Rifle Scopes Zero Compromise Optic update

So I just finished the Mile High Shootout this weekend running the 527 I just got in. Mpct2 reticle. Scope worked great except the elevation turret. Coming from a TT damn it's a downgrade. So much so it slowed me down on stages because I constantly had to go to the nearest .5 and dial from there. Example: if I needed 3.8 mils I'd have to go to 3.5 then count up .3 or go to 4 and count down .2
Now I do believe this is one of the early models of 527 so I'll be in contact with ZCO to see if they can fix the turret. It also doesn't align 100% with the scope body so that also slowed me down a little. And yes I'm familiar with how to re-zero them as my 420 version is pretty decent. My 420 version only starts to mis-align after 7 mils.
My 420 has much much better turrets than the 527.
 
So I just finished the Mile High Shootout this weekend running the 527 I just got in. Mpct2 reticle. Scope worked great except the elevation turret. Coming from a TT damn it's a downgrade. So much so it slowed me down on stages because I constantly had to go to the nearest .5 and dial from there. Example: if I needed 3.8 mils I'd have to go to 3.5 then count up .3 or go to 4 and count down .2
Now I do believe this is one of the early models of 527 so I'll be in contact with ZCO to see if they can fix the turret. It also doesn't align 100% with the scope body so that also slowed me down a little. And yes I'm familiar with how to re-zero them as my 420 version is pretty decent. My 420 version only starts to mis-align after 7 mils.
My 420 has much much better turrets than the 527.

That sucks, I hope it can be improved. What does the turret feel like?
 
So I just finished the Mile High Shootout this weekend running the 527 I just got in. Mpct2 reticle. Scope worked great except the elevation turret. Coming from a TT damn it's a downgrade. So much so it slowed me down on stages because I constantly had to go to the nearest .5 and dial from there. Example: if I needed 3.8 mils I'd have to go to 3.5 then count up .3 or go to 4 and count down .2
Now I do believe this is one of the early models of 527 so I'll be in contact with ZCO to see if they can fix the turret. It also doesn't align 100% with the scope body so that also slowed me down a little. And yes I'm familiar with how to re-zero them as my 420 version is pretty decent. My 420 version only starts to mis-align after 7 mils.
My 420 has much much better turrets than the 527.
I just got to play with a ZC420 this weekend myself. I am not fully understanding what you are saying here noob, can elaborate a bit?
 
I just got to play with a ZC420 this weekend myself. I am not fully understanding what you are saying here noob, can elaborate a bit?
The turret and line on the scope body don't line up. So it dials in between clicks. Your you're not sure if you're at 4.3 or 4.4 by looking at it. You have to count the clicks.

I just want to add that I'm not worried about ZCO fixing it as from a CS standpoint I know they're stand up guys.
 
Triple check that you aligned the turret properly during re-zero. I have a couple very early models as well as messing with at least three other models.

Every mis-alignment I’ve had it saw was error in the re-zero process. Also have never seen one “move” out of alignment as it goes up in elevation.

Not saying it’s not possible, but haven’t seen one that wasn’t user error yet. Myself I included.
 
Triple check that you aligned the turret properly during re-zero. I have a couple very early models as well as messing with at least three other models.

Every mis-alignment I’ve had it saw was error in the re-zero process. Also have never seen one “move” out of alignment as it goes up in elevation.

Not saying it’s not possible, but haven’t seen one that wasn’t user error yet. Myself I included.

Tried it a few times. Should have my ZCO 420 back from ilya pretty soon here and I’ll take a video of it. For what it’s worth I showed it to him when we were doing the big scope review and he thought it was an interesting phenomenon as well.
And when I get back home I’ll do a video of the 527 as well.
 
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And just to put it in perspective, this isn’t a bashing on ZCO I really love the scope a lot. And no scope is immune to issues. As amazing as the TT turrets are I’m sure most of us have seen the primal rights TT review where his turrets weren’t aligned to the scope body either.
There’s also a thread on here from someone else who had misaligned TT turrets.
 
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Triple check that you aligned the turret properly during re-zero. I have a couple very early models as well as messing with at least three other models.

Every mis-alignment I’ve had it saw was error in the re-zero process. Also have never seen one “move” out of alignment as it goes up in elevation.

