.22 br

[Birddog6424]

I run the Manson reamer at .050 freebore.

My last barrel I put 150 rounds down the tube to break it in. Went to load development and landed on 28.5grs of Varget under an 88gr ELD-M. Then proceeded to shoot that exact same load for over 2200 rounds without touching a thing. Didnt chase the lands, notta...

It was still single digit SD when I pulled the barrel just north of 2500 rounds.

I considered trying a longer freebore, but I dont see a problem with .050.

 

[Hussell]

I just got my 22 BR up and running Monday. .255Neck with .100FB, Krieger 7t 4g HV at 26", Kelbys Black Bear Tactical action in a XLR Envy. I sized the new Lapua 6BR brass with a standard Forster Die. Once I had the barrel I did not have enough shoulder bump to get a free bolt drop. I was able to get just enough bump from a Redding 22 BR die with the bushings removed. I assume there was a small doughnut at the neck shoulder junction from the initial sizing that was making contact because a 1x fired case needed .003 less bump then the virgin brass. I was able to get a free bolt drop (.002-.003 bump is what i look for) with the Forster die on the 1x brass very easy.

I initially loaded 50 with 28gr Varget, CCI 450 and Jumped an 88 ELDM .020 for the start of the break in. Shots 41-50 we at 2884fps, 100yd groups were great. I do most of my break in positional and only fired a few from a bipod/bag combo. I then loaded up 50 more with 28.5Gr Varget and shots 81-90 were at 2958fps. I had 5 loaded up at 29.0 for curiosity and shots 101-105 were at 3017fps with no signs of pressure. The fired rounds were not much larger than my loaded rounds and a bullet would not go back into a fired case. I returned home and sized 5 fired cases . I then turned 5 necks and loaded them with 29.0gr of Varget and went out to test them again. Pretty much a 1 hole group again but the turned necks of the 1x fired brass (shots #111-115) were 3011fps 6es/2.4sd. I now have nearly 200 pieces of Virgin brass loaded up with 28.5gr and a little over 100 turned and ready for load development. The 88s are way down in the case but are shooting great. I have 200 of the new 85.5 Berger coming this week. Would have more to report but a sick kid has given me plenty of press time and not much trigger time.

 

[Midwestside]

... I had 5 loaded up at 29.0 for curiosity and shots 101-105 were at 3017fps with no signs of pressure. The fired rounds were not much larger than my loaded rounds and a bullet would not go back into a fired case. I returned home and sized 5 fired cases . I then turned 5 necks and loaded them with 39.0gr of Varget and went out to test them again.

Did you hear a little bit of crunching during the seating process?

 

[Hussell]

Did you hear a little bit of crunching during the seating process?

Ill edit that, my brain always defaults to my 130gr 6.5x47 load with Varget

 

[Birddog6424]

I'm surprised you are needing to neck turn.

Both myself and my shooting partner use a .254 neck and have never needed to turn them.

I'm to the point anymore that I dont even gradually resize from .243 to .224 like I used to. I started out running everything through an intermediate sized bushing, then running them through the proper sized bushing and finishing with a Sinclair sizing mandrel. I accidentally resized a 6mm BR from Norma while loading one day that must have gotten handed to me as part of my brass at a match. I felt the stiff resize and realized it was the wrong piece of brass, but then noticed it looked perfectly good from a resized perspective. So now I resize new brass right down to .224 in the first station on my progressive, it hits the mandrel on the second station, and I load it up. I fire it and toss it into the rotation with the rest of them.

 

[Potsy]

Throat on my Bartlein is at .080”. I started at 2.370 (OAL) and kept seating deeper until the bolt would close (real friggin’ scientific process), wound up at 2.350” (88eld’s).

