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224 Valkyrie vs 220 Thunderbolt
- Thread starter padom
- Start date
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Put a 69 or 77tmk in it and go kill critters with authority and good speeds. Those should be a good compromise between bullet weight and speed. The TMK kills quite well too.
I think any of the loads would do fine for coyotes
i am looking for a cheap rifle to use at the range. I figure half the powder, half the bullet costs, minimal recoil would be a great rifle to just go to the range with. only have two bolts, 300wm and super light 308. Think this will compliment nicely
right now thinking origin action, prolly a green mountain barrel (unless I find a deal on something better), slap a magpul pro stock on it and should be doing alright. But I won’t do anything anytime soon. looking at an optic doe the 16in 308
i am looking for a cheap rifle to use at the range. I figure half the powder, half the bullet costs, minimal recoil would be a great rifle to just go to the range with. only have two bolts, 300wm and super light 308. Think this will compliment nicely
right now thinking origin action, prolly a green mountain barrel (unless I find a deal on something better), slap a magpul pro stock on it and should be doing alright. But I won’t do anything anytime soon. looking at an optic doe the 16in 308
I've got the green mountain, also hearing good things about prefered barrel blanks and for $325 it's not a huge risk.
The 220TB is not an Improved Valkyrie. The 220 TB has been around for 12 years before 224 Valkyrie even existed...just so the record is straight
Very true......worded it wrong, it’s an improvement over the Valkyrie!
I built a 224 Valkyrie bolt gun for my 10 year old daughter. Shooting factory Hornady 88 ELD-M. It’s a laser. My daughter hits at 500 all day and she has stretched it out to 700 yards.
4 shots at 100 yards zeroing the optic:
Yes there are larger and faster 22 cals. I have a faster twist 22-250, but I do not care to reload every time we want to go shoot. I only reload for 3 rifles and own a about 12 different custom bolt guns. If they shoot factory ammo under 1/2”, then I see little to no purpose.
People have reasons, good reasons, for choosing what seems not to be the optimum choice for someone else.
In my case it was a long range capable, low recoil (10 year old girl low recoil) factory offering caliber with a high accuracy potential.
4 shots at 100 yards zeroing the optic:
Yes there are larger and faster 22 cals. I have a faster twist 22-250, but I do not care to reload every time we want to go shoot. I only reload for 3 rifles and own a about 12 different custom bolt guns. If they shoot factory ammo under 1/2”, then I see little to no purpose.
People have reasons, good reasons, for choosing what seems not to be the optimum choice for someone else.
In my case it was a long range capable, low recoil (10 year old girl low recoil) factory offering caliber with a high accuracy potential.
I've been playing with my 3D printer and I made a couple new spacer blocks for my magazines. The mag spacer kits (for 6mm BR) that I bought would not work for my 220 Thunderbolt cartridge OAL. So, I made a couple spacers that were about 0.020" thinner....all kinds or room now. The plastic mags that I bought work great too, but I like that the 5 round metal mags are shorter.
I hit 3100 fps with 80 grainers EASY with a 22" barrel and the .22 nosler throated long.
I got 3000 easily with the 88 eldm, but accuracy doesn't seem to be there.
Only thing that sucks is the limited brass supply and rebated rim, but it is workable.
Dogtown brass is reasonably priced and 65 staball seems to be the ticket. Would likely work well in this cartridge as well.
I got 3000 easily with the 88 eldm, but accuracy doesn't seem to be there.
Only thing that sucks is the limited brass supply and rebated rim, but it is workable.
Dogtown brass is reasonably priced and 65 staball seems to be the ticket. Would likely work well in this cartridge as well.
No new updates on brass being made specifically for 220TB. But yes the 220TB is still hammering along. Single digit SD's, I have continued shooting my 90smk load @ 3000fps. I had it out back in February to shoot at 900yd. Dialed my dope and first round hit was dead center. I shot a few 5 shot groups that were half moa @ 900yds. I havent had it out since then Ive been too busy with this RimX stuff.
Looks like Keystone's web page is under construction. I hope it gets back up and running.
Dies are pretty simple actually (if they are in stock)....
Get a 6mm Hagar Redding bushing die ....sizing die only http://6mmar.com/6mm_HAGAR.php
For a seating die try a Hornady universal seating die in .22 cal. I have one that I'm using for 22x47L seating and it works better than I thought. No I haven't checked runout, but low SD's and tiny groups are good enough for me!