Not saying it’s not possible, but haven’t seen one that wasn’t user error yet. Myself I included.

Mine did this also throughout different elevations on the 4-20. Spent time on the phone with ZCO and sent it back in. It was fixed and back in hand a few days later. Right on the money now and I am setting zero the exact same way I was the first time. Verified with ZCO multiple times I was doing it properly over the phone.

Stand up folks and amazing customer service. The scope is really nice and I did order up the 5-27 to pair with the 4-20.
 
The turret and line on the scope body don't line up. So it dials in between clicks. Your you're not sure if you're at 4.3 or 4.4 by looking at it. You have to count the clicks.

I just want to add that I'm not worried about ZCO fixing it as from a CS standpoint I know they're stand up guys.
Roger that, I didn't realize it was a misalignment issue now I understand perfectly, sorry you had to deal with that during a comp but I know ZCO will take care of you.
 
Roger that, I didn't realize it was a misalignment issue now I understand perfectly, sorry you had to deal with that during a comp but I know ZCO will take care of you.

Yea I have no doubt it’ll get fixed. Honestly half the fun of matches for me is trying new stuff.
It’s awesome and the ZCO is just an amazing scope. Even despite the turret issue I got a first round impact at ~1400yd with a 6br so there’s that hahaha
 
I knew this was an issue with the first batch but this is the first I’ve heard this since that time. I have the 4-20 on my DT and have swapped barrels several times rezeroed inbetween and have had zero issues with this. Mine is spot on all the way to 28 mils. I am sure ZCO will square you away quickly.
 
Read through the thread and didn’t find much but apologize if I missed it. ZCO from user feedback so far seems like a very nice optic, I have no hands on experience yet but from buddies who own them and review on the Hide, vast majority are very complimentary.

Most of us have probably seen the few Durability test videos from brand X or Y and I know some manufacturers keep the info close to home but any idea on how the ZCO is tested as far as durability goes?

Not questioning the quality by any means just curious as to what sort of testing it goes through and if it was public knowledge or not.

Anyone performed their own durability tests, on purpose or accidental? Lol

Thanks!
 
Read through the thread and didn’t find much but apologize if I missed it. ZCO from user feedback so far seems like a very nice optic, I have no hands on experience yet but from buddies who own them and review on the Hide, vast majority are very complimentary.

Most of us have probably seen the few Durability test videos from brand X or Y and I know some manufacturers keep the info close to home but any idea on how the ZCO is tested as far as durability goes?

Not questioning the quality by any means just curious as to what sort of testing it goes through and if it was public knowledge or not.

Anyone performed their own durability tests, on purpose or accidental? Lol

Thanks!

The name escapes me, but someone decided to do a durability test on the ZCO. They called them up, asked if they would fix it if he broke it and they agreed.

He then proceeded to drop an 18 pound rifle onto the scope to try and induce zero shift/tracking error. He did this about a dozen times and never could get anything to change. If I find the post again or remember the name, I'll put it up.

EDIT: It was Adam Cloaninger
 
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The name escapes me, but someone decided to do a durability test on the ZCO. They called them up, asked if they would fix it if he broke it and they agreed.

He then proceeded to drop an 18 pound rifle onto the scope to try and induce zero shift/tracking error. He did this about 20 times and never could get anything to change. If I find the post again or remember the name, I'll put it up.
@TangoSierra916 his name is Adam Cloaninger I believe. Frank did a podcast with him where they talked about it.
 
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Read through the thread and didn’t find much but apologize if I missed it. ZCO from user feedback so far seems like a very nice optic, I have no hands on experience yet but from buddies who own them and review on the Hide, vast majority are very complimentary.

Most of us have probably seen the few Durability test videos from brand X or Y and I know some manufacturers keep the info close to home but any idea on how the ZCO is tested as far as durability goes?

Not questioning the quality by any means just curious as to what sort of testing it goes through and if it was public knowledge or not.

Anyone performed their own durability tests, on purpose or accidental? Lol

Thanks!

I believe it's 43 minutes or so in...
Some cool Zco discussion from Adam C who shoots them,

Listen to the torture he put the scope through to check it

Everyday Sniper Podcast
 
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Here is another evaluation of the 5-27... I have had it since they were first released. I have enough time with it to feel comfortable with my comments.

