.22 br

[260284]

Is anyone still running the lighter heavies; 75 A Max's ,77 & 80 SMK's ? At the time I had mine built I only had a 300 yd. range, and a $hit pot full of the mentioned bullets so I went with a 26" 8T. Just got some H 4350, RL-16 & some 4451.

I shot just under 100 of the Berger 77gr OTM that didn't shoot well in my AR. I just loaded them over 28gr of 4166 for barrel break in. Shot really good out to 416 yards where I have a 12" plate for barricade practice. Not enough velocity gain to shoot the 75gr ELDM over the 88 at distance. I am really liking Rl16 with the 88gr ELDM. It should work fine with the lighter bullets too. Very temp stable in my 6.5 Creedmoor.

My barrel, 26" 7tw Bartlein sped up again at almost 400 rounds. I was getting 2958 with 30.2 of RL16 and am now up to 3030 fps with the same charge.

I have 200 of the 90gr A-Tips that I need to try in place of the 88s.

 

[ES 350]

Hello everyone, was wondering if any of you have a H20 capacity for 22 BR , perferably with a 88 ELDM seated @? Oal
Thanks!

 

[Potsy]

Also got a bunch of 95 gr smk, going to test those to just for fun. But it's only a 1:7" twist barell so i'm not sure they are going to work well with that. Bought those for the next barell which will be a 1:6.5" twist. Not 100% sure on caliber yet tho, most likely another 22 BR but have a 22 Dasher reamer on order(but might take a while to get it now)...

95's ran swimmingly in my 1:7. 30.3 grains of RL16 at about 2850. Nice flat node there in my rifle. Wind blew like hell the day I tried to shoot them, but they didn't shoot any worse than 88's at 600 and 1000.

I like them, but I don't think they'll do anything that 88's won't do for less money. Might be a different story in a .22 Creed case.

90 A-tips look pretty badass, but jeez they are proud of them.

 

[260284]

95's ran swimmingly in my 1:7. 30.3 grains of RL16 at about 2850. Nice flat node there in my rifle. Wind blew like hell the day I tried to shoot them, but they didn't shoot any worse than 88's at 600 and 1000.

I like them, but I don't think they'll do anything that 88's won't do for less money. Might be a different story in a .22 Creed case.

90 A-tips look pretty badass, but jeez they are proud of them.

I shot some A-Tips with RL16, 29.4 to 30.2 in .2 increments. Had a good node between 29.6 and 30.2. so I shot some more at 30. The 88s shot better so far, but it was really windy last night. The 88s with 30.2 of Rl16 give me 3030 fps out of my 26" 1:7, SD of 4 and ES of 14.

 

[Baner]

Awesome.

Tested the 88 gr eld m, and got some promising results with the N-150 powder at around 3000 fps.

Going to test the 95 gr SMK next, and see what it can do.

Wish i could get my hands on some RL-16, but seems to impossible here in Europe...

 

[Baddog 0302]

Been reading and collecting loading data, and here is what I have for the 88 ELD M
1. 28.5 - 29.5 Varget
2. 29.0 H 4895
3.30.0 LeverRevolution
4. 30.5 RL-16
Also on hand; H & I 4350, H 380, & I 4451
My Remage barrel should arrive today, anymore suggestions will be greatly appreciated

 

[260284]

Been reading and collecting loading data, and here is what I have for the 88 ELD M
1. 28.5 - 29.5 Varget
2. 29.0 H 4895
3.30.0 LeverRevolution
4. 30.5 RL-16
Also on hand; H & I 4350, H 380, & I 4451
My Remage barrel should arrive today, anymore suggestions will be greatly appreciated

Depending on your chamber, I would start at 27.0 or lower with H4895 and 28.0 or lower with Varget and the 88gr ELDM. I ruined some brass with my first shots with 28gr of H4895. I ended up at 26.8 to 27.3 grains getting a little over 3020 fps. 28.8 of Varget was great in my first barrel, but blew a primer in my new barrel cut with the same reamer.

