Hunting & Fishing What caliber do you pick for starting children?

[rookie7]

Curious to what others think and their reasoning behind their decision.

My daughter, who is 10, has killed 2 bucks with the RARR in .300 blackout. Last year her first was with a loaded Barnes 110 TAC-TX. This year I loaded 125gr Hornady SST.

The rifle and caliber have accounted for 5 bucks - 3 last season, and 2 so far this season. Last year I killed 2 with it plus her buck, and this season we both have one each.

However, the 300 blackout is leaving me wanting, and I can't quite place my finger on it. At first, I was singing it's praises as a great round for beginning hunters on medium game due to the low recoil and muzzle blast.

Today I tested the recoil and muzzle blast against other rifle calibers to include: 357, 44, 223, 243, and 270. Of course the 270 had the most recoil, but the blast from the 300 blackout and the 243 were very similar. The 357 was the winner of the bunch.

My first big game rifle at the age of 12 was a 270 - which in hindsight was a mistake. Not really needed for Georgia deer, and too much for a 12 year old with factory ammo back then.

I don't buy into the mentality "they can grow into it." I say buy the right fit now, and change later when needs and wants change.

So I have been doing a lot of reading on the 6.5 grendel, 6.8 SPC, 7.62x40WT, and the 7.62x39 - and comparing those to the 300 blk.

Just looking for other hunters/shooters experience.

Thank you

 

[WeiserBucks]

I have never seen anyone attempt to take a deer with a .357 , but I've personally witnessed several bears wounded with one . I'll never attempt a shot at a game animal with one. Sounds like you guys are using an AR platform, I would use a .243 , .260 or .308 for game.

 

[rookie7]

No she is shooting a bolt action. RARR = Ruger American Ranch Rifle.

I used the .357 for comparison. It’s a Rossi 92 with Octagon barrel, and it’s a lot of fun to shoot. I don’t hunt with it but I bet a hot 357 put thru a deer’s lungs would do the job under 100 yds.

 

[Brux]

I just went threw this with the guy I hunt with and his son. I don't like a 243 for whitetail unless a perfect shot can be placed. His son is 10 so I recommended a youth TC bolt in 308.It comes with a accuracy guarantee and we bought some of the Hornady reduced recoil ammo with the SST's and it worked out great. Light recoil with that ammo and his son don't have to make that perfect shot.

 

[Mullhead]

I've killed a pile of deer with my blackout's . 110 vmax or black tips running 2400 fps is bad medicine for whitetail. My oldest boy has taking two deer this year with it, bang 30 yards then flop. I did purchased a T/C 308 for him to use but he shots the blackout so well. After season is over gonna try some reduced loads with h4895 and 155 amaxs for him. Another option would be Ruger American predator 6 or 6.5 creed. Boyd's AT one stock. Chop the barrel to 18" to 20" for ease of handling . But 250 yards and in its hard to beat the blackout for a compact ,low recoil youth rifle.

 

[rookie7]

I've killed a pile of deer with my blackout's . 110 vmax or black tips running 2400 fps is bad medicine for whitetail. My oldest boy has taking two deer this year with it, bang 30 yards then flop. I did purchased a T/C 308 for him to use but he shots the blackout so well. After season is over gonna try some reduced loads with h4895 and 155 amaxs for him. Another option would be Ruger American predator 6 or 6.5 creed. Boyd's AT one stock. Chop the barrel to 18" to 20" for ease of handling . But 250 yards and in its hard to beat the blackout for a compact ,low recoil youth rifle.

Are y’all hitting bone with the vmax?

Shooting an AR or a bolt?

I guess i cant complain 5 up and 5 down with it, and truth is I make her wait until deer are about 50 yards and broadside. I’m trying to maximize her success.

I don’t want to get caught up in the grass is greener on the other side with similar cartridges. Even though on paper some calibers seem better real world results may be the same.

I have read where others have used the vmax with success.

