6mm Crusader

[A10XRIFLE]

Re: 6mm Crusader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You guys got Dies for 6.5 version?

more importantly can my smith rent/burrow the reamer?

Is reamer setup for 140vld? and OAL?

</div></div>

you just have to change the 6mm bushing to a 6.5 bushing in the Die and the expander ball to a 6.5 mm

 

[Longrange****]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Any idea on barrel life yet? And has anyone settled on a full package of specs yet? IE:

Best --
-Twist
-Powder
-Primer
-Proj
-Vel

Has anyone tried this without Gain twist?

 

[Jedi]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Damn it, me likes this much
dedicated f class rig
31" broughton, defiance action, Shehane MBR etc
makes more sense than swede...did i just say that

PM to ya GEO

 

[IanB]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Anymore news on this? barrel life, available brass etc

 

[A10XRIFLE]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Latest Lets See:

20 Some rifles built

all the shooters are easily getting 3200 with the 115's
3400 with the 105-107

Barrel life is still expected to be 2500-3000 no-one has shot one out yet so that still looks to be the case.

Gain twist from 9-8 is what we have been running but there are several straight 8 twists out there as well a 8.5 would probably be ideal at top speeds.

Dies are in stock here at GAP they are Redding S Serries Comp

the 6.5 Crusader is also an option as we have a reamer but have not started messing with it yet. equivilant to a 6.5x284 with a little less powder.

Brass, probably will not see comercial brass unless this really starts to take off, im going to start compeating with it from now on so the interest will get better if it does well. F Clasers are all over the idea but so far there are three guys shooting it in the 2011 matches.

Hornady now makes a Hydrolic form die which takes away the fire forming hastle. fill the case with water run it up in the press and smack the plunger with a hammer. a little messy but works great.

Brass, Winchester, Remington, Hornady all make 6mm Rem brass

7mm Mauser brass also works as well as cases bases off the 7mm mauser.

 

[IanB]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Thanks for that George, two more questions if you don't mind.

Do you stock the reamer? and how would the 115's perform in a 1-7.5 or 1-7.8 twist?

Ok I have done some research and answered the first question, yes you do. The only thing that concerns me now is will the 115 Dtac stay together in a 1-7.5 twist barrel.

 

[kombayotch]

Re: 6mm Crusader

A small update:

Pulled the Crusader barrel out of the closet and gave it a good scrubbing. Just shy of 1500 rounds on it. Been shooting 308 all summer...

Went to sight in and confirm velocities and dope:

Yes, most are three round groups, but I was just confirming dope...

Top left: First group after cleaning (3 rounds)
Top right: Fired another to confirm postion (bottom), then made an elevation adjustment (top)
Bottom left: Confirmed 200 yard elevation, made a horizontal adjustment.
Bottom right: Confirmed 300 yard dope

So much for the predictions that the barrel will be toast by 1000 rounds...

 

[Carnivore]

Re: 6mm Crusader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KJDrake</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"Will have the rifle ready with ammo for the Hide Cup"

wonderful...now i can only pray its not windy. LOL

KJ </div></div>

In DECEMBER at RO, right Kevin, keep dreaming those dreams!

 

[SONIC SAAMI]

Re: 6mm Crusader

New Tac 30 sitting here I think I have found a new home for it. ACIS 2.0 Tac 30 chambered up in 6mmCrew

 

[Sendero_Man]

Re: 6mm Crusader

I am Loving my 6mm Crusader !




But the coyotes HATE IT !!!

 

[kombayotch]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Still lovin' mine. Just got around to shooting it again after having the 308 barrel on all summer.

Been playing around with making cases from all of the once fired 30-06 and 270 brass hunters left at the range. Its pretty easy:

1) Run the case into a 243 sizing die down to where you want the bottom of the shoulder
2) Size the case with the 6mm Crusader die to knock the shoulder down to 30 degrees
3) Trim
4) Neck turn
5) Anneal

Its a bit more work, but you get a case that looks like a piece of factory 6mm Crusader would and you can fire full loads with it right off the bat. Thinking about getting a box of Lapua 30-06 to compare it to cases formed from WW 6mm Rem.

 

[Sendero_Man]

Re: 6mm Crusader

I have had a lot better luck with the WW brass than the hornady. seems to form and size better. softer I'd assume.

 

[kombayotch]

Re: 6mm Crusader

I never got around to trying the Hornady cases, but the FC 270 case are working nicely.

