If I get their full length sizing die, shouldn't I be able to use my Hornady seating die?
223 Ackley Improved
- Thread starter Huckleberry75
- Start date
I finally got to do some load development with fire-formed Lake City Brass, N140 powder and Berger 80.5 gr. FB bullets. I did a ladder of 3 shots each for 10 powder charges increasing by 0.3 grains each. I'm super pleased with the results on targets. The largest 3-shot group was 0.6 MOA, but most were 0.3-0.4 MOA. See below for some of the highlights, and yes, each picture is 3 bullets. I got up to 0.5 gr and 75 fps over what VV lists for standard 223 Rem with this bullet and powder with zero pressure sign so far. Unfortunately, my chrono kinda puked when I got home and I may have lost all my speed data. Fingers crossed I can retrieve that. And FWIW, my ARC CDG ran perfectly, albeit for only 30 rounds.
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Better get yourself a garmin so you won’t loose anymore date.
It is a Garmin Xero. I'm not happy right now, but I'm hopeful I'll get it back up and running.
And, it's back working just fine. Apparently just needed a solid 4 hrs charge.
I was 2540 fps up to 2820 fps with pretty conservative loads and zero pressure signs. Ultimately, I don't put a whole lot of weight into these preliminary loadings. I was mostly looking to find max pressure and speed (not yet achieved). Group size, ES, SD, were fun to look at and share/brag with friends, but these will need a lot more data to become meaningful.
Shoot, with groups like that, I’d pick a speed I like, verify at distance and go with it.
I haven’t measured the COAL but CBTO is about 1.924, about .025 Off the lands
I agree, but I have ~1.5 gr. of powder / 200-300 FPS left on the table to explore...
Did some more fire forming today. Load consisted of new HSM brass, Federal 205 primers, Hornady 55gr VMax, and a mild charge of H335 at 22.5gr. ES/SD’s were trash but the groups speak for themselves. All 50rds were fired consecutively within about 20 minutes.
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This is an Osprey barrel. FWIW, I've got plenty of fire formed brass now and I've been messing around with loading Berger 80.5 and 85.5 bullets over VV N140 powder. I'm getting very consistent 0.3" - 0.5" @100 yds. Here's a 5-shot group @100 yds with the 85.5's today.
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Lake City Brass, Federal 205 primer, Berger 85.5 gr LRHT, 24.5 gr VV N140, 2788 fps. It was only 30*F today and primers were starting to show a little flattening, so I would NOT recommend this load. I'll start backing down the powder looking for a lower node now.
Fireforming Load:
Recently I decided to fireform some additional brass for a couple of .223 Ackley Improved rifles that I own. I ended up with the following:
TZZ once fired processed brass/Lapua New Brass, and Starline 5.56 new brass. <different brass for each firearm>
In the TZZ brass, I used RP 7.5 primers, Lapua and Starline CCI 400's.
26. 0 Benchmark
53 grain Hornady Vmax.
In the 7 & 8 twist, COL was 2.41, shorter COL in the 12 twist because of a short throat, but all shot well on paper and steel. ~.75 MOA
Velocity is in the neighborhood of 3200 fps, but varies a bit depending on which rifle I am shooting them in because of barrel length.
What I found extremely interesting and fortunate, was that this fireform load, in three different rifles, was very close (within .1mil approximately), out to 500 yards> of the 75/80/ and 80.5 grain Ackley Improved loads. Perhaps its the high BC of the 53 grain Vmax, but it's nice to be able to use these without having to have a new dope card. Past 500 more elevation has to be dialed in.
While I didn't pierce any primers, the 400's were VERY flattened (excessive) in the Lapua Brass, probably will have a muffin top when I punch them out to reload. The fired Starline brass looked okay, and no issues with the military TZZ brass. Cases were well formed, no rounded shoulders. I also loaded a few LC cases with the brass colored Ginex SR primers, and they were excessively flattened, leading me to believe that they have soft cups like the CCI 400's. I would not recommend either of these... unless the fireform loads are reduced which will probably result in rounded shoulders on the fireformed brass.
