I am tempted to build a lighter 22BR and use the 75 for coyotes. I am pushing them 3025 fps out of a factory barreled 223 already though.
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.22 br
- Thread starter Dai Bando
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I am tempted to build a lighter 22BR and use the 75 for coyotes. I am pushing them 3025 fps out of a factory barreled 223 already though.
I tried pushing the 75 eld to 3000 FPS and beyond in a bolt gun. I could not get the sub 1/2 Moa accuracy that I desire. I went back to a 50 or 55 vmax and voila sub 1/2 Moa. I am thinking the 22 br will give me the accuracy that I desire I guess we will see.
Nick at Straight Jacket has the 22BR figured out. I stayed at his place in Evanston Wyoming while we were over to shoot the Hornady PRC match. His reamer specs are the ones I use as well. Great guy, makes a great rifle.
I've fooled around with the 75gr bullet, it ended up not really making sense to run it as a target round. The 88gr just seems to be such a sweet spot for this rifle right around 3000fps, give or take a little for shooting steel. I do run run the 75gr Hornady BTHP Match in my 223 Ackley Improved trainer. They match up nicely at that 3k velocity mark to my BR and are super cost effective bought in the bulk box of 4000 count. But for a primary bullet the 88gr ELD-M is still relatively inexpensive. And running Varget, which isnt difficult to find, most fellas will land somewhere between 28.5 to 29.5 as their accuracy node.
And I've heard great things about the 50 and 55gr varmint bullets from this round. A varminter seems to be where this caliber got it's start.
I've fooled around with the 75gr bullet, it ended up not really making sense to run it as a target round. The 88gr just seems to be such a sweet spot for this rifle right around 3000fps, give or take a little for shooting steel. I do run run the 75gr Hornady BTHP Match in my 223 Ackley Improved trainer. They match up nicely at that 3k velocity mark to my BR and are super cost effective bought in the bulk box of 4000 count. But for a primary bullet the 88gr ELD-M is still relatively inexpensive. And running Varget, which isnt difficult to find, most fellas will land somewhere between 28.5 to 29.5 as their accuracy node.
And I've heard great things about the 50 and 55gr varmint bullets from this round. A varminter seems to be where this caliber got it's start.
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Was going to fix my match load today with VV N150 and 80 gr Eld-match.
Found out the other powder bottles i had was from another lot, so full panic mode(no time to fix a new load).
Rushed to the range and tested it, same low ES and SD, just got some more speed(3130 fps instead of 3100).
Group looked good, never measured it but was around 2" or so with 10 shots on a newly painted steel plate att 330 yards.
28.6 gr N150 and just off the lands.
Found out the other powder bottles i had was from another lot, so full panic mode(no time to fix a new load).
Rushed to the range and tested it, same low ES and SD, just got some more speed(3130 fps instead of 3100).
Group looked good, never measured it but was around 2" or so with 10 shots on a newly painted steel plate att 330 yards.
28.6 gr N150 and just off the lands.
I am using the standard 22Br Manson Reamer with the .050" freebore. It has grown almost .020", but most of that was at a high rate of fire team match I did when it was almost 100 degrees out. Burned through 24 rounds on some stages in less than 3 minutes.
I would go .254 neck diameter next time.
I would go .254 neck diameter next time.
I have a new 22BR reamer on order.
We have been using a .100fb.
Very pleased with the 88s. new reamer will be .120 and a 255 nk so none of the necks need to be turned.
We found with the .253 we had to turn the bottom 3rd of the nk to keep them cycling smoothly without pressure.
Hard lift for young shooters sucks.
We have been using a .100fb.
Very pleased with the 88s. new reamer will be .120 and a 255 nk so none of the necks need to be turned.
We found with the .253 we had to turn the bottom 3rd of the nk to keep them cycling smoothly without pressure.
Hard lift for young shooters sucks.
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The 80 gr eld-m seems to work fine out to 700+ yards, had pretty good results on the long range targets.
Had no problems hitting a 6" plate at 600 yards with some funny winds.
So going to keep this load for the competitions with mainly shorter ranges.
Had no problems hitting a 6" plate at 600 yards with some funny winds.
So going to keep this load for the competitions with mainly shorter ranges.
New guy here. Been looking on the Hide for years and finally signed on.
Getting a .22BR barrel put together right now (Bartlein, by Bugholes), with 88's in mind (7 twist). Not real sure exactly what throat I'm going to wind up with, but I told Greg I was planning on 88's and possibly 95's, and didn't want to have to turn necks.
