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Gaming the NRL-22 Offhand Stages - does anyone GAF?
- Thread starter Starbuck
- Start date
Screw one leg off and it’s technically a bipod
that position was surprisingly stable too
Well I see that some of the shooters at last weekend's NCRGC NRL-22 match are at last weighing in on here. No, I don't think you're cheating. You are gaming NRL-22 management's poorly written rules. You're competitors, and that's what competitors do. Fine, I'm OK with it.
However, and I quoted @308pirate here because I think he nails my issue, NRL-22 management bears all of the responsibility for this confusion - not any of the competitors or MDs - and they suck until they fix it.
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So they allowed this at NRL22 Nationals? Looks like everyone got their answer on this as far as what NRL22 thinks about it then.
Our match director once told us to shoot off the chair. He had a folding chair opened up on the line. Quite a few guys sat behind it and put a bag on the seat.
Then that 1 guy folds the chair and drops it flat on the ground. Goes prone, and cleans it quickly.
MD simply looked at everyone and said "that's what my plan was, I didn't specify the chair had to be open or sitting up for a reason."
We now know to question each other during the pre-match walk through so nobody is left wondering. We have went to an outlaw style format with revolving MD's and whatever they feel like making up for the stages. Everyone is happier getting away from the nrl and it's repetitive props.
My local club match occasionally has a pistol stage. It's normally a pretty generous target size like 100% IPSC at 100yds. Next time I'm gonna show up with a 10" Ruger Charger w/ pistol brace. MD will probably say no, but it's worth a shot lol
the more appropriate question is how did you shoot it last weekend? did you shoot it like Jeramie?How are we shooting the next “standing” off hand stage fellas?View attachment 7696047
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If you’re not gaming you’re not trying right?
I shot it the same as him, ended up getting 495/520. All misses where on the offhand stage. While squatting is more stable I think it was a mistake trying it for the first time on match day.
I am the MD in question. Prior to the match, I was told by several competitors that it was allowed at NRL22 Nationals so I allowed it locally. Did I screw up? Maybe. Did anyone die? No.
I'd recommend shoes. There's alot of rimfire brass inevitably on the ground.
Getting a core sample taken out of your foot is probably worse than legos.
Getting a core sample taken out of your foot is probably worse than legos.
Someone needed to squat to hit that giant target at 50 yards? Maybe they should give up shooting. They cheat but on a ridiculously easy stage.
You want to own up and admit to shooting the top of the kyl too? Once a cheater always a cheater.
Also these positional stages are sling only so the fact you had a bag on your rifle is double cheating. Do us a favor and sell your rifle.
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Hi,
So question, lol.....
Being I can put both feet on the ground while prone...does that count as standing since the rules do not state "Bottom of feet"?? Asking for a gaming friend....
Sincerely,
Theis
So question, lol.....
Being I can put both feet on the ground while prone...does that count as standing since the rules do not state "Bottom of feet"?? Asking for a gaming friend....
Sincerely,
Theis
No. We have a lot of fun at our local match. We sometimes do goofy stuff, for a laugh, and a bit of added fun. I knew before I shot the stage that I wasn’t going to take first in the match.
The OP isn’t a regular attendee at our match. What he witnessed was the the two top competitors at the match goofing a little bit. I owned up to the gaming while I was shooting the stage, just like I’m owning it here. Maybe I deserved a zero for the stage, because of the “spirit of the sport”, and obviously this offends a bunch of people on the inter-webs. The fact of the matter is, it was fun. It was still challenging.
I’ve stomped more than my fair share of guys with $5-7000 rifles. I did it first with a 455, and now with a Bergara in the factory configuration with a trigger and a $500 optic from a brand new manufacturer.
Never shot the top of a KYL rack, I’ve missed plenty of 1/4” targets.. I’ve also connected with 1/4” KYL rack at 75 in 12 mph wind in a snow storm in freezing temps at an X match. I’ve also never shot an offhand stage with a bag on my rifle. That would just be weight on my rifle that isn’t needed.
Sir, you sound salty. Are you a Vudoo shooter that gets smoked by guys with CZ’s, and Savages?
Sounds like I need to show up next time I'm back at the farm.
You guys have any steady schedule for matches and locations?
You guys have any steady schedule for matches and locations?
You sure?? You said you were the "shitter" in the photo posted earlier. That photo the guy has a bag on his rifle.
Looks like its resting on your knee. What happened to "unsupported"
I dont shoot a vudoo. Started with cz now rimx.
If you shot at nationals you would know most of us got smoked by a young gun with a base tikka. What's your point?
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Bud you got lost back there in this thread. There were 2 photos posted. One was me, the one with the “2021 NRL22 Nationals” t-shirt on.. and one was not the second photo was of another shooter who had the bag on his knee.
My point is, you’re salty. You don’t need to be. I’ve owned what I did. I’ve acknowledged that maybe I deserved a zero for the stage. Even if both of the shooters at our club would’ve received a zero for stage the top shooter would have still been the top shooter.
4th Saturday of the Month, every month. Held at NCRGC in LaPorte, CO. Come on out! We love to see new faces at our club.
