Trimble Juno T-41/Field Firing Solutions Delta V System Review

[AIAW]

This "review" is more aimed at someone who has never used this software (or hardware) before. Consider it a crash-intro so to speak. I've been running this combination for a while now and figured it was time for a review of these two systems paired up since no one else has. I'd imagine that most people that are currently utilizing FFS Delta V are probably running this on different, previous generation hardware. Understandable, since the entire Windows Mobile and even the hardware itself to an extent is quite antiquated by today's mobile standards. Be aware that there is an Android OS available, but FFS will only work with Windows Mobile.

Juno T-41-X Hardware

I won't go into detailed hardware details as it's a rather boring journey that honestly doesn't mean much in the long run. I think touching on the highlights will be sufficient before diving into the software itself (for those who haven't perhaps used it before).

Firstly, the hardware itself. The Juno T-41-X has been out for a few years now. It comes standard with a 4.3" WVGA Gorilla-Glass capacitive touch screen, 2-4 meter GPS receiver, 8MP camera with flash and an IP65 (yellow) or IP68 (grey) ingress rating. Optional are a 1-2 meter GPS receiver, 3.75G cellular radio, RFID and barcode scanning - within a larger form-factor and different model designation.

I've found that normally a typical day at the range (6-8 hours) running FFS constantly with a 5 minute screen backlight timeout will leave the unit with about 65 percent battery capacity remaining. Not too shabby. I do have the extended battery pack as well which adds roughly 80 percent capacity. The external battery pack is configurable to either run the unit, or to charge the internal battery. I have it running the unit in order to save charge cycles on the internal battery - if that even really matters. It charges via a proprietary USB-to-9-PIN serial cable - 2A outlet charger takes roughly 4 hours to charge both packs. PC USB takes considerably longer - up to 12 hours (.5A versus 2A) - USB 3.0 will charge it (and most any other device) considerably faster since it is rated for 1.0A - 1.5A depending on the specification and USB chipset vendor.

Yeah, it's heavy... well worth the weight to me. Might not be for others.

FFS Delta V Software

If you are in the Kestrel Horus or Applied Ballistics world like I was for a few years, this is where I'll describe the major differences - there are plenty to cover. Please note that FFS doesn't do away with the need for a Kestrel - you still need the Kestrel (or similar) to give you environmental information. What you won't need is the ballistics calculator in any of them.

First off, I know someone is going to scream "It's a totally different form factor that weighs around 10 times more than a Kestrel and the Kestrel gives me good dope as-is". Mine still does too! This won't be a bashing contest against Kestrel Horus or AB because they are outstanding at what they do. They are simply a different - and more simple - tool for the job. I want to highlight more of the differences between the two - ignoring the obvious weight, form factor, cost and lastly learning curve. You won't pop open a little quick start guide for FFS and be up and running in an hour! The program will come from Lex Talus on either a Standard SD or Micro-SD card. I suggest the Micro-SD as you can always change hardware and either run a SD adapter or not. The program does not install on your device - it can only be ran from the SD card itself. This being said, it will run on any hardware that meets the minimum specifications just by moving the card.

Environmental

Like the previous versions, Delta V does not use density altitude by default. You can reference a chart of course to determine station pressure, but the program will want temperature and station pressure as it's main environmental inputs. Note that station pressure is not barometric pressure and the application can use either as long as you tell it which you are inputting. You can also link a Kestrel via Bluetooth to pull this data in near real-time.

Along with environmentals, FFS allows you to set a "powder temperature offsets" that will impose a "fps increase or decrease per degree" ambient temperature change. For instance, through data I have collected I have found H1000 to give a 0.7 FPS increase in velocity per degree Fahrenheit temperature increase over my zero-day temperature. 1.1 FPS per degree F appears to be a good all-around metric for Varget for instance.

Rifle Profiles

This is where things start to get very customizable versus Kestrel AB/Horus. The rifle profile is the basis around most of the application. It allows you to select a particular rifle, but jointly also select bullets to fire out of that rifle - dynamically. (I don't mean loaded rounds when I say "bullets" here).

As you can see, you input the basic rifle information here. Even with the commonality of switch-barrel systems these days, think of this being "the barrel". Twist rate is the only variable from this screen that are used additively in ballistic calculations.

Shooter - This is for team shooters that may use the same rifle. It provides the ability to filter based on this name for different zero offsets, etc. You can setup the same rifle data with a different shooter. I believe there are easier ways to really do this though.
Bullet - Will be the default bullet profile that the rifle is zeroed to.
Turret - The optic that is attached to this rifle.
Count Tab - Lets you keep track of you round count for this rifle, with dates and cumulative round counts.
Notes - Just a general text field where you can put any text notes you might have.

