Gunsmithing Holland drilling fixture. Built it instead - pics added

[Tac284]

I put a WTB in the PX but with all the smith's looking in here I thought I might better my odds. I am looking to buy one or possibly rent one of the Hollands switch barrel drilling fixtures like this.

http://www.hollandguns.com/DrillFix.jpg

Let me know if you have one to sell or know where I might find one. Thanks!

 

[chipsfan]

I put a WTB in the PX but with all the smith's looking in here I thought I might better my odds. I am looking to buy one or possibly rent one of the Hollands switch barrel drilling fixtures like this.

http://www.hollandguns.com/DrillFix.jpg

Let me know if you have one to sell or know where I might find one. Thanks!

Why don't you just make it? The one he sells is also a sine bar for his scope mounting system- you don't need that.

All it is is a V-block with a reference line on the lug side. Nothing fancy.

 

[chipsfan]

I found this blog and a few pictures of the fixture- hope it helps

Chambering a Rifle Barrel | Rifleshooter.com

 

[Tac284]

Why don't you just make it?

Well it was more of a time vs money thing and I didn't seem to have the time. But over the last few days I found some time and went ahead and built one.

 

[selfbowhunter]

Well it was more of a time vs money thing and I didn't seem to have the time. But over the last few days I found some time and went ahead and built one.

I have been wanting one too to do some mill work on receivers. Can you post a pic of what you ended up with?

 

[Tac284]

Sure I will put up some pictures.

So the material I used was some 1018 cold drawn. Our local steel supply had it, it was a rim leftover and was not quite long enough for the hole layout I intended to do but they had it and it was cheap so I made it work.

The start

After squareing the edges, milling the relief in the middle.

Then machining the 45 angle. I would have preferred a 30 but I had the cutter and wasn't going to buy one because it would have been more then the whole project cost.

I drilled the holes right after I milled the angles.


Counterboring the short/long action holes.

It's interesting what this jig shows you when you Bolt the action in it. It appears the raceways are not 90 to the action screw holes.

 

[chipsfan]

Nice job

 

[selfbowhunter]

I need to build one! How high is the mill you used to cut the 45* angle? How easy macining was the steel? Would aluminum be sufficient?

Chuck

 

[Straight Shooter]

Now you need the plug to hold the lug in place. An old barrel tennon will do that. You could thread and epoxy a bolt in the end to fill the hole and give you a spot for a wrench to tighten it.

 

[Tac284]

I need to build one! How high is the mill you used to cut the 45* angle? How easy macining was the steel? Would aluminum be sufficient?

Chuck

The mill I used was my 9 x 48 Bridgeport. The steel was 1018 which is free machining and easy. In my opinion aluminum would work fine, I almost used it but I choose steel for long time durability. If you think it will be something you'll use over and over again, I would chose steel.

 

[chipsfan]

The mill I used was my 9 x 48 Bridgeport. The steel was 1018 which is free machining and easy. In my opinion aluminum would work fine, I almost used it but I choose steel for long time durability. If you think it will be something you'll use over and over again, I would chose steel.

I have the Holland fixture and it is aluminum. It works great.

 

[flatland1]

Great project! Thanks for posting the pics of making your fixture. Been quite some time since I made anything like this for use in my shop - probably time to get 'creative' again.

 

[selfbowhunter]

The mill I used was my 9 x 48 Bridgeport. The steel was 1018 which is free machining and easy. In my opinion aluminum would work fine, I almost used it but I choose steel for long time durability. If you think it will be something you'll use over and over again, I would chose steel.

I have the milling machine. I was inquiring hiw much the 45* cutter costs. My mill head totates 90*. I guess i could use it to cut the 30* angles. What is the dept and width of the center cut?

 

[338RUM runner]

I have the milling machine. I was inquiring hiw much the 45* cutter costs. My mill head totates 90*. I guess i could use it to cut the 30* angles. What is the dept and width of the center cut?

If you look at the bottom picture you can see that the bar stock is a little wider than the receiver, rec is 1.35 so the stock is 1.5x 2.0. Parallel in race way is my guess 3/16x7/8. My guess is slot is .8 x.5. Hope this helps

 

[Tac284]

I have the milling machine. I was inquiring hiw much the 45* cutter costs. My mill head totates 90*. I guess i could use it to cut the 30* angles. What is the dept and width of the center cut?

Sorry about that, I was a little unsure about what you where asking in the earlier post. The cutter costs $290.00 plus inserts, I provided a link to MSC for the one I have Indexable Chamfer & Angle End Mills | MSCDirect.com.

The material is 1.5 x 2 just like 338RUM runner said. The center relief cutout is .875 width by .4375 depth.

