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Best home defense is no suppressor? / zero distance
- Thread starter TurboTrout
- Start date
What does that matter? Reality doesn't change regardless of where it's posted. If you actually believe that you better take a real good look at how you think.
You didn't add the other facts in your previous post. These can and probably will make a difference. Remember though he will say he brought a firearm because you had already threatened to kill him in the past. He'll also say that you invited/lured him to your home. I've seen this happen more than once. Considering the history you two have this can and will be an issue.
The main objective is to live in dignity. Being forced out of my home by some shitbag or group of shitbags is not part of my definition of that. Everyone has a line somewhere that won't be crossed. One of my lines lies at the entry to my home. Anyone who violates it while I'm there does that at the risk of his life.
I have no duty to arrest anyone, nor do I have to follow some proportionality of force bullshit, so the confrontation will have much different dynamics.
When it comes to a deadly threat, that gets dealt with first. Then the phone calls get made. To the attorney first then to the cops.
You said 80% of people have one firearm/only a pistol, I’d say 90% of the people who are on this site have well over just a single firearm
LAPD isn't the West there buddy. And most cops I have worked with and trained are at best tactical children. They don't get in gunfights or do intensive training enough to learn and develop. They are not comfortable solving a home invasion on their own. Your comments show that you do not have confidence to solve it.
Many people on this site not only have that confidence, but have done it in the worst circumstances overseas.
As far as going off the block...well
2.5 years time in Afghanistan
Democratic Republic of the Congo
Central African Republic
South Sudan
Uganda
Djibouti
Malawi
Thailand
Niger
And most of my time was off by myself or if in a group then the only one armed conducting missions in countries at Civil War or with massive unrest problems. Like child soldier army type unrest. Often with the nearest friendly US force 7 hours away. The nearest US base with a trauma hospital was 16 hours by air.
I've been on the receiving end of a VBIED tractor trailer truck with 2500 lbs of HE followed by 9 suicide bombers.
Where I was the people didn't even understand the concept of a block so I think I was off of it.
Haha! I’m sure you are smarter than me and know more, but you are pretty ignorant of life in the mountains of Idaho. I’m not calling cops first. That’s laughable!
I’ll deal with what I have to as the situation dictates, the cops take way to long to arrive, and I don’t feel like discussing it with a feminist liberal dispatcher while I have a ongoing threat.
I have had someone at gunpoint in my front door. Actually in that case the cops were never even notified. Is that illegal? Nope. I committed no crime. So if there is a law that says “you must call 911 if you feel threatened” then please tell me.
You get it.
Yes, it’s true that many on here, if not most, have more than one firearm. In fact I’d probably not be off the mark to say that most here have more than 10 firearms. His statement is still correct no matter how much you’d like to argue otherwise. It’s actually probably more than 80% off households that own a firearm that own only that one firearm. And if they purchased that weapon for self defense, huge odds are that that weapon is a pistol of some sort, followed by shotgun as the next largest number.
The math isn’t even close otherwise.
Now, you are correct in your statement that when addressing just those that are active members on the Hide, odds are heavily in favor of any particular person having at least a few more than one firearm.
Carry on.
- Nov 3, 2010
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Nah, if you really want to drive the point home, and if he survives he’ll never dare tell anyone what happened
You can tell it to the Judge as your arrangement. Good luck with that. I spent 40 years in law enforcement and the court system. It doesn't go the way you think it should or does. With that attitude if you find yourself on the ass end of a manslaughter or murder rap you'll find that out for yourself. In your home or in a stand your ground state the leagl duty to retreat is off the table. But why would you get involved in a use of force incident if you don't have to? That's exactly what at least half a trial Jury will be thinking. Keep in mind trial Juries are dangerous things. If you end up in front of one for your actions you stand at least a 10% chance of being convinced no matter how innocent you are.
Is that really a battle you need to fight at a cost of $500,000 of your favorite dollars and the next 5 to 10 years of your life providing your not convicted or most of the rest of your life in prison if you are? I've seen the winner of the fight was the one that died last in the hospital. Think on these facts for a while. Is there really anything inside or outside of your home that's worth dieing for or killing over? My property that anyone could actually carry off is insured. My life is the most precious thing I own. As a civilian I'm not about to lose it over stuff, nore am I going to risk spending the rest of my days in prison because I wanted to show some shit bag(s) mines bigger than there's. I've lost 2 of the several gunfights I was involved in. Getting shot SUCKS. Spending a month in a hospital and 6 months in physical therapy SUCKS. I've got a few really cool scars and I always know when it's going to rain or snow before the weather guessers do. Don't stop a bullet if there's any way you can avoid it. Scumbags that will break and enter an occupied dwelling are a special kind of animal. If they'll kill a cop, what do you think they would do to you?
