Which Optics 4 Your HD Guns

[Convex]

Wishing everyone a happy Thanksgiving week.

Every 2 wks. to a month, I get everything out, unload it, ck function, oil em up, and load 'em up again.

This one is my G41 (Grab 4 1st) pump in an urban setting around my house in addition to my Ruger 357 in a pocket holster.

This is Reptile (Yes, I name my pumps).



Got the Eotech on it, which some folks consider a big clunky antique, but I love it. Yes, U have to turn it on, it's big, short on battery life, but no worrying the image dancing around while UR trying to save UR life, the circle is just natural 4 me and just so quick w/acquisition.

Of course out in the country it's my rifles w/a scope on one, and the Aimpoint on the other.

Wondering what optics other folks have on their GO2 HD guns.

 

[Milf Dots]

What's a g41- is that an actual model number? TYIA

 

[Milf Dots]

To your general question about optics- If my guns hadn't sunk in the minisub accident, I certainly wouldn't put an OEM Ch***** optic on anything. (Not talking about your Eotech)

 

[Convex]

Grab for 1st.

It's the Eotech on it.

 

[Convex]

Yes I agree 100%. I've never jumped out of planes, but I imagine when it comes to your life, not many folks are looking for the cheapest chute.

 

[Milf Dots]

That's a sweet shotgun.

I had a 590a1 spx with the factory heavy & ported barrel, tried to get an AimPro heat shield for it, but AimPro went sideways and outta biz.

With Aimpoint, Elcan, Eotech, Trijicon, Sig, and Leupold electro-optics- every possible need is covered.

 

[NHPiper]

I have a few HD guns that my wife and I keep out.

12.5” AR-15
-Aimpoint T2
-Backup Irons
-FP Peq15 + Surefire white light
-Surefire RC2

B&T APC9 Pro (This is the backup)
-Trijicon RMR RM06
-Inforce WML
-SilencerCo 9K

Then we each have two handguns with surefire X300s and RMRs, one of which is suppressed.

I also keep a 16" SPR with an NX8 1-8, top mounted RMR RM06, FP DBAL A2, and Modlight white light handy, with an OCM5 on it.

I prefer the Eotech sights as someone who has a slight stigmatism, especially if a magnifier gets used, but their auto shut off feature is a no go for me.

 

[koshkin]

I use an AR-type with a Meprolight MOR Pro.

ILya

 

[PappyM3]

Elcan Specter DR 1-4x. Bright red dot, but works perfectly fine without the dot. 4x is acceptable for every line of sight from my house if some crazy and unlikely situation ever happened.

Also, OP, your writing style and replacement of “for” with ‘4’, and “you” with ‘u’ is pretty childish. It’s annoying enough when people do it in texts, but in a full format discussion forum? Eesh.

 

[Convex]

That's a laugh.

Go ahead and think it's childish and go ahead and be annoyed.

Now KMA after U GFY. If that has U shitting out of both ends, good.


Nobody asked U to show up on my thread, so you chose to be annoyed.

 

[PappyM3]

That's a laugh.

Go ahead and think it's childish and go ahead and be annoyed.

Now KMA after U GFY. If that has U shitting out of both ends, good.


Nobody asked U to show up on my thread, so you chose to be annoyed.

That escalated quickly.

 

[black5.3]

Would it actually be a real thread on SH if it didn’t go sideways at some point??

 

[Convex]

Yes, it certainly did. When somebody annoys me here or anywhere else, I don't show up on their thread to correct them, and then get personal, I live and let live, and leave alone.

It's what's called not being a troll.

 

[ironhiide]

Red-dots on all HD weapons, a Glock 19 and a Remington 870. I went with the Burris Fastfire 4 on both because I like the auto feature and the changing reticle.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

That storage chest setup is pretty badass.

 

[PappyM3]

That storage chest setup is pretty badass.

I feel like it is something you’d find in this house:

 

[FuhQ]

By “HD” I’m guessing you mean “home defense” & truck gun?

If so, mine is a custom 8” .300 BLK build w/ a Holosun 510-C…

 

[Makinchips208]

ATACR 1-8 on 16” 556
Irons on the glocknikov 19

And @Convex , I like your storage method and your set routine. I will do better.

 

[RUN8]

The house carbine is a KAC SR-15 with KAC BUIS, and an Aimpoint Comp M5 on a Geissele lower 1/3 mount. Using a Cloud Defensive OWL for a light.

 

[Convex]

Thank U very kindly.