I have now had the opportunity to use the 5-27 with MPCT1 reticle to shoot in 4 matches for a total of 7 days behind the optic during competitions. I have also used it for many practice sessions, load development and my 10 year old used it to shoot to a mile in a side match. To date I have just short of 1700K rounds under it.

My wife has about 400 with hers. She has an MPCT2.



The 3 areas that are the most important to me are:

  • Repeatability and exactness of adjustments for both elevation and wind
  • Depth of parallax and the ease of eye-box, forgiveness and ability to have a clear full sight picture without perfect head position. .
  • Reticle
The next 2 areas are very subjective:

4. Smoothness, feel of the turrets

5 Glass, image quality

Repeatability: Thus far it is perfect. I have done a tall target test to 10 mils and the adjustment are correct. I did a measured box test and the reticle marks match the turret adjustments. In actual use on paper out to 1K yards, the adjustments have been consistent and correct. When making a .1 to .2 mil adjustment to verify loads, the impacts on paper have been within the adjustment range and the rifles ability for consistency.

Shooting on paper at 600 yards, the small adjustments have been exact. Under field conditions on steel, the adjustments have been correct and repeatable. When we make .2 to .5 dial adjustments at 1300 yards, the impacts track with those adjustments.

At 1745 yards, the feed back from spotters indicated the .3 and .5 wind corrects were correct. There were between 19.3 mils of elevation dialed. We had plenty of adjustments to keep the 260 dialed at that range. (Gwen, 10 year old daughter was 1 of 5 shooters to successfully make a hit at that range) The first shot was within .3 mils of elevation. We had not previously shot the scope to that range.

I am very pleased with the adjustments. They are spot on and repeatable.



Depth of parallax: This is a huge issue to both my wife and I. I like to set the parallax at a midpoint for a string of mid to longer range targets and forget it. Truth is I usually set it on the first target and forget it unless the last targets are over 800…

I have been very pleased. I have not noticed any parallax to date on the mid targets and have shot to 960 with a the settings at 300 and not had an issue. The resolution of the targets remains good as well when looking at target image at different distances with a shorter range adjusted parallax. The knob is smooth and not binding, but it does not rotate on its own. It is also large enough I am not searching for it or cussing how stiff it is.

The “eyebox” ease is great. If the eye relief is adjusted for the shooter, I have been very pleased with the image throughout the adjustment range. Granted, things get tighter at the high mag, but when the head position has the greatest chance of not being perfect, we are usually at 12 to 18 range in the power settings and the image does not black out or partially black out under normal conditions.

I believe a great testament to the generous eye relief and “eyebox” was with my daughter at the mile shoot. She used my rifle with an LOP over 14 inches ( she usually is at 12.75 inches). She likes to crank the scope up and she had zero issues maintaining a clear, full sight picture and no parallax issues…

Anne’s scope: She says adjustment is very short on th pplx. The mid to longer range adjustments are only an 1/8 turn or so. .



Turrets:

To date this seems to be the sticky spot on the optic. I have the early model with the softer elevation and much firmer, tactile windage.

Honestly, I did not like the elevation feel to begin with, but after use and the days of match shooting, I am sold. I like the speed, ease of adjustment and the solid, yet “soft” feel. I have not mis-dialed due to the feel of the turret.

My wife has a newer model and It is sharp and stiff. The feel and to some extent the sound is distinct and positive.

The wind is solid and feels good, but in reality, I had to watch it when making small adjustments because of the force needed to make the initial movement and at times I would over adjust because of the needed force.

The size of the turrets is great. Large and easy to grab even when wearing gloves.
Note: I have shot this from 0 to 97 degrees. Shot a match in the snow at 25.... There is no difference from the temp in the feel of the turrets, but they do work well with gloves..:)

My only negative comment is the same as I have discussed many times…. I wish they had 10 mils per revolution to increase the spacing so those of us with older eyes can more clearly see where we are. I do not like the tight spacing and smallish indicator line. The large primary numbers are fantastic, I would like more space and larger lines in between…

Reticle: Fantastic. I thought it would be too fine in the 10 to 12 range, but I was incorrect. I have not had an issue picking up my holds even at those power settings. The .4 and .6 tall lines are the primary selling point to me. They are fast references and are my primary mover holds. They make fast and follow up shots on movers simple and quick.

