DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

[AKAce]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

I hear you Shortbus...
My crew shot SIX Savages (2 Each because of Heavy Class) at Mammoth with No issues... Musta got Lucky

 

[Short-bus]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ~Ace~</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I hear you Shortbus...
My crew shot SIX Savages (2 Each because of Heavy Class) at Mammoth with No issues... Musta got Lucky

</div></div>

I like to abuse the 'ol Savage. Why, you ask? Because i'm waiting to see what will break and when. Today I shot about 80 rounds from 280 to 1005 yards, and I have a adjustment screw in my trigger that's walking on me. The safety won't engage with the bolt cocked and closed, I have to open the bolt, engage the safety, and then close it, it's kinda weird the way the trigger works. The reason it's walking is because my dumb behind forgot to put some fingernail polish on it to lock it in so it won't walk. It's on my list to do tomorrow night at the shop.

I've kicked dirt into my open action to see if that would make it stop working, all it did was make the action not quite as smooth, but it still shot great.

Branden

 

[mrjimsfc]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: frankythefly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a Sako TRG and I like shooting it a lot more than all my other rifles. </div></div>
And there dear OP, is the real reason to get any gun! "I like shooting it a lot more than all my other rifles." There's just no reason to spend your time and money on something you won't like! Try to find an excuse to try each one of them on the range before purchasing one of them. Good luck!

 

[mk36]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

If you want to start with a reasonably priced, well engineered and very accurate .223 or .308 rifle don't overlook the Tikka T3 Tactical. Finnish craftsmanship ( Sako makes the barrels) and all of the features you may want later. Reinforced threaded barrel (suppressor or muzzle brake) and teflon coated action make this a bargain you don't have to upgrade. Sub MOA out of the box with the right ammo. Throw on an ultra light bipod and some good glass and you can keep up with best on the range with a little practice.

I like the 24" barrel that's reinforced near the muzzle to help with suppressor weight. Some guys don't care for the stock but I haven't had any problems with mine. The best part for me is that these weapons aren't range queens. Humping a 15+lb bench rest rifle on a hunting trip is not only impractical it's also frustrating. These platforms come in at about 8lbs w/o any toys added. Not too many tack drivers can say that, and none on your list.

I don't like the factory muzzle brake (too much dust and debris when prone) and totally ridiculous on the .223 unless you want to look cool. Extra mags are kind of pricey but are made well.

If you want to shoot targets on Saturday and that nice 6X6 on Sunday after a long hump up the canyon check out the Tikka T3 Tac. You'll save some money for glass, ammo and still be able to gas up the SUV for a trip to the range. Good Hunting

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

So from some of the sarcastic and smart ass remarks I'm to believe that Savages never have any problems and run in any conditions? They're the perfect rifle?

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So from some of the sarcastic and smart ass remarks I'm to believe that Savages never have any problems and run in any conditions? They're the perfect rifle? </div></div>

Exactly

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So from some of the sarcastic and smart ass remarks I'm to believe that Savages never have any problems and run in any conditions? They're the perfect rifle? </div></div>

Exactly</div></div>

Glad to hear. Then I know you'll be selling your Badgers and having all of your rifles built on Savage actions. I'll be looking for the closet clean out.

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So from some of the sarcastic and smart ass remarks I'm to believe that Savages never have any problems and run in any conditions? They're the perfect rifle? </div></div>

Exactly</div></div>

Glad to hear. Then I know you'll be selling your Badgers and having all of your rifles built on Savage actions. I'll be looking for the closet clean out. </div></div>

Selling guns is against man code.

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So from some of the sarcastic and smart ass remarks I'm to believe that Savages never have any problems and run in any conditions? They're the perfect rifle? </div></div>

Exactly</div></div>

Glad to hear. Then I know you'll be selling your Badgers and having all of your rifles built on Savage actions. I'll be looking for the closet clean out. </div></div>

Selling guns is against man code.</div></div>

Even if that were true, I'll look forward to you never building on anything but a Savage action from this point moving forward.

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Even if that were true, I'll look forward to you never building on anything but a Savage action from this point moving forward. </div></div>

I won't be confined by your anger. I build what I want!