Bullet Profiles

This is where you'd build the profile for the actual bullet. Most of this is going to be rather self-explanatory but I will cover a few of the fields.

BC - Obviously this is the ballistic coefficient of this bullet. I'll cover this more as an important thing to note is that Delta V does not use exacting G1 values. Calculation is almost always a must.
DK - We don't touch that - ever! That's an "all else has failed, let me mess with this" field. It basically alters the way the engine generates values.
Min. Twist - This is the minimum twist rate that this bullet should be fired though. It's informational, no calculations are used from it.
Powder Temperature - Remember earlier when I was talking about powder temperature offsets? This is where you set the "zero-temp" for this particular velocity/powder. It's a selectable item that can be turned on or off on demand.
Notes - That's just where I put some reloading details about that particular bullet/brass/primer combination. You can put anything you want to here.

Turret Profiles

As you can see here, this is where you optics profile is associated. All of the normal information in here, relatively straight-forward.

"Scope Click Values" are used to true your turret for actual real-world click data. Who knows, your optic might actual equal 1.1 MILs in 10 clicks due to random variables. (I track-test all of my scopes right out of the box.)

The "Scale" section is used to set the values for "clicks" to the actual scale printed on the turret (1 MIL on a S&B DT MTC turret equals 10 clicks).

Offset Profiles

This is a very powerful feature. It allows you to fire the same bullets with an altered zero offset. You still need a dedicated "suppressed" (it can be called anything but used for a shorter barrel, different barrel, etc.) bullet profile so your BC calculations at that speed are used, but you can maintain the same physical equipment zero across all bullets (and even calibers). Requires you to fire and actually measure the offset from your zeroed round though. Just remember - a change in this zeroed round will affect everything else because it is the "foundation" upon the offsets! I won't go any deeper into those as it gets rather involved. Just know that it's possible and it works.

Target Profiles

These are a rather nice feature. Targets are defined either by strictly distance (with no bearing information) or via the method pictured. If you create a profile with coordinates and angle, the program will give you the magnetic bearing and cosine to the target from your set FFP. This is useful for Coriolis/Eotvos calculations with magnetic variation. Useful if you know the exacting coordinates but don't have a LRF (for some reason). Target profiles can also be grouped together and bound to a FFP if desired. There are several LRF (Vectronix having the most support) for direct-targeting information linking via a serial cable.

The Final Firing Position screen is rather self-explanatory.

Main Screen

This is where all of your different profiles will comprise your dope, etc. You can get a full target profile dope list, or you can manually type in a distance.

A single wind direction can be input on the main screen. If you are firing in an environment that has multiple wind directions out to your target, you can resolve for that as well with "Wind Vector Zones".

The small box next to the range is the projectile metrics button. The color of the box indicates the velocity of the bullet at that distance. White/tan equals supersonic. Yellow equals transonic. Red equals subsonic. Pink-White means that the bullet would have to be fired at such a ridiculous angle that it would probably never even make it to the target.

Speed will be target speed. Heading is target direction.

T is your Target profile selector
R is your Rifle profile selector
O is your Offset profile selector
B is your Bullet profile selector

There are many, many tools inside of Delta V as well. Stability Calculator, BC Calculator, Muzzle Velocity Calculator... as well as references for different measurements and conversion formulas.

Speaking of the BC Calculator; In my experience it is almost mandatory that you calculate a custom BC with this application for any true long-distance (or otherwise transonic-bound) shots. I start out with the advertised G1, but calculate the final BC using the POI method right above the transonic boundary. Before doing this, just make sure you have some solid loads with a preferable single-digit SD. You want your POI's to be as true as possible for the POI BC calculation to be valuable.

Overall for the average user I would have to award the following summary attributes to this system:

Pros:

A) About as much detail as you can get in or out of any handheld system.

B) If you have a ton of rifles and some of them fire the same bullets with different barrel lengths and with/without a suppressor.

C) You want to increase your first-round-hit probability substantially at distance (cold-bore or a clean-bore offset comes to mind).

D) LRF interfacing.

E) GPS coordinate and target "mapping".

F) You like the "science" behind it all. If you hate collecting data, this isn't for you. Then again, you might be in the wrong hobby to begin with if this is the case.

G) LOS Metrics "obstacle avoidance" is a very nice feature.

H) You get to turn your Kestrel AB/Horus into a backup ballistics solution.

Cons:

A) It can be a little expensive at $1750 for the hardware (new) and $395 for the software. Units can be found used for much less.

B) The learning curve can be a little much for some.