My wife has been very pleased with the MPCT2. She has held off a couple of times and likes the layout. She is very pleased with the open area around the 1 mil lines. She can see impacts and call corrections very rapidly.



Glass: Fantastic. 2 points:

1. I have been able to see 30 cal holes at 600 on white paper with good lighting conditions..

2 Huge mirage at a recent match. I was able to use more power than most and able to “see through it”. I like the ability to read mirage with the optic on marginal mirage locations/days as well.

Always nice to be able to clearly resolve impacts on steel at 1300 yards in good conditions. Seeing impacts on white or tan steel at 1K and in is not an issue.

I did notice a touch of color fringing in extremely bright conditions, but it is not an issue, just a comment.

I am currently waiting for a 4-20…
 
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Here is another evaluation of the 5-27...

Turrets:

To date this seems to be the sticky spot on the optic. I have the early model with the softer elevation and much firmer, tactile windage.

Honestly, I did not like the elevation feel to begin with, but after use and the days of match shooting, I am sold. I like the speed, ease of adjustment and the solid, yet “soft” feel. I have not mis-dialed due to the feel of the turret.

My wife has a newer model and It is sharp and stiff. The feel and to some extent the sound is distinct and positive.

The wind is solid and feels good, but in reality, I had to watch it when making small adjustments because of the force needed to make the initial movement and at times I would over adjust because of the needed force.

My only negative comment is the same as I have discussed many times…. I wish they had 10 mils per revolution to increase the spacing so those of us with older eyes can more clearly see where we are. I do not like the tight spacing and smallish indicator line. The large primary numbers are fantastic, I would like more space and larger lines in between…

Thank you MTETM for the thorough review and work that went into putting this all together, it is greatly appreciated. This past weekend I had a chance to play with a ZC420, it had not been mounted on a rifle yet but we did mount to a tripod and were able to get an "initial" experience with it. Overall, the experience with the ZC420 mimics your experience with the ZC527, but for an ultra short this is even more impressive as the "short" design often comes with optical drawbacks, but the ZC420 was simply superb.

I do want to comment on your feedback regarding the turrets (keeping in mind my short experience was with an unmounted scope). I had exactly the same experience you mention above with regard to the "force needed" to get the turret started, I too would sometimes overtravel on initial turn of .2 mils instead of .1 mil, this was with elevation, and windage was even a little tighter. Keeping in mind this is a brand new scope, the expectation is that over time (when those turrets get put through the paces) they will more than likely settle down as well as once mounted on a rifle, the ability to finely adjust will be easier than just holding in hand. The point is, I like the resistance and the positive response the ZCO turrets provide. I also agree that those of us with presbyopia (if you don't know what that is, you will once you hit your mid 40's) struggle with the smaller distance between clicks visually; however, I have to move my had back so far these days if I need to visually verify the turret setting that I break cheekweld anyway, otherwise that turret is just a blur so being able to physically feel the clicks is important for making adjustments without breaking cheekweld.
 
I agree with @MTETM about click spacing and mils per turn. My old (45-yo) eyes hate the tiny bit of space between clicks. I almost always have to count...and I have to wear bifocal safety glasses in order to read my turrets.
Never much go past 8-mils on my guns anymore.WWith all these newfangled second-turn indicators found on optics anymore, you'd think 10-mils would suffice.

It's not just a ZCO thing either. Bring back the 5-mil per turn Vortex Razor! ? <\rant>
 
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Just threw a zc420 mpct2 on one of our tikka demo rifles. The optic and reticle pairs so well with a clip-on.

IMG_20190717_214358_164.jpg
 
Read through the thread and didn’t find much but apologize if I missed it. ZCO from user feedback so far seems like a very nice optic, I have no hands on experience yet but from buddies who own them and review on the Hide, vast majority are very complimentary.

Most of us have probably seen the few Durability test videos from brand X or Y and I know some manufacturers keep the info close to home but any idea on how the ZCO is tested as far as durability goes?

Not questioning the quality by any means just curious as to what sort of testing it goes through and if it was public knowledge or not.

