300 Norma Mag

[Runnineh]

Are you finding R33 to be dirty? I’m reading of people having to clean every 30-40 rounds.

I haven't found that at all. I clean my barrel every 250 rounds, and its not too bad

 

[nick338]

Been seeing a lot on long jumps with Bergers. Played with seating depths and settled on .090 off the lands and went out to re-zero at 100 today.

Berger 245 EOL
87.0 grs N570
CB0 2.775" @.090 off
Avg Velocity - 2951 FPS
ES - 10 FPS

3 shots on the left and adjusted scope and 2 shots on the right to confirm.

 

[Bacarrat]

I'm having the hardest time finding some N570, been looking for months! I do have some IMR7977 anyone have a starting point on 220gr class bullets? QL showing not so great speeds 2700-2800FPS, just looking for some real world data on what to expect if someone has used this combination. Barrel is a 26" Proof, with Lapua brass and 225gr ELD to start.

 

[Blkbird6]

Howdy folks, has anybody got any recommendations/tips for the recommended jump/seat depth for 250 atips in 300NM?

running a 30" 1/8" barrel with F215GM and N570

I have done some comprehensive testing on the 225ELDM with N570 - I will be sharing that here soon...

/EK

 

[GIXXER2000]

I was informed my 30in 1-8 new Bartlein steel barrel has shipped to my smith. I am planning on running Berger 230 hy's as well as 230 -Tips. I just got 8 pounds og N568 so I am going to give that a try, I do have N570 , Retumbo as a back up plan.

 

[waveslayer]

I was informed my 30in 1-8 new Bartlein steel barrel has shipped to my smith. I am planning on running Berger 230 hy's as well as 230 -Tips. I just got 8 pounds og N568 so I am going to give that a try, I do have N570 , Retumbo as a back up plan.

I've had really good luck with 570

 

[GIXXER2000]

I have run N570 in my 338lm worked great. I came across the N568 and thought it was worth a shot. I I ever can get some 245 Bergers hy's I would use N570 for sure.

 

[shoot4fun]

I was informed my 30in 1-8 new Bartlein steel barrel has shipped to my smith. I am planning on running Berger 230 hy's as well as 230 -Tips. I just got 8 pounds og N568 so I am going to give that a try, I do have N570 , Retumbo as a back up plan.

I've shot the 230 Berger in my 10 twist 300 WM for a while now and it has performed well out to 1250 yards. My 300NM 35˚ IMP has a Krieger 1 in 9 twist. I can shoot either 215 Hybrids or any of the 230 grain bullets as far as I am gonna have room for here without issue. I wonder if the 8 twist in a fast moving 30 will be enough RPM to have sporadic bullets turning to vapor?

 

[TankFrank]

I've shot the 230 Berger in my 10 twist 300 WM for a while now and it has performed well out to 1250 yards. My 300NM 35˚ IMP has a Krieger 1 in 9 twist. I can shoot either 215 Hybrids or any of the 230 grain bullets as far as I am gonna have room for here without issue. I wonder if the 8 twist in a fast moving 30 will be enough RPM to have sporadic bullets turning to vapor?

I shoot with an 8 twist 28" K&P. I have no issues so far with it shooting the 230s. I have about 400ish rounds through it so far. Nothing special with the gun. Just an RPR with an LRI chambered 300 norma improved barrel.

 

[CHEYTAC]

I was informed my 30in 1-8 new Bartlein steel barrel has shipped to my smith. I am planning on running Berger 230 hy's as well as 230 -Tips. I just got 8 pounds og N568 so I am going to give that a try, I do have N570 , Retumbo as a back up plan.

N565

 

[Bacarrat]

Trying to figure out this AXMC Proof Prefit barrel on why I am getting hard bolt lift at times. It would do it probably half the time and getting some ejector marks. Even some of the lighter loads in testing would do this.

Current load is:
Lapua Brass sized .002 from fired.
84.5gr Retumbo, should be well under max
225gr ELDMs at 3.60 COAL would have to check but should be around there

It shoots lights out, have had a couple of groups well in the teens. Had it out yesterday for some longer range confirmation and had no problems hitting 1 MOA targets out to 1k.

Only thing I could think of is the OAL of the chamber is too short from Proof? I had a .243 barrel once that was cut too short for me to shoot the 115gr DTACs and had the throat reamed out and it shot fine with no pressure issues.

