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Rifle Scopes Val has made the IOR Recon even better
- Thread starter phillip61
- Start date
The Hide remembers more than an elephant at Pepridge Farms eating Ginko Biloba...
Hi,
Ok so let me get this straight....guy in the video is talking about how much "better" this version is and THEN at the end of the video he says he has not even used it yet........
How can he say how good or bad anything is unless he falls into the category of knowledge by association instead of knowledge by application....
Sincerely,
Theis
Ok so let me get this straight....guy in the video is talking about how much "better" this version is and THEN at the end of the video he says he has not even used it yet........
How can he say how good or bad anything is unless he falls into the category of knowledge by association instead of knowledge by application....
Sincerely,
Theis
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Frank is going to be so excited about this release 
Spec wise and glass wise IOR/Valdada is usually pretty impressive, it's the tracking and reliability that suffer traditionally. In the video at the 1:05 spot Paul begins to talk about "it doesn't matter how big this objective is, the light has to get from this end [front objective] to this end [rear objective/ocular], the glass in this tube and the size of this tube is what determines the quality of the picture you actually see..." well it does matter how big the objective is in regard to light gathering ability, the size of the tube has nothing to do with how much light the scope can transmit which is a common fallacy I've often heard, in fact, my last trip to the range I was talking with a guy who was interested in buying the Valdada 4-28x50 Recon and raving about it's 40mm tube, I tried to share there were better scopes that have a better track record but for him, it was the 40mm tube that sealed the deal.
I like that the scope is only 13.75" long and surprisingly weighs less than a TT525P and just a hair over the ZC527. Yes, it's impressive that it has 44 mils of adjustment, but if it doesn't track true that won't mean very much to the ELR crowd. I would be curious why Val decided to go with a 6.25 erector instead of the 7x erector in the 4-28, but nice to see they improved the finish, gave it a 56mm objective (almost wish he would have given it 72mm since Hensoldt discontinued the Hubble). I've met Val a couple times when his shop was up in Denver and he was always really nice and helpful, I might see if I can't convince him to loan me a scope for a review as I'd love to see an IOR worthy of praise here on the Hide.
Here's a link for specs: http://www.valdada.com/valdada-4-8-30x56-40mm-recon-g-2-ffp-mil-mil/
So it appears this scope is not made by IOR, they mentioned Japan and I can't help but think possibly LOW? Also, the front objective is Japanese glass but the rest is Schott, that is an interesting decision and apparently was chosen to keep the cost down. German glass definitely tends to be warmer than Japanese glass (not sure why but I have observed this as well) and Val says the blend brings the color somewhere in between.
Spec wise and glass wise IOR/Valdada is usually pretty impressive, it's the tracking and reliability that suffer traditionally. In the video at the 1:05 spot Paul begins to talk about "it doesn't matter how big this objective is, the light has to get from this end [front objective] to this end [rear objective/ocular], the glass in this tube and the size of this tube is what determines the quality of the picture you actually see..." well it does matter how big the objective is in regard to light gathering ability, the size of the tube has nothing to do with how much light the scope can transmit which is a common fallacy I've often heard, in fact, my last trip to the range I was talking with a guy who was interested in buying the Valdada 4-28x50 Recon and raving about it's 40mm tube, I tried to share there were better scopes that have a better track record but for him, it was the 40mm tube that sealed the deal.
I like that the scope is only 13.75" long and surprisingly weighs less than a TT525P and just a hair over the ZC527. Yes, it's impressive that it has 44 mils of adjustment, but if it doesn't track true that won't mean very much to the ELR crowd. I would be curious why Val decided to go with a 6.25 erector instead of the 7x erector in the 4-28, but nice to see they improved the finish, gave it a 56mm objective (almost wish he would have given it 72mm since Hensoldt discontinued the Hubble). I've met Val a couple times when his shop was up in Denver and he was always really nice and helpful, I might see if I can't convince him to loan me a scope for a review as I'd love to see an IOR worthy of praise here on the Hide.