C) It's heavy and bulky - still beats the hell out of the Trimble Nomad (although you do get a limited mechanical number pad with the Nomad).

D) You won't get the 6-month battery life that you get out of a Kestrel! Think hours instead of months.

E) Still requires you to carry weather instrumentation for atmospherics.

F) Capacitive touch screen. Useless with gloves on and sometimes a stylus doesn't work well. Resistive would have been much better, but it's difficult to get accurate clicks on a small screen with resistive screens. Capacitive are also way more rugged.

G) If it matters to you, you can forget staring at the Juno screen with NV.

Blaine Fields (the creator of Field Firing Solutions) is a great guy and will help you out with anything that he can. http://www.lextalus.com will give you virtually all of the information you'd ever need if you ever want to make the switch. He also has hours and hours of training videos on the operation of the software.


Feel free to let me know if you have any questions.

 

[ZiaHunter]

Thanks for the post. Currently running FFS on a Trimble 900 and have a Juno 5D on order and plan to migrate FFS to that unit. Use a 4500AB as well and both have a place in my kit.

 

[Emouse]

Anyone running FFS on a Tallatech RPDA? I know ASHBURY sold this as a set but have yet to see it in the wild?

 

[AIAW]

Haven't seen the (now Elbit Systems) RPDA-57 in use, but according to the specs it should work well.

Outside of Trimble products I have also seen the Glacier Ridgeline Q100 and the AmRel Rocky DF6 in use, and have a good used market out there as well. A bit bulkier, but built like an absolute tank.

 

[Bull81]

Great post and very informative, I'm currently in the market for a Juno myself.

 

[CoryT]

I've got an RPDA-57, but I much prefer the Nomad. Eblit is not interested in commercial sales, or support of existing units in civilian hands, so it's practically worthless.

 

[AIAW]

Nice. I do miss a physical keyboard sometimes, mainly in glove weather.

Have you had anyone come out with a Juniper Mesa? That screen on that thing would make a nice range toy I believe. It's just so big I don't think I'd want to hump it around!

 

[_Windrider_]

F) Capacitive touch screen. Useless with gloves on and sometimes a stylus doesn't work well. Resistive would have been much better, but it's difficult to get accurate clicks on a small screen with resistive screens. Capacitive are also way more rugged.

you can buy conductive thread and stitch into the fingers of any glove. This makes all gloves compatible with capacitive screens.

 

[AIAW]

I've had someone ask me a question that should be covered. Being that this was originally a broad overview I see no reason that it shouldn't start including more advanced discussions. To be honest, CoryT probably has more field time with FFS than anyone else so he would be a top-notch person to receive responses from as well. I wouldn't go and PM him questions, but rather post them here.

The question pertained to POI method BC calculations with Vertical Deflection enabled. The train of thought would logically be to disable this option only for calibrating an accurate BC that FFS would use but this would be incorrect under a few scenarios. It is only a valid operation in one.

First, where is it valid to disable Vertical Deflection while calculating a BC for a particular bullet? This would apply when you can undeniably verify that you have absolutely zero wind influencing the bullet flight path to a target in the transonic range. The chances of ever experiencing such a lack of wind influence to the degree that you'd consider worthy of calculating a solid BC is going to be rare. Max ordinate wind influence especially. If you do not set all wind-zone values (or just the single zone) to 0 then you will get invalid results here. The BC calculation is not a special mode - it's simply asking you if POI was high or low of your POA and computing a BC difference that makes the vertical (elevation) data sync which you must then use in your bullet profile.

In my experience with the application, it is best to leave Vertical Deflection enabled constantly, but always input absolutely accurate wind data into the app. The more zones the better. The goal is for the engine to "cancel out" these effects in essence by factoring them in. Like anything else though, garbage-in, garbage-out. I've only ever tested this with a DoF at bearing 0-15 degrees magnetic, so I cannot comment on Eötvös/Coriolis concerning elevation. I would imagine that still you'd want this enabled for any DoF for both windage and elevation negation. It is always enabled in my application.

The thing to remember is to always put a valid wind speed in the application, even if you already know what the wind is and what to DOPE for it in your head. Some people only use the application for elevation and that is where the disconnect comes from. It needs that wind value to make an accurate calculation for elevation as well (with Vertical Deflection enabled).

 

[CoryT]

I would agree, I leave all the solution enhancements on all the time. I turn them off for demonstrations, showing how the solution is affected by each one, but otherwise, leave them on. When calculating the BC, you should indeed have the correct wind value entered and the enhancements ON. I'm not really sure it matters on a measurable scale if you enter the wind as zones, or just enter a wind value that matches your actual hold/drift value for the shots fired. Given that there are multiple combinations of wind values in three zones that would produce the same total drift, I can't see that entering zones would be helpful unless the range was instrumented is some way as to capture ACTUAL wind values along the bullet path.