 

[Huskydriver]

Trying to figure out this AXMC Proof Prefit barrel on why I am getting hard bolt lift at times. It would do it probably half the time and getting some ejector marks. Even some of the lighter loads in testing would do this.

Current load is:
Lapua Brass sized .002 from fired.
84.5gr Retumbo, should be well under max
225gr ELDMs at 3.60 COAL would have to check but should be around there

It shoots lights out, have had a couple of groups well in the teens. Had it out yesterday for some longer range confirmation and had no problems hitting 1 MOA targets out to 1k.

Only thing I could think of is the OAL of the chamber is too short from Proof? I had a .243 barrel once that was cut too short for me to shoot the 115gr DTACs and had the throat reamed out and it shot fine with no pressure issues.

I had issues with a die not sizing the body all the way down to the end of the web.

I would take some web measurements and see if your stickers are .001-2 wider then the ones that extract okay. Eventually I bet if is the die on the next firing, all will have issues.

This can happen if the chamber is on the loose end and so is the die

 

[Bacarrat]

Brass is probably on it's 3rd or 4th firing. Only have used about 30 cases so far for the initial load development and to make sure everything is OK with the load. I checked a sized case with no bullet and it will chamber and extract fine. Die is a Whidden FL Neck sizer. Cases are also annealed after every firing with a AMP.

 

[Huskydriver]

Brass is probably on it's 3rd or 4th firing. Only have used about 30 cases so far for the initial load development and to make sure everything is OK with the load. I checked a sized case with no bullet and it will chamber and extract fine. Die is a Whidden FL Neck sizer. Cases are also annealed after every firing with a AMP.

Check all 30

 

[Bacarrat]

I never had any problems closing the bolt, empty or a loaded round. Only fired I would get the issue.

 

[Huskydriver]

I never had any problems closing the bolt, empty or a loaded round. Only fired I would get the issue.

I understand. Measure the webs on all 30 see if some are 1 or 2 tho larger

 

[EKane]

Has anyone has success with the 220 ELD-X or 250 A Tip with RL-50?

I can get the 250 Atips to 2880fps with 88.5 grains of H50BMG powder. It runs best at 2820 and 87 grains. I'm tempted to try some RL50 at 88-91 grains and see if I cant squeeze out a tiny bit more speed out of a 28" barrel. Sorry Im fresh out of RL50 or I'd give it a try. Anyone else ran 250 Atips behind some RL50?

 

[Birddog6424]

I recently switched up my load. I softened it up up a bit.

I've been running 92.6grs of RE33 under a 230gr Berger Hybrid at 3050fps for several years now. But cracking it out a month or so ago to get ready for hunting season it just wasn't impressing me. It was so much recoil my magazine was slipping off the latch and not feeding the round. Groups weren't as good, etc. It just seemed off, it felt too much like running on the ragged edge of the load.

So I dropped it down to 91grs and 2950fps and it all came back together. Low single digit SD, stacked two shots 4" apart on the waterline at 800 yards last night, then smacked the 1moa 8" square at that distance. Moved to the 20" plate at 1400 yards and put two good hits on the plate.

Glad I decided to tinker with it.

 

[jonthomps]

Dad used my 300NM to smoke his bull last week in CO. Shot it at 1080y. 15 degree angle. One and done. Here’s a pic of our shooting position. Bull was shot in the opening below us. 72 and still going strong! Load:

230 Berger hybrid
Peterson brass
83.5 Retumbo
2910fps
SD: 4

 

[762 ULTRAMAGA]

What are you guys seeing for case growth with the standard 300 NM?
I'm torn between doing a 40 degree improved version or the plain jane with a 20" barrel.
I hate fire forming but if that 20 degree shoulder causes problems I'd like to mitigate it

 

[nick338]

.003-004 with heavy loads and standard chamber.

 

[762 ULTRAMAGA]

.003-004 with heavy loads and standard chamber.

Right on so 4-5 firings between trimming?

 

[Birddog6424]

Right on so 4-5 firings between trimming?

I have 60 pieces of Norma brass with about 5 firings on them. They don't need trimmed yet.

I anneal after ever firing and checked all of them about a month ago when I loaded up all my ammo for this fall.

 

[nick338]

Right on so 4-5 firings between trimming?

It's Lapua brass and that was first firing from virgin cases. Haven't done any brass prep on them until I'll use up what I have left and then I'll clean, size and see where I'm at.

 

[918v]

Trying to figure out this AXMC Proof Prefit barrel on why I am getting hard bolt lift at times. It would do it probably half the time and getting some ejector marks. Even some of the lighter loads in testing would do this.