 

[Mullhead]

I mostly use a Remington 700 16.5" . My load is 21 gr lil gun at 2.115" with the vmax 2420 fps with liberty mystic. I'll double check length tomorrow. I try to get a lung shot but have shot several square in the shoulder broadside. Breaks first shoulder clean trashes the lungs then usually recover what's left in the off shoulder. Pics below you can see the broken shoulder bone and wound channel damage.

 

[BoilerUP]

It shouldn't be a surprise that a 16.5" rifle like a RAR Ranch has some blast, even "only" in 300 BLK form.

If the terminal effects suit you, run a 30cal blast diverter or a suppressor.

Otherwise, my vote would be for a 6.5 Creedmoor using H4895 reduced loads with a 123gr ELD-M or SST.

 

[rookie7]

It shouldn't be a surprise that a 16.5" rifle like a RAR Ranch has some blast, even "only" in 300 BLK form.

If the terminal effects suit you, run a 30cal blast diverter or a suppressor.

Otherwise, my vote would be for a 6.5 Creedmoor using H4895 reduced loads with a 123gr ELD-M or SST.

I agree, and if it were a different caliber using rifle powder I think the blast would be a lot more. IMO, that is the one true virtue of the 300 blk is that it uses pistol powder which in turn keeps blast to a minimum.

The terminal effects are what is in question - it works, but....

Out of 5 deer one was a bang flop - last year. The other 4 have run 40 to 100 yards. They basically act like a deer does when I shoot them with bow and get a double lung with an arrow.

I already have a inline compensator on the rifle to drive sound away from her.

Your suggestion for H4895 is exactly what I was thinking yesterday. I did load a few rounds up in the 270 using that. It made a difference. I wouldn't have her shoot the 270 though - something along the lines of the 6.5 creed is a good idea though if I go that route.

 

[BoilerUP]

If you shoot deer in the heart/lungs, they are gonna run until they expire - doesn't matter if you do it with a bullet or a broadhead. I seriously doubt you'll achieve your desired result by switching chamberings as deer I've shot with a 270 or '06 all ran 40+ yards after being hit in the vitals. Hell, a 250gr .50cal muzzleloader bullet through the vitals has allowed deer to run after being hit.

If you want bang/flops, your daughter needs to drive the bullet to high shoulder or CNS regardless of the chambering used.

 

[stwcattle]

I'd have to say a rifle in 6 or 6.5 creed.

Both cartridges very effective on deer. Also a abundance of quality factor ammunition for the 6.5.

 

[reeljob]

I started both my son and daughter out with a 7mm08. Dandy cartridge and recoil comparable to a .243. Several of my friends have taken my advice and done the same. I haven't seen one in awhile but the Stevens 200 is one of my young friends favorite rifles. If a AR platform is what you are after than the Grendel is hard to beat as well.

 

[coldboremiracle]

I went .260rem for my son, mainly because I already had a .260 myself, and ready to roll em. Made it an easy decision anyways. Otherwise I may have just went 308 and shot low velocity 125-140 class bullets. Junior is 2 for 2 on deer (last year was his first year hunting) and 1 for 1 on elk, we hope to make that 2 for 2 in the next month or so.
Rifle is a 16" Remington I slapped together with a 1-6X24 Minox, shoots PVRI match 120BTHP's at 2790FPS. Little bastard rifle shoots .5 all day long.

 

[kurt]

I have killed a shit ton of deer with the .243. My kid started shooting my 6.5 creedmoor. Now he has a .243 he picked out. So far he has shot at one deer it is dead. The .243 is a fine rifle not even just for kids

 

[Bradu]

I have never seen anyone attempt to take a deer with a .357 , but I've personally witnessed several bears wounded with one . I'll never attempt a shot at a game animal with one. Sounds like you guys are using an AR platform, I would use a .243 , .260 or .308 for game.

I used a .357 in a TC contender pistol when I was younger for pistol season and it did really well dropping a deer. I personally would go with a .223 or a .243 for a youth to deer hunt with, lower recoil and both are capable of putting down deer without any issue. I'd rather see a kid with a low recoil gun so they practice shooting throughout the year than a gun that kicks to the point they only shoot it once or twice a year right before hunting season.