30 grains of Leverevolition barely clears the shoulder, so compression is a non issue. I’ll fret seating depth and maybe switch powders after all my brass is once fired. It’s shooting better than I can anyway.
I monkeyed with neck turning, but they all chamber fine and I’ve been keeping it pretty clean so I quit. I’ve been intentionally leaving a bit of a false shoulder on the premise that it will help the virgins headspace and form out a bit better. Neck is at .255, btw.
My only gripe is that the Redding FL die sizes necks WAY down (out of town and away from my notes at the moment) then WAY back up over the mandrel and I DO feel like I need a neck die with an intermediate bushing. I collapsed the shoulders on several cases so I’ll have that before I start on the next box of brass. Thinking I’ll order a .250 bushing to wind up at .252 OD.

First 100 yard group I ever shot with the rifle. Five rounds, two holes a half inch apart. That’s about as good as I can do at this point in life and I’m fairly in love with the rifle and the round.

 

[260284]

Throat on my Bartlein is at .080”. I started at 2.370 (OAL) and kept seating deeper until the bolt would close (real friggin’ scientific process), wound up at 2.350” (88eld’s).View attachment 7200515

30 grains of Leverevolition barely clears the shoulder, so compression is a non issue. I’ll fret seating depth and maybe switch powders after all my brass is once fired. It’s shooting better than I can anyway.
I monkeyed with neck turning, but they all chamber fine and I’ve been keeping it pretty clean so I quit. I’ve been intentionally leaving a bit of a false shoulder on the premise that it will help the virgins headspace and form out a bit better. Neck is at .255, btw.
My only gripe is that the Redding FL die sizes necks WAY down (out of town and away from my notes at the moment) then WAY back up over the mandrel and I DO feel like I need a neck die with an intermediate bushing. I collapsed the shoulders on several cases so I’ll have that before I start on the next box of brass. Thinking I’ll order a .250 bushing to wind up at .252 OD.View attachment 7200521
First 100 yard group I ever shot with the rifle. Five rounds, two holes a half inch apart. That’s about as good as I can do at this point in life and I’m fairly in love with the rifle and the round.

Leverevolution acted the same and was interchangeable with CFE223 in my 6.5 Grendel. I have used H4895, Varget, and even Rl16 in my 22BR with the 88gr ELDM. All were over 3000 fps out of a 26" 1-8" Bartlein, a touch over 3100 with Rl16. Single digit SD will all of them.

 

[Potsy]

I knew Lever and CFE were real close together on the burn rate chart. I had Lever on hand and had ran it in a .223 with 75’s. I rather like it’s density and the fact it runs like water through my old uniflow. I’d stick with it, but I have some doubts about its temp consistency vs. some other powders.

Probably start fooling with RL16 and maybe 6.5 Staball come spring. Might try to fling a 95 Sierra or two along with it.

 

[260284]

I have StaBall 6.5, just haven't had time to mess with it. I have over 1800 rounds on my current barrel and have another just like it waiting to get chambered. Rl16 is probably the most temp stable of any powder I have tested. I shot some CFE in my 6.5 Grendel and got good velocity, but went back to 8208 for the temp stability. Too much temperature variance here in KS to not use a temp stable powder.

 

[Birddog6424]

I'm getting ready to test out the new Precision Rifle powder from Shooters World.

They say its identical in performance to Varget, but far less lot to lot variance. And I'm buying a keg of it for $155.

Precision Rifle - Propellant | Shooters World

Precision Rifle - Wholesale Ammunition | Smokeless Powder | Greenville SC

shootersworldpowder.com

And a great comparison article to Varget.

The Reloaders Network

Firearms, reloading and hand loading, bullet casting, and the shooting sports. Articles, videos, and other media to inform, educate, and entertain.

thereloadersnetwork.com

 

[Hussell]

Tried some 85.5s tonight. The bearing surface stays above the neck shoulder junction with these. I jumped them .020 and will do more testing later on. The 85.5's with BR4's ran around 50fps faster for me than the 88ELDM's with CCI450s with the same charge weight.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Got dummy rounds necked down, trimmed, and turned.