Here she is buttoned up and covered. Everything in my house is Rustic, so it pretty much fits in w/all my other furniture.

 

[kyjd75]

For HD ("Home Defense") purposes I have a couple of 11.5 SBRs (Sig 516 and MCX Virtus) each running a Sig Romeo 4T RDS always on using the "circle of death" reticle option. The 4T is quite rugged and the reticle is sharp and clear.

 

[Convex]

Here's showing what kind of quick access to the chest is combined with just being/appearing to be just a table.

A few years back my Daughter waited until I went to the store and stole this old TV which never stopped working and drove straight to the dump and threw it out.

She then had them ship me a 60" tv which I've now got up on the wall.

 

[Milf Dots]

Here's showing what kind of quick access to the chest is combined with just being/appearing to be just a table.

A few years back my Daughter waited until I went to the store and stole this old TV which never stopped working and drove straight to the dump and threw it out.

She then had them ship me a 60" tv which I've now got up on the wall.

A good CRT tube TV could go 25 yrs. The published average life span of a good flat screen TV is about 10 yrs.

 

[Convex]

It still had a pretty good picture B4 she kidnapped it.

 

[Cotay]

I have four SBRs set up for home defense. Since I have a bad astigmatism (that so far 4 of my 6 kids have inherited), I've settled on Primary Arms 1x Micro Prisms.

 

[diggler1833]

I have an EOTech XPS-2 on my HD rifle. Probably not "the best", but it works well with my eyes...and my thermal uses the same reticle, so I have a metric fuck-ton (that is a unit of measurement) of experience shooting at live, moving things in the dark with it. Not exactly the same, but when I practice with the EOTech at night it just feels natural.

 

[WindstormSCR]

I live in suburbia, so I've had to choose mine based on collateral damage and overpenetration concerns.

Mossberg 590A1 with DDupleks Kaviar slugs loaded. will shred a target if it hits true, but most barriers will cause it to disintegrate and become harmless (a single double-drywall standard wall it'll penetrate one side and not the other)

its basically a modern take on the old wax slug concept, a bunch of birdshot in a polymer matrix molded into a hollow point.

side saddle has a few alternatives if someone decides to try and use cover.

Yeah, sightmark laser, you can laugh, but I've posted my thoughts about vis lasers here before. they're useless on a flat range, but very useful for shooting from awkward positions in a dynamic environment, I've tried others and the sightmark ones handle the recoil and are cheap and cheerful. I don't plan to use nods so no point in spending big money for a proper IR unit on a gun I expect to get put in evidence lockup if its ever used.

tried a few different optics, but at the end of the day the ghost rings are easier to use with my astig if my glasses or contacts get forgotten or dislodged.

link to the slugs for the curious: https://www.ddupleks.com/kaviar-slug

 

[Convex]

Yes, the ghost ring..."Reptile" started out life as a Rem 870 police pump and came w/a Scattergun Tecnologies ghost ring, and rifle sights up front.

Even if the batteries of the Eotech go out or it malfunctions you can still co-witness. Whenever I took this set up to the range I'd finish by shooting w/the Eotech turned off and still placing where I wanted on center mass. Not like a rifle but good enough for HD.

 

[stanley_white]

Iron sights for condo defense.

Home defense or acreage defense likely has different requirements.

-Stan

 

[Convex]

but when I practice with the EOTech at night it just feels natural.

On a regular basis, I wait until late @ night when nobody else is home (so they won't think I'm crazy) and unload "Reptile" and start going around the house barefoot in the dark w/this "firestick".

As a result of doing this barefoot, I now make sure there's no odd "yuk bits" of anything laying anywhere.

Quite a number of years ago when I started doing this I broke a couple of toes on the corners of chairs (there's no feeling like that U understand) and even w/a 18 inch barrel, I was bumping the barrel into a bunch of things and making a lot of noise.

I was surprised @ the difference between thinking I could automatically do this because I was used to being in my own house and actually doing it.

Now pretty good @ going around the house in the dark w/o making any noise and not bumping the barrel into anything, but it took some practice.


A handgun in the same scenario was always a snap, but this wasn't.

 

[RayDBonz]

Primarily iron sights.
One Aimpoint PRO.
One NF NXS 1-4x24.
Nothing fancy needed or wanted.

 

[308pirate]

Trijicon RMR on the handgun which I carry every day (P-10C), which is also what comes out when someone in the house needs to be dealt with.

 

[Naaman]

Its nice to not see a bunch of know-it-alls "critiquing" peoples' HD set ups.