In my 220TB AR15 I run ASC mags. My 220TB AR load is a 77TMK at well over 3100.. I don't have any pictures of the rounds in the mag. Ill have to take some pictures
Anyone have a case capacity , H20 or CFE for the 220 TB?
Would like to see how my 22 Wildcat compares .
I have 2 AR barrels and a 8 twist bolt gun , getting ready to chamber a 7 twist for bolt gun.
Have pushed 88 ELDM 3015 from 27" AR.
Shot the 8 twist bolt (80 ELDM @ 3120) at 1000yd this past weekend .... LOVED IT!
Would like to see how my 22 Wildcat compares .
I have 2 AR barrels and a 8 twist bolt gun , getting ready to chamber a 7 twist for bolt gun.
Have pushed 88 ELDM 3015 from 27" AR.
Shot the 8 twist bolt (80 ELDM @ 3120) at 1000yd this past weekend .... LOVED IT!
Necked down, shoulder moved forward and 40° 6.5 Grendel or blown out 22 PPC .
From what little info i can find basically a 6mm Grinch necked down to 22.
My post on another forum promted 1 other guy to have PTG grind a reamer similar to mine. This guy also told me that another guy was building one for tested and possibly producing barrels/uppers.
As far as i know (someone has probably done it before....) I built the first one....
I machined reamers for chamber and size die.
Originally my idea was to be able to shoot 80 and 88 ELDM from small frame AR mag , which it does .
Both AR uppers i built shot so well i wanted to see what it would do from a bolt gun.
From what little info i can find basically a 6mm Grinch necked down to 22.
My post on another forum promted 1 other guy to have PTG grind a reamer similar to mine. This guy also told me that another guy was building one for tested and possibly producing barrels/uppers.
As far as i know (someone has probably done it before....) I built the first one....
I machined reamers for chamber and size die.
Originally my idea was to be able to shoot 80 and 88 ELDM from small frame AR mag , which it does .
Both AR uppers i built shot so well i wanted to see what it would do from a bolt gun.
That’s awesome! That there is a fine looking cartridge! I’d love to move forward with a .22 cal something to be able to shoot heavy bullets faster than my Valkyrie and still have decent velocity, around 3000fps, and not be a horrid barrel burner. Thanks for the information on your caliber.
Updates as in brass or die? Unless I can get a 50k-100k piece order of brass....And dies I need a minium order of like 10
That looks a lot like a baby version of the Dasher. I suspect that it should be inherently quite accurate. I would be interested to see what that does with 69/77 TMK/75eldm on critters.
I know this thread is about 224 vs 220TB, not trying hijack......
I "think" my caliber is close in capacity/performance of 220 TB but shorter case allows longer bullets from AR platform without intruding on capacity as much.
While 224 Grendel , LBC and Predator existed and almost went with one of the above , i figured an increase in capacity / performance would be nice.....
I am extremely pleased with performance and precision as it does seem to be a very precise chamber with anything i have thrown down the barrels.
Heading to WY in couple weeks..... plan to test it out on some Prairie Dogs and maybe a coyote or 2..... trying to talk a guy with Antelope tag into using one of my rifles since 22 cal is legal with heavy bullets.
I "think" my caliber is close in capacity/performance of 220 TB but shorter case allows longer bullets from AR platform without intruding on capacity as much.
While 224 Grendel , LBC and Predator existed and almost went with one of the above , i figured an increase in capacity / performance would be nice.....
I am extremely pleased with performance and precision as it does seem to be a very precise chamber with anything i have thrown down the barrels.
Heading to WY in couple weeks..... plan to test it out on some Prairie Dogs and maybe a coyote or 2..... trying to talk a guy with Antelope tag into using one of my rifles since 22 cal is legal with heavy bullets.
My 6mm Hagar brass order from creedmoorsports came in.
Just now going through them, so far all good.
Have a couple hundred unmolested from the first batch and now another 500.
Combine this with the Nolser and Dogtown 22N I can burn a few barrels
I will keep some for maybe a 6mm Hagar or a 220 TB in the future.
I'm guessing the 22N chamber could be reamed to 220TB? ? ?
You can see the capacity difference between the 6mm Hagar necked down to a 220TB as compared to the shoulder bump and neck job to make a 22 Nosgar. The extra capacity probably allows different powders that wouldn't fit in the Nosgar case. Not having to go to compressed loads would keep the pressure down a little. Right?
The lighter 22N cases have more capacity than the NOSGAR but won't hold up to heaver loads. Same bolt thrust but on a smaller
.223 size bolt.