Im getting a 1.770 BTO with the boat tail junction a bit above the neck/shoulder junction.

Berger 85.5

 

[Miguel7527]

Can anyone tell me What bullet jump do the 88 eld’s like in there 22br?

 

[260284]

Can anyone tell me What bullet jump do the 88 eld’s like in there 22br?

.020" works for me with the 88gr and 3 different powders so far.

 

[Potsy]

FWIW, I did a little measuring and re-measuring with my cheap calipers and ball mic.

My Redding FL die was crushing some shoulders (really pissing me off). I was running cases up in the die with the expander ball removed. Then running them back over the expander (read a long time ago that helped with concentricity, dunno if it really does or not). They were harder to run back over the expander than any other caliber I had ever done that with. Something just didn't seem like it was jiving.

Lapua 6mmBR necks measured .267". Ran up into the die, they were ran all the way down to .232" (!), then having to bump all the way back up to .250" (all dimensions outside diameter). In contrast, my RCBS .223 dies run case necks down to .238" then back up to .243". I get that the Lapua 6BR necks were thicker than the Remington .223 brass (.013 6BR, .014 .22BR vs. .011 or so for the .223) I compared it to, but up and down .018" seems (and feels) way excessive vs. .005".

I ordered a Redding Bushing Neck die with .259" (for a step down when sizing virgins) and .250" bushings.

Then I emailed back and forth with Redding and explained what I had going on. A.J. at Redding told me to send the FL die to them and they'd look into it. Dropped it into the mail Saturday.

I'll let you all know what I find out.........

 

[Codiekfx400]

I had the exact same problem with my die working the brass down then expanding it back out. It was giving me terrible concentricity. The good news is it is a Forster die. A trip to Forster and they honed the die out so now it’s only working the brass about 4 thousandths of an inch. The concentricity is now spot on and the brass full length sizes with very little effort.

 

[Miguel7527]

I had the exact same problem with my die working the brass down then expanding it back out. It was giving me terrible concentricity. The good news is it is a Forster die. A trip to Forster and they honed the die out so now it’s only working the brass about 4 thousandths of an inch. The concentricity is now spot on and the brass full length sizes with very little effort.

FWIW, I did a little measuring and re-measuring with my cheap calipers and ball mic.

My Redding FL die was crushing some shoulders (really pissing me off). I was running cases up in the die with the expander ball removed. Then running them back over the expander (read a long time ago that helped with concentricity, dunno if it really does or not). They were harder to run back over the expander than any other caliber I had ever done that with. Something just didn't seem like it was jiving.

Lapua 6mmBR necks measured .267". Ran up into the die, they were ran all the way down to .232" (!), then having to bump all the way back up to .250" (all dimensions outside diameter). In contrast, my RCBS .223 dies run case necks down to .238" then back up to .243". I get that the Lapua 6BR necks were thicker than the Remington .223 brass (.013 6BR, .014 .22BR vs. .011 or so for the .223) I compared it to, but up and down .018" seems (and feels) way excessive vs. .005".

I ordered a Redding Bushing Neck die with .259" (for a step down when sizing virgins) and .250" bushings.

Then I emailed back and forth with Redding and explained what I had going on. A.J. at Redding told me to send the FL die to them and they'd look into it. Dropped it into the mail Saturday.

I'll let you all know what I find out.........

My Redding FL die is doing the same thing! I would be interested to know what they tell you. Please keep up posted.

 

[Dthomas3523]

So, I’ve refined my .22br brass process. It’s long, but it seems to be much easier on brass.

Run 6mm expander mandrel
Turn necks to .0115
Run through .22br non bushing die
Run .22 expander mandrel
Trim to length
Run through FL bushing die
Run .224 mandrel
(Brass is back up to ~.012 neck (guessing from the sizing down)

Final chamfer/deburr
Seat (about 50psi as the necks are clean)

This is getting me about a .247 loaded diameter on a .252 reamer

Prior I was sizing down, running mandrel, trimming, turning and then back to FL bushing die. But I was deal with more friction with the mandrels and it was pretty tight on the turning mandrel. Even flattened some shoulders with mandrel.