 

[Sportsman]

7mm-08 or 6.5 Creedmoor.

 

[WB300]

I agree with BoilerUP. The only way to guarantee, as much as possible at least, a bang-flop, is with high shoulder or Central Nervous System shot. But it's high risk, high reward.

I went through this same process with my son 2 years ago. He's 11 now. I've worked him up from 22lr, 223, 243 reduced loads, and now have him on 308 reduced loads where i can slowly work up to a full strength load. Hornady offers factory 243 and 308 reduced loads as an option if you don't want to load them.

Sounds to me that you are suffering from rifle/cartridge ADD. It's a common disease on this sight. I suffer from it too, but that's half the fun.

I think the blackout is just fine for now. If you just want to try something new, 6.5 Grendel in a bolt or semi platform would be my choice. I'm actually looking at this caliber next for my semi. Second choice would be 6.5 Creed, 7-08, or 308. Start with reduced loads and go from there. As i said, Hornady offers reduced loads. A job change took most of my free time away, so it was easier to buy a box of bullets instead of buying a new rifle.

I too hunt GA deer and although 243 with the 80 grain TTX is my favorite, and absolutely hammers deer, i want to minimize the risk of my son wounding and not recovering. Now before everyone goes ape shit on that last statement, yes, i realize shot placement trumps caliber/bullet, but it has been my experience that the larger bore is just a little more forgiving on shot placement, especially when the occasional hog comes out.

I hope this helps and doesn't muddy the water. Be sure to update the thread and post pics.

Good luck.

Oh... and invest in a suppressor. Best move i ever made.

 

[Mr. Z]

There’s a ruger m77 available in .357. With the longer barrel it pulls velocities up well into medium sized game range. If you reload the applications are endless from a quiet backyard pop gun to a great short to medium range <250 yard deer rifle.

Then again, I just described the blackout...

 

[bullseye13]

There are so many great cartridges for a youth deer hunter. I love the .260 rem and .308. Reduced recoil loads can be had in either. I decided to take my 6.5 Grendel out this year, and can guarantee the big bodied 9 point wouldnt have known the difference between that or a 300 win mag. Since you load, id stick with the 300 blackout, and TSX bullets. Spend the time to teach her the importance of shot placement, instead of the latest and greatest caliber. Shes comfortable with the platform and it hasn't let you down. That's a win win.

Congrats and good job taking your daughter out with you. I can't wait until mine is old enough.

 

[Maestro]

I started with a .270 and still shoot it today. Had a bang-flop 8 point this year with a high shoulder hit at 180 yards with a box stock R700 ($550). That said. .270 will wallop you pretty hard if you’re not used to it. I know a lot of guys shooting .243 and it’s a great round for Whitetail if the range isn’t too far (with a novice hunter I’d try to keep shots under 100-150 anyways). As said, .260/6.5 Creedmore would be a great rifle that they could shot forever for whitetail, elk, coyote and hog.

 

[tansinator]

7mm-08 without question. My daughter has killed a buck each of the last five years. All were 200+lbs. All one shot kills, Two made it about 40 yards, rest were DRT. I am personally changing to the 7mm-08 as well after watching the terminal performance. I have hunted with 25-06, 300 win mag, and .308. It has out performed them all in my opinion.

She started with an H&R 7mm-08 and now shoots a Weatherby 7mm-08. Used Remington managed recoil ammo for the first 3 years, last two full factory loads. I will sell the H&R for cheap if you are interested.

Hope this helps,

Eddie

 

[stello1001]

I agree with BoilerUP. The only way to guarantee, as much as possible at least, a bang-flop, is with high shoulder or Central Nervous System shot. But it's high risk, high reward.

I went through this same process with my son 2 years ago. He's 11 now. I've worked him up from 22lr, 223, 243 reduced loads, and now have him on 308 reduced loads where i can slowly work up to a full strength load. Hornady offers factory 243 and 308 reduced loads as an option if you don't want to load them.