Yeah, I’m going to defend my home and family first and do what I need to do after
I just don’t trust the police and government to be my salvation, every time they are brought to task they fail miserably
How much dignity is there in a coffin being buried in that last 6 feet of real-estate you'll ever own or that prison cell you'll spend most of the rest of your life in? You have a fucked up idea of the value of mere property over life, especially yours.
We’ll I mean if he doesn’t call the cops he has a 50/50 they ever even find out
And in many states if the dude is unknown to him and inside his home, not many non crazy liberal DAs are going to try to go after him
As far as being involved in a use of force incident where you were forced to kill your assailant most are the same. The language can differ but it comes to the same thing. No matter how much of a scumbag the man/woman you killed was, you still took their life and this ain't a tolerant society when it comes down to that. You really don't want to find that out the hard way. Just because you did it right don't necessarily mean you're going to skate on through it with no problems. count on being arrested and count on telling it to the Judge and count on having to post a hefty bound and a tidy some to retain a competent attorney ( they ain't cheep, that's why I purchased the insurance available) No matter what you think the laws and statutes say in your particular state you very well could find yourself on the ass end of the ass end of a felony murder, manslaughter rap. Usually an aggressive prosecutor will hit you with both giving him/her a better chance of getting a conviction on at least one. If you are acquitted on these two you still can be charged with a felony assult with a firearm. If the individual (s) you killed are Black you can face a civil rights violation my first partner out of the LAPD academy was acquitted of the manslaughter charges he got jammed up with but got 8 years for a civil rights violation because the punk he shot and killed happened to be Black. The very same thing can happen to you if things go sideways. If you ever have to draw your gun guess what things are going sideways. I'm betting I know a bit more about the laws than you do....
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A lot of your posts sound like a shill for a service or organization just waiting to come out. When do we find out what organizations your peddling
@Max4007
Maybe you now have time to respond to my above post?
You asked a question and I answered it in the post.
Maybe you now have time to respond to my above post?
You asked a question and I answered it in the post.
I don't give a shit about your generalizations and assumptions. They are irrelevant.
The amount of mental gymnastics and conflation of masculinity with some dumb arbitrary feeling of heroism in these threads is hilarious.
Not really. I retired from there and moved back to to the east coast where I'm originally from. I was a Cop on a small town for my last 12 years in law enforcement. A buddy of mine that is a State Trooper was forced to shoot a bad guy to death. Line of duty, no other choice. It took 14 months to clear the case. Don't tell yourself that because you don't live in C.A. your safe for the criminal justice system. The laws are based on the statutes the way they are written, interpretation, on president and the way a particular trial judge will rule. Keep in mind that if your case actually goes to trial the jury is given a set of instructions by the judge on what evidence and testimony they can include and what they have to disregard. This is up to the Judge. Your attorney only gets the exculpatory evidence he/she motions for in discovery. There might be some missed that could win you an acquittal. The state only has to turn over what your attorney asked for and nothing else. That's how our advisory justice system works. The moral of the story is under no circumstances involve yourself in any use of force incident especially one that is likely to end in the use of deadly force unless you absolutely have no other options. Like I always say to male students I train, think with the big head not the little head. A property crime isn't worth your life or his if it comes to that. You can always get more stuff and it's a whole lot cheaper. I don't own anything worth bleeding for.
You make a valid point. I've always told male students I've trained to think with the big head not the little head. I personally don't own anything worth bleeding for or killing for. If I can walk or drive away I will. I've got nothing to prove to anybody. If you need to prove to yourself what a man you are do it in bed or on the golf course. It's a whole lot cheaper.
No. I've heard those stories myself. I don't know any of the facts, but there's an lot of smoke so there must be fire somewhere. 98% of the other cops I've worked with and know are straight professionals doing a tuff job as best we can with what we have. But there's always a 2% failure in anything people do. I certainly hope you never get tangled up with one of those. Nobody deserves that. Police Officers are supposed to be the cavalry that you can call when you need help, not the pricks that make a bad situation worse. Unfortunately I've seen more than one wrongful prosecutions in my day. That sucks, unfortunately that sometimes is the way it goes. If you ever need a free leagl opinion message me I'll gladly give you the benefit of a two year law degree and 40 years of experience using it.
