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308 Winchester AR Only
- Thread starter padom
- Start date
18" Wilson 308 AR
1xLC Brass
168 ELD / Varget OCW
168 ELD / Varget Seating Depth Test
175SMK / Varget OCW
175SMK / Varget OCW
1xLC Brass
168 ELD / Varget OCW
168 ELD / Varget Seating Depth Test
175SMK / Varget OCW
175SMK / Varget OCW
Savage msr lr 308
20" factory barrel
175gr RDF
LC/lr brass
FGMM primers
42.7 grs IMR 8208
2670 FPS
COAL 2.850
NOTES: I installed a jp heavy SCS .
Brass and primer pockets are
holding up pretty good.
Accuracy averages 1 moa
20" factory barrel
175gr RDF
LC/lr brass
FGMM primers
42.7 grs IMR 8208
2670 FPS
COAL 2.850
NOTES: I installed a jp heavy SCS .
Brass and primer pockets are
holding up pretty good.
Accuracy averages 1 moa
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On the old forum, there was a 308 AR section,as best I remember a lot of posts were with 175/178's and mostly Varget
Varget can be hard to find, but IMR4064 is a little easier... I believe this is the powder used in FGMM and the M118LR, I believe 41.78gr... my load with 4064 is 42.5gr behind a 168 or 175 smk. shoots well in my gas guns and bolt guns
DPMS 18" heavy profile on home built AR10.
LC brass, Win LR primer, Hornady 178HPBT, 43.5gr Varget
LC brass, Win LR primer, Hornady 178HPBT, 40.7gr WC846
FC brass, Win LR primer, Hornady 178HPBT, 43.1gr Varget
Hornady brass, Win LR primer, Hornady 178HPBT, 43.8gr Varget
Velocity is 2504-2520fps.
LC brass, Win LR primer, Hornady 178HPBT, 43.5gr Varget
LC brass, Win LR primer, Hornady 178HPBT, 40.7gr WC846
FC brass, Win LR primer, Hornady 178HPBT, 43.1gr Varget
Hornady brass, Win LR primer, Hornady 178HPBT, 43.8gr Varget
Velocity is 2504-2520fps.
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My old load:
178 Hornady HPBT
Hornady Match Case
42.2 IMR 4064
CCI primer
my new load:
same as above except
LC or M80 case (sorted)
41.5 AA2520
Ive grown tired of weighing charges, the new load is not as accurate as the former but it’s close enough and I can crank them out fast in the 550...
178 Hornady HPBT
Hornady Match Case
42.2 IMR 4064
CCI primer
my new load:
same as above except
LC or M80 case (sorted)
41.5 AA2520
Ive grown tired of weighing charges, the new load is not as accurate as the former but it’s close enough and I can crank them out fast in the 550...
Out of a 16” bbl my two loads are:
175 SMK
FGMM brass 2.011” trim
43.6gr Varget
Fed 210M
2.803”
155 Scenar
FGMM brass 2.011” trim
48.6gr N550
Fed 210M
2.803”
Both shoot just under 1MOA in my gun, the 155gr groups an inch higher (at 100yd) than the 175gr load for me.
175 SMK
FGMM brass 2.011” trim
43.6gr Varget
Fed 210M
2.803”
155 Scenar
FGMM brass 2.011” trim
48.6gr N550
Fed 210M
2.803”
Both shoot just under 1MOA in my gun, the 155gr groups an inch higher (at 100yd) than the 175gr load for me.
