what was wrong with savages?

[jackh]

just read somewhere that savages used to not be considered real rifles... article said that changes when winchester stopped making rifles and savage is not really in tune with the long range public. why were/are savages hated? arent they prone to be more accurate out of the box than remingtons and just under howas? id rather buy a savage over howa any day since its made here

 

[Downzero]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

They're nuts. I've had gunsmiths tell me that they'd never buy a Remington when they could get, "A damn nice Savage" for half the price.

Obviously Remington is advertising in that gun magazine.

 

[jackh]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

haha no i read it here

http://www.snipercentral.com/sav10fcpmcm.htm

 

[jackh]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

EDIT

"I remember back in the mid 1990's walking through a gun show and coming up to a Timney Trigger booth and asking them if they had a replacement trigger for a Savage 110FP I had at the time. What was the response? They literally laughed. To them the Savage was not a real rifle."

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

Elitist snobbery, pure and simple. I like them all, but when I buy a new rifle, it's a Savage. It works.

Greg

 

[bohem]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

My savage shoots as good or better with hand loads and a factory barrel as many people's semi custom remingtons. For 1/3 the price or less.

I'd certainly buy more of them.

 

[desertHK]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

Savage rifles can be quite accurate, especially with the new Accutrigger. I think it's the nut behind the trigger that makes it less accurate. Having said that, lots of people prefer the Remy rifles because of aftermarket products to "up grade" their rifles, or make it look "tacti-cool"...

 

[jackh]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

well i dont really have a side in the argument because i dont own any of these rifles yet but im about to purchase a savage 10fcp mcm. i just read that in the sniper central review and it stumped me so i thought id ask yall about it. i have never read anything but praise about the savages these days....

 

[BOLTRIPPER]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

sniper central ?


....savvy what show up in the winners circle at tactical matches...

 

[jaw921]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

I have that exact rifle, savage 10FCP w/mcmillan stock, and it's an outstanding rifle. You will be happy with it for sure.

 

[jackh]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jaw921</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have that exact rifle, savage 10FCP w/mcmillan stock, and it's an outstanding rifle. You will be happy with it for sure. </div></div>

pm sent

 

[sinister]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

The Savage 10FCP w/McMillan stock is the sleeper bargain precision rifle. It'll beat out many Remington long-throat 700V/700Ps with the nasty lawyer-proof trigger.

 

[BOLTRIPPER]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

all this is useless drivel.....pictures for the un-washed !!

BTW .....i'll still waiting to see 'em in the winners circle in competitions i go to........some one PROVE me wrong ,,,,,bitches

 

[jwn8552]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

correct me if I am wrong, but didn't a Savage factory team just win a national F-class championship using factory rifles? I have Savage rifles.The "naysayers" just have no experience with them. I read the review mentioned above. I think it was a fair assessment.The reviewer wasn't knocking Savage, the Timney rep he spoke to was.

 

[RemingtonSPS]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jwn</div><div class="ubbcode-body">correct me if I am wrong, but didn't a Savage factory team just win a national F-class championship using factory rifles? I have Savage rifles.The "naysayers" just have no experience with them. I read the review mentioned above. I think it was a fair assessment.The reviewer wasn't knocking Savage, the Timney rep he spoke to was. </div></div>

I believe you are correct just ask Monte Mil. Maybe they're not used heavily at tactical matches but that doesn't mean they are inferior. I do not like savages feeding mechanism. If I were a savage fan I would by their target repeater action and use the vbull bottom metal and it would solve this. The other argument against them for me is the bolt feels cheap and sloppy but it is more of a feel than function thing. Lastly some don't like that the heaviest contour you can put on the reciever with the barrel nut is 1.062" compared to Remingtons 1.250" or even 1.350" on some of the custom actions. all things considered these are weak arguments because the savage performs fine the way it is. I like an action that feels like its riding on ball bearings and locks up tight when closed. Problem is you have to pay a lot for it and your not getting much more in return unless you go with Bat.

 

[jackh]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

i like smooth bolts too. guess i need to go to gander mountain and play with the savages and rems again to see what feels better.

idk why but ive just always wanted a savage. prone to out of the box accuracy and american made, why not?

 

[nashlaw]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

I have had a couple of the base model tactical Savages. They had the heavy barrel and the absolute flimsiest stock ever bolted to a receiver- but they both shot lights out.

Go figure.

 

[jwn8552]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

MuleHunter, I think the bolt thing is a problem for a lot of guys new to Savages. It was a problem for me at first to. But the rifles I own shoot so well I got over it. I believe the "Precision Target" actions take large shank barrels;1.250" so that wouldn't be a concern if you really wanted a heavy barrel.