 

[AIAW]

I would agree, I leave all the solution enhancements on all the time. I turn them off for demonstrations, showing how the solution is affected by each one, but otherwise, leave them on. When calculating the BC, you should indeed have the correct wind value entered and the enhancements ON. I'm not really sure it matters on a measurable scale if you enter the wind as zones, or just enter a wind value that matches your actual hold/drift value for the shots fired. Given that there are multiple combinations of wind values in three zones that would produce the same total drift, I can't see that entering zones would be helpful unless the range was instrumented is some way as to capture ACTUAL wind values along the bullet path.

Thanks Cory. Absolutely agreed. I should have left the bit about the wind zones out because as you stated it honestly shouldn't make a difference at all.

 

[The Angler]

Thanks for the review.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[AIAW]

Updated broken images

 

[Nik H]

Ver

This "review" is more aimed at someone who has never used this software (or hardware) before. Consider it a crash-intro so to speak. I've been running this combination for a while now and figured it was time for a review of these two systems paired up since no one else has. I'd imagine that most people that are currently utilizing FFS Delta V are probably running this on different, previous generation hardware. Understandable, since the entire Windows Mobile and even the hardware itself to an extent is quite antiquated by today's mobile standards. Be aware that there is an Android OS available, but FFS will only work with Windows Mobile.

Juno T-41-X Hardware

I won't go into detailed hardware details as it's a rather boring journey that honestly doesn't mean much in the long run. I think touching on the highlights will be sufficient before diving into the software itself (for those who haven't perhaps used it before).

Firstly, the hardware itself. The Juno T-41-X has been out for a few years now. It comes standard with a 4.3" WVGA Gorilla-Glass capacitive touch screen, 2-4 meter GPS receiver, 8MP camera with flash and an IP65 (yellow) or IP68 (grey) ingress rating. Optional are a 1-2 meter GPS receiver, 3.75G cellular radio, RFID and barcode scanning - within a larger form-factor and different model designation.

I've found that normally a typical day at the range (6-8 hours) running FFS constantly with a 5 minute screen backlight timeout will leave the unit with about 65 percent battery capacity remaining. Not too shabby. I do have the extended battery pack as well which adds roughly 80 percent capacity. The external battery pack is configurable to either run the unit, or to charge the internal battery. I have it running the unit in order to save charge cycles on the internal battery - if that even really matters. It charges via a proprietary USB-to-9-PIN serial cable - 2A outlet charger takes roughly 4 hours to charge both packs. PC USB takes considerably longer - up to 12 hours (.5A versus 2A) - USB 3.0 will charge it (and most any other device) considerably faster since it is rated for 1.0A - 1.5A depending on the specification and USB chipset vendor.

View attachment 7000649

Yeah, it's heavy... well worth the weight to me. Might not be for others.

FFS Delta V Software

If you are in the Kestrel Horus or Applied Ballistics world like I was for a few years, this is where I'll describe the major differences - there are plenty to cover. Please note that FFS doesn't do away with the need for a Kestrel - you still need the Kestrel (or similar) to give you environmental information. What you won't need is the ballistics calculator in any of them.

First off, I know someone is going to scream "It's a totally different form factor that weighs around 10 times more than a Kestrel and the Kestrel gives me good dope as-is". Mine still does too! This won't be a bashing contest against Kestrel Horus or AB because they are outstanding at what they do. They are simply a different - and more simple - tool for the job. I want to highlight more of the differences between the two - ignoring the obvious weight, form factor, cost and lastly learning curve. You won't pop open a little quick start guide for FFS and be up and running in an hour! The program will come from Lex Talus on either a Standard SD or Micro-SD card. I suggest the Micro-SD as you can always change hardware and either run a SD adapter or not. The program does not install on your device - it can only be ran from the SD card itself. This being said, it will run on any hardware that meets the minimum specifications just by moving the card.

Environmental

Like the previous versions, Delta V does not use density altitude by default. You can reference a chart of course to determine station pressure, but the program will want temperature and station pressure as it's main environmental inputs. Note that station pressure is not barometric pressure and the application can use either as long as you tell it which you are inputting. You can also link a Kestrel via Bluetooth to pull this data in near real-time.

View attachment 7000652

Along with environmentals, FFS allows you to set a "powder temperature offsets" that will impose a "fps increase or decrease per degree" ambient temperature change. For instance, through data I have collected I have found H1000 to give a 2.2 FPS increase in velocity per degree Fahrenheit temperature increase over my zero-day temperature. 1.2 FPS per degree F appears to be a good all-around metric for Varget for instance.