After first firing I’m expecting seating pressure to go down and being up to use .002 under mandrel for neck tension.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Finally feeling halfway decent from the shot show fungus. Brand new barrel.

.050 reamer throated to .100 freebore.

88 eld and 85.5 Berger with 28.5gr varget. Both loaded .020 off lands to start.

88 didn’t do well on es/sd as I ended up using a .2245 mandrel to get them to seat in my hydro press without going off the gauge. Didn’t feel like messing with lube as I’m getting firing brass and barrel sped up.

85.5 I used a .224 mandrel. Es/sd: 7/15 so not bad.

Eld was at 2940 and 85.5 was 2950

These were slightly cherry picked. Once the barrel was fouled, all groups were in the .3moa area or less.

Smallest group in two pics is 88eld

 

[SNOW JW]

I know most of you are shooting the heavy pills but any info on the 53vmax or pills on the lighter side? I have a 12 twist barrel on order.

 

[Codiekfx400]

I know most of you are shooting the heavy pills but any info on the 53vmax or pills on the lighter side? I have a 12 twist barrel on order.

Is this for varmint or prairie dog hunting?

 

[SNOW JW]

Pdog

 

[Potsy]

I’ve been tempted to try them at some point in mine, though no real reason why other than my AR (.223) loves them (26.0 TAC, 400’s, RP cases).
I suspect my 7” twist would be “unkind” to them at 3500fps......

 

[tydex21]

Pdog

Hey brother, check out 6mmbr.com. Most of their stuff is a bit dated, but the overall data is still excellent. They focus more on the light varmint and flat base match bullets.

 

[Potsy]

To bring everyone up to date. I've been back and forth with A.J. at Redding over their FL die.
He emailed me this morning as said he "gauged" it, and it was right on the money. In a nutshell, I replied that it may be their spec, but their spec was pretty terrible (in much nicer words) and re-explained the jacked up dimensions that I had measured. I told him to hang on to the die (I ain't usin' it), and actually size some Lapua or Norma Brass and see how it goes. If it runs swimmingly, I'm the idiot. If he has to lay on the press handle and buckle shoulders, their spec has an issue.

Honestly, I don't expect much. The guy is an engineer. Which likely means he has the "can't help its". If it measured according to spec, it has to be right. He's likely incapable of savvying that the spec itself could be screwed up.

He did say that I could have a machine shop hone the neck as they didn't offer that service, but it would void the warranty (HA!). If any of you know of a shop capable of doing such work, I'd appreciate their info.

I did buy the Redding neck/bushing die. Along with a .259 and .250 TiN coated bushings. They seem to work pretty well. There were a couple of odd things about it, but I'm away from my notes, so I'll go into detail later.

 

[Codiekfx400]

If you really want the full length die then Forster is the way to go they will hone the neck for $15.

 

[Potsy]

I might've been a bit too rough on A.J. in my above post. Past experience has left me with little patience for engineers and accountants.

He did reply to my email (his responses have always been prompt) and said that the neck gauged .242 on that die. I'm not sure how, as my necks measure .232, but I told him I'd re-check and check my calipers to sure they hadn't lost their mind.

More importantly, in his reply he stated that he DID size a few cases and that he didn't have a problem. He did not indicate which brand cases.

The only thing I need a full length die for at this point is to bump shoulders back on occasion, but I will need something for that. Also, when initially sizing 6BR brass, I suspected that a FL die would leave less of a donut than bushing dies. It feels like I get less donut with the bushing dies. Go figure.

 

[SNOW JW]

If you really want the full length die then Forster is the way to go they will hone the neck for $15.

Think its safe to custom Forster hone and size to 22BR in one shot without messing up the brass?