 

[Potsy]

Been reading and collecting loading data, and here is what I have for the 88 ELD M
1. 28.5 - 29.5 Varget
2. 29.0 H 4895
3.30.0 LeverRevolution
4. 30.5 RL-16
Also on hand; H & I 4350, H 380, & I 4451
My Remage barrel should arrive today, anymore suggestions will be greatly appreciated

Baddog,
If you try LeverRevolution, be aware of a couple of things, first, it does not enjoy a reputation for temperature stability, secondly, ladder up to 30 grains from 28 or so.
I just spitballed 30 grains, it shot well enough at 100 yards, I was still forming out brass and getting used to the rifle and shooting at distance, so I didn't fret it. But that load had a 65fps extreme spread that will come back to bite you at long range. A quick ladder test would likely reduce that and I'd consider 30 grains top end with 88's.
The good news about 'Lever is that it flows like water through my old Uni-Flow (which is pretty tempermental) and it's dense enough that I want to try it with 75's (you can fit a lot of it in the case, more so than RL16).
FWIW, I'm really liking '16 with 88's and 95's at the moment, just be aware you'll want to funnel it in to the cases slowly with a bit of a drop tube (I've got an old MTM funnel with about a 6" drop tube) as it's easy to run out of room with it (for those who have followed this thread, I'm likely NOT gonna try RL22 at this point ).

 

[Baddog 0302]

Posty,
THANK YOU, summer is almost here with 90* days , unless it rains . I'll save the Lever R for fireforming cases . With 600 yds as my limit I'll try RL 16 & 17 with the 88 ELDs as well as the Nosler 85 RDF's. I picked up a lot of 80 SMK's at an estate sale so finding loads for those will be another project

Again, Thanks

 

[Badfinger]

When forming the cases do you have to neck turn them?

 

[DisplacedTexan]

When forming the cases do you have to neck turn them?

I did, but most don't and just rely on fireforming to get rid of the donut. I feel like most people don't think about the inner donut though.

 

[Potsy]

I bought the K&M neck turning tool, and after fooling with it a bit, didn't see the point. Though as the Displaced Texan says, I may not be channeling my inner donut.

One thing, run either a Forster and get the neck honed or a Redding Bushing FL die. I made the mistake of buying the regular Redding FL die thinking it would eliminate the donut, but it sizes necks WAY too far down, resulting in an even worse donut (outer, and quite likely, inner), along with several crushed shoulders.

I bought the Redding Bushing Neck die, but I still need something (likely the Redding Bushing FL) to bump shoulders with eventually.

 

[DisplacedTexan]

One thing, run either a Forster and get the neck honed or a Redding Bushing FL die. I made the mistake of buying the regular Redding FL die thinking it would eliminate the donut, but it sizes necks WAY too far down, resulting in an even worse donut (outer, and quite likely, inner), along with several crushed shoulders.

I bought the Redding Bushing Neck die, but I still need something (likely the Redding Bushing FL) to bump shoulders with eventually.

FWIW, I'm running a Hornady 6BR die with a .249 bushing.

 

[260284]

I use a Redding FL die to form brass and the Hornady 6BR bushing die also.

 

[Potsy]

My throat's pretty short at .080 (likely a bit longer now), but I didn't have any trouble with 95's (I'm sure I had quite a bit of bullet below the neck, but I'm too lazy to look at my notes).
I came to the conclusion that .22BR speeds, the 95's don't do anything 88's don't do (they seemed to shoot fine, just more money). At 3000fps out of a Creed case, it's a little different story.....

 

[lance2121]

Got my 22 br running good now. Made the switch from 88s/varget/swpr to 95s and RL26. 2894 fps low node sd of less than 5. Had them up to 2940 but the accuracy wasn't what I wanted. Plus the extra 46 fps didn't gain me anything extra but less barrel life.

 

[Potsy]

Sweet!
I'm probably sticking with 88's, but I still do have most of a box of 95's I'll eventually load and shoot.
I'm running RL16 and found a nice node at 30.3 right on top of 2850 with 95's.
I love this cartridge in that, after minimal fooling around with it, it's pretty predictable. Even something as slow as '26 runs swimmingly.
Just curious, what barrel length and throat are you running?

