The same thing happened to me with a 375 H&H AI. A bit more pressure cleaned them right up.
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300 PRC update
- Thread starter DAVETOOLEY
- Start date
The 300PRC did it again. 1MOA LR match out to 1500yds.
It depends on a lot of things. Brass, powder, bullet, bore tightness, action, barrel thickness around the combustion area. That’s why everyone repeats the same old phrases about starting low and working up.
From what I can tell amongst all the various combinations of things, 2800 is a pretty safe bet for a 230 bullet with a 26” barrel. 2900 fps if we’re talking close to pressure. But I’ve seen people shooting 250s near in 2800-2900fps with 26-28” barrels and I just scratch my head when I see that.
What I consider a safe load is when pressure occurs from say a heavy bolt lift, backing off that by 100 FPS. Idk how many people follow a rule like mine but I suspect some are pushing it closer to the edge than they want to admit.
I tend to not run at top pressure I always back off a grain or two and run with it. I had a 300 win mag throated long 28 inch barrel 225 eldm at 2929 and 245 berger 2800. That's why I was asking. Seeing the difference maybe coming back to 30 cal.
For reference, I have a 26” 300WM that I run 225 ELDMs at 2900. My 24” Howa PRC does about the same with 225 ELDMs / 230 A-Tips. It gets around 2830 with 250 A-Tips. It’s a factory barrel that seems slow to me. It’s about to become a 28”.
It’s definitely not FAST, but I’m not trying to kill the barrel either.
This is 78 grains of ADI AR2225 (our version of Retumbo / Reloader 25). There isn’t heaps of room left in the case.
I’d rather be fairly conservative and have an accurate load, for the distances I’m generally shooting (800-1300m) this is plenty of rifle.
What charge loads are you guys sitting around?
This is 78 grains of ADI AR2225 (our version of Retumbo / Reloader 25). There isn’t heaps of room left in the case.
I’d rather be fairly conservative and have an accurate load, for the distances I’m generally shooting (800-1300m) this is plenty of rifle.
What charge loads are you guys sitting around?
It
It does well. Of course, I seat them quite long ( a bit over 3.6”) and have to single feed them. If I’d bought an 8 twist barrel instead of a 10 twist for my WM I wouldn’t be messing with the PRC.
It does well. Of course, I seat them quite long ( a bit over 3.6”) and have to single feed them. If I’d bought an 8 twist barrel instead of a 10 twist for my WM I wouldn’t be messing with the PRC.
My win mag with the 225 eldm was loaded at 3.777 I run long action cup mags load alot longer in them. But got rid of it for other things. But 30 cals are fun might be getting another
Any thoughts on Structured Barrell with a +1 twist for copper solids? Would the faster spin rate be better for turned copper solids. I'm thinking more spin would be better through the transonic zone will help stabilize it no? nice info thread , I'm about to read/catch up on it.
I just tested 250 a-tips in the yard for pressure before I test for accuracy. Velocity was with the Magnetospeed. 29" barrel has exactly 100 rounds down it before these shots. Action is an Atlas Tactical. At 88 degrees, with Lapua brass and 215M's I got the following:
N565
72 - 2660 fps
76 - 2845 fps; no bolt lift and a very small smear
N570
75 - 2702 fps
76 - 2790 fps; began feeling powder when seating bullet with Wilson arbor die
78 - 2829 fps; zero pressure signs; could still hear powder when shaking case
N565
72 - 2660 fps
76 - 2845 fps; no bolt lift and a very small smear
N570
75 - 2702 fps
76 - 2790 fps; began feeling powder when seating bullet with Wilson arbor die
78 - 2829 fps; zero pressure signs; could still hear powder when shaking case
Used rifle on the way. Hint - no structured barrel. I will need a brake(Cortina Tuner Brake?) and some powder, I think I have everything else. Will be digging on the recipes and new profiles for strelock.
Man, that’s bitter sweet. I fricking love/hate n570. Not sure your groups but I bought a tmb tuner and was able to keep coal and charge with the 245’s @2940 and punching one big hole at 200 yards. Hoping to test out to distance this Saturday = 4.5 hour drive
In ELR events...we are running our COAL a lot longer than 3.7.....by about 100 thou or more. I don't even go down to 3.70 when magazine feeding.
The seater was set to the depth I'm using on the 225 ELD-M's. Since I was just looking for pressure I just left the depth where it was. I hit my velocity goal before any real pressure at that depth. I'll be starting at max length for the CIP magazine when I start testing for accuracy.
Anybody fiddled with N568 yet? I'll be trying it soon with 215 and 245s.
I'll play with it after the ELR season....don't have the time to do new load development when all I do is work all week...and travel on the weekends to shoot. This Winter...I'll put some effort into it...but I can almost guarantee you that I'll run 76.0 grains and tune a seating depth in about 10 shots and call it a day....with the 245's
300 PRC
28 inch barrel
230 A tip
80 Gr of H1000
2970 Fps no pressure signs.
Lapua brass
elevation 1100 Feet
28 inch barrel
230 A tip
80 Gr of H1000
2970 Fps no pressure signs.
Lapua brass
elevation 1100 Feet
Today...about an hour ago actually....
300PRC
29.5" barrel
245gr EOL's
76.0gr of RL-26
2887 fps no pressure signs ******* caveat ******
Lapua Brass
Elevation 954ft
So....the reason my speeds are slower than the were...and no pressure signs are the following:
I didn't clean my brass...I brushed out the necks with a 30cal nylon brush just to get the big carbon out.
I annealed with Aztec Code 168 on an Amp Annealer *** on neck turned brass at 13.5Thou ***
I full length resized with a LE WIlson bushing die...and I forget exactly which bushing...but very little neck sizing.
I Mandrel each one back out to 2 thou below bullet size.