Current load is:
Lapua Brass sized .002 from fired.
84.5gr Retumbo, should be well under max
225gr ELDMs at 3.60 COAL would have to check but should be around there

It shoots lights out, have had a couple of groups well in the teens. Had it out yesterday for some longer range confirmation and had no problems hitting 1 MOA targets out to 1k.

Only thing I could think of is the OAL of the chamber is too short from Proof? I had a .243 barrel once that was cut too short for me to shoot the 115gr DTACs and had the throat reamed out and it shot fine with no pressure issues.

AI tends to give you hard bolt lift sometimes if your shoulder clearance is that tight. Try .003”-.004” and you’ll be happy.

 

[Jrtex]

I was informed my 30in 1-8 new Bartlein steel barrel has shipped to my smith. I am planning on running Berger 230 hy's as well as 230 -Tips. I just got 8 pounds og N568 so I am going to give that a try, I do have N570 , Retumbo as a back up plan.

I have 8 pounds of N568, but I have been using retumbo and getting 3050fps with 230 a tips and shoots .2” groups. What data have you got with the n568? What velocitys are you seeing and how’s the accuarcy?
TIA

 

[millertime2]

Just put together a 300 Norma and doing some load experimentIng. Trying some 50 BMG based off of a buddy’s experience but Im not sure I’m gonna get enough velocity out of it before I’m crushing powder. Hopefully the barrel speeds up a bit.

 

[GIXXER2000]

New Barrel 30in 1-8 new Bartlein steel spun up by Dave Tooley for my AI-PSR. With just 62 round on the barrel its already looking good shot 3 -3 round groups under 1/3 moa. The groups tightened up when I went from 20 to 10 off the lands. Will update once I have gone though the brass once. With the size of the kernels there is no issue with case fill.
Norma Brass
Berger 230's
WLRM
N568 86.2
AVG FPS 2954
SD 6.3
COAL 3.604

 

[Scwalker83]

Howdy folks, has anybody got any recommendations/tips for the recommended jump/seat depth for 250 atips in 300NM?

running a 30" 1/8" barrel with F215GM and N570

I have done some comprehensive testing on the 225ELDM with N570 - I will be sharing that here soon...

/EK

I use .1 off the lands and 82.7 Retumbo @ 3.6 OAL with 250 A-tip. Gives 2820 FPS with 5-7 SD and Sub 12 ES. 28" ES Tactical barrel.

 

[EKane]

Just put together a 300 Norma and doing some load experimentIng. Trying some 50 BMG based off of a buddy’s experience but Im not sure I’m gonna get enough velocity out of it before I’m crushing powder. Hopefully the barrel speeds up a bit.

I have had really good luck with H50BMG and 250 grain atips. For me Retumbo or H1000 are slightly faster for the 215-230 grain bullets. I have never tried any N570 b/c it has been unobtainium for the last year. Practically speaking, H50BMG and Atips have been more readily available as compared to Berger bullets and Vihtavori powder. Of course currently the limiting factor for my 300 Norma is large rifle primers.

 

[millertime2]

Tried some 245’s and 570 today got up around 3000fps and the brass looks fine. Noticed every once in a while I was getting some clickers this was once fired Lapua brass I bought off a forum. Sounds like the Bullet Central sizing doesn’t will fis this issue and size my brass down closer to the web? Anyone have experience with this same issue? Thanks

 

[Scwalker83]

250 ATIP w/ 83.5 N570 at 3.58 OAL (.1 off) gives 2998 w/ 30 inch structured barrel out of an AXSR. 3-4 SD and 1/4-1/2 MOA. Lapua brass, 215M primer.

 

[ITR_98_111]

You're just burning up the barrel with that powder. You should be running that 220 around 3100 fps at max pressure with the right powder. Why bother for 300 WSM ballistics?

Late to the party, but why do you believe H4350 is going to burn out the barrel? Best I can tell, its heat potential is actually less than most popular powders for the 300NM and you use 10% less - so my understanding is the barrel would actually last longer (I'm very open to hearing why it would burn the barrel quicker because I agree, it seems counter-intuitive to what I would expect).