Trijicon RMR on the handgun which I carry every day (P-10C), which is also what comes out when someone in the house needs to be dealt with.

I too like a handgun for HD in most cases that I can conceive of.

 

[Convex]

Here's a Rem WM pump which doubled as a "house gun" from years and years ago. I love/loved the "furniture" on it.

When my youngest son was small, I handed him this WM just like my Dad handed me my first shotgun when I was 10 and waited to see his reaction.

He got a smile on his face so wide U could see his back teeth; from that moment on this pump was retired/not another second of range time/has been packed up in grease ever since. This is going to him when I go.

This is a way older WM w/that old fashioned/beefy "KAA-CHINNNKKK" sound when U rack it.



He's also crazy about my Dad's Baretta 92F which still hangs out in this gun chest, going from my Dad to me to him.

 

[hkguns]

I'm a gonna go out on a limb and say a 4X elcan is too much magnification for "Home Defense."

I have several options; My Benelli M4 sports an RDS, my MK18 sports an EOTech.

 

[PappyM3]

I'm a gonna go out on a limb and say a 4X elcan is too much magnification for "Home Defense."

Have you used the Elcan Specter on 1x before? True red dot brightness, but the reticle itself functions perfectly fine without the dot.

The 4x provides enough magnification for any contingency outside my house within line of sight, or if I need to evacuate due to a natural disaster. It’s kind of like a really durable red dot with magnifier all in one unit, but doesn’t need batteries to work.

 

[hkguns]

Have you used the Elcan Specter on 1x before? True red dot brightness, but the reticle itself functions perfectly fine without the dot.

The 4x provides enough magnification for any contingency outside my house within line of sight, or if I need to evacuate due to a natural disaster. It’s kind of like a really durable red dot with magnifier all in one unit, but doesn’t need batteries to work.

I don't own Eclans, my preferences lie elsewhere. Your post made it sound like it was 4x, not 1-4x, so disregard.

 

[PappyM3]

I don't own Eclans, I don't like them. Your post made it sound like it was 4x, not 1-4x, so disregard.

Gotcha. Yeah, a 4x Elcan machine gun optic would be a terrible choice.

 

[Charger442]

Call me old school but I see no reason for any optic on an HD shotgun. Gamer gun? Ok, have at it.

Home defense shotgun should be simple beads or maybe a fiber optic front tube/pin. Why complicate something so simple? If you can't shoot someone in your house without a red dot, then I don't know what help anyone can give you....

 

[Convex]

For me personally I went to the Eotech so as to justify defending myself although my eyesight had gone bad and was getting worse to where I might lose my DL and now even after the surgery on both eyes, I'm used to shooting w/what I've got for all these years and they're paid for, so they might as well stay on the gun.

I get what you're saying, but as to in and/or around my home, I still want every edge I can get because we got too many moms walking around here w/babies and toddlers not to be "on the money" if I gotta use this.

I get to pick what I reach for, trouble is that I can't predict when someone shows up, w/innocent folks around.

Right or wrong, this is my mindset.

 

[Convex]

I've already pulled a gun on 2 guys getting ready to rob my house, it happened on my front porch, and a couple of my neighbors watched.

Nobody got shot because these knuckleheads careers changed from robbery to running track.


I've been through this about 8-10 years ago.

Maybe in the last 5 years we've had maybe 2 home invasions; thankfully nothing lately.

Somehow folks who don't live here have got it in their heads that people here have 10 grand hid underneath their pillow.

The money is in the new garage door, the roof, nobody around here keeps wads of cash around, it's in the bank.

 

[WindstormSCR]

The biggest thing to drill imo for home defense is not your aim, but keeping a cool head and being able to handle the situation without making a mistake.

The most common mistake is not standing down that use of force or threat of force at the right time, and letting adrenaline get the better of you. If they are compliant (and restrained), fleeing (and no longer have a gun), dead, or unconscious then lethal force is no longer justified, as the threat to your life is ended.

The best trainer for this mentally I’ve found is various forms of martial arts, specifically ones with a heavy self defense focus like Krav Maga, which train you to assess a situation in the moment.

 

[Naaman]

Have you used the Elcan Specter on 1x before? True red dot brightness, but the reticle itself functions perfectly fine without the dot.

The 4x provides enough magnification for any contingency outside my house within line of sight, or if I need to evacuate due to a natural disaster. It’s kind of like a really durable red dot with magnifier all in one unit, but doesn’t need batteries to work.