Here's a link for specs: http://www.valdada.com/valdada-4-8-30x56-40mm-recon-g-2-ffp-mil-mil/
So it appears this scope is not made by IOR, they mentioned Japan and I can't help but think possibly LOW? Also, the front objective is Japanese glass but the rest is Schott, that is an interesting decision and apparently was chosen to keep the cost down. German glass definitely tends to be warmer than Japanese glass (not sure why but I have observed this as well) and Val says the blend brings the color somewhere in between.
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The first one scored a perfect score in mechanical reliability in the great scope shootout done a few years back, so knowing that I've never found or read one bad review of the first one, I can only think this one will be just as good. Seeing as my new rifle will be ready in a few weeks and there is no wait time on these, I believe I am about to buy one of these bad boys.
Hi,
Per YouTube that video was published Jan 17, 2018 but Paul says estimated delivery is expected to be April/May of next year, so that would equate to a little wait time.....
Sincerely,
Theis
Paul couldn’t find his own ass with both hands.Frank is going to be so excited about this release
Spec wise and glass wise IOR/Valdada is usually pretty impressive, it's the tracking and reliability that suffer traditionally. In the video at the 1:05 spot Paul begins to talk about "it doesn't matter how big this objective is, the light has to get from this end [front objective] to this end [rear objective/ocular], the glass in this tube and the size of this tube is what determines the quality of the picture you actually see..." well it does matter how big the objective is in regard to light gathering ability, the size of the tube has nothing to do with how much light the scope can transmit which is a common fallacy I've often heard, in fact, my last trip to the range I was talking with a guy who was interested in buying the Valdada 4-28x50 Recon and raving about it's 40mm tube, I tried to share there were better scopes that have a better track record but for him, it was the 40mm tube that sealed the deal.
I like that the scope is only 13.75" long and surprisingly weighs less than a TT525P and just a hair over the ZC527. Yes, it's impressive that it has 44 mils of adjustment, but if it doesn't track true that won't mean very much to the ELR crowd. I would be curious why Val decided to go with a 6.25 erector instead of the 7x erector in the 4-28, but nice to see they improved the finish, gave it a 56mm objective (almost wish he would have given it 72mm since Hensoldt discontinued the Hubble). I've met Val a couple times when his shop was up in Denver and he was always really nice and helpful, I might see if I can't convince him to loan me a scope for a review as I'd love to see an IOR worthy of praise here on the Hide.
Here's a link for specs: http://www.valdada.com/valdada-4-8-30x56-40mm-recon-g-2-ffp-mil-mil/
So it appears this scope is not made by IOR, they mentioned Japan and I can't but think possibly LOW? Also, the front objective is Japanese glass but the rest is Schott, that is an interesting decision and apparently was chosen to keep the cost down.
Hi,
So a video in January that "he" made stated April/May of next year but they are ready for DELIVERY (Not sale) with no wait time?
Sincerely,
Theis
So a video in January that "he" made stated April/May of next year but they are ready for DELIVERY (Not sale) with no wait time?
Sincerely,
Theis
I had a chance to play with all the controls on that scope at Shot.
It definitely gave me a far more pleasing impression than any other IOR I've played with before. The turrets were superb.
Maybe this one will break the curse??!!
It definitely gave me a far more pleasing impression than any other IOR I've played with before. The turrets were superb.
Maybe this one will break the curse??!!
If it was already the best thing since sliced bread, why change almost everything about it including where it's made? ?
Maybe you should repost that test again. You know damn well it was the one with inconclusive results you brought up last time. If they can't get repeatable results from a test. It means their results are useless.
How does a storied optics manufacturer make their flagship even better? Get someone else to make it. Brilliant!
Its not an IOR , but Vals project ,Valdada is Vals brand that sells whatever they want , same japanese company makes the Vortex, Delta Optical Stryker and bunch of others so would expect similar quality , 40mm tube in IOR makes it easyer to make robust mechanism (40mm IORs do not fail much and are very popular on 50cal rigs in Europe ) , the japanese probably don't need 40 mm tube to make the scope work but it makes things easyer and aids in geting 42mil elevation travel , has nothing to do with optical quality .
IOR's bad rep is more or less down to a pair of tactical models that were definetly bad .
40mm models were a step back to fix their tactical scopes , it seems they couldnt figure out the solution for older 35mm ,IOR 40mm scopes are from technical stand point primitive but because of direct paralax drive and lots of space for mechanical parts easy to make reliable .