 

[selfbowhunter]

Sorry about that, I was a little unsure about what you where asking in the earlier post. The cutter costs $290.00 plus inserts, I provided a link to MSC for the one I have Indexable Chamfer & Angle End Mills | MSCDirect.com.

The material is 1.5 x 2 just like 338RUM runner said. The center relief cutout is .875 width by .4375 depth.

Thanks for the specs! $290 is more than i would be willing to spend for a one time use. Looks great. Would you be willing to make one for sale?

 

[Tac284]

You don't have to use that cutter. There are other chamfer mills you could use, check out ebay! Here is one that would be nice to have - ISCAR Indexable Chamfer End Mill E30 D 62 w 75 with 9 Inserts 30 Degree | eBay

You said you had the mill? So what if you machine the block square, mill the slot, tilt your head, use an endmill and mill the angles?

 

[selfbowhunter]

You don't have to use that cutter. There are other chamfer mills you could use, check out ebay! Here is one that would be nice to have - ISCAR Indexable Chamfer End Mill E30 D 62 w 75 with 9 Inserts 30 Degree | eBay

You said you had the mill? So what if you machine the block square, mill the slot, tilt your head, use an endmill and mill the angles?

Thats is what i will likely do. This is the first time i have had the need to tilt the head.

 

[Tac284]

Sorry I just really don't have the extra time to make another one, hence the reason for wanting to buy one original. Do you have a Bridgeport mill or equivalent?

 

[Clark]

I did not make a fixture, I just put it in the magnetic Vblock and drilled.
My problem was WHERE to drill.
I sent an email to Holland and he got right back to me.

I am trying to drill a hole in the receiver for the pin.
What is the distance from the center of the barrel hole to the center of
the pin hole?
I am having a hard time measuring it, but it is somewhere around .605"
to .608".
I have your standard lug.

TIA
Clark
-------------------------------------------------

Clark, the dimension is .605... Good measuring...

Go forth and do GREAT things, check out our stocks muzzle brakes etc.

Thanks



Hollands

A year later I shot a deer at 477 yards with the 7mmRemMag with the pin in the lug

 

[Tac284]

Nice Clark!

I use Holland recoil lugs almost every time. I have to bore them out to 1.085 because I bore out my receivers when I true them. I just take half 1.085, half the pin hole dia, and the material between those two circles and move that distance. Which just happens to be .606

 

[selfbowhunter]

View attachment 25973View attachment 25974

I did not make a fixture, I just put it in the magnetic Vblock and drilled.
My problem was WHERE to drill.
I sent an email to Holland and he got right back to me.

A year later I shot a deer at 477 yards with the 7mmRemMag with the pin in the lug

I was wanting the fixture for doing bolt releases and other milling operations on receivers where maintaining a perfect 90* relationship during operations is paramount. I thought about purchasing a v-block and milling bolt holes in it but figured it might prove difficult to get through the hardened surfaces without serious issue. what are the dimensions are your block and where did you find it?

 

[Clark]

That magnetic V block is from CDCO.
CDCO Machinery Corp.
It is in Frames, so I cannot link to the product, but give a map:
Click on "all kinds of die maker's tools"
Click on "precision grinding vises, angle plates, and V blocks"
Scroll to the bottom of the page and see it.

It's dimensions are listed as:
Magnetic V-Block 2-3/4(w) x 3-3/4(H) x 4(L)

It is $44 + $19 shipping = $63
Mine weighs 9 pounds. I would not want to drop it on my toe.

 

[selfbowhunter]

That magnetic V block is from CDCO.
CDCO Machinery Corp.
It is in Frames, so I cannot link to the product, but give a map:
Click on "all kinds of die maker's tools"
Click on "precision grinding vises, angle plates, and V blocks"
Scroll to the bottom of the page and see it.

It's dimensions are listed as:
Magnetic V-Block 2-3/4(w) x 3-3/4(H) x 4(L)

It is $44 + $19 shipping = $63
Mine weighs 9 pounds. I would not want to drop it on my toe.

Thats awsome. Thanks a bunch! How hard do you think it woukd be to get through the hardened area if you were to drill it out for bolts? Have you seen them in that size that arent magnetic?

 

[338RUM runner]

Thats awsome. Thanks a bunch! How hard do you think it woukd be to get through the hardened area if you were to drill it out for bolts? Have you seen them in that size that arent magnetic?

You can't drill thru them, they have a magnet that turns in the center to make them work. If you remove the magnet they are just a v block that you might be able to drill but no magnetic force

 

[selfbowhunter]

You can't drill thru them, they have a magnet that turns in the center to make them work. If you remove the magnet they are just a v block that you might be able to drill but no magnetic force

If it was set up for bolts i wouldnt need or want the magnet. Do you know of the same size vblock available without the magnet? I could bore it out for pins and still use the magnet. This way i could maintain the 90* relationship during milling operations???