 

[lance2121]

Sweet!
I'm probably sticking with 88's, but I still do have most of a box of 95's I'll eventually load and shoot.
I'm running RL16 and found a nice node at 30.3 right on top of 2850 with 95's.
I love this cartridge in that, after minimal fooling around with it, it's pretty predictable. Even something as slow as '26 runs swimmingly.
Just curious, what barrel length and throat are you running?

26 in Hawk Hill 7 twist. No idea on the throat as I had my smith throat it for 88s at the neck/ shoulder junction. Running the 95s at 20 thou from hard jam.

 

[260284]

Got my 22 br running good now. Made the switch from 88s/varget/swpr to 95s and RL26. 2894 fps low node sd of less than 5. Had them up to 2940 but the accuracy wasn't what I wanted. Plus the extra 46 fps didn't gain me anything extra but less barrel life. View attachment 7384777

What are your chamber specs? I have had great sd and es with RL16 and the 88gr ELDM. I have some 90 gr A-Tips, but haven't tried them yet.

 

[lance2121]

All I know is that it's a. 253 neck. Just a regular 22 br chamber.

What are your chamber specs? I have had great sd and es with RL16 and the 88gr ELDM. I have some 90 gr A-Tips, but haven't tried them yet.

 

[lance2121]

Boy, that's a tight neck.. are you running Lapua brass?

Nick at Straight Jacket Amory has built about 100 of these. He gave up on the .254 neck and went to a .256 with .100 freebore.

Manson messed up my first reamer and sent me a .252. It overpressured and wouldnt even feed properly. My new reamer is .255 for my .250 loaded OD.

Yes lapua. Neck turned.

 

[lance2121]

Got my 22 br running good now. Made the switch from 88s/varget/swpr to 95s and RL26. 2894 fps low node sd of less than 5. Had them up to 2940 but the accuracy wasn't what I wanted. Plus the extra 46 fps didn't gain me anything extra but less barrel life. View attachment 7384777

Opened up a new jug of powder. Old load was 33.1 @ 2894. New jug load is 32.9 @ 2954. Same or better accuracy.

 

[jzerfoss]

Boy, that's a tight neck.. are you running Lapua brass?

Nick at Straight Jacket Amory has built about 100 of these. He gave up on the .254 neck and went to a .256 with .100 freebore.

Manson messed up my first reamer and sent me a .252. It overpressured and wouldnt even feed properly. My new reamer is .255 for my .250 loaded OD.

Funny I just got my reamer from Manson yesterday that was supposed to be .255 and I got a .252 neck reamer. Aggravating after waiting 10 weeks but mistakes happen I guess.

 

[jzerfoss]

They sent me a reamer print and I didn't look it over real close. It was a .252 neck, even though I requested a .255. So I didn't make a big stink over it, I should have caught it.

But .252 only works if you neck turn. Which I won't do.

Just wanted to say they had a replacement reamer to me in a week. Happy with the customer service!

 

[just browsing]

So neck turning... is it necessary or not? Or completely dependent on neck diameter/chamber?

I have zero interest in turning or really having to do anything beyond the normal size down - load - shoot.

I have plenty of virgin BR brass, RL16 and 88s. Thinking this could be an option... if I can be lazy with loading.

 

[jzerfoss]

So neck turning... is it necessary or not? Or completely dependent on neck diameter/chamber?

I have zero interest in turning or really having to do anything beyond the normal size down - load - shoot.

I have plenty of virgin BR brass, RL16 and 88s. Thinking this could be an option... if I can be lazy with loading.

Not necessary but can be beneficial. If you don't want to turn necks just make you get a .255" or bigger neck.

 

[jzerfoss]

I refuse to neck turn.

Its a solution to a problem that shouldn't exist. Get the right reamer dimensions.