J, Your new "custom title" is hilarious! See you around!
Hi, my name is Hlee, and I gamed a 22lr comp stage.
I shot the hanger on a 50 yard KYL. Not the top of the hanger, but the 1/4" post that the target hangs from. I knew that aiming a bit high gave me more latitude on the 1/4" target and went for it. I cleaned the stage.
I shot the hanger on a 50 yard KYL. Not the top of the hanger, but the 1/4" post that the target hangs from. I knew that aiming a bit high gave me more latitude on the 1/4" target and went for it. I cleaned the stage.
May I refer you to your own "Keep Calm and terminate with extreme prejudice"?
Shooters are supposed to better than "athletes" that dope or cheat any way they can.Shitter doesn't care who he sees in the mirror as long as he can steal or grift his way up the score ladder.He's not a better shot,he's a better sneak.A lawyer maybe? NRL's supposed to keep it fair and ethical. Perhaps NRL will start adding an asterisk next to the "shitty Shooter's" scores? It would be easier and better to define the positions clearly.
But even that takes guts and honor, perhaps that's missing in their case?
I've seen this one before. When I was MD for the now defunct Boulder Rifle Club RF match, we had a 50KYL rack, and first match, a few shooters were aiming for the 1x2" crossbar fasteners instead of the much smaller intended targets, and claiming hits. Sounds like what you describe above. I put a stop to that, because as MD, I could.
Next, we would always have a shooter who said the KYL target "shimmied" or "wiggled," so, calling bullshit again, I created a rule whereby a hit only counted if the target rotated 360 deg. around the crossbar.
And this was in an outlaw match, i.e. no NRL or PRS affiliation, no prize table, no cash payout, just bragging rights. And still, the gamers gonna game....
Well, in my particular instance, the aim point was such that if the bullet impacted slightly low, it would still impact the 1/4" target. But, if it stayed true, it would impact just above the 1/4" target, on the 1/4" wide post. And, yeah, you know when you hit the targets as intended because they do loops for a while, though we count the grazing impacts that cause the target to swing but not go 360.
The simplest fucking solution it to drop unsupported standing stages altogether. I mean, everyone fucking hates this stage except for the one fucker who's been practicing this his whole life just to game this stage anyway.
Shot match 22's as a kid, I like offhand. Was at the steel range one day when a local swat unit was shooting the turkeys at 400 meters. Hitting them most of the time, I started shooting them offhand.
Ugh,
As a MD it seems there are always particular individuals who always push it at each match they show up at. Anything from moving or arranging the obstacles/barricades to their advantage and when being called out using the "you didn't brief that I couldn't" excuse.
There are those who will get called out and will take the L and than there are those who will literally bury themselves in argument why they are right. Absolute shit show that ruins the sport IMO.
If a shooter has to say "I'm not trying to game it" while doing something it's exactly what's he doing.
The best one I've seen was at the NLR22 Nationals - there was a stage where you could shoot the custom build RimX/ZCo combo at a troop line (day prior match). But you couldn't look thru the scope until you got behind the rifle. This guy told the RO that he never looked thru a MRAD scope before because he shoots MOA (dope card was already pre made and on a rifle) so the RO let him get behind the rifle/scope prior to shooting. All the while the guy was saying "I'm not trying to game it" - a line he used practically at each stage...
As a MD it seems there are always particular individuals who always push it at each match they show up at. Anything from moving or arranging the obstacles/barricades to their advantage and when being called out using the "you didn't brief that I couldn't" excuse.
There are those who will get called out and will take the L and than there are those who will literally bury themselves in argument why they are right. Absolute shit show that ruins the sport IMO.
If a shooter has to say "I'm not trying to game it" while doing something it's exactly what's he doing.
The best one I've seen was at the NLR22 Nationals - there was a stage where you could shoot the custom build RimX/ZCo combo at a troop line (day prior match). But you couldn't look thru the scope until you got behind the rifle. This guy told the RO that he never looked thru a MRAD scope before because he shoots MOA (dope card was already pre made and on a rifle) so the RO let him get behind the rifle/scope prior to shooting. All the while the guy was saying "I'm not trying to game it" - a line he used practically at each stage...
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Here we go again lol, Squatting > Prone > Tripod , everything allowed for the cheaters.... And I don't care anymore.
Holy f*ck. Standing does NOT need to be defined by a lawyer in the rulebook. Standing is standing. Standing is not squatting with your ass cheeks 1" from the ground. If you're not upright, it isn't standing.
Maybe this will help. When you ask your boss for a standing desk at work, is this what he gives you?
Maybe this will help. When you ask your boss for a standing desk at work, is this what he gives you?
I think most of us "older" guys did get a kick in the ass when we were kids and your dad or teacher told you to stand up and you squatted, no translation needed. Sticks for a lifetime lol. Maybe that's how RO's could fix it...?
All they would have to do is add an additional sentence to the curret definition and the problem would be solved.
"Shooters will perform standing and other unsupported positions in accordance to addendum images provided with the COF sheets with exceptions only made to those with physical dissabilities."
And then supply the images like they have done already in the past.