 

[Codiekfx400]

Yes it is possible that’s how I did mine.

 

[SNOW JW]

Thanks can't wait for my tube reading all the info makes me want to order a fast twist for the heavies as well.

 

[Hussell]

Think its safe to custom Forster hone and size to 22BR in one shot without messing up the brass?

I used the std Forestor die to take my 6br brass down to 22br. It worked well but a honed put die would have been better. I have a honed one on backorder. I use several of there honed dies for my rifles. I am using a Redding FL Type S die now and it works very well also.

 

[SNOW JW]

What are you guys using for ammo boxes??

 

[Codiekfx400]

Plano makes a 50 round. I also utilize the Lapua blue box that the brass comes in.

 

[DisplacedTexan]

What are you guys using for ammo boxes??

I have a few MTM BR cases I picked up this summer.

 

[Hussell]

I have a few MTM BR cases I picked up this summer.

These BR boxes work very well. They are small and do not take up much room in a pack at all.

 

[Potsy]

A couple updates and a couple questions.....

I've not been back and forth with Redding for a few weeks on my FL die. I was out of town (and out of the country for 8 days) for most of February. Last contact I had, they had measured, re-checked, sized some cases (I wonder if they were old Remingtons) and A.J. told me it met their spec. I need to just tell him to send it back to me. If there's enough room, I may just pour it full of lead and stick it in the stock of my Bravo for ballast. That's where it'll do the most good. Then call Forster and tell them what I want.

I did shoot the Long Range Steel Challenge at Dead Zero in Spencer TN last Saturday. Out of 24 shooters, I won the cold bore shot (on the electronic target at 1,000 yards)! But then I didn't shoot worth a crap on the gongs. Out of 45 possible points, 38 won it, 26 was third place, I only shot a 16 (which still put me bottom middle of the pack). The wind was a mother and the layout of that range makes it even trickier. I think the biggest problem was that was first time I had ever shot in a match, I wasn't trusting my own dope, and I couldn't get out of my own head.

There is another issue. When I initially chronied my load (30 grains of Leverevolution, 88 ELD), I fired three rounds. There was no real load workup (I just spitballed the load) and was mostly just making sure I was somewhere at or below 3,000fps. Of the three rounds, there was a 57fps extreme spread. I rolled with it, but my groups run around .7 at 600 to 1.2 minutes at 1000 of mostly vertical. Then, a couple weeks ago, a buddy with a magentospeed clocked 5 out of it. Averaged 2995fps with an ES in the 60's. Sooooo, I'm about to attempt a ladder test with 88 ELD's and 95 SMK's, both with RL-16. The plan is to use his magnetospeed and a 400 yard target.

My question is where to start? Thinking 30.5 to 32.5 with 88's and 29.0 to 31.0 with 95's? I'm dealing with a .080" throat, so I'm sure that's gonna play in. Load a couple each at the upper end of the ladder, chrony, and go from there?

I've always just sort of guessed a charge weight according to what data I read, loaded it, ran it over my cheap chrony to be sure I wasn't leaving to much room or running to hot, shot a group at 100, and went from there. Working with a 2 grain range of charge weights is new to me.

We will run a seating depth test after the charge weight ladder. I think that'll take care of some of my horizontal, which isn't near the issue the vertical is at this point.

 

[MTETM]

Here ya go..
24" 1:7.5 barrel .100FB
I will update this tonight with her current loads. I believe they were backed down a bit.

 

[DisplacedTexan]

I shot 30.2 grains of RL16 this weekend (just threw something together) and averaged 2930. SD was a little high with this virgin brass but I had an SD of around 6 before I had a couple hot ones.

I just chalked it up to different sizing methods I had used and will just leave all my shit alone now to see if my SD/ES settle down.

During an RL16 ladder, I got to 3170 before I got bad plunger marks, around 32.4 gr iirc

 

[Potsy]

Thanks guys! Looks like my guess wasn't too far off. MTETM, I'd be interested in where your at now, and why you backed off.