I ordered 200pcs of Lapua brass yesterday, along with a Redding FL sizer and a Forster seating die (figured I'd get a neck die setup after I get everything necked and get through the first firing).
I've read through this whole thread and was wondering if anyone would care to elaborate on their die setup for necking down and then sizing after firing.
Thanks!
Getting a .22BR barrel put together right now (Bartlein, by Bugholes), with 88's in mind (7 twist). Not real sure exactly what throat I'm going to wind up with, but I told Greg I was planning on 88's and possibly 95's, and didn't want to have to turn necks.
I ordered 200pcs of Lapua brass yesterday, along with a Redding FL sizer and a Forster seating die (figured I'd get a neck die setup after I get everything necked and get through the first firing).
I've read through this whole thread and was wondering if anyone would care to elaborate on their die setup for necking down and then sizing after firing.
Thanks!
I used the standard .252" neck reamer on mine and I didn't have to neck turn, buy my loaded rounds are around .251". It has the standard .050" freebore, so I started out loading them short, but there was plenty of room for 28.8 grs of Varget and 27.3 of H4895. I would probably go with a .254" neck so you have some more clearance on a loaded round.
I use the standard Redding 22BR full length dies for sizing new brass down to 22BR. I just picked up a bushing die and haven't used it yet. If you neck down with a bushing die, I feel you have a better chance of getting a ring at the neck/shoulder junction and would have to neck turn to get it taken care of. I know a guy that had that issue and he is running the .254" neck and I believe a .100" freebore.
I shot a high volume team match with my 22BR in June in 97 degree weather. My throat grew .040" as we had a few stages where I shot 24 rounds in less than 3-1/2 minutes with H4895. I switched to Varget and am currently playing with Rl16 with pretty good results.
Got my 22br running with about 550rds on it now. We used a .254 neck reamer with .100 freebore. I ended up having to neck turn though. Recent batches of 6br brass have been about .002 thicker in the necks than my Gunsmith has ever seen. I shaved off about .002 and it cycles perfect now. 28.8grs Varget under the 88ELDM getting 2970fps after neck turning. Just won my 3rd PRS Regional Series match in the SE. The 22br is growing on me and having a 2nd barrel spun up to have ready for the remainder of the season.
Need to fix my modified case gauge or make one from a fired case, probably supply a few pieces to my Gunsmith to keep records on throat erosion.
Need to fix my modified case gauge or make one from a fired case, probably supply a few pieces to my Gunsmith to keep records on throat erosion.
Okay. Stupid question time.
Bear with me, the only time I've ever necked anything down was some W-W .270 brass to .25-06. It worked well, but that was years ago and I've not necked anything down from one caliber to another since. Never neck turned anything.
I lubed a case body and inside the case neck with Imperial sizing wax. took the expander out of the Redding FL die, and gradually ran it up into the die until it "kissed" the shoulder (it looked like it bumped it about .001" or less on my cheap calipers with the crappy hornady shoulder measuring tool). I had a very small ridge (donut) at the neck/shoulder junction. Another potential issue is that my brass measures .009" shorter after running it through the die. When I necked .270's to .25-06, they were LONGER (?). Is this a big problem? Any way to fix it?
Sooo, I guess I need to go ahead and turn the necks. Never turned necks before. I do want to be sure I've got this down. First, neck turn a couple thou off the cases (before sizing, looking at the K&M tool and the RCBS ball mic), then size. Correct? Or do I size, then turn off the donut?
Thanks for helping out someone new to the wonderful world of wildcatting!!!
Bear with me, the only time I've ever necked anything down was some W-W .270 brass to .25-06. It worked well, but that was years ago and I've not necked anything down from one caliber to another since. Never neck turned anything.
I lubed a case body and inside the case neck with Imperial sizing wax. took the expander out of the Redding FL die, and gradually ran it up into the die until it "kissed" the shoulder (it looked like it bumped it about .001" or less on my cheap calipers with the crappy hornady shoulder measuring tool). I had a very small ridge (donut) at the neck/shoulder junction. Another potential issue is that my brass measures .009" shorter after running it through the die. When I necked .270's to .25-06, they were LONGER (?). Is this a big problem? Any way to fix it?
Sooo, I guess I need to go ahead and turn the necks. Never turned necks before. I do want to be sure I've got this down. First, neck turn a couple thou off the cases (before sizing, looking at the K&M tool and the RCBS ball mic), then size. Correct? Or do I size, then turn off the donut?