How would you rate the utility of the Spectre vs a dot+magnifier set up? That Elcan is one that piques my curiosity.

 

[PappyM3]

How would you rate the utility of the Spectre vs a dot+magnifier set up? That Elcan is one that piques my curiosity.

Personally, I’m not a big fan of dot&magnifier combos. So I may be biased. I also avoided the Elcan for a long time, going from my ACOG back in the early 2010s to various LPVOs. But, on SBRs, I’ve found the Elcan Spectre to be a great option.

Pros compared to dot&magnifier:
- Reticle that is usable at both 1x and 4x without a battery
- Ranging features
- Usable BDC
- Not just an illuminated dot, but you can gently illuminate the whole BDC reticle to effectively get shots out to distance in low light/dark areas
- Not bulky like a magnifier rotated off to the side
- End of world durability/usability

Cons:
- Not amazing eye relief (though I’ve never had any difficulty getting behind it and being able to use the reticle, even with scope shadow)
- Illumination battery life probably not as good as a true red dot
- Can’t detach a magnifier to look at something without aiming a rifle (never really worried about this).
- Would work well with an IR clip-on, but not good for helmet mounted NODs like a red dot

Honestly, I wasn’t very confident I would like the Elcan, but decided to try it, moving from an NX8. I like it at 1x far more than I expected and at 4x, with its wide field of view, it’s a lot like the ACOG I was so used to. It is really effective and effortless close in on 1x, but lets me stretch the carbine’s legs if I need or want to. Best of both worlds.

And to boot, with Black Hills 77gr TMK out of my 11.5”, these are the BDC drops in yards:

 

[Ronws]

EDC, on me all day in an OWB under a large angler's shirt. Always within reach.
S&W M&P M2.0 in 9 mm with a 17 rd double stack mag, 2 extra mags loaded. During the mostly peaceful protests, I had 100 more rounds in boxes in my tactical ruck, AKA, man purse.

My secondary carry in a plain black bag with pouches for 5 loaded 30 round mags and 1 30 rd mag in the rifle, one in the pipe, safety on, the Windham Weaponry Dissipator M4 A3, except that I changed the foregrip to a Magpul that my boss gave to me.

Also in the home, Mossberg 590A1 12 ga. (with bayonette.) I have upland bird and some #4 shot but for home defense, I still prefer accuracy. So, slugs that simply WILL NOT STOP bleeding. Aim for the crotch and get a little femoral artery action going. Send flowers to the family.

Only difference is that I put a Magpul stock on mine.

All iron sights. The M4 has a combat zero from the factory. The shottie will obliterate anything to 25 yards. The 9 is good for CQC, 7 yards or less. Actually, at my LTC test, this 9 mm was good to 15 yards..

 

[themightytimmah]

Eotech and an X300 on the APC9. Would rather be absolutely, positively sure of what I’m aiming at before I let anything fly at night. Have heard too many tragic stories of kids who snuck out coming home at night, etc.

 

[308pirate]

Its nice to not see a bunch of know-it-alls "critiquing" peoples' HD set ups.

Yeah threads like this one tend to go sideways in many forums.

 

[308pirate]

Call me old school but I see no reason for any optic on an HD shotgun.

Most people who say this don't really know how to use a zero magnification optic to best advantage.

Don't be too proud to admit that maybe you need some better training/education.

I'm not saying this to be a dick. Four years ago I was where you are. Then I learned.

Also riddle me this, if an optic makes you more effective in competition where time and accuracy matter why would it not benefit you in a fight where time and accuracy matters?

 

[chevy_man]

Call me old school but I see no reason for any optic on an HD shotgun. Gamer gun? Ok, have at it.

Home defense shotgun should be simple beads or maybe a fiber optic front tube/pin. Why complicate something so simple? If you can't shoot someone in your house without a red dot, then I don't know what help anyone can give you....

You're talking to a man who names his guns and types like he's 12. He would be the type to mount an optic on a shotgun.


I don't even bother with them for my gamer gun. A bead is all that's ever needed. I also feel that if they're out of buckshot range it's time for a rifle.


But people will continue to tacti-cool anything and everything.

 

[308pirate]

You're talking to a man who names his guns and types like he's 12. He would be the type to mount an optic on a shotgun.


I don't even bother with them for my gamer gun. A bead is all that's ever needed. I also feel that if they're out of buckshot range it's time for a rifle.


But people will continue to tacti-cool anything and everything.

OK boomer