I'm getting a pretty consistent ejector mark and some minor primer cratering at 30 grains of 'Lever, but I'm chalking that up to mashing the bolt closed on the donut on virgin hulls. The donut got a bit better after I switched from the aforementioned FL die to a Redding Neck Bushing die, but the primers and ejector mark remained. Might be the donut. Might be a touch warm. Either way, I'm thinking I want to stick to at or just a bit below 3,000fps with 88's. Guessing I need to be down around 2,850fps with 95's. 24" 7" twist 5R Bartlien, suppressed.

 

[DisplacedTexan]

I'm using a .249 bushing with 6BR Hornady match dies.

1-6.5 Bartlein 4 groove 1.25" straight suppressed.

Leverevolution is temp sensitive so be careful.

 

[Potsy]

Had read Leverevolution is temp-ermental, hence the move to RL16. Warmest she's been ran so far was 65 degrees. That'll change here pretty quick.

Hoping my 7" twist will spin the 95's. They came in today.

 

[DisplacedTexan]

RL16 is the shit. I love it in everything so far.

 

[Potsy]

I’ll try RL22 eventually. If only because I’ve got a 5 pounder that’ll likely last till I retire.

 

[Potsy]

Was thinkin’ a 2’ drop tube and a fat chick to sit on the press handle.........

Actually runs great in my .25-06, 7x57, and Dad’s .270WSM, but none of those rifles get shot just a whole lot anymore, which is a shame.

 

[MTETM]

My small daughter is shooting the 22BR. We wanted zero bolt lift issue regardless of weather conditions including rain. The wind difference between the velocities did not make it worth pushing any pressure, so we went lower to maintain consistency, a touch less recoil and smooth extraction. The 29xx loads worked well for her. Looking back at the notes last night, she shot 30.0 last summer and fall. They were at 2930 or so. This was after the cases were turned and fireformed. SD for 15 round strings were in the single digits. ES in the teens.
RE16, because you get good case fill, consistent numbers, good velocity and it isn't Varget... We also shoot RE16 in the BRX's and GT. We have a short pile of Precision that will be testing in the coming week with the 22 and 6 BR's.

 

[DisplacedTexan]

SW Precision gave me a busted case at 30.2 gr and ejector swipes from 29.0 and up.

Didn't actually test below 29gr which was 2980.

 

[MTETM]

Thank You for the info. That is good to know. Seems a much lower starting point will be in order. I am not too worried about top end velocity, just has to be consistent..

SW Precision gave me a busted case and 30.2 gr and ejector swipes from 29.0 and up.

Didn't actually test below 29gr which was 2980.

View attachment 7270760

 

[260284]

I know most of you are shooting the heavy pills but any info on the 53vmax or pills on the lighter side? I have a 12 twist barrel on order.

I loaded some 53gr V-Max over 32gr of Varget and shot them out of my 1-7" Bartlein. Barrel had less than 50 rounds out of it and I shot it without the brake in case they blew up. First 3 hit the target in a tight little group, so I put the brake and the magneto speed on. Shot 5 at 100, 3595fps average and 5 sd. Shot the last 15 at a plate at 416 yards. Might have to cut down and set back my 1800 round barrel for a coyote calling gun.

 

[bubbaokie]

Not to steal the thread about heavier bullets, but I have a 22BR barrel (rem 700) built by Mike Bryant for sale. Lost my PD hunting area, so I rebarreled to a 260. It has about 200 rounds thru it. Also have Lapua brass, dies, and loaded rounds. It is a 14 twist set up for 52 and under weight bullets. It is a tack driver with 40 grain vmaxes.

 

[mese341]

I just had a 22br built and I have a pound of varget and a pound of ramshot tac I am trying to decide what bullets to use would you guys recommend eld(m) over Sierra matchkings and it’s set up to shoot heavy bullets I am just not sure what grain you try and starting and max powder loads