I've noticed and measured that necking down can cause the necks to get thicker towards the base of the neck. Turning has helped with my neck tension consistency, seating depth consistency, and reduce flyers. Saw this with my 22 Creed and I'm seeing it with my 22BR. I guess results may vary

 

[jzerfoss]

I run a .222 mandrel from Sinclair through all my brass so I get consistency. Its on the second station of my progressive reloader, so it doesn't add any time to my reloading process. It gives me .002 neck tension and a .252 OD on the neck. It pretty much eliminates any issues.

I use the same mandrel after sizing. What I noticed at first seating started easier than it finished when the necks aren't turned. Hypothetically, since the brass of the neck gets progressively thicker as it goes down the tension will be higher as you go down. Just out of curiosity have you measured the top and bottom of the neck with a mandrel in the neck or a long bullet seated? I saw at .002" difference from top to bottom. It could be an issue with the particular lot of brass I have when necking down.

 

[just browsing]

Birddog, what is the “correct” reamer dimension/neck bushing size then given that I don’t want to turn necks?

I’ve seen .255 thrown around a lot in the thread, but then you said .252 gives you no issues. I would be using the same sizing process with initial neck-down and then mandrel.

 

[Potsy]

Pretty sure mine's a .255", but I'd have to look at my notes.
I don't turn, but I do get the sized-down-donut. They chamber pretty tight the first couple firings and eventually form out.
I have wondered about it's effect on consistent neck thickness.

 

[Jewbacca]

Just jumping on thread

 

[Potsy]

Soooo.....
I couldn't hunt the TN rifle opener this weekend. Family stuff. Long story.
I wanted a coyote load for the .22BR, and I'm not doing anything else today, so here we go.
I figured I could leave everything zero'ed for 95SMK's, take good notes, run the turrets to POA/POI with whatever load I'm shooting coyotes with, skate the reticle for any dogs way out there (way out there being 4-500 yards where I'm at) and rock on.

I stuffed a 75 grain A-Max (have the better part of a box) over 32 grains of LeveRevolution, chrony said 3245fps (24" barrel, 9" suppressor), seems like plenty. Think I'll work up a ladder from about 30.6-32 and run it over my Buddy's magnetospeed and go from there.

My next question, and I think I know the answer (but I can't quit thinking about it), does anyone think a 53 grain V-Max at 3500 or so would survive the trip out of my 7 twist barrel? These shoot swimmingly out of my 16" AR (8 twist, at 3000fps). I think they'll have a come apart, but has anyone tried it? Thinking around 31-32 grains of TAC would be the ticket. Any opinions?

We're not saving hides, btw. However, we do like flying fur, red mist, mushroom clouds, etc............

Edited to add: I tried a 53 over 31grn TAC. I took the suppressor off (didn't figure a bullet flying apart inside of it would help it any), it clocked 3507fps. Made a large hole in the pumpkin behind the chrony (like, way bigger than the 75).

Hmmmm..........

 

[ES 350]

While not a 22BR my Grendel IMP is same neighborhood capacity/performance .....

I think the Vmax is thinner jacketed than 53 Nosler but have pushed Nosler over 3900 fps from a 27" 7 twist AR and 27" 8 twist bolt gun with good accuracy to 600 yds, furthest i have tested 53 gr to date.

 

[jzerfoss]

Soooo.....

I couldn't hunt the TN rifle opener this weekend. Family stuff. Long story.

I wanted a coyote load for the .22BR, and I'm not doing anything else today, so here we go.

I figured I could leave everything zero'ed for 95SMK's, take good notes, run the turrets to POA/POI with whatever load I'm shooting coyotes with, skate the reticle for any dogs way out there (way out there being 4-500 yards where I'm at) and rock on.


I stuffed a 75 grain A-Max (have the better part of a box) over 32 grains of LeveRevolution, chrony said 3245fps (24" barrel, 9" suppressor), seems like plenty. Think I'll work up a ladder from about 30.6-32 and run it over my Buddy's magnetospeed and go from there.