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LMT MWS 16in CM 1-10 w/ SureFire brake
Mine likes factory FGMM 168s and hot 150gr military ammo
168gr Nosler CC
FGMM Brass
Fed 210M
42.8gr IMR 4064
COL 2.800
Last batch clocked 2,517fps, SD = 5, ES = 12 vs FGMM clocking 2,509fps at 78F
168gr Hornady BTHP
Winchester or Black Hills Match Brass
Fed 210M
43.5gr RL-15
COL 2.810
Developed as a Black Hills clone for my 308 bolt gun but shoots well in the LMT also
Averaging 2,508fps from the 16" LMT
Mine likes factory FGMM 168s and hot 150gr military ammo
168gr Nosler CC
FGMM Brass
Fed 210M
42.8gr IMR 4064
COL 2.800
Last batch clocked 2,517fps, SD = 5, ES = 12 vs FGMM clocking 2,509fps at 78F
168gr Hornady BTHP
Winchester or Black Hills Match Brass
Fed 210M
43.5gr RL-15
COL 2.810
Developed as a Black Hills clone for my 308 bolt gun but shoots well in the LMT also
Averaging 2,508fps from the 16" LMT
I ran 43.1 grains of RL15 and a Berger 175OTM. It ran 2520 out of an 18” OBR and had 10 rounds in the same hole.
Custom AR-10-T with 1-12 T 26" Shilen Heavy BBl.
43.0 140 with NCC & SMK 155;s
43.0 N-203-B with NCC & SMK 168's
both MOA at 300 yds.
Just joined a range that has 600 & 1000 yd ranges. Thinking I should go with 168/175/178's for the 600 yd range and save the 155's for the 300 yd. range ?? These are at AR load levels.
43.0 140 with NCC & SMK 155;s
43.0 N-203-B with NCC & SMK 168's
both MOA at 300 yds.
Just joined a range that has 600 & 1000 yd ranges. Thinking I should go with 168/175/178's for the 600 yd range and save the 155's for the 300 yd. range ?? These are at AR load levels.
Attachments
These are from my older DPMS LR-308 that I upgraded the barrel and gas block on.
18" Criterion DPMS Pattern Hybrid Rifle Gas, Nitride w/Seekins adjustable gas block and Dead Air Nomad-30
165gr Hornady BTSP interlock
LC new brass, already primed [brass prep = .30cal exp mandrel, 0.332 bushing, annealed, .30cal exp mandrel]
CCI 34 (assumed)
42.36gr / 2.744g IMR-4895
2525fps
I might try the next higher node around 43.4gr to get another 100fps out of it, but overall I'm pleased with this for a general purpose pig/critter load.
I'm also working on a 150gr SST load up around 44gr also with IMR-4895.
18" Criterion DPMS Pattern Hybrid Rifle Gas, Nitride w/Seekins adjustable gas block and Dead Air Nomad-30
165gr Hornady BTSP interlock
LC new brass, already primed [brass prep = .30cal exp mandrel, 0.332 bushing, annealed, .30cal exp mandrel]
CCI 34 (assumed)
42.36gr / 2.744g IMR-4895
2525fps
I might try the next higher node around 43.4gr to get another 100fps out of it, but overall I'm pleased with this for a general purpose pig/critter load.
I'm also working on a 150gr SST load up around 44gr also with IMR-4895.
Attachments
These are my two go-to loads in a G28 clone
Mk319 type
130gr SOST
LC Brass
LR Primers
44.5gr Ramshot TAC
2.750" COAL
2830fps out of 16.5" barrel
M118LR type
175gr Scenar-L
Lapua Brass
Fed 210M Primers
41.4gr ARComp
2.785" COAL
2495fps out of 16.5" barrel
Mk319 type
130gr SOST
LC Brass
LR Primers
44.5gr Ramshot TAC
2.750" COAL
2830fps out of 16.5" barrel
M118LR type
175gr Scenar-L
Lapua Brass
Fed 210M Primers
41.4gr ARComp
2.785" COAL
2495fps out of 16.5" barrel
Anyone running the 155 Palma # 2156 in their AR's ? Picked up a bunch from a fallen Marine & friend's estate sale.
two nodes, one at 2700 for the M14's , The bolt guns go much higher.600 yds is MY limit.
thank you
two nodes, one at 2700 for the M14's , The bolt guns go much higher.600 yds is MY limit.
thank you
I ran 100 in my 20" Krieger gasser a few weeks ago with 4064 and they were very accurate out to 700
Thank you, will load some up along with NCC & SMK's for a shoot-off. I'm guessing something south of 44.5 Gn of 4064 ??
