Who has the right to ask to see a tax stamp?

[hlee]

And, with the efile system- which emails your stamped form to your email address- not only are the stamps not written upon, but one could print an unlimited number of them on their home printer.

 

[Dmvadala]

After reading this all i can think of is, this is why we cant have nice things...

 

[Merle]

Shoulda been like "What is this tax stamp thing you speak of? Never heard of her".

 

[SilentStalkr]

Yo momma!

 

[Colt45guy]

I honestly don't understand the problem people have with showing a tax stamp. I'm relatively new to NFA stuff, and every time I've been to the range lately, people ask about my SBR and homemade cans.

Range officials sometimes ask if I have a stamp because they know that ATF is always looking for ways to shut them down. I also know this, and since the ranges I go to are private property, I feel that they have a right to know if I'm legit or not......and since I want to be welcomed back to the ranges I go to, I don't mind showing a piece of paper that I keep in the pistol grip compartment anyway.

Fudds who accuse me of having illegal gear get a friendly conversation about how easy it is to file a Form 1. I take the opportunity to educate them about NFA and clear up some of their misconceptions. I don't know if I've 'converted' anyone, but I've found that by being reasonable and friendly, I generally don't have any problems with them later. The one time I did, the range official lectured the Fudd about 2A rights and kicked him off the range for being an asshole.

 

[wade2big]

I honestly don't understand the problem people have with showing a tax stamp. I'm relatively new to NFA stuff, and every time I've been to the range lately, people ask about my SBR and homemade cans.

Range officials sometimes ask if I have a stamp because they know that ATF is always looking for ways to shut them down. I also know this, and since the ranges I go to are private property, I feel that they have a right to know if I'm legit or not......and since I want to be welcomed back to the ranges I go to, I don't mind showing a piece of paper that I keep in the pistol grip compartment anyway.

Fudds who accuse me of having illegal gear get a friendly conversation about how easy it is to file a Form 1. I take the opportunity to educate them about NFA and clear up some of their misconceptions. I don't know if I've 'converted' anyone, but I've found that by being reasonable and friendly, I generally don't have any problems with them later. The one time I did, the range official lectured the Fudd about 2A rights and kicked him off the range for being an asshole.

Its sad that you don’t understand.

It’s also not a right if you have to ask permission. In fact, ruled men have no rights regardless of the lies being told stating otherwise.

 

[kthomas]

I honestly don't understand the problem people have with showing a tax stamp. I'm relatively new to NFA stuff, and every time I've been to the range lately, people ask about my SBR and homemade cans.

Range officials sometimes ask if I have a stamp because they know that ATF is always looking for ways to shut them down. I also know this, and since the ranges I go to are private property, I feel that they have a right to know if I'm legit or not......and since I want to be welcomed back to the ranges I go to, I don't mind showing a piece of paper that I keep in the pistol grip compartment anyway.

Fudds who accuse me of having illegal gear get a friendly conversation about how easy it is to file a Form 1. I take the opportunity to educate them about NFA and clear up some of their misconceptions. I don't know if I've 'converted' anyone, but I've found that by being reasonable and friendly, I generally don't have any problems with them later. The one time I did, the range official lectured the Fudd about 2A rights and kicked him off the range for being an asshole.

Because its not the ranges job to ensure legal compliance.

- Should they check to make sure the vehicle that you drove onto their property has a current and valid registration and insurance?
- Should they perform a background check on you every time you enter the property to ensure that you can legally be in possession of a firearm?

I don't know why we should consider it acceptable for ranges to take a guilty until proven innocent type of approach with class III items. That's not their job or their duty to enforce. All this does is further stigmatize class III items. Personally I think the firearm community should be doing everything to make class III items more acceptable and obtainable. Not the opposite.

 

[Colt45guy]

Because its not the ranges job to ensure legal compliance.

- Should they check to make sure the vehicle that you drove onto their property has a current and valid registration and insurance?
- Should they perform a background check on you every time you enter the property to ensure that you can legally be in possession of a firearm?

I don't know why we should consider it acceptable for ranges to take a guilty until proven innocent type of approach with class III items. That's not their job or their duty to enforce. All this does is further stigmatize class III items. Personally I think the firearm community should be doing everything to make class III items more acceptable and obtainable. Not the opposite.

So, since we agree 100% on the bold part, how is it a problem to educate people that class III items are legal and obtainable?

How does being willing to show a piece of paper mean that I'm somehow bending a knee? Technically, I bent the knee when I paid the taxes in the first place. I have the ability to crank out suppressors or chop barrels all day long....but I wanted to be able to play with my toys in public without facing prison time, so I paid up.

You can't change somebody's stance if you aren't willing to engage, and when you automatically resort to a 'Fuck You' defensive posture you lose the chance to make positive impact.

My view on this is that I'm doing more to push NFA acceptance by being friendly about it than by arguing about it. If you don't understand that, we're just gonna have to disagree.

 

[Rthur]

Can anyone show me the added lethality/occurrence increase of crime as a result of the things that require a tax stamp?

R

 

[Malum Prohibitum]

I honestly don't understand the problem people have with showing a tax stamp. I'm relatively new to NFA stuff, and every time I've been to the range lately, people ask about my SBR and homemade cans.

Range officials sometimes ask if I have a stamp because they know that ATF is always looking for ways to shut them down. I also know this, and since the ranges I go to are private property, I feel that they have a right to know if I'm legit or not......and since I want to be welcomed back to the ranges I go to, I don't mind showing a piece of paper that I keep in the pistol grip compartment anyway.

Fudds who accuse me of having illegal gear get a friendly conversation about how easy it is to file a Form 1. I take the opportunity to educate them about NFA and clear up some of their misconceptions. I don't know if I've 'converted' anyone, but I've found that by being reasonable and friendly, I generally don't have any problems with them later. The one time I did, the range official lectured the Fudd about 2A rights and kicked him off the range for being an asshole.

Wait, the ATF is shutting down shooting ranges? Really? Can you name one?

 

[Malum Prohibitum]

So, I was at a different gun club last weekend with a friend that was a member. We were working up a load for his 308. I am shooting my 308 with a suppressor. One of the other members walks up and says, "You got a stamp for that?". I was polite and told him "Yes, I do." He asked me to see it. I asked him if was a police officer, or with the ATF and/or the DNR. He said "No."

I did not want to make a fuss...so I just packed up my gear and loaded it in the truck. i waited for my friend to finish and then we left.

I had a jpeg of stamp on my phone but was so pissed off.

I wanted to tell this guy in the worst way to.......take a long walk off a short pier.

Anyway, back to my question, who has the right to ask for you tax stamp and/or documentation.

Anybody can ask.

I think the gist of your question is whether you need to comply.

In my state (Georgia), possession of any NFA item is a crime, see OCGA 16-11-123. There is an affirmative defense for items properly registered under the NFA, see OCGA 16-11-124. The burden of proving the affirmative defense is on the defendant, see OCGA 16-11-125.

So, in Georgia, if a police officer wants to see it, then I am going to show it, because otherwise he may just cuff and stuff and leave it to me to show the form to the judge later as a part of my defense.

Our laws regarding the carry license used to read this way, too, if the person was carrying concealed (but, strangely, not if carrying openly). After a federal court case n which the federal judge said there was no Fourth Amendment violation holding a person for a half hour in a locked room to investigate, because his pistol had been concealed, we finally got the General Assembly to change that law. The NFA weapon law, however, still has this affirmative defense set up, so . . .

Your laws in your state may be different, so this is going to require some research on your part.