My next question, and I think I know the answer (but I can't quit thinking about it), does anyone think a 53 grain V-Max at 3500 or so would survive the trip out of my 7 twist barrel? These shoot swimmingly out of my 16" AR (8 twist, at 3000fps). I think they'll have a come apart, but has anyone tried it? Thinking around 31-32 grains of TAC would be the ticket. Any opinions?


We're not saving hides, btw. However, we do like flying fur, red mist, mushroom clouds, etc............


Edited to add: I tried a 53 over 31grn TAC. I took the suppressor off (didn't figure a bullet flying apart inside of it would help it any), it clocked 3507fps. Made a large hole in the pumpkin behind the chrony (like, way bigger than the 75).


Hmmmm..........

I would run the numbers based off of the distance you are thinking you are going to shoot. If you are going to be shooting past a few hundred yards the extra speed bleeds off quick with the light low b.c. bullets. The 75gr and 88gr elds in my 22 Creed out perform the lighter bullets in every way past 300yds. Closer than that the drop is around .2 mil more which isn't much difference.

 

[Potsy]

Will probably punt and run the 75's for a few reasons:

-I counted and have 43 of them, which will leave me with 36 loaded after the ladder test. That'll likely last me a bit. Then, if I like them, I'll start looking for a box of 75 ELD's (good luck...)
-I MIGHT want to sluice a deer, which I'd be a lot more comfy putting a 75 between a deer's ribs than a 53Vmax.
-Assuming expansion down to 1800fps for either bullet, the 75 got me to about 700 yards, around 550 for the 53. Both are likely way further than I'll shoot.

Probably picking nits. But I'm gonna roll with it for the time being. Still might run a ladder with the 53's anyway, just to see WTF........

 

[260284]

Soooo.....
I couldn't hunt the TN rifle opener this weekend. Family stuff. Long story.
I wanted a coyote load for the .22BR, and I'm not doing anything else today, so here we go.
I figured I could leave everything zero'ed for 95SMK's, take good notes, run the turrets to POA/POI with whatever load I'm shooting coyotes with, skate the reticle for any dogs way out there (way out there being 4-500 yards where I'm at) and rock on.

I stuffed a 75 grain A-Max (have the better part of a box) over 32 grains of LeveRevolution, chrony said 3245fps (24" barrel, 9" suppressor), seems like plenty. Think I'll work up a ladder from about 30.6-32 and run it over my Buddy's magnetospeed and go from there.

My next question, and I think I know the answer (but I can't quit thinking about it), does anyone think a 53 grain V-Max at 3500 or so would survive the trip out of my 7 twist barrel? These shoot swimmingly out of my 16" AR (8 twist, at 3000fps). I think they'll have a come apart, but has anyone tried it? Thinking around 31-32 grains of TAC would be the ticket. Any opinions?

We're not saving hides, btw. However, we do like flying fur, red mist, mushroom clouds, etc............

Edited to add: I tried a 53 over 31grn TAC. I took the suppressor off (didn't figure a bullet flying apart inside of it would help it any), it clocked 3507fps. Made a large hole in the pumpkin behind the chrony (like, way bigger than the 75).

Hmmmm..........

I loaded up 15 of the 53gr V Max over Varget and got them up to 3595 fps. Shot the first 5 at 100 without a suppressor or brake. They all made it to the target, so I put the suppressor and Magneto on and shot a plate at 416 yards. They hit hard, but I bet they splash on impact om a coyote. If I use it, I will stick with the 88gr ELDM.

 

[Potsy]

I whacked one last year with an 88 (at 3000fps), just over 100 yards right through the top of the shoulders. It died right there, but the only sign it had been shot was a drop of blood on the far side.
I shot a bigger one a couple weeks ago with my AR, same range (a pretty pedestrian load of 25grns of H335 and a 55grn Hornady soft point, runs about 2900fps out of my 16" barrel), and it left a fairly nasty exit hole on another shoulder shot. That put me to thinkin'.

Like I said, I'll stick with the 75 flay-Maxes (if they work well, eventually 75 ELD-M's), but I'd bet those 53's would be pure hell on a groundhog!!!!
Gonna try to run a ladder with the 75's sometime this week.......