 

[RemingtonSPS]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

I don't shoot factory barreled rifles anymore but I understand your point. The accuracy of a rebarreled savage and a rebarreled rem are the same so for me personnally I don't see the need to deal with a sloppy bolt when I can have a rem for a few bucks more and have it be just as accurate.

Kevin rayhill sells a lift kit for savage bolts that make them a lot nicer too for anyone interested

 

[jaw921]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MuleHunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Kevin rayhill sells a lift kit for savage bolts that make them a lot nicer too for anyone interested</div></div>

I'm may be interested in this. Do you know what they go for? Where can I contact him.

-Thanks

 

[AXEMAN]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

whne i was bore sighting mine last night, i did ask my bud that owns the boresighter about the bolt being loose. i did notice that when its cocked it isnt as jiggly (technical term).

what does a bolt lift kit do exactly? it looked like a washer and a bearing if i recall. for its price, like $8, i was just gonna get one when i ordered a new bolt handle. i was $42 i can get a longer tactical knob and put it and the lift kit on myself.

 

[long range dogr]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jaw921</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MuleHunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Kevin rayhill sells a lift kit for savage bolts that make them a lot nicer too for anyone interested</div></div>

I'm may be interested in this. Do you know what they go for? Where can I contact him.

-Thanks </div></div>
Here you go.....

http://www.stockadegunstocks.com/

 

[titandriver]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

Here's mine with a McGowen 28 inch HV in 260.

[/img]

[/img]

 

[RemingtonSPS]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

The lift kit is very easy to install. The savages bolts are like lifting a boat anchor, the lift kit makes it easier to lift the bolt handle. Combine this with a longer tactical bolt handle and its a world of difference for a total of about $48.

 

[CumminsTruck97]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MuleHunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The lift kit is very easy to install. The savages bolts are like lifting a boat anchor, the lift kit makes it easier to lift the bolt handle. Combine this with a longer tactical bolt handle and its a world of difference for a total of about $48. </div></div>

That sounds good, I have a hard time staying on target and cycling the bolt in my 10fcp-k. The Sharp Shooters supply bolt handle did help some.

I read about the accu-stock for a while before I purchased and although not a great reference, some of the gun rags would talk about how Savages were the cheap rifle for so long that it may have damaged their name. I did hear about the "sloppy" bolt as well.

 

[OFIS]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

maybe theres a direct correlation between the people with enough $$$ for customs and thus enough $$$ for ammo and practice and those in the winning circle?

whats that sound? it sounds like.... ford.... or wait, is it.... chevy......

 

[RemingtonSPS]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

Until jewell makes a trigger for the Savage I'm affraid I'm stuck with remington.

 

[Zilla]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

FWIW, The Savage guys won the F-T/R World Championship with them.

 

[jwn8552]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

I had "Sharp Shooter Supply" true and time my 10fp, install their "Competition" trigger and bed it in a "Stockade PDog". I think it is pretty smooth although I will admit it is not as smooth as a custom remington I also own.

 

[zepheris.hk]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

SSS evolution triggers seem to be outstanding according to those that use them.

 

[jackh]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

damnit im so close to buying a 10fcp now i want to go feel the bolt of a few different rifles and make sure im ok with savages. i hate closing bolts that are loose and feel like theyre grinding on metal. i like smooth bolts lol

 

[monteboy84]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

Savages are fine, but I sold the one that I owned. They work, and they're durable, and quite accurate, I just didn't like the feel of mine or the way that it was manufactured. The newest ones are probably better, but mine was a blind magazine model where the magazine box was tabbed to the action bottom and nearly impossible to remove. I also didn't like the stamped trigger assembly or the feel of the bolt.

Are any of these things dealbreakers in terms of the rifle being functional? Probably not, I just didn't like mine versus a Remington for roughly the same price.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BOLTRIPPER</div><div class="ubbcode-body">sniper central ?

....savvy what show up in the winners circle at tactical matches... </div></div>

Quit trying to stir the poo pot.

-matt

 

[Diablo]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

The salvages seem to shoot well right out of the box. The only complaints I've heard over the years were about the use/appearance of the "plumber nut" on the barrel, poor triggers, flimsy trigger guards, sloppy bolts, etc.. All of this has been mentioned above except for the appearance of that barrel nut.

 

[AXEMAN]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jackh</div><div class="ubbcode-body">damnit im so close to buying a 10fcp now i want to go feel the bolt of a few different rifles and make sure im ok with savages. i hate closing bolts that are loose and feel like theyre grinding on metal. i like smooth bolts lol </div></div>

mine is smooth. its jiggly kinda, but when its cocked its tighter. uncocked its loose, but not overly so. its not a big issue, but then this my first bolt gun and i dont have others to compare. the nut on the barrel i dont even notice. if i had a rifle that didnt use that system first, i might notice the difference.


and JWN, when they tuned your bolt, you had sent in the whole rifle to get restocked. do they need the whole thing just to do the bolt work?