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Even if that were true, I'll look forward to you never building on anything but a Savage action from this point moving forward. </div></div>

I won't be confined by your anger. I build what I want!</div></div>

So you're a hypocrite? You'll claim that Savage is the best yet you'll build another rifle on a "lower" quality action? That makes sense.

 

[Kyshooter]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

I'm just glad there aren't any safety problems, known, suspected, documented, confirmed or otherwise, with the standard issue rifle for 90+% of the precision shooting world. Those kinds of problems should be relegated to inferior products such as "<span style="font-style: italic">Salvages</span>." Correct?

http://www.cnbc.com/id/39759366/Document...ems_for_Decades


Now, before any wrath is incurred, no I haven't seen, personally, any of these types of issues with the Remington platform. What I also haven't seen are any safety issues with the Savage platform. And, I have seen far more rounds fired in Savages than 700's in the short time I have been involved with this discipline.

I just think it is a bit short sighted to dismiss the Savage outright, for someone looking to get into this style of shooting for the reasons noted.

 

[Fx1]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ewen</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hi guys.
I have been shooting AI's for years and love them both for what they are and I am biased being a Brit. But I have been so impressed with the DTA that I have sold my AI's and replaced them with DTA's.

I should also state to be open that I like them so much I have become the European distributor.

As for their reliabilty, you are correct they are still new, however I have taken mine on several competitions now and through several dozen hard stalks with no issues. On one stalk the entire rifle was submerged in wet sand whilst crawling, I thought I was FUBAR'd but later on the stalk i came across a small stream, The entire rifle got dunked and cleaned out in the rifle and then I carried on with the rifle.

In the end I placed 4th and would have been higher if my pistol skills had been up to scratch.

I love the ergonomics of the DTA and find it really difficult to take anything else out of the safe these days as it just feels like a dinosaur!!!

regards

Ewen</div></div>

Yes im loving the fact you have managed to turn a $4500 rifle into a £5000 retail price!

£3300 is the direct convertion with VAT Where is the £1700 going? your beer fund?

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kyshooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm just glad there aren't any safety problems, known, suspected, documented, confirmed or otherwise, with the standard issue rifle for 90+% of the precision shooting world. Those kinds of problems should be relegated to inferior products such as "<span style="font-style: italic">Salvages</span>." Correct?

http://www.cnbc.com/id/39759366/Document...ems_for_Decades


Now, before any wrath is incurred, no I haven't seen, personally, any of these types of issues with the Remington platform. What I also haven't seen are any safety issues with the Savage platform. And, I have seen far more rounds fired in Savages than 700's in the short time I have been involved with this discipline.

I just think it is a bit short sighted to dismiss the Savage outright, for someone looking to get into this style of shooting for the reasons noted. </div></div>

Let's address a few things first since this thread has long since been derailed.

How convenient that we want to quote a news source that is blatantly anti-gun and left leaning. I guess we can use them when it's convenient yet we bitched and moaned about how bias it was when that report was first released. Classic!

First, when did it become a "Savage vs. Remington" thread?
When was it stated or implied that Remingtons are better than Savages?
How many Savages vs. Remingtons have been made? What are the percentage of failures per 100 rifles produced between the two?

And finally, a question I asked previously that I have not seen answered.
<span style="text-decoration: underline">
<span style="font-weight: bold">If you were being shipped off to war to fight with a "precision" rifle, is Savage your first choice (in any caliber)? </span></span>

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Even if that were true, I'll look forward to you never building on anything but a Savage action from this point moving forward. </div></div>

I won't be confined by your anger. I build what I want!</div></div>

So you're a hypocrite? You'll claim that Savage is the best yet you'll build another rifle on a "lower" quality action? That makes sense. </div></div>

Yeah, variety equals hypocrisy.... I guess that's why you've only owned Audi's.

Let's see.... My Badger actions give me a 60 degree bolt lift, AW mag compatible, and don't have to be confined to CDI bottom metal. I guess I should ignore all those things and stay with a Savage because I claim that they're great rifles that shouldn't be dismissed due to their cheap price.

I guess you'll only be owning a TRG from here on out too, huh? Just to avoid the shameful hypocrisy of liking different things...