Recently I decided to fireform some additional brass for a couple of .223 Ackley Improved rifles that I own. I ended up with the following:
TZZ once fired processed brass/Lapua New Brass, and Starline 5.56 new brass. <different brass for each firearm>
In the TZZ brass, I used RP 7.5 primers, Lapua and Starline CCI 400's.
26. 0 Benchmark
53 grain Hornady Vmax.
In the 7 & 8 twist, COL was 2.41, shorter COL in the 12 twist because of a short throat, but all shot well on paper and steel. ~.75 MOA
Velocity is in the neighborhood of 3200 fps, but varies a bit depending on which rifle I am shooting them in because of barrel length.
What I found extremely interesting and fortunate, was that this fireform load, in three different rifles, was very close (within .1mil approximately), out to 500 yards> of the 75/80/ and 80.5 grain Ackley Improved loads. Perhaps its the high BC of the 53 grain Vmax, but it's nice to be able to use these without having to have a new dope card. Past 500 more elevation has to be dialed in.
While I didn't pierce any primers, the 400's were VERY flattened (excessive) in the Lapua Brass, probably will have a muffin top when I punch them out to reload. The fired Starline brass looked okay, and no issues with the military TZZ brass. Cases were well formed, no rounded shoulders. I also loaded a few LC cases with the brass colored Ginex SR primers, and they were excessively flattened, leading me to believe that they have soft cups like the CCI 400's. I would not recommend either of these... unless the fireform loads are reduced which will probably result in rounded shoulders on the fireformed brass.
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I just saw this thread a few moments ago after stumbling into this idea this afternoon. Someone please save me the trouble of going through 11 pages. If you have a great 16" ar barrel in .223, what can you expect to see in velocity increase by hitting it with an AI reamer? Is it worth it?
I have a new Osprey PVA barrel, 18" 1:7 and am having trouble with loads.
I want to shoot the 80 ELDM as it worked with my old 223AI barrel. No luck so far with Varget 25.5-26.2gr) or StaBall Match (26.5-271.gr) in Winchester brass and CCI 400s. I am thinking of trying 8208. The lower end charges yielded me velocity around 2750fps which is too slow. My Mk12 does that with an 18" barrel and less powder with 77 SMK.
My old load has a base to ogive of 1.870" (1.415" OAL) and it shot like crap here. Shortening to 1.845" base to ogive improved groups but gave me increased pressure as powder compressed.
Even on the lower end of the scale, I will get some random pressure spikes, so I am wondering if I have too much of the bullet in the barrel and am compressing powder.
What are people running for a base to ogive or OAL with the 80 ELDs?
I want to shoot the 80 ELDM as it worked with my old 223AI barrel. No luck so far with Varget 25.5-26.2gr) or StaBall Match (26.5-271.gr) in Winchester brass and CCI 400s. I am thinking of trying 8208. The lower end charges yielded me velocity around 2750fps which is too slow. My Mk12 does that with an 18" barrel and less powder with 77 SMK.
My old load has a base to ogive of 1.870" (1.415" OAL) and it shot like crap here. Shortening to 1.845" base to ogive improved groups but gave me increased pressure as powder compressed.
Even on the lower end of the scale, I will get some random pressure spikes, so I am wondering if I have too much of the bullet in the barrel and am compressing powder.
What are people running for a base to ogive or OAL with the 80 ELDs?
What is the OAL of the load you are running for the 88gr ELD and 80 SMK? Or the base to ogive?
The photo of the 88ELDM target has all the load data, including OAL. Yes. In Tikka 223CTR and MDT 223 mags.
Started at 23.2 and ran it to 25.1 best groups at 24.2 and 24.5. Again, spicy with the 88s. Run with long freebore.
@BigDog00
A properly headspaced Ackley Improved barrel will have ~.004 crush fit on a new parent cases, so you shouldn't have to seat the bullet into the lands.
Thanks for the reply. I wasn't even thinking about the crush. I've got 200 pcs of starline prepped and ready to load. I'll have to get some loaded and ready to go.