 

[JamieD]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

This never goes away : ) I took 5th at Reade in 07 with my Savage 10fp top feed. It was still fun. I still have it but run my Remington in an AICS mostly now. Still like Savages though.

JamieD

 

[Cartman]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

What the hell is with this thread? I open it up and expect to hear about cannibalism and head shrinking, and you're all talking about rifles.

Try putting a capital S in "savages" in your next thread so I don't get excited thinking I'm going to read about violent Aborigines in the wild jungles of Borneo.

 

[jaw921]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Diablo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The salvages seem to shoot well right out of the box. The only complaints I've heard over the years were about the use/appearance of the "plumber nut" on the barrel, poor triggers, flimsy trigger guards, sloppy bolts, etc.. All of this has been mentioned above except for the appearance of that barrel nut. </div></div>

Poor triggers??? Flimsy trigger guards???etc.
-When was the accutrigger considered a poor trigger? Flimsy trigger guards, in what way?

And it's Savage, not Salvage.

 

[Netz]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MuleHunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The lift kit is very easy to install. The savages bolts are like lifting a boat anchor, the lift kit makes it easier to lift the bolt handle. Combine this with a longer tactical bolt handle and its a world of difference for a total of about $48. </div></div>

Also you can make your own lift kit by using a trimmed down .357 case and a ball bearing.
Curt

 

[AXEMAN]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Netz</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Also you can make your own lift kit by using a trimmed down .357 case and a ball bearing.
Curt </div></div>

care to give us a few more details on that? id like to see how its done

 

[DH]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

I've got both and like both of the savage and rem. The bolt is a little looser on the savage when it is open compared to a rem, but just a little. My comparision is between 3 savages and a 700 5R. The remington would have just as much slop in the bolt if it had a floating bolt head like the Savage. The savage has a faster locktime and with a SSS trigger they can be pretty slick. The remington is easier to bed and has slightly more rear bedding area then the savage. Barrel swaps and caliber swaps are easy with the barrel nut and the floating bolt head, you can go from 308 to 223 in about 20 minutes with the proper tools. Which cost all of 50-75 bucks

 

[jwn8552]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

Axeman, truing and timing involves the whole action so yes you need to send the rifle. Checkout www.sharpshootersupply.com. You could also go to www.savageshooters.com. They have more detailed explanations of the work involved. After I had mine done I did not think there was any need for a bolt lift mod.

 

[Netz]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AXEMAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Netz</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Also you can make your own lift kit by using a trimmed down .357 case and a ball bearing.
Curt </div></div>

care to give us a few more details on that? id like to see how its done </div></div>

The inside diameter of the Savage cocking piece sleeve is the same as a .357 case,so take a piece of .38/.357 brass and remove the primer, trim it down to about 1/8 to 1/16th above the rim,just enough to slide it into the cocking piece sleeve, then find a ball bearing that seats in the primer pocket, this is all there is to a cocking piece, the next thing to check is the Bolt Assembly Screw (BAS), you will have to remove the thickness of the .357 case head protrusion from the BAS.

I have an older 110 (mid late 80's), and the BAS has a protrusion that goes into the Cocking Sleeve, so I need to remove the protrusion and shorten the BAS accordingly, I think I will find a donor BAS to try first. good thing about the whole deal is the BAS is the only thing being modified if all goes wrong and can be easily replaced.
HTH, Curt

 

[jackh]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

checked out a r700 sps tac today and the 10fp again. idk why but after a year of dreaming of the savage im starting to lean towards the sps t

sps t already has the 20" barrel, its a tried and true gun that has tons of aftermarket products available, its going to out shoot me for a long time etc etc. i wanted the 10fcp for a little but now i feel like it would be smarter to go with an fp or sps t. ill be out half as much money from the get go with the gun, then if i decide later on to go with a mcm or manners stock i can do so. but, if i lose interest in the gun, i still have a functional hunting weapon that i can use accurately but i have saved about $500... make sense?

but between a 10fp and r700 sps t, im kinda leaning towards the rem for right now. whats the deal on the rem 700 5rs? i see their a bit more money than the sps t but not quite sure why.

 

[918v]

Re: what was wrong with savages?

Exactly. The aftermarket has not caught up to the Savage.

In my opinion the reason Savages have been laughed at is because they look and feel like a substandard firearm. They shoot great, but that isn't everything.