43.4gr 2803
I was using it to form some new LC primed pulled brass to my chamber.
155Amax with 43.2 is 2777
Hornady brass
42.5 H4895
210M
165 SGK
2.750
.570 @ 100 yds
same set - up with 165 Hornady Interlock was .622 @ 100 yds
Smith & Wesson 18” heavy profile M&P10
42.5 H4895
210M
165 SGK
2.750
.570 @ 100 yds
same set - up with 165 Hornady Interlock was .622 @ 100 yds
Smith & Wesson 18” heavy profile M&P10
150gr Hornaday SST
LC new brass, already primed
CCI 34 (assumed)
45.56gr / 2.952g IMR-4895
2.780in OAL
2740fps (18" barrel)
LC new brass, already primed
CCI 34 (assumed)
45.56gr / 2.952g IMR-4895
2.780in OAL
2740fps (18" barrel)
Nope. FGMM powder is 100% proprietary. It’s a blend between 3 diff powders. Likely 4064 due to length, something around the length of 4895 and something a little bigger than ball. 41.5gr if I’m not mistaken.
I am getting ready to load 168gr BTHP with LC/Winchester brass and CCI BR-2's. I will be running a 16" barrel (308 AR) at 100-200 yards. I wanted to get suggestions on any experience with powders and loads? Hornady has about (12) different powders in their data.
Powder I have:
- Vihtavuori 150 (Have most of)
- Varget
- BLC-2
- H335
Thanks!
Powder I have:
- Vihtavuori 150 (Have most of)
- Varget
- BLC-2
- H335
Thanks!
Varget should be the easy button. H335 is close to h4895 on the burn chart and I use that in my 308 as well
Results are from my initial pressure testing, using a CHRONY Beta @15 ft. for FPS/SD/ES numbers during first firing/break-in of the barrel. The commercial ammo used for "baseline" was "Magtech 150 Grain FMJ", registering avg. FPS/SD/ES of 2545/38/89.
Platform is my own build, Aero Precision upper/lower, Geiselle G2S, 16" Ballistic Advantage "Hanson" w/SLR AGB, Aero carbine buffer system, SLR single chamber compensator.
All LC "once fired" brass, various dates.
Targets are: Diamond, 3"Hx3.5"W, Circle: 1-7/8" diameter
Platform is my own build, Aero Precision upper/lower, Geiselle G2S, 16" Ballistic Advantage "Hanson" w/SLR AGB, Aero carbine buffer system, SLR single chamber compensator.
All LC "once fired" brass, various dates.
Targets are: Diamond, 3"Hx3.5"W, Circle: 1-7/8" diameter
Attachments
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This has been discussed on here, and the links are in the other 308 section, and buried somewhere in reloading. FGMM has changed components now.
@918v will correct me if I'm wrong, and he'll be right.
43.2gr 4064 in FC/LC brass, length escapes me right now, but I'm about to load a bunch of this very recipe.
I am wanting to conserve my Varget cache for 6mm. I have not given up trying to find powder online, but I think it’ll be easier to pick up powder in my LGS. They have a good stock and selection, but it’s kinda random. So i am trying to collect a list of viable .308 powders, so i am not googling in the store. I have gone through this thread and the .308 Win. What other powders would you run in a .308?
Reloader15
IMR 4064
IMR 4166
IMR 4895
Ramshot Tac
BLC-2
VV N550
VV 150
Shooters World Precision
Shooters World Long Rifle
AR Comp
CFE223
8208XBR
H4895
H380
H322
H355
Benchmark
Reloader15
IMR 4064
IMR 4166
IMR 4895
Ramshot Tac
BLC-2
VV N550
VV 150
Shooters World Precision
Shooters World Long Rifle
AR Comp
CFE223
8208XBR
H4895
H380
H322
H355
Benchmark
Of the ones you list, my picks for gas 308 would be IMR 4064, AR Comp, H4895, and XBR in no particular order.