Rifle Profiles

This is where things start to get very customizable versus Kestrel AB/Horus. The rifle profile is the basis around most of the application. It allows you to select a particular rifle, but jointly also select bullets to fire out of that rifle - dynamically. (I don't mean loaded rounds when I say "bullets" here).

View attachment 7000651

As you can see, you input the basic rifle information here. Even with the commonality of switch-barrel systems these days, think of this being "the barrel". Twist rate is the only variable from this screen that are used additively in ballistic calculations.

Shooter - This is for team shooters that may use the same rifle. It provides the ability to filter based on this name for different zero offsets, etc. You can setup the same rifle data with a different shooter. I believe there are easier ways to really do this though.
Bullet - Will be the default bullet profile that the rifle is zeroed to.
Turret - The optic that is attached to this rifle.
Count Tab - Lets you keep track of you round count for this rifle, with dates and cumulative round counts.
Notes - Just a general text field where you can put any text notes you might have.

Bullet Profiles

This is where you'd build the profile for the actual bullet. Most of this is going to be rather self-explanatory but I will cover a few of the fields.

View attachment 7000653

BC - Obviously this is the ballistic coefficient of this bullet. I'll cover this more as an important thing to note is that Delta V does not use exacting G1 values. Calculation is almost always a must.
DK - We don't touch that - ever! That's an "all else has failed, let me mess with this" field. It basically alters the way the engine generates values.
Min. Twist - This is the minimum twist rate that this bullet should be fired though. It's informational, no calculations are used from it.
Powder Temperature - Remember earlier when I was talking about power temperature offsets? This is where you set the "zero-temp" for this particular velocity/powder. It's a selectable item that can be turned on or off on demand.
Notes - That's just where I put some reloading details about that particular bullet/brass/primer combination. You can put anything you want to here.

Turret Profiles

As you can see here, this is where you optics profile is associated. All of the normal information in here, relatively straight-forward.

View attachment 7000654

"Scope Click Values" are used to true your turret for actual real-world click data. Who knows, your optic might actual equal 1.1 MILs in 10 clicks due to random variables. (I track-test all of my scopes right out of the box.)

The "Scale" section is used to set the values for "clicks" to the actual scale printed on the turret (1 MIL on a S&B DT MTC turret equals 10 clicks).

Offset Profiles

This is a very powerful feature. It allows you to fire the same bullets with an altered zero offset. You still need a dedicated "suppressed" (it can be called anything but used for a shorter barrel, different barrel, etc.) bullet profile so your BC calculations at that speed are used, but you can maintain the same physical equipment zero across all bullets (and even calibers). Requires you to fire and actually measure the offset from your zeroed round though. Just remember - a change in this zeroed round will affect everything else because it is the "foundation" upon the offsets! I won't go any deeper into those as it gets rather involved. Just know that it's possible and it works.

Target Profiles

View attachment 7000655

These are a rather nice feature. Targets are defined either by strictly distance (with no bearing information) or via the method pictured. If you create a profile with coordinates and angle, the program will give you the magnetic bearing and cosine to the target from your set FFP. This is useful for Coriolis/Eotvos calculations with magnetic variation. Useful if you know the exacting coordinates but don't have a LRF (for some reason). Target profiles can also be grouped together and bound to a FFP if desired. There are several LRF (Vectronix having the most support) for direct-targeting information linking via a serial cable.

The Final Firing Position screen is rather self-explanatory.

View attachment 7000656

Main Screen

This is where all of your different profiles will comprise your dope, etc. You can get a full target profile dope list, or you can manually type in a distance.

View attachment 7000657

A single wind direction can be input on the main screen. If you are firing in an environment that has multiple wind directions out to your target, you can resolve for that as well with "Wind Vector Zones".

View attachment 7000659

The small box next to the range is the projectile metrics button. The color of the box indicates the velocity of the bullet at that distance. White/tan equals supersonic. Yellow equals transonic. Red equals subsonic. Pink-White means that the bullet would have to be fired at such a ridiculous angle that it would probably never even make it to the target.

View attachment 7000660

Speed will be target speed. Heading is target direction.

T is your Target profile selector
R is your Rifle profile selector
O is your Offset profile selector
B is your Bullet profile selector

There are many, many tools inside of Delta V as well. Stability Calculator, BC Calculator, Muzzle Velocity Calculator... as well as references for different measurements and conversion formulas.