I’ve met a few of those shit birds, and it’s a AWSOME job, you make 3-4x what your neighbors make, full pension, qualified immunity, plus your own clothing line of defaced blue line flags, all for MAYBE a 2 yr community college degree off a pell grant, that’s dumb ass winning the lotto
Per the facts
New York State Police Troop C scandal - Wikipedia
If that's what you think sure.
I do know I'm definitely not one of those who does a bunch of posturing on internet forums.
There's only one way for you to know if it's posturing or not.
Not everyone needs to or wants to "brag" about their real combat experience... granted some of us actually have quite a bit.
Let me just throw this out there. I feel like we are kind of missing the point, and focusing on some of the wrong points. Every situation is different, and nothing will be completely "perfect". Obviously whatever your home situation is, make the best of what you have and train with your gear diligently and often, always being humble to know when you aren't at your best, and working to improve. That should go without saying... When I was active duty, I had the pleasure of learning from one of the top shooting instructors in the military (yes I know there are many, but this guy literally wrote several of the military and LEO doctrines, and much of the skills are in use today) He was my company Gunny when we getting ready for what would become a wild couple years. I, and many other men literally owe our lives to the skills he shared with us. But let me tell you the one thing that impacted me more than anything else learned from him.. It was to be mentally prepared for shit to get real serious, or even fucked up. What I mean is he taught us that in real life situations, people get shot, people get killed, so if that happens to someone (good guy) don't be surprised, and don't be shocked if it happens to you either. We all like to think that's its this perfect "gunfight" and we easily kill all the bad guys, yet we come out without a scratch.. Bullshit! It doesn't matter how high speed or spec ops you are. People can easily get smoked!! This is the part of training that is missed all too often, I honestly think its because a lot of "regular" 2a people can't truly fathom what the realities of what they "love" are. I'm not saying to expect to get hurt, not at all. But please understand the realities of what a situation like that might entail.
Sorry to ramble, but when I almost got smoked myself overseas I was glad to understand what was happening, and stay focused on the task at hand... My alive day was actually the 25th of last month.
Just my 2 cents.
Semper Fi,
Tom
Well this turned into a right shitshow, which is awesome, thanks for touching this one off OP.
I am still in NJ so if someone breaks in I'll have to shove all 2 inches of my cock in his ass and hope that is traumatic enough for him to surrender while I wait 60 minutes for the NJ State Troopers to show up, put a 20 man stack on my door, and then shoot me anyway for misgendering someone. If more than one shows up guess I'm dead.
I've never been in this situation so no idea. It's probably not like combat though unless they drive a backhoe loaded with UXO into my front door. I assume you'll lose your can though, probably good reason to not put too many interior cameras in so you can chuck that shit into a corner before the fuzz shows up to execute you anyway.
I am still in NJ so if someone breaks in I'll have to shove all 2 inches of my cock in his ass and hope that is traumatic enough for him to surrender while I wait 60 minutes for the NJ State Troopers to show up, put a 20 man stack on my door, and then shoot me anyway for misgendering someone. If more than one shows up guess I'm dead.
I've never been in this situation so no idea. It's probably not like combat though unless they drive a backhoe loaded with UXO into my front door. I assume you'll lose your can though, probably good reason to not put too many interior cameras in so you can chuck that shit into a corner before the fuzz shows up to execute you anyway.
It’s not always going to happen as you plan. I own two homes next to each other. Last week, I was in the garage of one house replacing leaf springs and rear shocks on one of my trucks. While I was in one garage working, two guys attempted to break into the other house. With the compressor going, using air tools, having a fan running (110 degrees outside), I did not hear a thing. Luckily, I decided to set the alarm in the house before I went next door.
I returned home about 10 minutes after they got scared off by the siren, which I did not hear either next door. I walked in and the panel showed there was an issue. I walked into the kitchen/family room area and could see the broken glass on the couch. I walked back out and called 911. No idea if they were still in the house but I was not going to go to the other side of the house to get a firearm and clear the house. Alarm guy should be here today to install the outside sirens. While I have safes, cameras, and security system, I still need to look at my away from home security plan further.
I returned home about 10 minutes after they got scared off by the siren, which I did not hear either next door. I walked in and the panel showed there was an issue. I walked into the kitchen/family room area and could see the broken glass on the couch. I walked back out and called 911. No idea if they were still in the house but I was not going to go to the other side of the house to get a firearm and clear the house. Alarm guy should be here today to install the outside sirens. While I have safes, cameras, and security system, I still need to look at my away from home security plan further.