I Coat my bullets with HBN
This coupled with my seating depth...I've reduced pressure for the sake of consistency. If I skip one of these steps and go same powder load...it will show pressure signs....The HBN really slicks up the bullets and drops your MV...but it makes verticals at ELR ranges really nice.
So....when you read loads on the Internet...even if they are true and real...there are a lot more things going on that you need to be aware of.
Signed,
B2
300PRC
29.5" barrel
245gr EOL's
76.0gr of RL-26
2887 fps no pressure signs ******* caveat ******
Lapua Brass
Elevation 954ft
So....the reason my speeds are slower than the were...and no pressure signs are the following:
I didn't clean my brass...I brushed out the necks with a 30cal nylon brush just to get the big carbon out.
I annealed with Aztec Code 168 on an Amp Annealer *** on neck turned brass at 13.5Thou ***
I full length resized with a LE WIlson bushing die...and I forget exactly which bushing...but very little neck sizing.
I Mandrel each one back out to 2 thou below bullet size.
I Coat my bullets with HBN
This coupled with my seating depth...I've reduced pressure for the sake of consistency. If I skip one of these steps and go same powder load...it will show pressure signs....The HBN really slicks up the bullets and drops your MV...but it makes verticals at ELR ranges really nice.
So....when you read loads on the Internet...even if they are true and real...there are a lot more things going on that you need to be aware of.
Signed,
B2
b2lee
I was looking at AB Mobile for the 245 EOLs and it was showing a higher G7 BC than the Berger published number (.438 vs Berger’s .413). From your usage does this seem correct? Also, what’s your opinion on the quality and consistency compared to the A-Tips. I had planned on starting out using the 250s since I can find them, occasionally. Thanks.
Mike
I was looking at AB Mobile for the 245 EOLs and it was showing a higher G7 BC than the Berger published number (.438 vs Berger’s .413). From your usage does this seem correct? Also, what’s your opinion on the quality and consistency compared to the A-Tips. I had planned on starting out using the 250s since I can find them, occasionally. Thanks.
Mike
I do believe that Berger is conservative with their numbers....and hence why they tried to educate people with the No BS BC series. The .413 is at a certain condition at a certain range.....with a certain barrel...and a certain velocity. Me using a 29.5" barrel and getting a little more giddy up behind the bullets....increases the BC. Now....I also tip my bullets and HBN coat them...I'm currently at around a .455 G7.
I've shot a lot of 230 A-Tips...and many hundred 250's. While I really like the A-Tips...they have a tendency to explodicate at the absolute worst time. If I'm shooting an ELR match and one explodes and I miss....probably not that big a deal since my odds of hitting that 2000+ yard steel aren't certain....but when you shoot 1 mile paper...and 1 miss is a DQ....then it just pisses you off.
I originally started shooting the 245 EOLs because they were $50/100 or so...while the A-Tips where like $80/100.....the price difference was large enough for me to give them a try. Then I found I shot consistent with the Bergers and while I was going to tip them...thus more work....I really liked them. It seems a 1-9tw likes the 245 Berger more than the 250 A-Tip...
I still have hundreds of A-Tips...but I have a lot of 245 EOL's I will shoot first.....until the new 245-ish Berger comes out soon...then I'll test them out. I was hoping the Bergers were 'close enough' for me not to fret over when shooting ELR....and they've exceeded my expectations.....I've had matches where I shoot a sub 2" vertical at a mile...but blow my wind calls....and last week I shot 3 groups with 2" horizontals....but had something going wonky with the rear bag and my vertical dispersion was too much to keep all 5 on paper. One day I'll get both at the same time and it will be magical.
So...the A-Tip is one sexy looking bullet. They are great....it's just that the low probability of one flying apart...seems to catch me and others at exactly the wrong time. Not much Hornady can do about that....it is what it is. The bergers have been consistently great for me....I'll measure the snot out of stuff...and they are great from lot to lot.
Both are great bullets....but like I said...I originally shot the A-Tips...and wanted to convert to something not so price heavy...and ended up finding something I like more.
It has to be random.....the bonding isn't strong enough in aluminum to lead/copper in one out of a bunch. I've seen them blow up in 1k and 1 mile benchrest...so like 5 to maybe 10 sighters...then shoot 5 for a group.....one of the record shots goes poof 15 yards down range....or simply doesn't show up on a 42" piece of paper at 1k when the other 4 are in a 5" group.
So very clean barrels....very expensive and lapped barrels.....plenty of cooling off between sighters......cool barrel...and then poof! In that game....1 miss is a DQ....can you risk it? In other disciplines...it is just merely annoying on the rare occasion.
Well dang. After I had the 180 eldm blow I switched to smk and a few bergers. But 30 cal bullets were tough to find and the 230 a-tips were there so thought I'd try. Hopefully they do better. I'm sure my speeds will be kept in the 2800 to 2850. Thanks for the info on them. Did you find the bc true?
I found the BC close enough to where I didn't really have an issue with them....if anything....my BC was 2 points higher or so...because of the speeds.
I've pushed them in excess of 3000fps....which is silly...I found at around 2925 they performed the best for me.
I don't think Hornady can fix the problem. Actually, I think Hornady has done a great job with them...better than probably any other company could do on a large scale. The problem is the design itself....it is...what it is. You will have the occasional...random bullet...just not bond good enough...spin it at a high RPM with pressure while squeezing it in the lands....and sometimes....they just fail.
With those 180 eldm I had 16 out of 20 blow. 7mm rem mag 2900 to 3000 1-8 twist but had great luck 280ai 2800 1-9 never lost one and shot amazing. But very true I shot hornady from hunting butters to target my whole life til that happened. I don't plan on getting those speeds but I appreciate the info on them. I wonder when berger will release the new 245 target that will be a good one
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