Sounds to me that you are suffering from rifle/cartridge ADD. It's a common disease on this sight. I suffer from it too, but that's half the fun.

I think the blackout is just fine for now. If you just want to try something new, 6.5 Grendel in a bolt or semi platform would be my choice. I'm actually looking at this caliber next for my semi. Second choice would be 6.5 Creed, 7-08, or 308. Start with reduced loads and go from there. As i said, Hornady offers reduced loads. A job change took most of my free time away, so it was easier to buy a box of bullets instead of buying a new rifle.

I too hunt GA deer and although 243 with the 80 grain TTX is my favorite, and absolutely hammers deer, i want to minimize the risk of my son wounding and not recovering. Now before everyone goes ape shit on that last statement, yes, i realize shot placement trumps caliber/bullet, but it has been my experience that the larger bore is just a little more forgiving on shot placement, especially when the occasional hog comes out.

I hope this helps and doesn't muddy the water. Be sure to update the thread and post pics.

Good luck.

Oh... and invest in a suppressor. Best move i ever made.

I also don't want to start any arguments or insult anyone. However, when my father started hunting years ago, I remember going with him as a little boy. Both him and I were new at this. He was using a .243 and was not able to recover 8 deer. Again, both of us were new to hunting and had no idea what ballistics, bullet drop, effective range, and all these things were. He thought that where you aim is where the bullet will impact and the deer will fall on its side dead. Anyhow, as a starter rifle, I also prefer something with a larger diameter than a .243. We now use. 270 and the last 3 bucks we have killed have been heart/lung shots and dropped dead right then and there. One of them jumped up on its hind legs and almost did a backflip and feel dead. While I personally think the .270 is a great deer clambering, it might not be best suited for a child barely starting. I would recommend to keep the .300 or go with maybe a .260, 6.5 cm, or possibly .308. As others have mentioned, reduced loads would be a good idea. If you wanna take it a step further, reduced loads plus muzzle brake so it isnt too hard on recoil.

 

[supercorndogs]

It shouldn't be a surprise that a 16.5" rifle like a RAR Ranch has some blast, even "only" in 300 BLK form.

If the terminal effects suit you, run a 30cal blast diverter or a suppressor.

Otherwise, my vote would be for a 6.5 Creedmoor using H4895 reduced loads with a 123gr ELD-M or SST.

just started load development with RL15 and the 123 ELD for a mule deer hunt. It is extremely soft shooting in the 6.5 creedmoor. The Creed is a soft shooting round to start with.

 

[D Baker]

For kids starting out the 6.8 SPC in the AR platform has been an excellent performer. The 16" LMT with the Federal Fusion 115gr ammo has piled up deer and hogs for a handful of 7-12 year old boys and girls. The Fusion has performed extremely well with all animals going down quickly and requiring limited tracking. Went this route so we could have manageable recoil and easily adjust the LOP to ensure proper position behind the rifle. With a quality single stage trigger and some practice these kids can consistently ring steel out to 300 yards. Tried the 300 Blackout this year, but the terminal performance has lagged the 6.8 SPC. While anecdotal, our experience has been that the 6.8 SPC has better terminal performance than the 300 Blackout using the 110gr TAC-TX or Win 150gr Extreme Point. I am of the opinion that the sectional density of the 6.8 vs the 30 cal bullet of similar weight has impacted our field experiences. Operationally we have had no issues running the 6.8 SPC with or without suppressors. The 300 Blackout has suffered some of the typical issues with cycling and running consistently. In defense of the 300 Blackout we have had fewer experiences with it. The Win 150gr Extreme Point grouped very well out of the LMT but did not cycle well at all. With that said the 300 Blackout might be a better performer with "tuning" and adjustments of the system, but we abandoned those efforts as the 6.8 SPC continued to work well without any modifications. With this in mind, we are planning to work up a 6.5 Grendel to benefit from even better sectional density and ballistic coefficients.

 

[19Scout77]

What caliber for kids? Headshot or heart/lungs??