Problem solved. No seven paragraphs describing of what "is" is. Its not hard at all. Wasting time arguing over what is common sense is pointless when its clear people are not using common sense or looking to subvert the rules when allowed to do so.
Add the sentence and supply the images. Done.
"Shooters will perform standing and other unsupported positions in accordance to addendum images provided with the COF sheets with exceptions only made to those with physical dissabilities."
And then supply the images like they have done already in the past.
Problem solved. No seven paragraphs describing of what "is" is. Its not hard at all. Wasting time arguing over what is common sense is pointless when its clear people are not using common sense or looking to subvert the rules when allowed to do so.
Add the sentence and supply the images. Done.
Again, a good MD with his man card can solve these issues with easy, bravo. It only matters what the spotter calls, I as the MD did not see what the spotter did and it's their call.
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I go to your matches to have fun. You're doing an excellent job.I am the MD in question. Prior to the match, I was told by several competitors that it was allowed at NRL22 Nationals so I allowed it locally. Did I screw up? Maybe. Did anyone die? No.
Dude, a KYL impact does not have to spin 360 degrees around the hanger to be an impact.. an impact on the left or right edge will not produce a compete spin, and there’s a lot of rifles that simply aren’t capable of center punching a 1/2” KYL target.
It’s possible you have a knack for sapping the fun out of shooting these matches, and your idea of fun doesn’t necessarily align with the shooting community at large. Which could be why the RF match you were directing went tits up.
After this, I have half a mind to show up at your bench, belly, or tripod match down by the airport, and bring Goofster with me so the two of us can just to burn that match down also. You’ve seen me shoot man, you’ve seen me crush Vudoos and RimX’s, you’d seen me crush it standing offhand. You’ve seen me clean stages that no one else cleaned.. you know I’m a damn good shooter. But haven’t done much of anything in this thread beside bust balls for goofing with a buddy.
I can't be bothered to get worked up about something so dumb.
"You know ima damn good shooter" Big Eye Roll....
Come on out to the CRC match with your sidekick!
"Burn it down," LOL. But remember, it's an outlaw match so you won't get any of your coveted NRL-22 points!
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The funny one I remember was a fixed structure barricade and hard angle targets.
To stay within the boundaries, you had to really contort and lean to get a shot on the targets. One guy came up to that point, grabbed the wooden stud with his left hand, leaned out to have a great angle onto the targets. Everyone was "holy shit!, is that allowed?" Well, yes as his feet didn't go over the line.
I personally call that one, thinking, as in thinking man's game
You "crushed" other shooters, maybe...you didn't "crush" other guns.
That's my favorite part of his posts. He's shitting on people who like to buy nice things. Better golfers beat people with more expensive equipment all the time. Doesn't mean anything.
I'm not sure he crushes anyone since he got 142nd at nationals.
I haven’t shit on anyone. Except Starbuck’s feelers when I shot in a way that he didn’t approve of. What I said in this thread is that I’ve beat my fair share of Vudoos and RimXs.
Yes, I didn’t shoot great at nationals. That was my first two day match in my life. It was my first match of that size. It was a lot of firsts for me. But why don’t you take a look at how many monthly matches I’ve won at NCRGC. Bunch of sniper typers... Starbuck shot a 150, for last place. How many times have I shot for last place since I started shooting competition 1.5 years ago? Exactly 0 times. I don’t bust anyone who has nice gear, or a nice rifle. But, I also don’t envy them. I’m content with my equipment. I consistently shoot above 400 at our local match, even breaking 500 once. My scores have shown that I put in the work to shoot consistently well.
I’ll invite any of you to show up and shoot a match against me, you might teach me a thing or two... and then again, you might go home with a lesson learned yourself. Type all you want keyboard shooters, but until you show up out here and shoot against me, it’s nothing but a bunch of blabbing and noise on the interwebs.
Good god man.. get a life.
I get it, you didn’t like that I shot a Slovak squat. But here’s the facts...
1. I saw this position allowed at nationals.
2. I wasn’t the first guy to shoot this way. Both at our club, and not at our club.
3. I talked with the MD about it -before- the match even began.
4. You shot the same COF as I did, and scored 15 impacts out of 52. I scored 44 of 52.
5. You were cleared to shoot the same position as I had.
6. You chose not to.
It’s possible, our personalities clash. You’re the type of person to jump on Internet forums and talk shit about people behind their back.. while I’m not that kind of person. What you didn’t expect, is me to see this..
I’ll see you at Cameo in a week. Good luck to you. Just remember when you’re there, you’ll be talking shit about the guy who’s shooting an X match with his family.
Ease off the caffeine folks , None of this will mean a thing when every firearm we own becomes illegal..
Never said anything behind your back. Never named you. You came on here and got all defensive. My beef is not with you or your sidekick Goofster - my problem is with the NRL rulebook. See my post 153.
As to talking shit about you, those are your words in the meme above, not mine. You embarrassed yourself, not me.
I know your wife and daughters will be with you at the Cameo match. I'll be nice if I see you. Good luck to you too. Burn it down.
It seems to me that all this would be a mute point if MD''s grew a set.