Thanks for helping out someone new to the wonderful world of wildcatting!!!
I necked down virgin 6br brass, ran a .223 mandrel through them, fire formed them on first firing, then ran the expander mandrel through them and turned brass until I had 100% concentricity and cut about .030 up the shoulder. Annealed, sized and loaded.
Which reamer print did you use and which mandrel and sizing bushing have you found works best? I'm probably going to go down this route, too.
.254 neck with .100 freebore. I've used the Forster FL Non-bushing die the first 2 firings, but switching to a Redding FL bushing die with a .245 bushing now. After NT a .221 Mandrel is fine. Loaded neck diameter after NT is .248. For Neck turning I'm using the 21st Century powered Neck turning lathe with the 22br kit.
Took a peek at me powder inventory and played with a necked, virgin case to see how much (roughly) it would hold of each.
Looks like around 34 grains of H4350 and RL22 to the bottom of the neck. 36 grains of LeverRevolution.
Going to look for a good load for 88's at about 3000fps (24" barrel).
I've got a whole 5 pounder of RL22. I may try it with 88's, starting about 32 grains, but wonder if it wouldn't be too slow. Might try about the same with 4350 (maybe start at 31).
LeverRevolution is one you don't hear much about, but my AR likes it with 75's. A bit faster than 4350, denser, and meters like water through my old uni-flow. It's also usually easy to find around here. Honestly, it's the one I want to start with, guessing around 31 grains.
Anyone dabbled with any of the above? Read some comments on cooler burning ball powders, wondered how the above (ball and stick) would relate to throat wear.
Oh yeah, almost forgot, any primer preferences? Got plenty of 205's and 400's, along with a few 450's, BR-4's, and 7-1/2's.
Should have my barrel in a week or so. Can't wait!!!
Looks like around 34 grains of H4350 and RL22 to the bottom of the neck. 36 grains of LeverRevolution.
Going to look for a good load for 88's at about 3000fps (24" barrel).
I've got a whole 5 pounder of RL22. I may try it with 88's, starting about 32 grains, but wonder if it wouldn't be too slow. Might try about the same with 4350 (maybe start at 31).
LeverRevolution is one you don't hear much about, but my AR likes it with 75's. A bit faster than 4350, denser, and meters like water through my old uni-flow. It's also usually easy to find around here. Honestly, it's the one I want to start with, guessing around 31 grains.
Anyone dabbled with any of the above? Read some comments on cooler burning ball powders, wondered how the above (ball and stick) would relate to throat wear.
Oh yeah, almost forgot, any primer preferences? Got plenty of 205's and 400's, along with a few 450's, BR-4's, and 7-1/2's.
Should have my barrel in a week or so. Can't wait!!!
Also got my K&M neck turning kit.
Virgin brass measured .013" on my ball mic. I ran a piece over the 6mm K&M mandrel. Cut .002" off for .011", chucked the shell holder assy. in my cordless drill and let the neck do a few laps in a piece of 0000 steel wool, then ran through the Redding FL die, then back over the expander stem. Finished thickness was .012". Is this good or do I need to back it off a bit?
Also, still getting a ring at the neck/shoulder junction barely detectable by my thumbnail, but I THINK that this is just where it's not going that far into the die. My shellholder is hitting the die, but the shoulder has not moved. I'm GUESSING that will probably fireform out when the shoulder pushes forward.
Virgin brass measured .013" on my ball mic. I ran a piece over the 6mm K&M mandrel. Cut .002" off for .011", chucked the shell holder assy. in my cordless drill and let the neck do a few laps in a piece of 0000 steel wool, then ran through the Redding FL die, then back over the expander stem. Finished thickness was .012". Is this good or do I need to back it off a bit?
Also, still getting a ring at the neck/shoulder junction barely detectable by my thumbnail, but I THINK that this is just where it's not going that far into the die. My shellholder is hitting the die, but the shoulder has not moved. I'm GUESSING that will probably fireform out when the shoulder pushes forward.
Follow up, decided I needed a little more bullet for a local venue that has a lot of long range positional stages. Tested out the 95SMK and at 2850fps (restricted due to current Freebore Dimensions) it tested out with a .310G7 BC and was confirmed out to 1135yds without any stability issues.
I'm going to have the Freebore extended with a throating tool on my current barrel as well as a second barrel I'm having spun up to test and then order a custom reamer based off my findings.
I'm going to have the Freebore extended with a throating tool on my current barrel as well as a second barrel I'm having spun up to test and then order a custom reamer based off my findings.