 

[rookie7]

I appreciate everyone’s input. I was just curious what other folks have done. We are going to finish the year out with the Ruger American Ranch 300 blk because that is what we started and practiced with.

WB300 you are right. I am suffering a little from caliber and rifle ADD. That’s part of the fun isn’t it?

100 yards and in there won’t be any difference in performance from a 300 blk, 6.8 spc, and the 6.5 Grendel from what I can tell from ballistic tables.

Head shots are are a no go. Too high of a risk for a bad shot. I limit her to broadside only into the shoulder or behind.

Next year I if we are still using the 300 blk it’s back to Barnes 110 tac tx. The Hornady 125 SST has worked but I have more faith in the Barnes.

Too bad more manufacturers don’t offer the 6.5 Grendel or the 6.8 SPC in a bolt gun. They seem to be ideal beginners calibers IF their muzzle blast is low.

 

[coldboremiracle]

Too bad more manufacturers don’t offer the 6.5 Grendel or the 6.8 SPC in a bolt gun. They seem to be ideal beginners calibers IF their muzzle blast is low.

There is a reason for that, both of those cartridges as well as the blackout were specifically designed for use in a small frame AR. For bolt guns there is not really a good reason to go with those cartridges, since there are more standard cartridges that will acomplish the same purpose and much more. Manufacturers are going to make what sells the best, and I think you’ll find that 6.5G and 6.8 have a VERY low demand in bolt guns. The only reason I suspect the BLK is available (in bolt guns) is because it has been marketed so much, and people go for that. The Valkyrie is another example, as is the 22Nosler, the whole point was to get better than 223 performance in an AR, with minimal changes. But in a bolt action rifle it almost seems silly, when you have other options like 22-250 etc.
I went through this same thought process, even considered the Grendel. But when I looked at components, and all the other ADD items I would need, it just made sense; I already have everything for a 260, or a 243, or even a 308. All of which can do exactly the same thing as the AR specific cartridges. And furthermore, as my son grows, there will be no need to “step up” to something “better”. I gave up on having niche and oddball cartriges sometime ago, since all it did was cost more for the same. But if you are looking for an excuse to have more guns, and more options, then it makes sense.

 

[Wyfox]

I built my daughter a 6.5 creedmoor on her 10th birthday(she's 12 now) and set my buddies 12 yr old son up with a Ruger Predator 6.5 creedmoor. I load 129gr Nosler Accubonds for both rifles, both have muzzlebrakes and zero recoil.
Results from this year speak for the creedmoors effectivness...

 

[rookie7]

There is a reason for that, both of those cartridges as well as the blackout were specifically designed for use in a small frame AR. For bolt guns there is not really a good reason to go with those cartridges, since there are more standard cartridges that will acomplish the same purpose and much more. Manufacturers are going to make what sells the best, and I think you’ll find that 6.5G and 6.8 have a VERY low demand in bolt guns. The only reason I suspect the BLK is available (in bolt guns) is because it has been marketed so much, and people go for that. The Valkyrie is another example, as is the 22Nosler, the whole point was to get better than 223 performance in an AR, with minimal changes. But in a bolt action rifle it almost seems silly, when you have other options like 22-250 etc.
I went through this same thought process, even considered the Grendel. But when I looked at components, and all the other ADD items I would need, it just made sense; I already have everything for a 260, or a 243, or even a 308. All of which can do exactly the same thing as the AR specific cartridges. And furthermore, as my son grows, there will be no need to “step up” to something “better”. I gave up on having niche and oddball cartriges sometime ago, since all it did was cost more for the same. But if you are looking for an excuse to have more guns, and more options, then it makes sense.

Dude! Stop making sense! I’m trying to justify spending some money here!

Just kidding. I think you just talked me out of building a Grendel or buying the Howa mini. I like to do things that on the practical side make sense.

UNLESS I decide to go with an AR, but I’m trying really hard to not go down that rabbit hole. For the amount of money that generally gets dumped into those I can have a semi custom bolt rifle built.