But like i said on Big 50cal rigs IOR is qute a contender (in Europe probably 1/3 of the 50cals and many ELR rigs are run with IOR 40mm scopes because they handle recoil well and offer lots of elevation) in BR scene its 36x42 Competiton model became a benchmark against which people test BR scopes on the scopechecker as its considered second only to 'frozen' scopes in terms of POI holding and was used to win Supershot more than once. interestingly recent testing on scopecheckers completely dislodged March as the scope to beat in BR (March raison d'être), new reigning king seems to Khales 10-50 (sucks opticaly) , while NF (some of the best glass)are being masacred wholesale .
IOR is kept plenty busy with aerospace optics and their scope manufacture is simply not making enough to fill demand so i am actualy suprised that they havent outsourced stuff .
IOR's bad rep is more or less down to a pair of tactical models that were definetly bad .
40mm models were a step back to fix their tactical scopes , it seems they couldnt figure out the solution for older 35mm ,IOR 40mm scopes are from technical stand point primitive but because of direct paralax drive and lots of space for mechanical parts easy to make reliable .
But like i said on Big 50cal rigs IOR is qute a contender (in Europe probably 1/3 of the 50cals and many ELR rigs are run with IOR 40mm scopes because they handle recoil well and offer lots of elevation) in BR scene its 36x42 Competiton model became a benchmark against which people test BR scopes on the scopechecker as its considered second only to 'frozen' scopes in terms of POI holding and was used to win Supershot more than once. interestingly recent testing on scopecheckers completely dislodged March as the scope to beat in BR (March raison d'être), new reigning king seems to Khales 10-50 (sucks opticaly) , while NF (some of the best glass)are being masacred wholesale .
IOR is kept plenty busy with aerospace optics and their scope manufacture is simply not making enough to fill demand so i am actualy suprised that they havent outsourced stuff .
They sounded good in the video. I'll be getting my hands on one pretty soon. I've never owned a FFP or a Mil based scope, so I'm getting into new territory.
It looks like this is the same basic design that LOW makes for Delta, Athlon, Trijicon, etc, except they shoved it into a 40mm tube for Val to keep it consistent with the Romanian made scopes. It should be a respectable scope, except it will be interesting to see how it performs at the edge of the adjustment range. I am not convinced the objective system of this scope can handle it, but we'll see.
It is probably a good decision for Val to decouple himself from the Romanian factory. They seem to be having a hard time making stuff.
All the stuff in the video about glass and where it comes from is meaningless bullshit. Same for the Tibosaurus Rex' video on Youtube together with Val. TRex has no idea what he is talking about although Val is certainly smart enough to not say anything stupid. TRex produces all sorts of pearls. My favourite, I think, was where he makes a focus face like he is about to fart and pronounces that "the lenses on this one are really good". Then a few minutes later he goes "I can't really tell the difference". That was the only honest thing he said, I think.
Oh, don't forget that Val now has an "Italian style" one piece scope mount. I'll let you decipher what that means.
ILya
It is probably a good decision for Val to decouple himself from the Romanian factory. They seem to be having a hard time making stuff.
All the stuff in the video about glass and where it comes from is meaningless bullshit. Same for the Tibosaurus Rex' video on Youtube together with Val. TRex has no idea what he is talking about although Val is certainly smart enough to not say anything stupid. TRex produces all sorts of pearls. My favourite, I think, was where he makes a focus face like he is about to fart and pronounces that "the lenses on this one are really good". Then a few minutes later he goes "I can't really tell the difference". That was the only honest thing he said, I think.
Oh, don't forget that Val now has an "Italian style" one piece scope mount. I'll let you decipher what that means.
ILya
I think you have just coined a new SH phrase , to be used and abused by all : ) . “ Is that your focus face ,
or are you going to fart ......” I’ve tested a few prototypes recently that have stacked more EL travel in
existing designs : all of them have shown significant distortion when EL turret is In the last 20% of travel ,
especially in the outer 50% of image .
I hope it works , but bending the light path internally that much is asking a lot of small lenses .