It's a bit better in the wind even running 100fps slower, but mostly I felt like it was more consistent at the longer distances.
Obviously haven't had hands on and probably won't with them costing the same as 105 Hybrids, but with all these 85-95grs bullets I'm leaning towards a .200 Freebore spec. The 88ELD and 95SMK are looooong! They'll work with .100fb, but you will have a ton of bullet left in the case. Even running .200fb you're not hitting 2.5COAL. Gonna be doing some tests with the 2 barrels I have then ordering a custom reamer based on my findings next year.
My 22 Dasher 95 SMK reamer is .235 works with 88s good too. That puts my 95 just above the neck shoulder junction seated touching the lands a .250 would give you a little more room to adjust for jump.
In a straight BR .175 should get everything above the donut area and work with a wide selection of bullets
In a straight BR .175 should get everything above the donut area and work with a wide selection of bullets
My 2nd 22BR just came together yesterday. Should get me through this years finale season.
Do you have any problem with blowing bullets in your 22 Dasher and 6.5T with the 95smk or 88 Eld?
I have not blown up any bulletsI have a friend that shoots them at 3120 out of a 22 -250 6-1/2 twist and one that shoots them at 3150 out of a Creedmoor none of us have experienced exploding bullets
Thanks for the response! I have a 22Br 6.5T 5R bartlein coming from area419. I’m excited to play around with the 22BR.
Sweet, I thought I was gonna have to sell my straight taper 1:6.5 Bartlein that I waited 6 months for...
I’m receiving my barrel next week but I have a match that weekend so I won’t be able to play around with it then. But as soon as I do I will post an update on how it’s shooting!
Still waiting on my Terminus to ship. Hopefully soon since my buddy told me his Helix was shipping.
What freebore are you guys running for 90smk/95smk. Looking for boattail/bearing surface right at or just above case neck/shoulder junction.
Smith's 22br reamer print says 0.050 freebore and .252 neck...
Smith's 22br reamer print says 0.050 freebore and .252 neck...
.050 is way to short. I ordered a .100 FB and the 95smk is sitting way below the neck shoulder area. Now I’m waiting on a uni throater to increase my FB. I would at least run .150 FB minimum. I seen a post of guys running over .200 FB for the 95SMK and that was putting the lower bearing surface just above the start of the neck.
Your welcome! I’m going to throat my barrel out and figure out what the perfect freebore is for the 95smk and have a custom reamer made.
Well I finally got my rifle together. 24" Barlein (chambered and shouldered by Bugholes), RV contour, 1:7, Origin, KRG Bravo, Burris 5-25XTRII.
I fretted neck diameter (supposed to have a .255" neck) as I wanted to be at .252" loaded. I played with my neck turning kit on Virgin Brass and finally just figured I was overthinking it.
I took the 7 cases on whose necks I had been playing with, loaded 30 grains of LeverRevolution and a 450, seated 88's to 2.370" OAL (.080" throat) and went to the range. I ran 3 over the chrony at about 12'. It read 2924, 2961, and 2904. The spread could be due to the loads, the fact it was raining on my chrony, or the fact it's just a cheap shooting chrony, it didn't really matter, I just wanted to be sure I was at or below 3000fps, unsuppressed. Temp was around 65-68 deg., FWIW. Sighted in at 100 yards with the other 4.
I sized 25 necks down on a Redding FL sizer (took the expander ball out, sized down, then ran the necks back UP on the expander ball) and left a slight shoulder on the neck (.050-.060 or so). This did make them a bit tough to chamber, so I'll try do a bit less shoulder on the next batch.
Went to a friend's farm yesterday where we had our annual muzzleloader and rifle sight in. Broke out the .22BR and it put 5 rounds into two holes for group that looked a touch under .5" (100 yards).
The only issue I'm sorta concerned about is I've a slight ejector slot mark on some of my brass (about half the fired loads). I really doubt the loads too hot, I've got an A Bolt .25-06 that'll put an ejector mark on factory ammo, so I'm not sweating it too much.
Thus far, I'm in love. I know that one, five round 1/2 inch group at a hundred doesn't mean much in the company that's on here. But for the first load I spitballed down the barrel, I'm pretty tickled. Gonna get a few more loaded and try to get it out to 600 and possibly 1000 yards next week.
I fretted neck diameter (supposed to have a .255" neck) as I wanted to be at .252" loaded. I played with my neck turning kit on Virgin Brass and finally just figured I was overthinking it.