Speaking of the BC Calculator; In my experience it is almost mandatory that you calculate a custom BC with this application for any true long-distance (or otherwise transonic-bound) shots. I start out with the advertised G1, but calculate the final BC using the POI method right above the transonic boundary. Before doing this, just make sure you have some solid loads with a preferable single-digit SD. You want your POI's to be as true as possible for the POI BC calculation to be valuable.

Overall for the average user I would have to award the following summary attributes to this system:

Pros:

A) About as much detail as you can get in or out of any handheld system.

B) If you have a ton of rifles and some of them fire the same bullets with different barrel lengths and with/without a suppressor.

C) You want to increase your first-round-hit probability substantially at distance (cold-bore or a clean-bore offset comes to mind).

D) LRF interfacing.

E) GPS coordinate and target "mapping".

F) You like the "science" behind it all. If you hate collecting data, this isn't for you. Then again, you might be in the wrong hobby to begin with if this is the case.

G) LOS Metrics "obstacle avoidance" is a very nice feature.

H) You get to turn your Kestrel AB/Horus into a backup ballistics solution.

Cons:

A) It can be a little expensive at $1750 for the hardware (new) and $395 for the software. Units can be found used for much less.

B) The learning curve can be a little much for some.

C) It's heavy and bulky - still beats the hell out of the Trimble Nomad (although you do get a limited mechanical number pad with the Nomad).

D) You won't get the 6-month battery life that you get out of a Kestrel! Think hours instead of months.

E) Still requires you to carry weather instrumentation for atmospherics.

F) Capacitive touch screen. Useless with gloves on and sometimes a stylus doesn't work well. Resistive would have been much better, but it's difficult to get accurate clicks on a small screen with resistive screens. Capacitive are also way more rugged.

G) If it matters to you, you can forget staring at the Juno screen with NV.

Blaine Fields (the creator of Field Firing Solutions) is a great guy and will help you out with anything that he can. http://www.lextalus.com will give you virtually all of the information you'd ever need if you ever want to make the switch. He also has hours and hours of training videos on the operation of the software.


Feel free to let me know if you have any questions.

Very nice review of FFS. I use a Trimble with CB and a Kestrel Elite. Been thinking about FFS...have a few other priorities now but I will save this for a reference

 

[AIAW]

Ver

Very nice review of FFS. I use a Trimble with CB and a Kestrel Elite. Been thinking about FFS...have a few other priorities now but I will save this for a reference

Thanks! Let me know if you need any help with it once you get into it.

I run CB as well on my Trimble. It's a great program in my opinion and for some might be a good fit, but I always find myself going back to FFS.

 

[AIAW]

Also, FFS will essentially run on any Windows Mobile 5.0 or 6.x device (6.x recommended)
624 MHz minimum for the CPU
128MB of RAM minimum (not to be confused with storage)
SD or Micro-SD card slot mandatory. SD adapters generally will not work

Here are a few devices that are options outside of the Trimble Juno T-41 that are recommened and compatible:

Trimble Nomad 800L/900L
Motorola MC75/MC75A
Honeywell Dolphin 99EX
Dolphin 9700
Nautiz X7
Psion EP10
Pharos 565E

 

[_Windrider_]

Also, FFS will essentially run on any Windows Mobile 5.0 or 6.x device (6.x recommended)
624 MHz minimum for the CPU
128MB of RAM minimum (not to be confused with storage)
SD or Micro-SD card slot mandatory. SD adapters generally will not work

Here are a few devices that are options outside of the Trimble Juno T-41 that are recommened and compatible:

Trimble Nomad 800L/900L
Motorola MC75/MC75A
Honeywell Dolphin 99EX
Dolphin 9700
Nautiz X7
Psion EP10
Pharos 565E

I use it on a nomad 800 and a Pharos. However the Pharos is not field worthy. I wouldn’t use it anywhere but my house.

 

[AIAW]

I only have FFS experience with the Juno, Nomad and MC75 myself. I listed it because it technically "works" but I totally agree, it's entirely not field-worthy. My buddy has one that he got super-cheap. Feels like a dollar store calculator.

 

[GIXXER2000]

I have been running FFS for over 4 years on the Trimble 900 bought the package from Blaine at FFS web site. I did have 1 issues my card got corrupted and i sent back to Blaine and he reflash it with the latest update and it works great. I was out this morning shooting out to 2446 yards and the data from FFS was right on. I was shooting at targets from 1205 to 2446 and elevation call out was correct at every distance. I am shooting a AI-PSR .338LM 27 in barrel with 300gr Berger OTM's.