Hodgdon H1000 - 3630 kJ/kg
Vihtavuori N570 - 3950 kJ/kg
Hodgdon Retumbo - 3710 kJ/kg
RL33 - 3900kJ/kg

Hodgdon H4350 - 3760 kJ/kg (close to Retumbo)

220 SMKs tend to want to stay in the 3k range from what I've tested - and admittedly shoot slightly better with the H1000 running 84-85gr. I did push them up to 3131fps with the H1000, but my SDs and accuracy went down anything hotter than 3050 (26" 1:8 twist).

 

[nick338]

Because if you look at the Quickload data Dogtown posted, near max load of 77 gr of H4350 is only giving you 2850 with a 220 gr projectile. Why waste precious barrel life on a 300 Norma for something like 300 WSM ballistics? That powder is too fast and limiting the cartridge potential and just shortening the barrel's life while your doing it.

 

[ITR_98_111]

Real world - I pushed a 230gr A-tip at 2,949fps with 77gr of H4350; Dogtown's data shows 77gr being -10%, whereas I calculated it being near maximum.

 

[Dogtown]

Reminder that QL is predictive simulation, not ground truth. Actual data from shooting loads > QL.

 

[ITR_98_111]

If I get some time next week, I’ll throw some 220s and see what they do.

Dogtown - if you have some time can you run the same on the Hornady 230gr A-tips please; believe they should be about 80fps slower from the data I have running both bullets in H1000

My magnetospeed seems to read as expected with other loads, so I believe it’s working properly (I did once let the voltage on the 9v dip and without giving me a voltage warning, it started reading all over the place). I since swapped over to the Cr123s or whatever it is they recommend and it’s been solid ever since.

Finally getting settled in after moving across the country, so picked up getting my loads dialed in on the 300nm. Also found a few boxes of the Berger 230s - so excited to test those out as well

 

[Dogtown]

 

[GIXXER2000]

I just shot a local 1000 yard match today. Light wind no more than 3 mph I shot 97 3x so not a bad day.
I was shooting 230 A-Tips at 2945 AVG FPS
Load was 86.2 of N568.

 

[ITR_98_111]

77gr H4350 with 220 SMK - 3040fps

Also ran 78.5 with the 230 a-tips @ 3,004 with heavy bolt lift - so certainly over pressure. 4 shot SD was 10.14

SDs sucked on all 4 groups today - which isn’t surprising since I sold my fancy powder thrower when I moved and am awaiting a new one for Christmas

 

[ITR_98_111]

For what it’s worth, other groups:

81.5gr H4831; 230 A-tip - 2,968
84gr H1000; 220SMK - 3,038

Group size for the H1000 was the best at about .6" vs the H4831 and H4350 were both in the 1.2-1.3" range (100yards).

Next up will be the Berger's with the H1000 after christmas.

 

[millertime2]

N570 245 EOL
85.5 2969 avg 4.5/11
86.5 3004 avg 5.2/11
3 shots
85.5 2957 3.6/7
85.7 2984 .5/1. Only 2 on chrono 3 shots one hole.
85.9 2986 6.7/10 2 registered
86.1 2987 3.1/6
86.3 2994 4.5/9
86.5 2994 3.7/7

 

[nick338]

N570 245 EOL
85.5 2969 avg 4.5/11
86.5 3004 avg 5.2/11
3 shots
85.5 2957 3.6/7
85.7 2984 .5/1. Only 2 on chrono 3 shots one hole.
85.9 2986 6.7/10 2 registered
86.1 2987 3.1/6
86.3 2994 4.5/9
86.5 2994 3.7/7




View attachment 8025687

You've pretty much duplicated my results. It's as if that bullet/powder combo were made for the 300 Norma.

 

[jonthomps]

N570 245 EOL
85.5 2969 avg 4.5/11
86.5 3004 avg 5.2/11
3 shots
85.5 2957 3.6/7
85.7 2984 .5/1. Only 2 on chrono 3 shots one hole.
85.9 2986 6.7/10 2 registered
86.1 2987 3.1/6
86.3 2994 4.5/9
86.5 2994 3.7/7




View attachment 8025687

What's your BTO or COAL?

 

[millertime2]

COAL 3.716

 

[waveslayer]

COAL 3.716

I'm the same for my loads with 230 Bergers

 

[jonthomps]

COAL 3.716

Thanks man

 

[jonthomps]

The 85.5 mark seems to be the sweet spot for the 245/N570 combo.

 

[millertime2]

when will the 245 LRHY be available and are the 250 Atips worth trying over the 245 Bergs?

 

[nick338]

My best accuracy is right around 87 grs. with the 245 and N570. I'll have to check my overall length but I'm .090 off.