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Even if that were true, I'll look forward to you never building on anything but a Savage action from this point moving forward. </div></div>

I won't be confined by your anger. I build what I want!</div></div>

So you're a hypocrite? You'll claim that Savage is the best yet you'll build another rifle on a "lower" quality action? That makes sense. </div></div>

Yeah, variety equals hypocrisy.... I guess that's why you've only owned Audi's.

Let's see.... My Badger actions give me a 60 degree bolt lift, AW mag compatible, and don't have to be confined to CDI bottom metal. I guess I should ignore all those things and stay with a Savage because I claim that they're great rifles that shouldn't be dismissed due to their cheap price.

I guess you'll only be owning a TRG from here on out too, huh? Just to avoid the shameful hypocrisy of liking different things...</div></div>

I said the Savage was the perfect rifle and you said "exactly". So by going with other rifles that have features and benefits the Savage doesn't have, you're either mistaken that Savages are the perfect rifle, or you're a hypocrite.

The Audi was the last personal car I owned. If I need to buy another personal car, it will most likely be an Audi.

I've said to you and to George that I love my TRG and will most likely not shoot another rifle in the near future. In fact, I believe WE were in KC when I said that exact same thing in front of George so don't act like I haven't said all I will shoot is TRGs.

 

[Bruiser_Joe]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

Ok lets roll out the mats put in mouthpieces and get it on

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I said the Savage was the perfect rifle and you said "exactly". So by going with other rifles that have features and benefits the Savage doesn't have, you're either mistaken that Savages are the perfect rifle, or you're a hypocrite.

The Audi was the last personal car I owned. If I need to buy another personal car, it will most likely be an Audi.

I've said to you and to George that I love my TRG and will most likely not shoot another rifle in the near future. In fact, I believe WE were in KC when I said that exact same thing in front of George so don't act like I haven't said all I will shoot is TRGs. </div></div>


ROFL.... You slay me.

 

[BasraBoy]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fx1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ewen</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hi guys.
I have been shooting AI's for years and love them both for what they are and I am biased being a Brit. But I have been so impressed with the DTA that I have sold my AI's and replaced them with DTA's.

I should also state to be open that I like them so much I have become the European distributor.

As for their reliabilty, you are correct they are still new, however I have taken mine on several competitions now and through several dozen hard stalks with no issues. On one stalk the entire rifle was submerged in wet sand whilst crawling, I thought I was FUBAR'd but later on the stalk i came across a small stream, The entire rifle got dunked and cleaned out in the rifle and then I carried on with the rifle.

In the end I placed 4th and would have been higher if my pistol skills had been up to scratch.

I love the ergonomics of the DTA and find it really difficult to take anything else out of the safe these days as it just feels like a dinosaur!!!

regards

Ewen</div></div>

Yes im loving the fact you have managed to turn a $4500 rifle into a £5000 retail price!

£3300 is the direct convertion with VAT Where is the £1700 going? your beer fund?</div></div>

fx1, the UK price will also need to cover costs of export/import documentation - maybe as a commercial undertaking also a US export licence/permit as well as an End User Declaration? - transport costs,duty etc. I've personally imported 3 rifles from the US and each time we're talking at least £700.

But, sorry to say, I agree that the landed price in the UK is the deal breaker when considering DTA as an option.

The UK DTA price from Ewan is very similar to the final cost of my GAP .308 with MST100 landed in the UK. When you see the deal available on AW's right now..the DTA just isn't in the picture:

http://www.sportingservices.co.uk/rifle_offers.asp

 

[Fx1]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BasraBoy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fx1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ewen</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hi guys.
I have been shooting AI's for years and love them both for what they are and I am biased being a Brit. But I have been so impressed with the DTA that I have sold my AI's and replaced them with DTA's.

I should also state to be open that I like them so much I have become the European distributor.

As for their reliabilty, you are correct they are still new, however I have taken mine on several competitions now and through several dozen hard stalks with no issues. On one stalk the entire rifle was submerged in wet sand whilst crawling, I thought I was FUBAR'd but later on the stalk i came across a small stream, The entire rifle got dunked and cleaned out in the rifle and then I carried on with the rifle.