 

[Sendero_Man]

Re: 6mm Crusader

little eye candy

 

[2clicks]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Will the 6.5 Crusader work out of a short action and an Eliseo RTS? Mag feeding with the RTS uses AICS magazines. Which bullet is slated for use with this design?

 

[iFENCEuin]

Re: 6mm Crusader

i second 2clicks. Please tell us more about this 6.5Crew

any built yet, chamber matched to a 140VLD? Anyone shooting this? Feedback would be great.

VERY interesting......

 

[JFComfort]

Re: 6mm Crusader

I'm curious about 6.5mm Crusader too!

 

[downhill]

Re: 6mm Crusader

It would appear that King George has set a new standard. Very interesting cartridge and performance.

 

[Sendero_Man]

Re: 6mm Crusader

sorry for cell phone pics...

swapped scopes and here is group for rounds 3 thru 7 during sight in.

 

[Chiller]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Nice work Drive By.....

 

[Sendero_Man]

Re: 6mm Crusader

thanks...

all I can say is....


"Poor coyotes !"

 

[smack]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Did this project ever make it to properly head stamped brass? Factory produced brass?

 

[A10XRIFLE]

Re: 6mm Crusader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SMACK</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Did this project ever make it to properly head stamped brass? Factory produced brass?</div></div>

Not yet, thats a huge undertaking like 1 million piece order Min

 

[smack]

Re: 6mm Crusader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SMACK</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Did this project ever make it to properly head stamped brass? Factory produced brass?</div></div>

Not yet, thats a huge undertaking like 1 million piece order Min </div></div>


I knew there was a huge min order but I had no idea that the min order could be that high, a huge financial step/commitment.

 

[Mohawk3a]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Is there any information on performance of the 6.5mm crusader?

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Did you read the thread? There's lots of info on performance!

 

[kombayotch]

Re: 6mm Crusader

No, he asked about the 6.5mm, not the 6mm.

I don't think one has been built yet, but logically it should give slightly higher maximum velocity than 260 AI based on case volume. However, the nodes may end up being at the same velocity.

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: 6mm Crusader

My bad......

-but then again I don't know if there is a 6.5 Crusader.....

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: 6mm Crusader

oops I see it now on some of the load data.

JeffVN

 

[Mohawk3a]

Re: 6mm Crusader

How will the 6.5 crusader compare to the .260 ai? Trying to decide between the two.

 

[2clicks]

Re: 6mm Crusader

6.5 Crusader 2950-3000 fps 139gr Lapua.

This looks real good, I'm going to try this for my first custom bolt action. Time to broaden my horizons. I'm Hoping to get a slight bit better barrel life than a 6.5-284 with near the same performance. Seems like the 6mm Remingtons potential has been tapped into (twice) and just when I was looking for Great performance out of a short action. Nice work George!!! And it's workable from AICS Mags! Dang.... Only thing holding me up is a tube stock in the works.

Link to a 260 AI performance

http://www.6mmbr.com/gunweek046.htm

 

[Jedi]

Re: 6mm Crusader

I was tempted by 6.5 version
thou i went a different route 6.5x47
Simple as i had a friend running a 28" barrel hitting 2930fps 139scenar, verified via come ups
less powder longer barrel life same result on paper

 

[holy cow]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Are those rings around the necks from neck sizing with a bushing? Are you also full length sizing after each firing. Those are some fantastic looking rifles you have their. Looking to build a 243 for varmint hunting this year but after seeing this i think i may be changing my mind.<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: A10XRIFLE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For those that really want to push the 115 Dtacs in a STD boltface, short action repeater.


115 in 243 win , compared to 115 in 6mm crusader

Base of bearing surface at the neck shoulder juntion. "no Doughnut's"

Fits nicley in an AICS (with plate removed) or Std AIAW mag

Bulets are seated to be .005" in the lands at this length.



3200-3300 FPS is the goal

has 8.5 grains more capacity than the 243 Win

32 deg shoulder.


HMMMMMMMM????






</div></div>

 

[holy cow]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Those are some fantastic looking rifles--- thought i was on the other post when i wrote that, sorry.

 

[Sendero_Man]

Re: 6mm Crusader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dan Tucker</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Looking to build a 243 for varmint hunting this year but after seeing this i think i may be changing my mind.

</div></div> [/quote]

I would if I was you !