Win 748 will also work. It’s what I use in my blaster 150gr FMJ loads. Cheaper than most others and flows in the Dillon PM great for progressive loading.
You will get very good results with IMR4064, AR Comp, CFE223, 8208XBR, and Reloader15. On RE15 do your load development in the summer time due to temp sensitivity. CFE223 is the slowest of the five giving more mv with the same pressure curve. I feel IMR4064 is the easiest powder out there to work up with. Federal did use 4064 in their fgmm 175.
...my "availability" selection is limited so I tend to use powders that can be used for both .308 & .223 "effectively & efficiently". AR-Comp, 8208 XBR & W748 have been what I've used to date, primarily because I order it in 8# jugs and have known loads developed for my barrels & bullets with them (all AR platforms). I intend to explore others to add to MY list as "supply & demand" in the marketplace is so volatile.
My AR-10 load is my standard 308/168 match load, rumored to be a clone of the standard 168gr 308 FGMM.
I use Starline 308 brass, but most of the better 308 commercial brass is fine for this. I use a Large Rifle Match primer, BR-2, 210M, and even WLR.
The bullet is the Sierra 168gr SMK, but I substitute the Speer 168 Gold Dot Rifle because I find similar accuracy but actual intentional and excellent terminal performance. Max OAL I use is 2.815". My charge is 43.5gr of IMR-4064. My Mags are Magpul 7.62 NATO Gen-III'.
I am currently testing Once Fired IMI Semi-Auto Match brass. It is rumored to be superior to LC Match (and is crimped). I will occasionally use Hornady or Federal Premium, but generally, only for match usage on the first firing. Hornady because I keep hearing wails and moans from users on here (but no supporting evidence), Federal because of lingering memories of soft primer pockets, which may be from bygones past. I have also had very good consistent results from PPU.
I do full match prep, but only after fireforming and trimming. I use the Little Crow trimmer, RCBS Case Prep center, and RCBS Chargemaster Lite. Cartridges are loaded on an ancient (bought used in the early '90's) Dillon RL-500b, and a regular two die RCBS F/L die set.
I am currently considering switching propellants to W-748 because it is labelled as having a lower burn temperature, and 308 is just about my most frequently used chambering. IMR-8208XBR is also interesting; I'm already using it for 6.5 Grendel and mid-weight 223's (62's, 64's). TAC's another possibility/probability. So little time...
My rifle is a PSA PA-10 20" (experimentally reconfigured as a bag rider) and it's still in the break-in/load testing stage. I tried a brake, but the noise was intolerable. It's currently waiting on testing with a linear comp, to put the noise out front.
I don't really break in the barrels, it's the rest of the AR for me. In the end, though, the round count is the same, mainly because I'm fireforming the brass for true load development. I load a max of five loads, and don't anneal. Initial tests with the FGMM/Speer Clone were very accurate; I may skip the load testing.
Greg
I use Starline 308 brass, but most of the better 308 commercial brass is fine for this. I use a Large Rifle Match primer, BR-2, 210M, and even WLR.
The bullet is the Sierra 168gr SMK, but I substitute the Speer 168 Gold Dot Rifle because I find similar accuracy but actual intentional and excellent terminal performance. Max OAL I use is 2.815". My charge is 43.5gr of IMR-4064. My Mags are Magpul 7.62 NATO Gen-III'.
I am currently testing Once Fired IMI Semi-Auto Match brass. It is rumored to be superior to LC Match (and is crimped). I will occasionally use Hornady or Federal Premium, but generally, only for match usage on the first firing. Hornady because I keep hearing wails and moans from users on here (but no supporting evidence), Federal because of lingering memories of soft primer pockets, which may be from bygones past. I have also had very good consistent results from PPU.