In the end I placed 4th and would have been higher if my pistol skills had been up to scratch.

I love the ergonomics of the DTA and find it really difficult to take anything else out of the safe these days as it just feels like a dinosaur!!!

regards

Ewen</div></div>

Yes im loving the fact you have managed to turn a $4500 rifle into a £5000 retail price!

£3300 is the direct convertion with VAT Where is the £1700 going? your beer fund?</div></div>

The UK price also needs to cover costs of export/import documentation - maybe as a commercial undertaking also a US export licence/permit as well as an End User Declaration? - transport costs,duty etc. I've personally imported 3 rifles from the US and each time we're talking at least £700.

But, sorry to say, the landed price in the UK is the deal breaker for me when considering DTA as an option.

The UK DTA price from Ewan is very similar to the final cost of my GAP .308 with MST100 landed in the UK


</div></div>

You have been listening to far to many UK importers and their bull shit.

How do they get US rifles to the UK for £300-£400? if it costs £700 per rifle?

Fact is that it doesnt.

1 export licence is 400$ for as many rifles as you want to purchase, 10 rifles is 40$ a rifle.

Shipping is Shipping but buy 5 or 10 rifles at a time and its much lower than 1 rifle at a time.

It would cost you or me far more to get 1 rifle out of america but an RFD buying many rifles direct from the factory should be able to keep costs to a minimum.

Dont forget that $4500 is factory full RRP also, they will be getting them at a way better price than that.

£5000 just takes the piss.

Id take a AI AX rifle in 308 for £3300 anyday

 

[BasraBoy]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

Fx1 - I can show you the invoices on the three <span style="font-weight: bold">personal</span> imports I've done....but I agree with you, a distributor should be able to get it cheaper. And £5K (without glass) is chancing it!!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fx1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Id take a AI AX rifle in 308 for £3300 anyday </div></div>

For me, that's a no brainer! And you could top it off with an SuB and still be well in front

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Short-bus</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Mike, it sure seems to me you have some sort of vendetta against Savage, likely because some of the factory boys did well at the world championships that you attended, I don't know, don't really care.

What I do care about is the lack of consideration for who gives a shit what your shooting and just shoot. Tell me what i'm getting after spending an extra $2K? Am I getting $2K worth of better accuracy? I've shot several GAP's, a TRG and none blew the doors off my Savage, they all shot good. Mine shoots just as good as just about anything and I spend about $1K total for everthing (minus scope).

Like Jrose said, he's got a badger because he wants a 60 degree bolt and AW mags, and he's willing to spend the money on that. I don't need either, i'm fine with 90 degrees bolt throw and CDI bottom metal. I want to be able to change the barrel myself, so for that I save a lot of money. If someone wants to spend a huge chunk of change on something, or save a little money, that's their business. But brand bashing for whatever reason is rather stupid to me. I'll joke around and bash to get a rise from someone, but it doesn't matter to me what their shooting as long as they are shooting.

Branden</div></div>

Branden, first, shut up. I'll say that to your face in KC next time if you have a problem.

Next, I don't have any type of "vendetta" against Savage. All I said in the beginning was to throw Savage out when considering the others. They're not on the same playing field regardless of what you think or say. Features are features whether you want to "accept" them or not. I'm tired of people talking about accuracy, accuracy, as if that's the only criterion a rifle needs is to be accurate. Maybe for you, and if that's the case, good for you, but that doesn't take away from the fact that it has MORE features. If your Ford Focus does 100mph top speed and my Chevy Corvette does 200mph, you can't take away the fact that the Corvette is a better performing car because the speed limit is only 70mph.

This is not about brand bashing. This is about a better value to the buyer. If the buyer doesn't give a shit about features and benefits, he can go with whatever. But to try and state or imply the Savage is as good as the AI, TRG, or DTA just because you don't see the benefit of the advantages offered from those other rifles is ludicrous.

a .25 moa, .5 moa, or 1 moa rifle doesn't matter if you're trying to perform an Australian Peel throwing your rifle around on concrete. Accuracy is irrelevant if your rifle's bolt handle accidentally gets ripped off a la M700s. Durability to be able to withstand constant abuse is my first and foremost criterion. If I wanted only an "accurate" rifle I'd build a benchrest gun with incredibly tight tolerances only to be shoot from a front rest and rear bag. But I don't.