I've always thought TRex seemed like a bell end, never watched enough of a video to make see if was as my first impressions suggested, seems I was right.
What do you think of Richard Utting (Sharp shooting UK)? He and T Rex seem to be the only people offering good reviews on IOR scopes, whilst he mostly seems like he knows what he is talking about, at times he says some slightly odd things that make me question his judgement.
Is it a 3 piece tube this time?
Because 3 is better than 1 after all.
Because 3 is better than 1 after all.
I have only looked at his optics related videos. He can't tell his ass from an elbow as far as optics are concerned.
I have not watched any of his other videos and have no knowledge of his competence level with firearms.
ILya
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Edited the previous post to clarify that I was talking about Mr TRex. I have no insight into Richard Utting's expertise.
ILya
ILya
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Ah and just as i was about to make your acquaintance from across the pond, sir
We all love optics - no point squabbling amongst ourselves.The new Recon G2, which I'm assessing in detail for Val, looks extremely promising optically. I'm comparing in great detail side by side over the next month before compiling a report, primarily against:
Recon
Chronus
Vortex Razor 2
Delta Strykers
Terminator
Crusader
ATACR
Swaro X5i
PM2s
All of which i have here permanently as i do this for a living 7 days along with teaching ballistics in high winds here in the gnarly North of England. So i'll be actually walking the walk not just talking the talk
These scopes above are wildly different in price from the USA market so the hierarchy ends up slightly different as frankly a scope's quality must tie in proportionately to it's local asking price. Warmest regards from the UK, Richard Utting of www.sharpshootinguk.com
BTW I'll likely be posting progress reports on this process on my Facebook group SharpShootingUK so anyone from this esteemed forum would be most welcome to join in
Hey Richard, I’m curious if you still consider the Crusader one of the best scopes ever? I know the vid you made on it was several years ago and there have been many more high end scopes drop since. So I’m very interested to know where it ranks with the current market. Thanks
Ah and just as i was about to make your acquaintance from across the pond, sir
The new Recon G2, which I'm assessing in detail for Val, looks extremely promising optically. I'm comparing in great detail side by side over the next month before compiling a report, primarily against:
Recon
Chronus
Vortex Razor 2
Delta Strykers
Terminator
Crusader
ATACR
Swaro X5i
PM2s
All of which i have here permanently as i do this for a living 7 days along with teaching ballistics in high winds here in the gnarly North of England. So i'll be actually walking the walk not just talking the talk
Warmest regards from the UK, Richard Utting of www.sharpshootinguk.com
BTW I'll likely be posting progress reports on this process on my Facebook group SharpShootingUK so anyone from this esteemed forum would be most welcome to join in
A little squabbling is sometimes therapeutic. It gives us all a bit of a reality check.
I'll keep an eye on your progress with the scopes. Which specific models are you looking at? There are different ATACR and PM2 models out there.
ILya
Good question. Things do move on, certainly. Well the Crusader now has the 5-45 PM2 to contend with, albeit at very much more money (it's £1000 more in the UK) The 5-45 is as good. Not better. I still don't rate the PM2 rets at all. But optically it's a dead match. I was interested to see if the PM2 could deliver more fov than the IOR which it has historically done but with the big mag range the PM2 just matches the IOR 5.8-40 rather than beating it. So i would not buy a 5-45 over a crusader as it's not worth the extra £. So, other than that, what mega mag FFP tacticals have come out to challenge the Crusader? None. Now the Recon has lots of competition around its price point (in UK it's only £2200) but yes IMO the Crusader still reigns supreme at this time. It's that massive mag range (there are dozens of 5-25s but 5.8-40 is killer) and the utter dependability of tracking, the 50cal all day toughness, the great turrets and ret...nothing has got a better recipe. However who knows what Val will do next after the inevitable success that this new ReconG2 of his will be....
Interesting. I saw the Crusader when it first came out and was very unimpressed. Low mag issues, distortion issues, etc. Perhaps they improved it since.
ILya
ILya
Sorry guys,
I thought we banned Phillip so we didn't have to suffer his endless propaganda in regards to IOR.
After all it's the best scope the reviewer above never shot. Funny, how the best scope from the best company has to go to the manufacturer of every other scope out there to make their best scope ever.