 

[rookie7]

I built my daughter a 6.5 creedmoor on her 10th birthday(she's 12 now) and set my buddies 12 yr old son up with a Ruger Predator 6.5 creedmoor. I load 129gr Nosler Accubonds for both rifles, both have muzzlebrakes and zero recoil.
Results from this year speak for the creedmoors effectivness...

Nice pics! What are the specs on your daughter’s rifle? Thanks

 

[Wyfox]

Thanks, the kids are spoiled now!
I had the rifle built by LRI in Sturgis
Rem 700
21" Douglas w/LRI brake
Cerakoted in stainless gray and socom blue
Mcmillan Game Scout w/ 11.5" lop
Timney 510
Bushnell LRHS 3-12
Had her name engraved on it too.

 

[psinclair]

6 Creed.....works well for adults to...

 

[SHwbyfan]

That's my 7 yr old. Shot him with my 20" 22 Creedmoor @ 160 yds w/ a berger 80.5 fullbore. High shoulder, bang flop. I guess it's his gun now.

 

[rookie7]

That's my 7 yr old. Shot him with my 20" 22 Creedmoor @ 160 yds w/ a berger 80.5 fullbore. High shoulder, bang flop. I guess it's his gun now.

Thats awesome! And that’s what it is all about right there!

 

[myronman3]

6.8 is mild, yet potent. other than that....7-30 waters, or a 7-08.

 

[xdeano]

Nothing wrong with the old 243. It'll take varmints, predators and deer. Lots of elk have been taken with it over the years, but on marginal shots, I'd go with a bigger caliber. Its more about feeling comfortable and abilities, less about caliber selection. Don't just shoot it once a year and let it sit. My father would take me out every Sunday afternoon and we would shoot. I try and do the same with my son, and will do it with my daughter when she is old enough too.
xdeano

 

[supercorndogs]

When I was a kid I started with the 30/06, after I had worn out about a dozen air rifles. I was also 6ft tall and 200lbs by the time i was in middle school. So i never needed anything youth size. It was more like {my dad} "Hey Mongo, go drag that deer back here." LOL.

 

[MarkCO]

When I turned 13, my parents gave me a Winchester 670A in .243Win. I just gave that to my youngest when he turned 13. My Oldest and I also hunt Deer and Pronghorn with .243Win. Great caliber that is simple and effective for medium size on down game. But I can't say that another caliber from 6mm to 6.5mm to 7mm to .30 caliber would not do just as well. Oldest shot his first Elk with a TC Encore in .308. When we go Elk hunting next week, oldest will use the .30-06 I hunted with for 20 years which is now his, and the youngest a 6.5CM. It has taken them some time to work on the skills and grow enough to be able to shoot the bigger calibers which are also in heavier guns. Carrying them is as big an issue as shooting them for small framed people. .260s (my 6.5) and 7mm-08s (sold off) have also been in the mix at times.

The .300BO at its best is about .30-30 class. Good for some things, be there are better choices IMHO. Ruger Americans are excellent values, easy to cut down and then as they grow, inexpensive to put a better stock on, and light. Have one as a .243 in the Predator and on in .223 in a Boyds as a trainer.

We have several AR pattern (large and small frame both) rifles in various calibers. We hunt varmints and such with them, but not my preference for big game.

 

[BoilerUP]

Wyfox, what’s that rifle of your daughter’s weigh?

 

[rookie7]

Right now we will stick with the 300 blk for deer. At the ranges I allow her to shoot it works well. I was just curious about the route others take. In a few years I will buy or build her a .243 or 6 creed.

There is a recoil difference between the 6 and the 6.5. I'd rather be reserved and cautious in my selection. She isn't going to be shooting deer out there for some time to come. Like MarkCO said actually carrying the rifle can be an issue. She is small, and can carry the Ruger American 300 blk with a sling, but she has to have a rest to shoot it.

I've owned three 7-08 rifles over the years. Two Remington model 7s, and one Remington 700 that came hydro-dipped from the factory in original Mossy Oak. Wish I still had that rifle.

I would never recommend the Model 7 in 7-08 or 308 for a youth rifle as a starter. Too many things against it in my experience - recoil, and muzzle blast is more in that short and light rifle.