I want a rifle that I know is going to shoot no matter when and where.

And I missed where you answered the question:

If you were being shipped off to war to fight with a "precision" rifle, is Savage your first choice (in any caliber)?

 

[Tactical]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

I bet Savage was happy just to get mentioned in same category as the others. Different price point/market rifle than the others. Time will tell how well it does.

I have owned all of the other rifles and gone round and round which one is best.

I have to say if you told me tomorrow I had to go to war with one I would pick up the AI in 338 Lapua. Just plain the go to rifle in 338 Lapua for me. Dirt tough, simple and accurate.

If you told me I had to pick one to hit a long range target and it was my money to buy the rifle I would go with Sako. Best deal for 338 Lapua

If you told me I had to carry the rifle a long way it would then be the DTA 338.

Clear as mud? Buy them all.

 

[leadbullet]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

I love mY TRG22 but if I were to start competition, what what i know, I would buy the savage FTR 308, put a godd scope on it, nightforce, sightron etc and go shoot it, it is done and will be competitive at 1000 and under.

 

[mrjimsfc]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

Hmmm.....If I have to pick a rifle to go out where the guy shooting back at me might have a 50 cal. machine gun mounted on a post welded into the back of a Toyota pick up truck......
I'm pretty sure I would want a rifle, glass and all the other bells and whistles that I could absolutely depend on to put that bullet to my point of aim. I really don't want to give the other guy a chance to shoot back! Does that mean I want a 30 pound gun that I might have to pick up and run with? Probably not! That said, If you're not physically capable of shooting sub MOA then don't bother with paying for a gun (or glass) that has that capability! Most people without marksmanship abilities just get an AK and hose down the general area with automatic fire. Your actual abilities should determine what rifle and scope you spend your hard earned money on.

 

[bkster]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

if i were to be shipped off to war i would pick the gun im familiar with, know how to clear and trust its accuracy.

i have seen alot of different rifles fail for one reason or another
i have shot better than others with far superior weapons
i have been beaten consistantly by better shooters not rifles
or because they shot a superior caliber
i shoot a 260 i have been beaten by a 308 many times

i shoot savages and have shot all the others except the dta
a trg may well be my next rifle platform but the bar has been raised with my savage. mine works yours may not.

none of the rifles listed will make the op a better shooter
shooting will

my advice
get behind these rifles and shoot them. plenty o f variety here on the hide. then the choice is easy because you will not like all of them equally.... you will like one more than the others
for whatever reason.

also if you shoot more than you post here you will enjoy the sport alot more

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

Chances are, if any of you are going to war, your choice in rifle will be made for you. Lol

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Chances are, if any of you are going to war, your choice in rifle will be made for you. Lol</div></div>

Not the point. I wasn't asking as a "military" slotted shooter. It was a question to gauge your confidence in the rifle.

Nice way to side step the question though.

 

[Fx1]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bkster</div><div class="ubbcode-body">if i were to be shipped off to war i would pick the gun im familiar with, know how to clear and trust its accuracy.

i have seen alot of different rifles fail for one reason or another
i have shot better than others with far superior weapons
i have been beaten consistantly by better shooters not rifles
or because they shot a superior caliber
i shoot a 260 i have been beaten by a 308 many times

i shoot savages and have shot all the others except the dta
a trg may well be my next rifle platform but the bar has been raised with my savage. mine works yours may not.

none of the rifles listed will make the op a better shooter
shooting will

my advice
get behind these rifles and shoot them. plenty o f variety here on the hide. then the choice is easy because you will not like all of them equally.... you will like one more than the others
for whatever reason.

also if you shoot more than you post here you will enjoy the sport alot more</div></div>

6.5mm can piss over a 308 in the right hands and rifle, its your shooting and not the calibre thats the issue there

 

[BasraBoy]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

Branden, not sure if your reply was aimed at me or just following on from my last post.