Just now going through them, so far all good.
Have a couple hundred unmolested from the first batch and now another 500.
Combine this with the Nolser and Dogtown 22N I can burn a few barrels
I will keep some for maybe a 6mm Hagar or a 220 TB in the future.
I'm guessing the 22N chamber could be reamed to 220TB? ? ?
You can see the capacity difference between the 6mm Hagar necked down to a 220TB as compared to the shoulder bump and neck job to make a 22 Nosgar. The extra capacity probably allows different powders that wouldn't fit in the Nosgar case. Not having to go to compressed loads would keep the pressure down a little. Right?
The lighter 22N cases have more capacity than the NOSGAR but won't hold up to heaver loads. Same bolt thrust but on a smaller
.223 size bolt.
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@padom Any update on Scandale (Keystone Accuracy) making (or having made) a run of dies? I've got no issue with mine, but I've had several folks tell me they'd love to try the 220 Thunderbolt if they could find dies for it.
Thanks,
Ross
Thanks,
Ross
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Yes a matter of fact. He informed me last week he is about to make a run of 220TB dies of more than 10 sets.. Ill be starting a group buy or something like that to reserve your sets if you want one.
If/when you start a group buy (or whatever it ends up being called)....I'll let the folks over on the US Rifle Teams forum know as well. Plenty of folks like or want try the 220 TB and need a good set of dies.
Talking to Keystone, we need to gauge interest as doing a run of dies for 2 people isn't going to be worth it.
Post here if you are in for a set of 220 TB dies.
Post here if you are in for a set of 220 TB dies.
These arent anything going to be done anytime soon. I talked to KA today and was told they have to make 5 dies and send for heat treat to make sure the steel and specific heat treat play nice together. Once that is done and worked out then they would make sets for final sale. Would essentially be a Redding Type S Full Length Bushing style sizing die and a Redding micrometer seating die and sets would be somewhere in the $275.00 range but nothing has been finalized.
The competition sets that Redding market in various calibers have been selling for around $185. But if John S. is doing them up himself no doubt they will be more precise, and that cost $. And I can see them probably looking different, maybe more along the lines of what Whidden produces. They will certainly be a top notch product.
Also, if you call Redding (or Forster or .....etc) and have them make you a set that is not in their catalog it's going to cost you about the same as what John is asking. You are paying for the lack of scale/economy.
And Redding and Forster wont even take custom die orders right now... We tried that... Im working on a few options right now to put die sets together for you guys.. Nothing is set in stone right now. But yes, custom order and made dies in small batches are expensive, no matter who you buy them from.
Guys think because they can buy Redding or Forster 223rem or 6.5cm dies for cheap 220 TB dies should be the same. The difference is they run them in batches of many thousand and have standing orders with LOTS of distributors for them on a continuing basis...... Thats what keeps the price down on those popular calibers.
I never tested the 95smk's because the 90smk's shot so damn well and exceeded my goals when I set out to do this 220TB bolt gun test. My original goal was 3000 with the 90smk and no pressure. I far exceeded that and was up over 3100 with no pressure. I backed down to get tons of brass life and match my goal. Ive shot over 1000 90smk @ 3000 and is straight hammers so I had no reason to even mess with the 95 smk but maybe Ill test them for you guys sometime soon.
I know Keystone just cut a Mullerworks cut rifled 1:7 TL3 barrel in 220TB for another SH member just a few weeks ago thats out at Kampfeld's getting fluted and painted right now. Since he didnt have dies I helped him make 500rd with my 90smk recipe. He will be a tad slower as he went 24" vs my testing was all done on a 26" barrel. Im sure we will see some more results shortly from another 220TB shooter.
Thanks SuperMod--just curious.
The 90gr at 3000/3100 essentially matches 260 rem/6 xc performance at 600yds which is the benchmark for us National Match Course shooters.
Thread pics seem to show custom actions with appropriate bolt face diameters?
Simple enough to bush down or open up Rem 700/Tikka series bolts for those of us that need it.
Is it correct to assume the cartridge is being fed from 308 series aics mags with no problems?
The 90gr at 3000/3100 essentially matches 260 rem/6 xc performance at 600yds which is the benchmark for us National Match Course shooters.
Thread pics seem to show custom actions with appropriate bolt face diameters?
Simple enough to bush down or open up Rem 700/Tikka series bolts for those of us that need it.
Is it correct to assume the cartridge is being fed from 308 series aics mags with no problems?