I had mine before the days of reduced recoil loads and factory 140 grain 7-08 had a good kick to it in the Model 7.

 

[Wyfox]

BoilerUP just threw it on the scale 9 lbs even including a hornady stock pack.

 

[sandwarrior]

Curious to what others think and their reasoning behind their decision.

My daughter, who is 10, has killed 2 bucks with the RARR in .300 blackout. Last year her first was with a loaded Barnes 110 TAC-TX. This year I loaded 125gr Hornady SST.

The rifle and caliber have accounted for 5 bucks - 3 last season, and 2 so far this season. Last year I killed 2 with it plus her buck, and this season we both have one each.

However, the 300 blackout is leaving me wanting, and I can't quite place my finger on it. At first, I was singing it's praises as a great round for beginning hunters on medium game due to the low recoil and muzzle blast.

Today I tested the recoil and muzzle blast against other rifle calibers to include: 357, 44, 223, 243, and 270. Of course the 270 had the most recoil, but the blast from the 300 blackout and the 243 were very similar. The 357 was the winner of the bunch.

My first big game rifle at the age of 12 was a 270 - which in hindsight was a mistake. Not really needed for Georgia deer, and too much for a 12 year old with factory ammo back then.

I don't buy into the mentality "they can grow into it." I say buy the right fit now, and change later when needs and wants change.

So I have been doing a lot of reading on the 6.5 grendel, 6.8 SPC, 7.62x40WT, and the 7.62x39 - and comparing those to the 300 blk.

Just looking for other hunters/shooters experience.

Thank you

rokkie7,

Most of us in our conversations run into the "I need more gun" syndrome. When I was in the Army down there in Georgia, I saw .35 Rem brass all over Ft. Stewart. Over on the west side (Ft. Beginning) I saw a much more varied mix of brass. Funny thing was up in the north part of the state I saw more .30 Rem than anywhere else. In northern Minnesota, I saw a lot of smaller cartridges in rifles than what I saw out in NV. I ran into old timers who shot deer and even moose with a .32-20 and .32 WCF. the biggest whitetail EVER, fell to a .25-20.

In many conversations, I've been told a .243 will just bounce off deer and you need at least a .30-06, blah, blah blah, ad nauseum. How did we ever kill deer with .30-30's and .300 Savages?

The truth is you've got what you need. And, that really allows you to be focusing on shot placement. Too big of a cartridge, as you saw yourself, is too much. Why go bigger unless you need more range. But, with .270 recoil, it's hard to get a young'un to settle down and think about the shot when it's going to bite them back. IMO, a .243 is a deer killing machine! It shoots flat and hits a lot harder than the big boys think.

Which brings me to address another myth. Energy, or more of it to be exact, is derived from velocity, not bullet weight. This doesn't mean a .357 or .44 won't kill a deer, they will, they just have to have enough velocity to do it. But, a .243 with an 85 gr. Partition, or any other quality hunting bullet speeds right out there and kills deer...and elk All without busting you up in the process.

One thing 'old timers' used to tell me, and this is no myth, whether it be speed or a massive bullet made to expand correctly and do the most damage, the damage caused is lost meat. One reason the venerable .30-30 was so popular is it didn't destroy meat. If you had relatives and knew people who lived through the depression, ruining meat was a no-no.

 

[Pesekcw]

When I was a kid I started with the 30/06, after I had worn out about a dozen air rifles. I was also 6ft tall and 200lbs by the time i was in middle school. So i never needed anything youth size. It was more like {my dad} "Hey Mongo, go drag that deer back here." LOL.

Sounds like you were part of my family, my brother and I would
pick our dad up and carry him out also just for shits and giggles.


OP FWIW the main part about shooting that people don’t thing about is teaching someone HOW to manage recoil, me being 6’5” 300 lbs doesn’t lend me to shooting any better than my 5’5” wife, but without proper training she will take much more of a beating than I will. YMMV but I would find the caliber that fits the game you are chasing and build form from there