Yes, My AW is my favourite rifle, but I have others and am open to others. I really like the concept of the DTA and was (am?) still really interested to try and buy one

My point I'm making (as is Fx1 if I read him correctly) is that Ewen's prices (UK distributor) makes DTA an impossible choice here in the UK.

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Chances are, if any of you are going to war, your choice in rifle will be made for you. Lol</div></div>

Not the point. I wasn't asking as a "military" slotted shooter. It was a question to gauge your confidence in the rifle.

Nice way to side step the question though. </div></div>

There is no side stepping, I just refuse to keep entertaining how many directions this thread keeps getting derailed into...

I stand by my first statement, that it would be a mistake to dismiss a Savage just because it's the cheap gun. If anything, it's probably the best choice of the 3 for a new shooter simply for the fact the savings on the rifle could go toward ammo, range time, and a decent scope. Now if the shooter finds that precesion long range isn't for him, he doesn't have the price of a new car wrapped up in a bolt gun...

Now, if you really want me to ask which gun I would take to war, and entertain the hypothetical Internet question of the year, it would be my M40. It's NATO chambered, has decades of proven reliability, and all I need to do is get my hands on a crate of M118 and my scope is calibrated close enough to kill people.

Now, if I'm going to a match, that's the last rifle I would grab. So I really fail to see the point in the "battle proven rifle" theory for a thread in which the OP is a new shooter, with no service affiliation.

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

There is no side stepping, I just refuse to keep entertaining how many directions this thread keeps getting derailed into...

I stand by my first statement, that it would be a mistake to dismiss a Savage just because it's the cheap gun. If anything, it's probably the best choice of the 3 for a new shooter simply for the fact the savings on the rifle could go toward ammo, range time, and a decent scope. Now if the shooter finds that precesion long range isn't for him, he doesn't have the price of a new car wrapped up in a bolt gun...

Now, if you really want me to ask which gun I would take to war, and entertain the hypothetical Internet question of the year, it would be my M40. It's NATO chambered, has decades of proven reliability, and all I need to do is get my hands on a crate of M118 and my scope is calibrated close enough to kill people.

Now, if I'm going to a match, that's the last rifle I would grab. So I really fail to see the point in the "battle proven rifle" theory for a thread in which the OP is a new shooter, with no service affiliation. </div></div>

Here's the bottom line. No one dismissed the Savage because it's a "cheap gun". The Savage was dismissed because it can't hold a candle to the durability and field serviceability of the other three. Plain and simple. IF this was a Savage, Winchester, Remington thread, it would be a completely different story however it is not.

The expensive rifles hold their value extremely well. We see that here constantly whether it be a custom or factory. Right now there is a TRG-42 in 300WM for sale here.

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2503071#Post2503071

Guy is asking $2700. Brand new from Euro Optics that rifle is $2500-3300. So if he got into LR shooting and didn't like it, it's safe to say his "loss" would not be any greater than if he bought a Savage and tried to sell it.

Next with the "go to war" question. Again, you're acting like a politician and can't address the question head on. No one was talking about your M40 clone. The point is, if you're going to a two-way range you're not going to take the Savage. You'll take one of the others and that same case of M118LR.

I understand you fail to see the point. You've been failing to see the point this entire thread. Your sole purpose is to do nothing more than to help derail it.

What Savage will you be taking to the Bash or the Cup next year?

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

If the bash or cup goes .308 only, you'll see my Savage there. Putting a whoopin on your TRG...

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If the bash or cup goes .308 only, you'll see my Savage there. Putting a whoopin on your TRG... </div></div>

I hope the fire department doesn't test for drugs...I'd hate to see you get fired because you must be smokin' crack.

Besides, Savages are so inexpensive, build one in 260 or 243.

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

I already have both of those calibers....


Stay away from my drugs, and make sure your junk goes bang when you pull the trigger, m'kay...

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

You already have a <span style="text-decoration: underline">Savage</span> in 243 AND 260?

Do you even have the barrels for those calibers? Or more likely, you'll fall back on the "I can swap calibers any time I want". When was the last time you did that?

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You already have a <span style="text-decoration: underline">Savage</span> in 243 AND 260?