Yo u will be busy enough just getting your brain awake if time, adding ANYTHING else to the situation just complicates and slows response.Plus, even ear pro can make it harder to sense direction and recognize the sound of a freindly.
Failure to add the CORRECT things lead the situation becoming more complicated.
…also you understand something like Peltors in no way impede your sense of directional sound or reduce you ability to identify and recognize friends. These are literally the definition of mission enhancing. It’s almost like some of you might not have tried this before and are offering advice based off of some seriously limited experience.
Put ear pro on…or don’t I guess, it will self correct one way or another
It's been my personal experience and observations in 40 + years as an armed professional Marine Corps, Law enforcement, Contractor that the choice of weapon is pretty much natural. Anything from a .22 through a .50 bmg will kill any human. The factors to consider are the perceived threat, location to a point but most importantly you are using a weapon that you have confidence in and you can hit what you shoot at under the conditions you will probably be using it.
I do know where I'm posting. There are several points that get missed in the myth of it's my house and I'll kill who ever comes in. How long have you been telling yourself that? First any animal that would break into an occupied dwelling isn't afraid of you. Nine out of ten times they will be armed and usually not alone. They ain't afraid of the cops, do you really think that you scare them?
Take your hand off your gun toots. I'm telling you how the real leagl system actually works and what it can do to you no matter how right you think you are. After fourty years in law enforcement means I know a little bit more about that than you think you do. The leagl system is gender natural, a woman can end up doing years in prison for doing what they thought was a good idea at the time. The point being missed here is surviving the encounter is the object of the exorcize. If you can avoid a fight avoid it. The good guy/gal doesn't always win, in many instances the winner is the one that dies last. At this stage of life I personally live alone. If you or anyone else on this forum owns something (not counting a family member) that's worth killing or dieing over let me see it and maybe I should get one too. Everything thing in my house is either insured or I can get another one. I can't think of a single thing worth bleeding for that I own. Avoiding a fight is the smart play if possible. There are a lot of people that aren't alive today that could be if they just got out of the way when they had the opportunity to do so. I personally saw a lot of that. If you or anyone else on this forum thinks a bullet in the gut is preferable to backing of and letting the cops deal with it if that's an option you have safely your a fool. You potentially stand to lose everything you have including your freedom even your life over stuff that you can replace. I'm not talking about defending your or your family from imminent attack obviously. What I am telling you is you absolutely never want to put yourself into or stay in a situation where you might have to pull the trigger. I guaranty life as you knew it is over. You mistake reality for arrogance. That is your privilege and mistake to make. It means 0 to me how that will play out for you. If it goes sideways and you do find yourself in front of a trial Jury count on North of five hundred grand of leagl fees and expenses to defend yourself in court, that's if your acquitted. This too is reality. Juries are dangerous and unpredictable. You can be totally innocent and you still have a 10% chance of being convinced and spending most of the rest of your life in prison, this too is reality. THESE are the reasons that if you possibly can avoid a fight avoid it. The days of I'll kill anyone that tries to take from me are history and that is reality too. Don't think so, I hope you don't find that out the hard way toots.You come across as a typical arrogant cop who thinks he has answers for the whole world but is just a mixed up mess himself.
Maybe now is when you should walk away.
Oh, and don’t assume my gender either…
Exactly that, theory. Theory put forth by a dumb fuck guntoober.
You ever hear unsuppressed gunfire in an enclosed space, rifle fire at that? He obviously hasn't.
You're going to be fucking deaf. How do you hear your wife or child calling for help afterwards? How do you communicate and move effectively from additional threats if you can't fucking hear because your ears are bleeding?
Stop listening to assholes on YouTube.
Be a pro. Suppress the gun, put the bad guy down, save your hearing... ya might still need it after the shooting. Might be additional bad guys. Might have a wounded family member. Might have a scared shitless child that ran out the door that you have to go find in the darkness now.
If the cops take your can you'll get it back. Be a pro and don't worry about dumb shit like that. End the threat, win the day.
Fuckin' shoot unsuppressed to make the concussion worse for the bad guy, Jesus Christ that might have been the DUMBEST thing I ever saw on the Internet.
