hunting is unfortunately becoming a dying "want" for buying a rifle, especially here in the northeast. In the 6-7 years Ive been back interested in guns everything has moved to precision shooting. Over that time Ive seen members at my local club invest heavily in high end gear that would only be seen on line, never available for sale locally.
Remington needs to move its focus from hunting to precision and perhaps other action shooting events.
If they realized this was the future you would think they would build a rifle with a decent mag fed system.
Yesterday I tried to buy some small parts from their website to take advantage of their 35% sale. Some parts I needed like an R700 ejector and some trigger/sear pins were not on the website so I tried to call in my order. I was on hold for over 5 minutes. When the sales operator answered I was told that if items were not on the website that meant they were not in stock (trigger pins for an R700 not in stock?). I asked if I could order what was in stock and backorder what wasn't in stock and I was told not in stock items wont get the 35% discount. I said that would be fine Ill pay full price for the out of stock/backordered items. Than I was told that in order to get the 35% discount I had to order my parts on line.
A company with cash issues cant afford that type of stupid.
As you guys hate on Remington please keep me in mind as Ill buy all your 5 digit, 6 digit, C and E receivers you want to divest yourselves of. Aesthetics matter and to me the Remington receiver is clean and functional design. I especially like those pre 1968 bolt handles with their more "elegant" less cast industrial look.
when Im done I will have a rifle you wont be able to buy COTS and anyone here would likely lust for.
The key is to Remove Remington from the equation, which as noted questions what the future of Remington is and who buys these things at Dick's.
"We" are not Remingtons "counter sales" customer typically and what Remington provides will shoot better than most of "Us" as well as the typical "counter sales" customer.
Remington is trying to meet a price point for the "counter customer" that needs a rifle for a limited hunting season period than will sight in at some point during the year.
What they are failing to respond to is that hunting is unfortunately becoming a dying "want" for buying a rifle, especially here in the northeast. In the 6-7 years Ive been back interested in guns everything has moved to precision shooting. Over that time Ive seen members at my local club invest heavily in high end gear that would only be seen on line, never available for sale locally.
Remington needs to move its focus from hunting to precision and perhaps other action shooting events.
If they realized this was the future you would think they would build a rifle with a decent mag fed system.
Yesterday I tried to buy some small parts from their website to take advantage of their 35% sale. Some parts I needed like an R700 ejector and some trigger/sear pins were not on the website so I tried to call in my order. I was on hold for over 5 minutes. When the sales operator answered I was told that if items were not on the website that meant they were not in stock (trigger pins for an R700 not in stock?). I asked if I could order what was in stock and backorder what wasn't in stock and I was told not in stock items wont get the 35% discount. I said that would be fine Ill pay full price for the out of stock/backordered items. Than I was told that in order to get the 35% discount I had to order my parts on line.
A company with cash issues cant afford that type of stupid.
As you guys hate on Remington please keep me in mind as Ill buy all your 5 digit, 6 digit, C and E receivers you want to divest yourselves of. Aesthetics matter and to me the Remington receiver is clean and functional design. I especially like those pre 1968 bolt handles with their more "elegant" less cast industrial look.
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I don't know anything about the meaning of how many digits are on a serial number or letter prefixes/suffixes, so I avoid them all and buy something else to be safe.
Three Howas in a row since 2000, three damned good shooters that needed nothing done except turning a screw on the trigger housing to lighten up the force needed to break the shot.
Three Howas in a row since 2000, three damned good shooters that needed nothing done except turning a screw on the trigger housing to lighten up the force needed to break the shot.
I have had about a dozen great shooting 700s go through my hands since then. All shot great with stock triggers a couple XM, a couple XMP, and a couple 40x triggers. Guess how many screws you adjust for pull weight on all of them. I will give you a clue, less than 2 and more than 0.
Yeah I think we are close to a situation you could argue that Remington is the worst out of the box budget rifle made currently in the USA Today.
savage? A little better I think.
Thomspon Center? Enormously superior machine work, and completely under utilized by the maker to try to snag some of our market
ruger american? Not a bad gun actually. Way more innovative than the 700
mossburg? Some nice features, a little clunky. Shoots good
savage? A little better I think.
Thomspon Center? Enormously superior machine work, and completely under utilized by the maker to try to snag some of our market
ruger american? Not a bad gun actually. Way more innovative than the 700
mossburg? Some nice features, a little clunky. Shoots good
Why would you buy a 700 today?
I like the Remington 700 actions...
But what would I know ?
Mike R.
Tac Ops
I like the Remington 700 actions...
But what would I know ?
Mike R.
Tac Ops
With all due respect, the point isn't what can be done by sinking $$$$$ into them. The point is what they are when you buy them, today.
There are other options, that cost the same or less, that need nothing (or hardly anything) done to them so they perform like they should.
With all due respect, the point isn't what can be done by sinking $$$$$ into them. The point is what they are when you buy them, today......
Your comment is Noted Johnny ( I only used Johnny cause I don't know your name and I think Johnny is a super cool name ) but to be HONEST I have been building platforms for 35 years and have seen a thing ( I say this being HUMBLE and Respectful ) or two. NOT to mention any of the HIGH End action Manufactures here in this thread but believe me I have seen them out of spec as well and for THE Money one is spending their hard earned coin on that's Not cool either. Has Remington lost a little of their attention to detail with said Product especially the 700 platforms? Yeah but I have also seen it on others as well.
Just my 2 cents about rifles and THINGS...
Mike R.
Tac OPs
Your comment is Noted Johnny ( I only used Johnny cause I don't know your name and I think Johnny is a super cool name ) but to be HONEST I have been building platforms for 35 years and have seen a thing ( I say this being HUMBLE and Respectful ) or two. NOT to mention any of the HIGH End action Manufactures here in this thread but believe me I have seen them out of spec as well and for THE Money one is spending their hard earned coin on that's Not cool either. Has Remington lost a little of their attention to detail with said Product especially the 700 platforms? Yeah but I have also seen it on others as well.
Just my 2 cents about rifles and THINGS...
Mike R.
Tac OPs
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