Do you even have the barrels for those calibers? Or more likely, you'll fall back on the "I can swap calibers any time I want". When was the last time you did that? </div></div>

Nope, I have GAP built on Badger actions. You know that.


You think I'm gonna go build a redundant rifle just to prove a point?

Tell you what, you have George put a 6.5 Creedmoor or .243 barrel on it, and I'll run the shit out of it. Ain't skeered.

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You already have a <span style="text-decoration: underline">Savage</span> in 243 AND 260?

Do you even have the barrels for those calibers? Or more likely, you'll fall back on the "I can swap calibers any time I want". When was the last time you did that? </div></div>

Nope, I have GAP built on Badger actions. You know that.


You think I'm gonna go build a redundant rifle just to prove a point?

Tell you what, you have George put a 6.5 Creedmoor or .243 barrel on it, and I'll run the shit out of it. Ain't skeered.</div></div>

You said if the Bash or Cup goes 308 only you'll run the Savage. My question to you is if the Savage is so great, why don't you run it in a more competitive caliber at the Cup or Bash?

I would think you would have redundant rifles because A) the platform shoots so well and B) you can have the same "fit" throughout all of your rifles.

I'm just curious why you're espousing the awesomeness of the Savage yet wont go out of your way to shoot it outside of 308? Heck, for the cost of that Badger rifle you probably could have 2-3 Savages in various calibers.

 

[Tactical]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

No kidding. The term going to war was used to make a point. Based on a lot of use, of all the rifles.
Based on my experiences I gave him what I liked for what reasons and which I would trust my life on out of the box.

Pretty fng hard to argue the AI has the longest and best track record of any sniper rifle on planet for durability.
Pretty hard to argue the Sako has best record for best accuracy out of the box ( Desription from SOTIC Instructor was "The most accurate out of the box sniper rifle they ever ever)
Hard to argue the DTA is easiest to carry.

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

You said if the Bash or Cup goes 308 only you'll run the Savage. My question to you is if the Savage is so great, why don't you run it in a more competitive caliber at the Cup or Bash? <span style="color: #FF0000">Again, I already have the calibers I need, why would I build another one on a Savage action just to appease your argumentative nature? </span>

I would think you would have redundant rifles because A) the platform shoots so well and B) you can have the same "fit" throughout all of your rifles. <span style="color: #FF0000"> All my other rifles shoot good, and are ballistically superior to .308. As far as "fitting" me, it's just a bolt rifle, not a custom car seat. I like my variety... </span>

I'm just curious why you're espousing the awesomeness of the Savage yet wont go out of your way to shoot it outside of 308? Heck, for the cost of that Badger rifle you probably could have 2-3 Savages in various calibers. <span style="color: #FF0000">Again, because I already have those rifles, and my kick ass Savage, I don't feel the need to go selling things to go "all Savage". I think my Savage is great, as well as my other rifles, I don't understand where your coming from with this "if you like one thing, it's wrong to own anything else" attitude. I won't "go out of my way" to shoot it outside of .308 because that's again, a waste of money. Like I said, you pay George to put me a 6mm or 6.5 tube on there, I'll run the shit out of it. I'm not paying for another 6mm or 6.5mm just to prove I love my Savage and think it's reliable enough to trust in competetion. You pay for it, I'll prove it all day long.</span> </div></div>

 

[Dirty D]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

Wow, just wow...

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

So what your post says is:

"Savages are great, but not great enough"

Gotcha

 

[Rob01]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

It's like watching your parents fight! Mike and JRose stop it before I cry! LOL

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

Stay away Rob!!!! Don't you get sucked into the Vortex... I can handle Mike.

Mike, I'm saying it's good enough, yes. As for the rest of what I own, I still fail to see your reasoning that because one thing is good enough, you have to be exclusive. I'm not dating my 10FP exclusively Mike, I'm allowed to see other people.

Btw, if your TRG is so great, why do you keep wanting to buy George's Winchester??? Hmmmmmmmmm? Wouldn't that be saying that your TRG is good, but not good enough?

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Stay away Rob!!!! Don't you get sucked into the Vortex... I can handle Mike.

Mike, I'm saying it's good enough, yes. As for the rest of what I own, I still fail to see your reasoning that because one thing is good enough, you have to be exclusive. I'm not dating my 10FP exclusively Mike, I'm allowed to see other people.