 

[AIAW]

I have been running FFS for over 4 years on the Trimble 900 bought the package from Blaine at FFS web site. I did have 1 issues my card got corrupted and i sent back to Blaine and he reflash it with the latest update and it works great. I was out this morning shooting out to 2446 yards and the data from FFS was right on. I was shooting at targets from 1205 to 2446 and elevation call out was correct at every distance. I am shooting a AI-PSR .338LM 27 in barrel with 300gr Berger OTM's.

You sir are having a good day then!

It does happen. He uses high-quality SD cards but they do have a finite lifetime unfortunately. He is very responsive to replacing those, like you experienced.

Once you get it setup correctly and everything it's great. That's some good distance there - pretty much the entire engine is being put through the paces. If you are hitting those distances consistently I am sure you did a BC calculation for those OTM's?

 

[GIXXER2000]

Yes i have done a lot of truing and tweeking the of the parameters in the presets. I also Bluetooth my Kestrel and have the GPS setting on. I think the reason more people don't use FFS is that it does require time to learn the system and most people was instant answers with little effort. I use FFS for .223,243,6cm,6.5cm, 308, 300wm and .338LM. I have a 33xc barrel on order so that will be next.

 

[ZiaHunter]

Run FFS on both a Nomad and Juno with the Juno having CB on it as well. Been using FFS for several years and it is my goto solver. For ELR I tether it to a LRF which is co-witnessed with the spotter. See a target in the spotter, ping it and you instantaneously have a solution. Build range cards from a FFP and and you have the coordinates for every target. Change FFP, change target, change rifle...no problem. FFS makes the necessary adjustments and even recalculates windage based on DOF as well LOS. Try that with other solvers. Attended the Gunsite XLR class twice and the second time around Cory and I did a head to head test of FFS v CB. Shot out to 2200 and the solutions were basically the same. Once you get into the weeds with FFS you will come to appreciate it. will be using this same setup for Ko2M.

 

[AIAW]

I've seen your setup ZiaHunter. Very well done rig you have.

 

[_Windrider_]

I wonder what FFS is going to do when Windows Mobile dies this year.

 

[AIAW]

Windows Mobile 5.x and 6.x has been "dead" for years actually. Won't hurt Lex or Patagonia one bit. It's a stable ancient OS running on ancient hardware. Needs no Internet connectivity or OS updates in order to function for what it does.

What Microsoft means is that it's entirely out of their hands in any function or fashion for new development. You'd be surprised how many Windows CE devices UPS and FedEx has out in the field for instance.

 

[_Windrider_]

Windows Mobile 5.x and 6.x has been "dead" for years actually. Won't hurt Lex or Patagonia one bit. It's a stable ancient OS running on ancient hardware. Needs no Internet connectivity or OS updates in order to function for what it does.

What Microsoft means is that it's entirely out of their hands in any function or fashion for new development. You'd be surprised how many Windows CE devices UPS and FedEx has out in the field for instance.

Oh I understand that. But at some point it’s going to become unstable. Then what? It won’t work forever. Not to mention as much as I love FFS, it needs a refresh. It could be so much faster to get solutions if we applied some modern programming techniques.

 

[AIAW]

As long as compatible ARM processors are manufactured OR the current devices continue to function it can run no problem no matter what Microsoft says. There are still firmware copies of WM6.x that the manufactures have. Even if a device that runs WM 6.x now dies in 2025 that same firmware image could still be applied to the same device as long as said device is functional. Microsoft isn't going to ban WM installs, but call-in tech support and software support. The OS won't magically degrade unless there is a hardware problem (flash memory degradation for instance). Flash can be replaced and the WM OS reloaded, no worries there.

Any software developer that knows a particular OS is end-of-life knows what he/she is dealing with also. It can be programmed specifically for that one OS (and generally a single task) with all caveats in mind. For instance, unlike a modern smartphone, UPS/FedEx handhelds have a single task - scan packages and transmit that data to the truck transceiver. Windows Mobile is so dated already that no one ever concerns Microsoft is development and support - everything is a work-around because of limitations that already exist and have existed in Windows Mobile forever. Microsoft just wants the liability off of their books.

Lex Talus and Patagonia know that ARM is an dead CPU architecture, they also know that Windows Mobile/CE is a dead OS, but it's stable as hell along with the ancient but seasoned hardware.

Same reason that the Space Shuttle Atlantis (all the way to it's retirement) used IBM APA-101S CPU's from 1981 - proven stability.

Whether Lex Talus or Patagonia will update their core ballistics software (and not some cheap spin-off) to a more modern OS, who knows. Right now that would be doubtful. Android would probably be their answer though (and even that is iffy honestly) given the rocky stability with Windows Mobile 8.x and newer.