 

[Sendero_Man]

Re: 6mm Crusader

top for ARP

 

[ARP]

Re: 6mm Crusader

thx SM.

 

[wadebrown]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Sounds like an interesting round. Is there a posting that has the specifications of the round, I have looked through quite a few of the postings on this thread and have not found one. It is possible I just did not look hard enough but there are a lot of postings that it is not easy to sift through. Searching with Google did not do me any good as there are so many 6 mm crusader postings.

Thanks

wade

 

[Sendero_Man]

Re: 6mm Crusader

contact George at GAP

 

[IanB]

Re: 6mm Crusader

A little bit more info for you.

I have tried N560 and H1000 and N560 is a clear winner, both will easily get the 115 DTAc to 3200 fps, but accuracy seems to drop off beyond 3150 fps, I haven't pushed either to their full max so there might be another accuracy node.

49 grains of N560 gives me 3130 fps with 16 ES and 1.1 inch 5 shot groups at 300 yards, using a 30 inch Bartlein 237 5R 1-7.5 twist.

The next logical step will be to try RL25 and H4831SC.

If anyone is thinking of using RWS 7x57 Mauser brass be prepared for a lot of neck turning, and I do mean a lot!

 

[kombayotch]

Re: 6mm Crusader

N570 would also be interesting to try. You should have room for it in the case if you're only using 49 g. of N560.

I posted data for RL25 earlier in the thread. The temperature stability of it is terrible.

You will find accuracy for H4831CS also at around 49 gr. But, you will probably like the results from Retumbo better.

 

[IanB]

Re: 6mm Crusader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kombayotch</div><div class="ubbcode-body">N570 would also be interesting to try. You should have room for it in the case if you're only using 49 g. of N560.

I posted data for RL25 earlier in the thread. The temperature stability of it is terrible.

You will find accuracy for H4831CS also at around 49 gr. But, you will probably like the results from Retumbo better. </div></div>

Thanks Kombayotch.

What sort of velocity were you getting from H4831SC? QL predicts 3160 fps.
Retumbo is a bit of a rarity this side of the pond.

I really would like to find some accuracy around or above 3200 fps with the 115 Dtacs, other wise I think the 105 Berger VLD is a better bet.

 

[kombayotch]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Around 3080-3100...

Try N570. The node will probably be around 3250 fps., though.

 

[264Charlie]

Re: 6mm Crusader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I was tempted by 6.5 version
thou i went a different route 6.5x47
Simple as i had a friend running a 28" barrel hitting 2930fps 139scenar, verified via come ups
less powder longer barrel life same result on paper </div></div>


I am currently shooting a 6.5x47... Yes it can drive a 139scenar at 2930 or so, R17 is the powder for the 65L. The issue is the 139 BC is very bad for a 140gr bullet you might as well shoot a 123SMK. The 142smk @ 2850 has less wind than the 139s at 2950.

You would need to run a 6.5 very hot to get a 142 to 2930. I have tried a few powders and just cant get it to shoot over 65k of PSI. Now if the 6.5crusader can get the 142SMK to 2950 - 3000fps in that same 28' barrel I think I would be a worth wild endeavor.

 

[clinto]

Re: 6mm Crusader

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The 142smk @ 2850 has less wind than the 139s at 2950.
</div></div>

Ok correct me if Im wrong here but I dont see how the 142smk would have less wind at a lower velocity than the 139 scenar. The 139 scenar has a higher BC right?

 

[SingleShot85]

Re: 6mm Crusader

yeah I don't see the .615 BC of the 139 and the addition of a 100fsp being beat by the 142 at .595 BC.

Mathematically speak'n anyway,

but then again I don't shoot a 6.5mm rifle

 

[264Charlie]

Re: 6mm Crusader

You don't trust the Lapua site to you? Read the litz book and work in G7 BCs, G1s are useless.


139Scenar G7 .285 G1 .557

142SMK G7 .301 G1 .588

 

[kombayotch]

Re: 6mm Crusader

The 139 Scenar has the lowest BC of all of the 140`ish gr. 6.5mm bullets, according to the book. The JLK has the highest.

 

[pdd614]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Check lapua's website. They updated all the bc's with g7 and cd data. They almost mirror what litz's data says. All of the crazy high bc's have been brought back to reality.

 

[clinto]

Re: 6mm Crusader

Well hell, I wasnt aware of the book. Guess Im gonna have to get one. thanks for the info.