Trump is back…the “Now What” thread

[Mr.BR]

i don't know the details, but i did read that the tariff rates may include vat fees that are not reported as tariffs, but are an additional tax on imports.
when i lived in the uk, people would get mad at me if I didn't load up on duty free goods when i traveled back and forth.

VAT is taxed on all products imported or not, Trump tarif scale is some black magic . closest to those numbers are trade deficits with each country

Honestly you would not want to onshore most of cheap shit made in asia.

 

[BCP]

The tariff is paid by the business doing the importing. So for example, when Apple imports its iPhones and MacBooks and so on, Apple would pay a tariff to the US government. This then becomes a cost of the goods sold.

It affects prices every bit as much as a rise in the price of raw materials. Whether the consumer pays it or not is a little more complicated, but the cost will be mostly passed on to the consumer.




The hope is that Apple will decide that the cost of importing iPhones with the tariff is too great and open up factories in the US with captive workers who commit suicide by jumping out of windows . . .

Is that a likely outcome? We'll see.

The hope is also that other countries will lower their own tariffs to our US produced goods. Again, is that a likely outcome? We'll see. In the case of China, I am not sure it matters much. The reason for the huge trade imbalance is that there is not much domestic demand in China. They manufacture for export. They would be selling domestically to their own citizens if the demand was there. Lowering tariffs on US goods is not likely to spur a huge amount of demand in China for US goods.

So is lowering of Chinese tariffs on US goods even a desired outcome?

Then there is currency manipulation, failure to protect US intellectual property rights, etc. Maybe the tariffs will result in favorable outcomes on some of those issues.

If you read the fine print his tariffs aren't really that big of a deal because there's lots of exemptions, the mexican->usa stuff is largely exempt. The democrat media driven hysteria is the bigger issue.

 

[Longshot231]

Some rich folks are in a panic cause the stock prices are dropping. I hope that they don't have enough votes to override a veto.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-senators-seek-rein-trump-tariff-authority-2025-04-03/

 

[Mr.BR]

Some rich folks are in a panic cause the stock prices are dropping. I hope that they don't have enough votes to override a veto.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-senators-seek-rein-trump-tariff-authority-2025-04-03/

I think those are mostly plebs and funds panic dumping ,moneyed folks were pulling together mountains of cash for months to buy at the bottom as the whole tariff show was quite foreseeable.

Congress critters have home base spooked by potential impact.
Grassley's home state of Iowa is heavily dependent on farm crop exports, while Cantwell's Washington state is home to many export-heavy companies like Boeing .

 

[stevieb92]

Reciprocal tariffs literally are designed to get rid of tariffs, not to perpetuate them. Thus, those who claim that tariffs are bad as a general concept have no credibility in this debate since they are and have been perfectly fine with the world placing massive tariffs (as well as non-tariff trade barriers) on U.S. goods for decades. If you're against tariffs, fine. If you're for tariffs, fine. But you can't reasonably be opposed to U.S. tariffs but also fine with large global tariffs. In other words, it makes no sense that U.S. tariffs, and only U.S. tariffs, are bad.

 

[Malum Prohibitum]

Reciprocal tariffs literally are designed to get rid of tariffs, not to perpetuate them. Thus, those who claim that tariffs are bad as a general concept have no credibility in this debate since they are and have been perfectly fine with the world placing massive tariffs (as well as non-tariff trade barriers) on U.S. goods for decades. If you're against tariffs, fine. If you're for tariffs, fine. But you can't reasonably be opposed to U.S. tariffs but also fine with large global tariffs. In other words, it makes no sense that U.S. tariffs, and only U.S. tariffs, are bad.

Doesn't that assume that they exist in the first place?

Did you read Mr. BR's post # 2248?

Even if all tariffs on US goods abroad are lifted i do not think it will change trade flows much , the chart with Tarrifs Trump showed was absolute BS , those tarif numbers someone pulled out of their ass. there is no 39% tarrif on US goods in EU , that is the trade deficit ,

From my business importing shit from and to US there is no tarif higher than 3-4% i ever paid.
''The World Trade Organization says the EU's average tariff rate is 5.0%, while the Commission says the average tariff on goods traded between the EU and the U.S. is about 1% for both sides''

 

[theLBC]

 

[W54/XM-388]

Reciprocal tariffs literally are designed to get rid of tariffs, not to perpetuate them. Thus, those who claim that tariffs are bad as a general concept have no credibility in this debate since they are and have been perfectly fine with the world placing massive tariffs (as well as non-tariff trade barriers) on U.S. goods for decades. If you're against tariffs, fine. If you're for tariffs, fine. But you can't reasonably be opposed to U.S. tariffs but also fine with large global tariffs. In other words, it makes no sense that U.S. tariffs, and only U.S. tariffs, are bad.