El o el
What you say is directly refuted by metric shit tons of CCTV footage of such incidents
I would say that it appears the Democrat party and all the SJW types have been very busy trying to push the narrative of we shouldn't blame the criminal for being a criminal apparently it's like too hard to follow the law if you are a "just turning your life around" type 13%
You see that all the time when a "Was just turning their life around" gets dead because they wanted to play rough with the law.
I'm guessing in places especially like Houston or Austin which are Democrat strongholds, you'll have to keep in mind that the Woke DA may be all about "bad pale face for not letting oppressed 13% rob, rape or kill them because you know... slavery..."
Then there is always some ambulance chasing scumbag of a lawyer racing to find the claimed kin of "was just turning their life around" and claiming they could get them a pile of money from that bad pale face that should have let your precious little thug rob, rape, murder them because you know, it was only going to be the last time then they were going to be a perfect angel after that.
The riots in 2020 were all the proof of the local law being stacked against the good that anyone should ever need.
All that to say, there is a lot of truth to the statements that if you have to defend your life with deadly force, there is a very good chance you'll need to pay a lawyer some money.
You see that all the time when a "Was just turning their life around" gets dead because they wanted to play rough with the law.
I'm guessing in places especially like Houston or Austin which are Democrat strongholds, you'll have to keep in mind that the Woke DA may be all about "bad pale face for not letting oppressed 13% rob, rape or kill them because you know... slavery..."
Then there is always some ambulance chasing scumbag of a lawyer racing to find the claimed kin of "was just turning their life around" and claiming they could get them a pile of money from that bad pale face that should have let your precious little thug rob, rape, murder them because you know, it was only going to be the last time then they were going to be a perfect angel after that.
The riots in 2020 were all the proof of the local law being stacked against the good that anyone should ever need.
All that to say, there is a lot of truth to the statements that if you have to defend your life with deadly force, there is a very good chance you'll need to pay a lawyer some money.
Lest anyone resist the state, your signature line seems to be at odds with that statement
If you replaced “play rough with the law” with “victimize people” I’m with you 100%
These days when I hear about a cop hurt in the line of duty, we’ll as a kid it was like “oh no, the good guy got hurt trying to help people”, now I’m like “well what was he doing when this happened”
Exactly that, theory. Theory put forth by a dumb fuck guntoober.
You ever hear unsuppressed gunfire in an enclosed space, rifle fire at that? He obviously hasn't.
You're going to be fucking deaf. How do you hear your wife or child calling for help afterwards? How do you communicate and move effectively from additional threats if you can't fucking hear because your ears are bleeding?
Stop listening to assholes on YouTube.
Be a pro. Suppress the gun, put the bad guy down, save your hearing... ya might still need it after the shooting. Might be additional bad guys. Might have a wounded family member. Might have a scared shitless child that ran out the door that you have to go find in the darkness now.
If the cops take your can you'll get it back. Be a pro and don't worry about dumb shit like that. End the threat, win the day.
Fuckin' shoot unsuppressed to make the concussion worse for the bad guy, Jesus Christ that might have been the DUMBEST thing I ever saw on the Internet.
I certainly have. And no, I'm not deaf, or anywhere close to it.
Some of you guys throw out a lot of "You will be..." or "it's going to be...". You're guessing about something that may or may not happen, but acting like you know it for a fact. It's crap.
My opinion is your over thinking your scenario. Should this scenario happen..
You won't think to don your ear pro.
I'm not gonna add that thought process to an already complex and unknown situation.
Plan for; grabing what you have near by. I would use my suppresor vs not using it.
Zero at 15 yards or 25 yards. It doesn't matter they both have identical trajectories for that short of distance. Or zero for what ever makes you happy and learn your POI at different ranges.
Back to ear pro. Yeah if this is a planned event and you know the likelihood of a gunfight/ambush are high, yes wear them.
But don't complicate the the unknown. If you have time yes. Otherwise plan for not having them. ie. Use a suppressor if available.
You will be if you try what that retard is suggesting, professor. I was dumb enough to expose an ear to regular old rifle fire let alone an SBR in something like a hallway.
My shit was ringing non stop for hours and that's not even what that fool was advocating. But hey, to each his own, you want to run a short rifle unsuppressed in your house to make it "harder on the bad guys ears"
Go for it.
For the average break in video, I don’t see many where 10 or even 30 seconds from time of first indication, would make much of a difference
Oh my gosh! You heard regular old rifle fire at the range once? You poor thing!
I'll bow to your infinitely superior expertise.
NOT.
This is exactly what I was referring to above. Guys with very limited experience, but convinced they know it all.