I do full match prep, but only after fireforming and trimming. I use the Little Crow trimmer, RCBS Case Prep center, and RCBS Chargemaster Lite. Cartridges are loaded on an ancient (bought used in the early '90's) Dillon RL-500b, and a regular two die RCBS F/L die set.
I am currently considering switching propellants to W-748 because it is labelled as having a lower burn temperature, and 308 is just about my most frequently used chambering. IMR-8208XBR is also interesting; I'm already using it for 6.5 Grendel and mid-weight 223's (62's, 64's). TAC's another possibility/probability. So little time...
My rifle is a PSA PA-10 20" (experimentally reconfigured as a bag rider) and it's still in the break-in/load testing stage. I tried a brake, but the noise was intolerable. It's currently waiting on testing with a linear comp, to put the noise out front.
I don't really break in the barrels, it's the rest of the AR for me. In the end, though, the round count is the same, mainly because I'm fireforming the brass for true load development. I load a max of five loads, and don't anneal. Initial tests with the FGMM/Speer Clone were very accurate; I may skip the load testing.
Greg
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LR308 18” barrel, LC match brass, 210m, 43.0 Varget, 2.800. .750” @ 200 yards all day long.
LR308 24” barrel, LC match brass, 210m,
42.6 Varget, 2.800. 1.125” @ 200 yards
LR308 24” barrel, LC match brass, 210m,
42.6 Varget, 2.800. 1.125” @ 200 yards
If I had to choose the most effective factors toward accurate/consistent POI, it would be consistent case capacity and the RCBS Chargemaster Lite powder measure.
FWIW, I have done some case capacity measuring. Most use water, but I use the powder I'll actually be loading; no issues with wetting and surface tension, and I'd rather measure the actual contents than some intermediate medium that has to be converted. Load density percentage calculations become direct ratios.
Case capacity variations and charge variations are where inconsistencies can slip into the equation more readily.
The RCBS Chargemaster Lite is very, very consistent, and quick enough not to be a drag on the process.
I don't experiment with bullet jump. All my rifles fire from magazines, and I consider conventional mag length compatibility to be my own favorite OAL standard.
I use SAAMI chambers because I always have, because most of my rifles are basic factory rifles, because I don't want my descendants to have problems with factory ammo, and because they make concentricity issues far less relevant. Some accuracy sacrifice is involved, but with close concentration on operating consistency, it's minimal.
To me, handloading is a chore, and not a challenge. The fewer the complexities, the better, IMHO. I learned my handloading from a pair of BR shooters, my elder Brothers. But I don't shoot BR, and have done my best to reduce the process as per Occam' Razor. My techniques match my expectations.
Greg
FWIW, I have done some case capacity measuring. Most use water, but I use the powder I'll actually be loading; no issues with wetting and surface tension, and I'd rather measure the actual contents than some intermediate medium that has to be converted. Load density percentage calculations become direct ratios.
Case capacity variations and charge variations are where inconsistencies can slip into the equation more readily.
The RCBS Chargemaster Lite is very, very consistent, and quick enough not to be a drag on the process.
I don't experiment with bullet jump. All my rifles fire from magazines, and I consider conventional mag length compatibility to be my own favorite OAL standard.
I use SAAMI chambers because I always have, because most of my rifles are basic factory rifles, because I don't want my descendants to have problems with factory ammo, and because they make concentricity issues far less relevant. Some accuracy sacrifice is involved, but with close concentration on operating consistency, it's minimal.
To me, handloading is a chore, and not a challenge. The fewer the complexities, the better, IMHO. I learned my handloading from a pair of BR shooters, my elder Brothers. But I don't shoot BR, and have done my best to reduce the process as per Occam' Razor. My techniques match my expectations.
Greg
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I just received 4 lbs of “RG4895” MilSurp powder from a friend, and see that the Hodgdon’s site has data for it.
Extruded powder, but very small kernels.
Anyone using this in their loads?
On a Dillon RL550B?
Extruded powder, but very small kernels.
Anyone using this in their loads?
On a Dillon RL550B?