I hate to break it to you and your love of Trump

BUT you are deceived and are propagandized.

It has been proven that the "tariffs" numbers actually have little to nothing to do with actual real "tariffs" charged by other countries.

Instead it has been proven (and even admitted to by the brain trust Trump is all listening to) that actually they are putting tariffs on countries based on us buying more from them than they buy from us.

You are being essentially lied to.

You are being told "it's because they tariff us" when in actuality it's because they didn't buy enough stuff from us and Trump has some stupid idea that you can have a zero sum trade balance. (Maybe other countries should just start tariffing Microsoft, IBM, google (just claim their islands ownership hack is invalid and they are what they always were, a USA corporation), Meta and Oracle and see how fast Trump and his team get the message).

 

[stevieb92]

I hate to break it to you and your love of Trump

BUT you are deceived and are propagandized.

It has been proven that the "tariffs" numbers actually have little to nothing to do with actual real "tariffs" charged by other countries.

Instead it has been proven (and even admitted to by the brain trust Trump is all listening to) that actually they are putting tariffs on countries based on us buying more from them than they buy from us.

You are being essentially lied to.

You are being told "it's because they tariff us" when in actuality it's because they didn't buy enough stuff from us and Trump has some stupid idea that you can have a zero sum trade balance. (Maybe other countries should just start tariffing Microsoft, IBM, google (just claim their islands ownership hack is invalid and they are what they always were, a USA corporation), Meta and Oracle and see how fast Trump and his team get the message).

Don't love Trump, but I love what he's doing. So, you can go kiss my hairy, white ass with your BS. Orange man bad, right?

 

[theLBC]

 

[theLBC]

 

[Malum Prohibitum]

I do not have any problem with getting tough on foreign nations who abuse trade policies with punishing tariffs and currency manipulation, theft of IP, etc.

But are we going to keep pretending that the EU has a 39% tariff on imported US goods just because President Trump claimed that it is true? Am I not a good and loyal American if I point to that and say, "Hey, wait a minute. That is not true." Am I prohibited from pointing out a false statement because I voted for him?

 

[Mr.BR]

I hate to break it to you and your love of Trump

BUT you are deceived and are propagandized.

It has been proven that the "tariffs" numbers actually have little to nothing to do with actual real "tariffs" charged by other countries.

Instead it has been proven (and even admitted to by the brain trust Trump is all listening to) that actually they are putting tariffs on countries based on us buying more from them than they buy from us.

You are being essentially lied to.

You are being told "it's because they tariff us" when in actuality it's because they didn't buy enough stuff from us and Trump has some stupid idea that you can have a zero sum trade balance. (Maybe other countries should just start tariffing Microsoft, IBM, google (just claim their islands ownership hack is invalid and they are what they always were, a USA corporation), Meta and Oracle and see how fast Trump and his team get the message).

Exactly the tariff list seems to be based on trade imbalances with said countries and has little to nothing to do with countries tarrifing US products , with some exemptions like China.

While yes these tariffs are meant to pressure onshoring first and foremost US companies that offshored and maybe automakers that are already making cars in US, but frankly aside from higer added value stuff you do not realy want to onshore cheap shit , toxic stuff , manual labor intensive shit, that for example Vietnam makes due to having massively cheaper workforce and even laxer regulations than china. Its not like Amish want to pay for clothes and shoes made in US .

Some of these trade imbalances are also quite phoney , like for example Ireland is some massive exporter to US , but really its just US corporations Microsoft, Google ,Meta using Ireland like Tax haven inside EU to cycle profits on service back to US, Ireland is kinda European Delaware for the tech giants. But its like TikTok has to have a US incorporated entity similar way EU requires EU incorporated branches for complianc eand shit.

Sure there are trade barriers like for US farm products , but much of that has to do with GMOs that are not permited in EU food , or peroxide bathed meat and poultry doped up on antibiotics and growth hormones , banned in EU ,this is actualy what Kennedy is trying to change to bring Food standards higher, but Trump always forced this shit to be accepted by other markets.

Similary with autoindustry ,most of US manufacturers do no manufacture EU compliant cars in US, Biggest US exporter to EU is Tesla shipping out of China and tarrifed as Chinese made car .


I expect most of these tarrifs will be shortlived , never come into effect or end up watered down massively by exemptions for minimal consesions, seriously what can 90% tariffs Vietnam offer ? transfer a sweat shop or two to Oklahoma to shorten the Amish supply chain for Kanye swastika shirts?