 

[ES 350]

Little over a month ago i shot prairie dogs with 88 ELDM and 53 gr Nosler VG ....
53 gr @ 3650 from 22" 14 twist AR or 3700 from 24" 7 twist would flat vaporize a dog 200 yd or under! Some, shrapnel was 10 -12 ft high!

Used the 88's from 7 twist over 200 as winds were up to 18 mph.
88 wasnt near as destuctive but to be expected...
But enough to see results... one was standing 430 yd , shot straight up like a rocket on impact.
Have shot lots of yotes with 53 gr out of a 22 250 @3850fps ... same as if they were struck with lightning , never an exit other than small fragments of jacket or bone.

Only one with 88/3000 so far.... it died immediatly but nothing spectacular. So both work but on windy days or long shots the heavies win everytime.

I do believe the Vmax's are more explosive than the nosler , buddy shot couple yotes with them in 22 250, they died but not immediately with good shot placement.....

 

[Potsy]

The 53 V-Maxes do shoot very well out of my AR (.223). 26.0grns of TAC runs 3000fps. Did a "ladder" and the better "node" is at 26.3 for 3050fps, which is what I'll load next. I had intended on carrying that load on that last coyote outing, but I had left them at home so the 55SPT's were what I had with me. The 55's about as plain as a fence post with the B.C. of a ping pong ball, but they have, for a sample of one, lived up to their reputation as killers.

The AR is handier, and would likely do whatever I need done, but I sooooo love shooting my .22BR...........

 

[ES 350]

I know what you mean, 22 BR performance is about optimum IMO for a 22 cal.
Not horrible barrel burner or bullet exploder from too much velocity/RPM.
Interest in AR platform over last year led me to the creation of my 22 Grendel IMP chambering to get 22BR performance from AR.

Was going to build a 22BR bolt gun .... until i built the AR and to keep things simplier just chamber 2 bolt guns so can use same brass, dies etc.

LOL, about all the 50 and 55 gr 22 cal bullets have a b.c. of ping pong (i say bowling ball) amd what led me to the 53's in 12 and 14 twist barrels.
One thing nice about the Noslers being flat base is they stabilize in all 14 twist barrels i have tried... the Vmax some will some wont stabilize them. Flat base usually increases short range (100 -300 yd accuracy.
They shoot bugholes in my rifles....

 

[bodhisafa]

I have a 8 twist barrel on the way. What bullet weights will stabilize in this twist rate?

 

[ES 350]

You should be fine with 40 to 80 gr bullets.

 

[Strike_out]

I have a 8 twist barrel on the way. What bullet weights will stabilize in this twist rate?

At 4700elev 88’s were stable in a 223 at 2650fps

 

[bodhisafa]

At 4700elev 88’s were stable in a 223 at 2650fps

I’m a little under the 4700....300 elevation where I live

 

[ES 350]

At 1100 ft 88's @3000 fps dont do well from my 8 twist.
1 or 2 out of 5 are couple inches out of group. They do fine from 7 twist.

 

[Strike_out]

New 22BR coming together

 

[bodhisafa]

I am thinking I may need to change my order from a 8 to a 7 twist to be sure

 

[ES 350]

All depends on what bullets you choose to shoot.
My 7 twist barrels shoot 40 to 88 gr no problem.
Have shot 53 gr Noslers at 3900+ fps out to 575 yds without bullet coming apart and great accuracy. Have not shot lots of them and barrels only have couple hundres rnds on them sooo.....

 

[bodhisafa]

All depends on what bullets you choose to shoot.
My 7 twist barrels shoot 40 to 88 gr no problem.
Have shot 53 gr Noslers at 3900+ fps out to 575 yds without bullet coming apart and great accuracy. Have not shot lots of them and barrels only have couple hundres rnds on them sooo.....

Plan on shooting the 85.5 Berger.


Has anyone shot a 22 dasher and went back to a 22 BR?

 

[Potsy]

If I were going to run anything heavier than 80’s (maybe even 75’s) I’d 1:7. Within reason, reserve rpm won’t hurt.