 

[ZiaHunter]

"I wonder what FFS is going to do when Windows Mobile dies this year. "

FFS is only a infinitesimal fraction of software that run on Windows mobile. Surveying and spatial control in construction and Ag are by far the biggest users and drive the market. Based on the large investment by industry, Windows Mobile will be around for a very long time. It is a legacy OS but is very stable and frankly does very well in what is was designed to do.

 

[AIAW]

"I wonder what FFS is going to do when Windows Mobile dies this year. "

FFS is only a infinitesimal fraction of software that run on Windows mobile. Surveying and spatial control in construction and Ag are by far the biggest users and drive the market. Based on the large investment by industry, Windows Mobile will be around for a very long time. It is a legacy OS but is very stable and frankly does very well in what is was designed to do.

True, I totally forgot the application in GIS and control. Good point.

 

[LastShot300]

Whether Lex Talus or Patagonia will update their core ballistics software (and not some cheap spin-off) to a more modern OS, who knows. Right now that would be doubtful. Android would probably be their answer though (and even that is iffy honestly) given the rocky stability with Windows Mobile 8.x and newer.

Years ago I sold, my Juno 3B and Nomad (I ran FFS and CB on both.)

Why did I do that? Because Patagonia released CB on the Windows Phone (while still keeping the WM version) and never looked back.

Not only the same feature set, but added a few more, making the package even hotter, it's also incredibly fast, new modern UI, GPS and Mapping support and I can sync all my data to the cloud for backup or just to synch the PC version. Anything better is hard to find if you are a power user.

I started off on a Windows 7.x phone, later updated to OS 8.x and finally settled on the current 10.x and never ever had a single hitch to deal with, so speaking of a stable software that crosses all OSes without ever need to call for support is simply outstanding and speaks volumes about Patagonia technology.

 

[northern50]

I like the old school of the Trimble, not being connected to anything and no need of the outside world. Ffs and a nomad are awesome.

 

[LastShot300]

I like the old school of the Trimble, not being connected to anything and no need of the outside world. Ffs and a nomad are awesome.

Well, no need to be connected with a phone either. It's all up to the user's preferences.

 

[TheGerman]

I like the old school of the Trimble, not being connected to anything and no need of the outside world. Ffs and a nomad are awesome.

Yeah its a bonus. Turning it on and not getting notices that 11 programs need to update is fantastic.

I fucking hate 'smart' phones.

 

[Bulletsmith]

Guys, Titan Elite has the Trimble T41 M for $399 It does not have Bluetooth or Wi-Fi so it’s less $. Mine will be here next week.

 

[texag0842]

Ordered a Trimble 1050 from Blaine and really looking forward to it.

Been watching my shooting partner use it forced me to take the plunge.

 

[_Windrider_]

Ordered a Trimble 1050 from Blaine and really looking forward to it.

Been watching my shooting partner use it forced me to take the plunge.

Damn son. You went all in.

 

[texag0842]

@TacticalDillhole

It's a lot easier when your shooting partners data is always spot on.

 

[AIAW]

Just a reminder... If you shoot the same bullets in multiple rifles you might be inclined to just copy the files on the SD card. You can't do that.

If you do and then try to build an offset profile (suppressed offset in my case), you will get this and a crash. This is sort of by design because I use folders for bullet profiles rather than just keeping them all in a flat folder like you are supposed to. It used to be much worse before 4.8.14 (Blaine called me out on using folders to organize things back in the day and I stopped for everything except for bullet profiles). He did work in a "fix" into 4.8.14 for people that use the same bullets across different rifles and sort the files into folders like I do.

I am trying to duplicate all of my AXMC profiles over to a different rifle so I can customize them there without having to manually type everything again. My plan is to customize the "new" bullet profiles on the new rifle after I gather data.

Point being, it's better to clear all profiles that are loaded (everything), open just the bullet profile that you want to duplicate to a different rifle and re-save it under a different folder or a different file name if you aren't using folders. This way the file pathing doesn't get messed up in the rifle profile or the offset profile. It indeed works flawelessly this way.

 

[AIAW]

Just a note to let FFS Delta V users know that version 4.8.1.15 has just been released. Change log is listed below.

Version 4.8.1.15 - Maintenance Release March 2019

1. Sundry maintenance, correction, minor modification changes.
2. Modify various forms for use on FWVGA displays.
3. Add TargetList check for “DIR” extension correction
4. Remove Cartridge Database form.
5. Add Reset function on Bullet Database form to process changes to database without having to close form.
6. Reconciled SD drive differences between Nautiz x8 and Trimble Nomad hand-held computers.