Tariffs table is absolute BS and someone made it with AI or something as it lists non populated islands as tarif targets due to unfair tariffs probably imposed by local Penguins


They didn't actually calculate tariff rates + non-tariff barriers, as they say they did. Instead, for every country, they just took our trade deficit with that country and divided it by the country's exports to us.

So we have a $17.9 billion trade deficit with Indonesia. Its exports to us are $28 billion. $17.9/$28 = 64%, which Trump claims is the tariff rate Indonesia charges us. What extraordinary nonsense this is.

 

[Edsel]

VERY unusual for Sachs to appear on Napolitano’s program twice in a week.

Because, Economist.

Though Norton’s unabashadly a Leftist / Socialist, all of his articles are always well - researched and verifiable with some work.

Also because, Economist.

If to be believed, his article explaining the math behind justifying our tariff methods is indeed laughable and makes us look like absolute imbeciles…

But, of course - we’ll continue cheerleading and standing behind our man



Also, penguins

 

[Mr.BR]

I would suggest Trump asks Musk for some DOGE folks , because this is beyond embarrassing .

 

[Edsel]

 

[theLBC]

but your tariffs don't?
oh no! kick us out!

 

[theLBC]

 

[gigamortis]

Wall Street and all their connected cronies made multitudes of riches by offshoring manufacturing labor, which screwed our middle class. A drawn down domestic manufacturing base further weakens our national sovereignty since we have to depend on potential enemies for essential goods.

I don't care how much Wall Street cries about tariffs. They are only crying because their gravy train wallets are finally going to get hit. Most of their obscene gains came about by screwing the middle class under the guise of globalism. Its time to build the middle class back up in the USA with domestic manufacturing opportunities.

I don't care if I have to pay a little more for something domestically produced. At least I won't be helping our adversaries gain an advantage over us to weaken us even more.

 

[Govt Mule]

Even if all tariffs on US goods abroad are lifted i do not think it will change trade flows much , the chart with Tarrifs Trump showed was absolute BS , those tarif numbers someone pulled out of their ass. there is no 39% tarrif on US goods in EU , that is the trade deficit ,

From my business importing shit from and to US there is no tarif higher than 3-4% i ever paid.
''The World Trade Organization says the EU's average tariff rate is 5.0%, while the Commission says the average tariff on goods traded between the EU and the U.S. is about 1% for both sides''

The objective is not to eliminate the trade imbalance with other countries , but to make companies that have left for cheap labor in other countries (China being the biggest), feel the pain of those tariffs and bring manufacturing back to the US. When you look at how China controls the manufacturing of drugs that we use daily, they have us by the short hairs if we go to war with them. The US is the largest consumer of goods around the world. Why should other countries reap the benefits of what we consume.

I will still buy good Scotch from Isley and good red wines from France because they have the best versions of that for my taste buds.

 

[Mr.BR]

The objective is not to eliminate the trade imbalance with other countries , but to make companies that have left for cheap labor in other countries (China being the biggest), feel the pain of those tariffs and bring manufacturing back to the US. When you look at how China controls the manufacturing of drugs that we use daily, they have us by the short hairs if we go to war with them. The US is the largest consumer of goods around the world. Why should other countries reap the benefits of what we consume.

I will still buy good Scotch from Isley and good red wines from France because they have the best versions of that for my taste buds.

I get that , but honestly you do not want most of offshored jobs back ,you are not willing to pay the price nor have your son or daughter doing that job.

Whole idea someone is taking advantage of US is ludicrous , US made the whole system by which others have to play , but rent seeking elites also financialised the economy to a massive degree, and there is no way back from that.

I think Trump might be in process of kneecaping own admin , republicans will lose narrow mayority for no good reason to democrats that have no plan or ideas , now they litleraly just have to sit tight and wait for Republican bodies to flow down the river.

Tarrif impact on US consumer will be immediate , on shoring to US even in best case would take years and it will be mostly industries that can afford it . Like Apple could have always made phones in US , but chose not to , maximises investors returns. Nike amish line of products might not be doable in US , Or will degenerate into a deal Italians are running , they have factories in Italy making designer brands , but labor is imported from China , so basicaly a chinese sweatshop just incorporated in Italy.
Most of US cars made in mexico are not made there for any othe reason that to cut cost ,mexico is cheaper than china ,it seems automanufacturers require such cheap labor to get you price you want in the show room .

And when you see new onshored factory it might turn out to be like new BYD ,factory with minimal workforce all automated.

In any case its good time to be a lobbyist , anyone with access to Trump circle will be cashing in millions on these tarrif deals.

 

[Edsel]

Is there ANYTHING which can explain this?

Perhaps something we’re failing to understand, maybe some reasoning that only those “in the know” can justify?

Trying to rationalize this.