I took the 7 cases on whose necks I had been playing with, loaded 30 grains of LeverRevolution and a 450, seated 88's to 2.370" OAL (.080" throat) and went to the range. I ran 3 over the chrony at about 12'. It read 2924, 2961, and 2904. The spread could be due to the loads, the fact it was raining on my chrony, or the fact it's just a cheap shooting chrony, it didn't really matter, I just wanted to be sure I was at or below 3000fps, unsuppressed. Temp was around 65-68 deg., FWIW. Sighted in at 100 yards with the other 4.
I sized 25 necks down on a Redding FL sizer (took the expander ball out, sized down, then ran the necks back UP on the expander ball) and left a slight shoulder on the neck (.050-.060 or so). This did make them a bit tough to chamber, so I'll try do a bit less shoulder on the next batch.
Went to a friend's farm yesterday where we had our annual muzzleloader and rifle sight in. Broke out the .22BR and it put 5 rounds into two holes for group that looked a touch under .5" (100 yards).
The only issue I'm sorta concerned about is I've a slight ejector slot mark on some of my brass (about half the fired loads). I really doubt the loads too hot, I've got an A Bolt .25-06 that'll put an ejector mark on factory ammo, so I'm not sweating it too much.
Thus far, I'm in love. I know that one, five round 1/2 inch group at a hundred doesn't mean much in the company that's on here. But for the first load I spitballed down the barrel, I'm pretty tickled. Gonna get a few more loaded and try to get it out to 600 and possibly 1000 yards next week.
I have to admit, I've entertained the idea of a longer freebore. But I fired 150 rounds breaking my barrel in, load developed, and shot that one load of 28.5grs of Varget till the 2200 round mark. Never had to touch it.
My reamer is a .254 neck at .050 freebore. So far I'm thinking it's not broke, so I shouldn't try to fix it.
Took mine to the range last week. I'm pretty sure the last one was me. The first four were at 2.96" at 600 yards. I think I pulled the top one a smidge high for 4.73".
Then I went to 1,000 yards for the first time ever. I had five rounds left. Shot one at the wrong target (dumbass), but fortunately, no one was on it. Then I pulled one way low. Three rounds left. I finally got my crap together and ran a 3 round group. 3 in 6.38". I'll take it.
A few takeaways; 600 is one thing, but this noob found out that 1,000 is a whole nother ball game. I spent several rounds at the gongs before firing away at their electronic targets and figured out my dope sheet was about .3 mils low. The wind (which was pretty whippy that day) is a whole nother ball game at 1,000 as well. For the group, I cranked it a half mil left, and watched the flags for it to die down just a bit, then fired.
I've got a lot of work to do, but I'm loving it so far.
Oh yeah, it works on coyotes too! 120 yard chip shot. An 88 high on the shoulder. No smoking crater, but still dead before she hit the ground.
Then I went to 1,000 yards for the first time ever. I had five rounds left. Shot one at the wrong target (dumbass), but fortunately, no one was on it. Then I pulled one way low. Three rounds left. I finally got my crap together and ran a 3 round group. 3 in 6.38". I'll take it.
A few takeaways; 600 is one thing, but this noob found out that 1,000 is a whole nother ball game. I spent several rounds at the gongs before firing away at their electronic targets and figured out my dope sheet was about .3 mils low. The wind (which was pretty whippy that day) is a whole nother ball game at 1,000 as well. For the group, I cranked it a half mil left, and watched the flags for it to die down just a bit, then fired.
I've got a lot of work to do, but I'm loving it so far.
Oh yeah, it works on coyotes too! 120 yard chip shot. An 88 high on the shoulder. No smoking crater, but still dead before she hit the ground.
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Damn, she takes some powder to get it going..
28.5grs of Varget is usually around 2990fps in a 22" barrel.
Trying to decide if I should start with the .050 freebore the reamer comes in at.
Or load some dummy rounds with the bottom of bearing surface little below neck/shoulder junction and have the chamber throated for that.
Thoughts? Going to be running berger 85.5 hybrid and hornady 88 eld
Thoughts?
Or load some dummy rounds with the bottom of bearing surface little below neck/shoulder junction and have the chamber throated for that.
Thoughts? Going to be running berger 85.5 hybrid and hornady 88 eld
Thoughts?
I have a reamer with a .150 freebore which seems to be perfect for the 88 grain bullets to sit just above the neck/shoulder junction. You'll probably want your freebore extended. I also shoot 80 grain bullets in the same chamber and because the 22 BR has such a long neck the bullets still have plenty of seating depth when they are out by the lands.
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