They should just call it, IOR Optics and Casino to bring out the truth in advertising. This way everyone knows the bet they are taking when they lay their money down.
Each year they try, and each year they fail, I am surprised they are still in business. But when you buy low and sell high, well the model works.
Why would even entertain this when we have so many proven winners out there. A fool and his money is soon parted is the old saying it applies here more than ever.
I thought we banned Phillip so we didn't have to suffer his endless propaganda in regards to IOR.
After all it's the best scope the reviewer above never shot. Funny, how the best scope from the best company has to go to the manufacturer of every other scope out there to make their best scope ever.
They should just call it, IOR Optics and Casino to bring out the truth in advertising. This way everyone knows the bet they are taking when they lay their money down.
Each year they try, and each year they fail, I am surprised they are still in business. But when you buy low and sell high, well the model works.
Why would even entertain this when we have so many proven winners out there. A fool and his money is soon parted is the old saying it applies here more than ever.
Good question. Things do move on, certainly. Well the Crusader now has the 5-45 PM2 to contend with, albeit at very much more money (it's £1000 more in the UK) The 5-45 is as good. Not better. I still don't rate the PM2 rets at all. But optically it's a dead match. I was interested to see if the PM2 could deliver more fov than the IOR which it has historically done but with the big mag range the PM2 just matches the IOR 5.8-40 rather than beating it. So i would not buy a 5-45 over a crusader as it's not worth the extra £. So, other than that, what mega mag FFP tacticals have come out to challenge the Crusader? None. Now the Recon has lots of competition around its price point (in UK it's only £2200) but yes IMO the Crusader still reigns supreme at this time. It's that massive mag range (there are dozens of 5-25s but 5.8-40 is killer) and the utter dependability of tracking, the 50cal all day toughness, the great turrets and ret...nothing has got a better recipe. However who knows what Val will do next after the inevitable success that this new ReconG2 of his will be....
Do you have any vested interest in pushing IOR scopes or for any of the scopes that you review? I personally enjoy your scope review videos, you do mention a UK company a bit (cant remember name?) so made me question this.
thanks
not totaly sure about that while i do know the crusader and terminator glass was made in germany a few too many pages on the web stating they went to a japanese company this time to save money while its supposed to be the same company that does nf , and a few others, which is not that big a deal. is it if they kept the same glass quality and proprietary quality as the crusader which to me is just my everything i just love it the view the price i could not beat it as it was on sale , I could be happy with this i think would be nice to actually be able to look through it before buying one this time. But as it is, sad am i to say no one in my area are using or sells anything like this.
would not bet too much on your skepticism, i did blindly buy into what some of those that reviewed the crusader5.8x40x56 mostly cause of the deal i found online to get one , and no one sells stuff like this anywhere in my area . i was more than happy upon first shooting it and spotting for people at my semi local range that could not spot their own hits with vortex pst gen II 5X25X50 and nf ATACR 5X25X56 and upon looking through a 5x45x56 34mm sNb pm ii a really nice scope at 6k + and realizing i spent 1/2 the money and had what the owner of snb did , and got an equil if not better view. while i would never dare to state its the best of anything i have not regretted the decision to buy it yet.But that is me i really would have rather been able to look through one first then compare and i do dislike people just talking about the scopes and you never are seeing through them there are a few that do show the view.
Itwastoolongandhadnocapitalizationandwasextremelyincoherent
Years of watching Haj communicate with random hand signals and sticking his hands under his arms pits and then smelling them, helped.
I mean IOR and Barska have the exact same internals so why not jus save your self the money
Seems you and Val have some unfinished business judging buy the way you talk about his company. Need to forgive one another. What ever happened in the past must have hurt. Wish this could be mended to end the drama and begin to help each other out instead of bash.
I know I’m setting myself up for people bashing me. But come on guys! People acting like high school popularity contest and talking crap when ever IOR or Valdada comes up in a forum.
One and only post in this forum.
As the bear said, "Mikey, you don't come here to hunt bear, do you?"
It was/is a shit product with a shit reputation.
When they dig themselves out of that hole, I’m sure frank and everyone else will acknowledge it.
But but but but Taborasaurus Rex said they were good!