Btw, if your TRG is so great, why do you keep wanting to buy George's Winchester??? Hmmmmmmmmm? Wouldn't that be saying that your TRG is good, but not good enough?</div></div>

Here is where it all started. You and others were of the ilk that a Savage is just as good as an AI,TRG, DTA. I argued that wasn't the case at all. Your (collective) belief that Savages are just as good other rifles lends one to believe that Savages are beyond the realm of a "good rifle" and transition into a "good as anything out there" rifle and you and I know that's not the case. So since you've succeeded in making this a "defend Savage" thread, you've failed at being a Savage Apologist.

George's Winchester has nothing to do with this. Again, you're acting like a politician taking something that is irrelevant and trying to draw it in. The Winchester is not made for tactical comps, the Winchester is not "as good" as the other rifles. The Winchester is attractive for what it is, not what it can do, which is not the case with your position. Because no, the Winchester is not as good as the TRG in any caliber.

 

[jbell]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

Here is one more way of looking at it JRose: go and get a large sample of each (I dont konw 10 rifles per MFG. or something like that) Then test each one for quality, categories can be: consistency of manufacturing to include fit and finish on the exterior, quality of machining like chamber, crown, borescope the barrel, alignment of optic attachment points to bore centerline, overall smoothness of operation of action, trigger, and safety. Consistency of the triggers from rifle to rifle, and any other inportant aspect to judge the quality of a rifle. Last but certainly not least accuracy for each rifle. Then you tell me how Savage stacks up to the other 3 rifles in this thread.

I would venture a guess that you may already know the outcome of the test. Im not dumping on Savage specifically, hell try it with a Remingtion, or any other rifle in that price point. Im just saying you get what you pay for, and I dont see how you can say Savage is just as good as the other 3. Im sure your rifle is very accurate, I have also seen some shoot like a mo-fo. But the sun does shine on a dogs a$$ every now and agan.

 

[jasonk]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

Bump for my entertainment, it must be killing Mike and JRose to not post on here today.

Anyways, everyone knows that AI's are better than Savage's and Sako's.

 

[JRose]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

I've given up arguing with someone who spins more than a DJ...

I dont blame Mike... It must be his Berkeley indoctrination that makes him keep arguing well after he's been proven that he's wrong.

 

[Mike]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've given up arguing with someone who spins more than a DJ...

I dont blame Mike... It must be his Berkeley indoctrination that makes him keep arguing well after he's been proven that he's wrong. </div></div>

Please show me where I'm wrong. What kind of Kool Aid are you drinking?

I claim that AI, TRG and DTA are better rifles than a Savage and I'm wrong??

I don't blame JRose though. Ignorance is bliss and he's in Hog Heaven. I guess it's hard to forget your first love no matter how much of a moped she is.

You're flat out looney tunes.

 

[mwroseberry]

Re: DTA vs. Savage vs. AI vs. Sako

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've given up arguing with someone who spins more than a DJ...

I dont blame Mike... It must be his Berkeley indoctrination that makes him keep arguing well after he's been proven that he's wrong. </div></div>

Please show me where I'm wrong. What kind of Kool Aid are you drinking?

I claim that AI, TRG and DTA are better rifles than a Savage and I'm wrong??

I don't blame JRose though. Ignorance is bliss and he's in Hog Heaven. I guess it's hard to forget your first love no matter how much of a moped she is.

You're flat out looney tunes. </div></div>

Just another example of gun snobs at work. Guys lets face it if you spend 1/2 as much on a savage you can make it just as accurate as an AI or a TRG (I know flame suit on). The simple fact is money is money. It just takes less of it on savage to get the same accuracy level. Once you do that to the savage any of those three rifles will be more accurate than you are capable of driving it. So the best advise I can give you is build yourself a custom savage rig, replace the accutrigger with something more reliable, spend money on good glass and then take the money you saved and go up to TVP and pay Tom Sarver to teach you how to drive what you have. Once this is all said and done I promise you will be more accurate than you would be if you spent 4k on an AI and had no training.

Just my $0.02....

Good luck,
Merritt