Anyone performed their own durability tests, on purpose or accidental? Lol

Thanks!

Both of mine have accidentally fallen onto tile floor while attached to rifles. No issues.

I toss them around on some props that require climbing, no issue.

And I’ve beaten on them with dead blow and rubber mallets without issue.
 
Both of mine have accidentally fallen onto tile floor while attached to rifles. No issues.

I toss them around on some props that require climbing, no issue.

And I’ve beaten on them with dead blow and rubber mallets without issue.

Noted. Glad they hold up on some abuse.
 
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Very nice setup (y)

A little edumacation please........not familiar with the rifle. What is it ?

Same with the scope mount, what is it ?
Blaser R8, adj comb. Put a Area 419 pic rail on forend. .300N/338L/9.3x62 barrels. Currently running the .300N 230 berger @ 2925 fps. All the barrels are real shooters. Blaser QD mount with Tier One 20 MOA Tactical rings designed for the Blaser mount.

Took the ZCO out for a run this afternoon. Super impressed and like everyone on this thread I have owned or do own all the alphas (except Henry) and the ZCO just blows me away!


First 2 shots after a simple bore sighting. Second dot after one adjustment and on the mark. Confirmed at 300/400/550 off the tripod. Will hammer it out further in the next few days but it has been a great for me out to 2K with NF/TT/SB scopes.

I am sure I will be springing for the 527 after just one day with this little beauty.

E9663374-F38F-41CC-8C5D-BC6DBFC89669.jpeg254F69D7-9090-4F85-860D-39620AE45446.jpeg
 
I've always been curious how the Blaser R8's perform, love the straight back bolt design, not sure how much I like the scope being mounted directly to the barrel, but it does offer for different scopes with each barrel depending on application, thanks for sharing experience with both the Blaser and the ZCO.
 
It's a good day when you get a call from a 916 area code. I was thinking no way my @CSTactical 5-27 MPCT2 was coming anytime soon, and sure as heck Richard was on the other end.

Wallet hurts from from 2 ZCOs in back to back months. ? Really pumped to get time behind it. Thanks CST!
 
It's a good day when you get a call from a 916 area code. I was thinking no way my @CSTactical 5-27 MPCT2 was coming anytime soon, and sure as heck Richard was on the other end.

Wallet hurts from from 2 ZCOs in back to back months. ? Really pumped to get time behind it. Thanks CST!
Image result for did i do that gif
 
I literally dreamed last night that I got a call from @CSTactical about my ZCO 527 shipping out soon. Woke up disappointed.

Few hours later, Richard called.

Finally get to see what all this hoopla is about. :D
I had a dream that CS Tactical shipped me a ZCO free of charge :ROFLMAO:
 
Yall really need to quit this shit out...trying to decide between ZCO 5-27 or TT525P Gen3XR
ZCO lol as a package or overall scope I feel personally it’s the best. Yes the TT is better in some areas, but for an overall feature set the ZCO to me is the best. Especially since the 420 gives up basically nothing to the big scopes.
 
ZCO lol as a package or overall scope I feel personally it’s the best. Yes the TT is better in some areas, but for an overall feature set the ZCO to me is the best. Especially since the 420 gives up basically nothing to the big scopes.
Noob has experience with the TT and ZCO, in fact, he just shot with the ZCO at the NRL match held here in Colorado a couple weeks ago - his advice is trustworthy. Most will still tell you the TT turrets are the best and glass is probably still king; however, there are features on the ZCO you will not find on the TT, like the locking turrets, red "and green" illumination, $1k cheaper and as always, the ever personal reticle choice. I think the choice between the TT525P and the ZC527 is probably a harder choice if both are within your price; however, the ZC420 is something that TT does not offer, this is truly one of the best ultra short scopes out there with regard to optical/mechanical execution and gives up little FOV at the bottom but gains you 5x at the top over the TT315 series.
 