 

[338RUM runner]

You could try Grizzly # G5657 page 725, might find something there that will work.

 

[selfbowhunter]

I will do that. Thanks.

 

[Manzgear]

Im going to make this Holland Fixture.. I have dimensions for LA action screws from center to center.. anyone have the dimensions for the SA screw holes?

 

[flatland1]

Nice Clark!

I use Holland recoil lugs almost every time. I have to bore them out to 1.085 because I bore out my receivers when I true them. I just take half 1.085, half the pin hole dia, and the material between those two circles and move that distance. Which just happens to be .606

I buy lugs direct from Hollands - they're a couple of bucks less than buying through Brownells, even with their dealer discount - but more importantly, they also make the same lug with a 1.075" ID hole for oversized bbls used in actions that have had their threads single-pointed. Only downside to these oversize lugs is that they don't drill them for the index pin.

 

[Straight Shooter]

I use the regular size Holland lugs with the pin holes. They also deliver so that is pretty handy. When we true an action I never just cut it out to be cutting on it. I only go as far as needed to get a 100% clean up. Usually not enough to warrant boring the lug out. We then fit the threads to the receiver and the difference is the thread may not point up as sharp. At most they might have a little flat on top of the threads. It looks and fits really good.

 

[338RUM runner]

I use the regular size Holland lugs with the pin holes. They also deliver so that is pretty handy. When we true an action I never just cut it out to be cutting on it. I only go as far as needed to get a 100% clean up. Usually not enough to warrant boring the lug out. We then fit the threads to the receiver and the difference is the thread may not point up as sharp. At most they might have a little flat on top of the threads. It looks and fits really good.
View attachment 26153

This to me is the way to do it, the thread fits on the thread pitch dia. not on the outside dia. of the thread. A flat of .012 on a side will not matter or make it weak.

 

[Manzgear]

I was not able to make my fixture yet.. planning on tomorrow. Blizzard up here had school closed and I was not able to get into the shop. But I was reading the above posts and if you dont have an indexable end mill. You can use a drill Mill.. They are angled and you can use it to make the 45 degree cut where the round part of the action is tangent on the sides of the fixture.. just an idea .. kinda like this..
Buy AMG2424DPALTIN Melin Tool AlTiN Solid Carbide 90deg Drill Mills from UseEnco a 3/8 or 1/2 one should get the job done. and they are not as expensive as the indexable Tac284 was using..

 

[Tac284]

Fixed the pictures, I guess Tinypic went on the rampage! Thanks Mike for sending me the PM to let me know.

The jig is proving to be quite useful, I have already used it twice. Pinned a recoil lug and used it to remove a stripped scope base screw.

Dialing in the action to pin recoil lug.

Removing stripped screw.

 

[Straight Shooter]

We just bolt the lug to the front of the action with a short tight fitting piece of stub cut like a barrel tennon. The bottom of the lug is squared off the jig. Then we dial in off the small hole in the lug and then just drill right through the lug. No way to miss and eliminates the bit from wandering.

 

[Clark]

We just bolt the lug to the front of the action with a short tight fitting piece of stub cut like a barrel tennon. The bottom of the lug is squared off the jig. Then we dial in off the small hole in the lug and then just drill right through the lug. No way to miss and eliminates the bit from wandering.

I put die chem on the receiver face and using the surface plate and a height gauge, I scribed lines that crossed.
I started drilling the pin hole with a short stubby spotting drill that does not wander.

 

[Straight Shooter]

Why risk making an error when you can just drill through the lug as the tool was intended? .001" off and you risk shearing the pin off when you tighten the barrel up.

 

[Manzgear]

finally made mine... here are some pics..
Tac284 has been a big help... anyone have dimensions for a recoil lug boring fixture?
I squared up the block..
got the needed dimensions for the holes for the action screws.
milled a slot .875 wide .500 deep
and the I adjusted the mill for 35degrees and milled .200 per side
the action screws are: LA is .900 from fixtures face and 7.350 from the front action screw to the rear (tang action screw)
SA is 6.500 from the front screw to the rear so essentially you only need three holes..
I did counter bore the holes so I didnt need really long action screws.. those are 1/4 20- Im sure most of you guys know this stuff but when I was looking for the info it had to find it from various places..
so Im putting it all here in case others need it. Im also looking for a solidworks file of the short action with complete blueprints and dimensions- remington700 - I have the long action dimensions that I would trade for it.
I dont own any short actions and Im making my own actions from EDM'd blanks I purchased from Gary Breiling in IL.