Noob has experience with the TT and ZCO, in fact, he just shot with the ZCO at the NRL match held here in Colorado a couple weeks ago - his advice is trustworthy. Most will still tell you the TT turrets are the best and glass is probably still king; however, there are features on the ZCO you will not find on the TT, like the locking turrets, red "and green" illumination, $1k cheaper and as always, the ever personal reticle choice. I think the choice between the TT525P and the ZC527 is probably a harder choice if both are within your price; however, the ZC420 is something that TT does not offer, this is truly one of the best ultra short scopes out there with regard to optical/mechanical execution and gives up little FOV at the bottom but gains you 5x at the top over the TT315 series.

Thanks for that brother! Appreciate the endorsement. I think something else that seldom gets mentioned is I love the the lower profile turrets. When hunting with the TT vs the ZCO I really noticed it.
 
Noob has experience with the TT and ZCO, in fact, he just shot with the ZCO at the NRL match held here in Colorado a couple weeks ago - his advice is trustworthy. Most will still tell you the TT turrets are the best and glass is probably still king; however, there are features on the ZCO you will not find on the TT, like the locking turrets, red "and green" illumination, $1k cheaper and as always, the ever personal reticle choice. I think the choice between the TT525P and the ZC527 is probably a harder choice if both are within your price; however, the ZC420 is something that TT does not offer, this is truly one of the best ultra short scopes out there with regard to optical/mechanical execution and gives up little FOV at the bottom but gains you 5x at the top over the TT315 series.
Plus when time to use WARRANTY! :) (youll never know)
ZC is the winner for that part.jeff and the gang easy to get a hold and they're in state side
 
Plus when time to use WARRANTY! :) (youll never know)
ZC is the winner for that part.jeff and the gang easy to get a hold and they're in state side
For me, this is a huge plus. Sounds like TT's warranty and CS is also top notch, but being able to ship within the states is beneficial for those of us living here. TT is not horrible being up in Canada, but if I can avoid customs, always a plus!
 
For me, this is a huge plus. Sounds like TT's warranty and CS is also top notch, but being able to ship within the states is beneficial for those of us living here. TT is not horrible being up in Canada, but if I can avoid customs, always a plus!

So to touch on the TT warranty briefly, I’ve used it a couple times, they make it super easy.

I sent in my last TT for what I thought was a canted reticle (was not, it was my testing error) but they emailed me a prepaid shipping label no questions asked, I just had to pack the scope and drop it off at my nearest ups. I got a personal call from Andy Webber (owner of ATI) and we proceeded to talk about scopes for the next 30 minutes. He personally looked at and had mine sitting on his desk while we were on the phone.
He then proceeded to inform me he was going on a fishing trip for the next couple weeks but wanted to make sure I was taken care of to full satisfaction before he left. I agreed. He said he’d get my scope back to me ASAP. I said no problem thank you for all your time, and that was it.
I honestly thought it would another 5ish days before I got it back. No problem. Little did I know, the NEXT DAY I got a surprise at my mailbox. He had overnighted it back to me. That was incredible. I never once asked or mentioned needing my scope back in any sort of quick turnaround.

ETA: all that is to say the TT warranty service is EASY. Not to derail this thread.
I will update with ZCO experience, but just briefly speaking with the guys at ZCO they’re top shelf as well.
 
So to touch on the TT warranty briefly, I’ve used it a couple times, they make it super easy.

I sent in my last TT for what I thought was a canted reticle (was not, it was my testing error) but they emailed me a prepaid shipping label no questions asked, I just had to pack the scope and drop it off at my nearest ups. I got a personal call from Andy Webber (owner of ATI) and we proceeded to talk about scopes for the next 30 minutes. He personally looked at and had mine sitting on his desk while we were on the phone.
He then proceeded to inform me he was going on a fishing trip for the next couple weeks but wanted to make sure I was taken care of to full satisfaction before he left. I agreed. He said he’d get my scope back to me ASAP. I said no problem thank you for all your time, and that was it.
I honestly thought it would another 5ish days before I got it back. No problem. Little did I know, the NEXT DAY I got a surprise at my mailbox. He had overnighted it back to me. That was incredible. I never once asked or mentioned needing my scope back in any sort of quick turnaround.

ETA: all that is to say the TT warranty service is EASY. Not to derail this thread.
I will update with ZCO experience, but just briefly speaking with the guys at ZCO they’re top shelf as well.
So it went to Canada and back without having to go through customs? I'm assuming it was because it was marked as repair and not a purchase, but that is good to know.