Night Vision IRay RH25 Micro video/picture thread

[Surgeon_Shooter]

Hey fellas,

I finally got around to getting the video done. I thought I had the Flu, turns out it was the Chyna Flu and it turned to pneumonia. Boy that was a mess… Anyhow I’ll post new footage and pictures as I get it in here in this thread.

If anyone has any questions feel free to message me.





Thanks
Jay

 

[jwramp]

Would love some insight to the zeroing process. Is it just clip it on and go, or was there any POI shift out of the box?

 

[rlsmith1]

Nice!! Was everything shot during the day or at night? Lots of good info in that video, glad you're back to feeling better!

Flexin on us with that auto too...

 

[stefan73]

Nice

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

Would love some insight to the zeroing process. Is it just clip it on and go, or was there any POI shift out of the box?

In the menu there’s an option to adjust collimation. You’ll adjust your X/Y axis just like zeroing a thermal scope and that’s it. It can be relatively close out of the box but it will likely have enough shift that you will want to correct it. Once it’s corrected and saved your good to go.

Jay

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

Nice!! Was everything shot during the day or at night? Lots of good info in that video, glad you're back to feeling better!

Flexin on us with that auto too...

Yes all of this was shot during the day. I’ve been too sick to get out on these cold nights lately. I’ll get some good night footage of it this weekend though.

Everyone needs an SOT! Haha

 

[rlsmith1]

Yes all of this was shot during the day. I’ve been too sick to get out on these cold nights lately. I’ll get some good night footage of it this weekend though.

Everyone needs an SOT! Haha

Makes the images that much more impressive!

And I wish my American birth certificate gave me the same rights as an SOT (and then some)!

 

[EWS6]

Does every micro come with a complimentary case of batbola/chinese sicken/flu manchu/genghis cough/tiananmen throat tickles/winnie the flu?

 

[Crews]

I really like the hardware that lets you swap between helmet and rifle. Seems like pretty solid hardware

 

[stefan73]

I really like the hardware that lets you swap between helmet and rifle. Seems like pretty solid hardware

That hardware would be great on a NOX

 

[stefan73]

Does every micro come with a complimentary case of batbola/chinese sicken/flu manchu/gengis cough/tiananmen throat tickles/winnie the flu?

It might, but it comes at about $10K less than the Voodoo S and it might be more capable.

 

[Totdoc]

I'

It might, but it comes at about $10K less than the Voodoo S and it might be more capable.

Agree with the first part, have yet to see anything to suggest the second part

 

[WhereNow&How]

I'

Agree with the first part, have yet to see anything to suggest the second part

Well here are some technical calculations. Take from them what you want.

The Iray RH 25 at 100 yards calculates to 1 FPA Pixel per 2.96 Sq. Inches of viewing area. On the viewing screen it calculates to 2.4 Screen Pixels for every 1 FPA pixel.

The Voodoo S at 100 yards calculates to 1 FPA Pixel per 2.13 Sq. Inches of viewing area. On the viewing screen it calculates to 1 Screen Pixel for every 1 FPA pixel.

So the Voodoo has a slight edge on the FPA pixel (Powah) and the Iray RH 25 has a slight edge on the viewing screen (Powah).

Then it boils down to the magic in the software rendering algorithms which I do not have a clue about for either unit.

 

[Rancid Coolaid]

I really like the hardware that lets you swap between helmet and rifle. Seems like pretty solid hardware

So far, that is the big takeaway for me in this: a whole new way to efficiently mount/dismount from 2 platforms. I like the looks of the RH25, just need to better define the mission.

 

[Jgunner]

I would like to see side by side compared to a nox 18mm in helmet mode.

 

[WhereNow&How]

I doubt the Knox 18 mm would stack up very well viewing critters further out as it has 1 FPA Pixel for every 5.745 Sq. Inches.

It would probably hold its own with the RH25 and Voodoo S on close up critters/scenery but as you step out it does not appear to technically have the horse power of the other 2 units because of its wider FOV.

It's really hard to have a one does it all device. I adhere to the give me one device that's cheap (cost wise, not build wise) which will detect something is out there. Then switch to a higher power device for PID and shooting. But each to his own.

 

[Jgunner]

I doubt the Knox 18 mm would stack up very well viewing critters further out as it has 1 FPA Pixel for every 5.745 Sq. Inches.

It would probably hold its own with the RH25 and Voodoo S on close up critters/scenery but as you step out it does not appear to technically have the horse power of the other 2 units because of its wider FOV.

It's really hard to have a one does it all device. I adhere to the give me one device that's cheap (cost wise, not build wise) which will detect something is out there. Then switch to a higher power device for PID and shooting. But each to his own.

Thanks. I had thought that would be the case. I am looking into a part time weapon sight and part time helmet mount. I already Have a nox, so i was just curious. I have a halo lr for reaching out, i am shopping for a backup helmet and a .22 optic for small critters in my back yard at under 100 yards

 

[WhereNow&How]

Yep, if N-Vison would add the ability to move the margins around and cut the cross-hairs on and off on the nox 18 it would probably make a pretty fair little clip on (from Zero out to 300 yards) in front of the right day optics.

 

[Jgunner]

Yep, if N-Vison would add the ability to move the margins around and cut the cross-hairs on and off on the nox 18 it would probably make a pretty fair little clip on (from Zero out to 300 yards) in front of the right day optics.

Bet that comes on v2

 

[Totdoc]

Well here are some technical calculations. Take from them what you want.

The Iray RH 25 at 100 yards calculates to 1 FPA Pixel per 2.96 Sq. Inches of viewing area. On the viewing screen it calculates to 2.4 Screen Pixels for every 1 FPA pixel.

The Voodoo S at 100 yards calculates to 1 FPA Pixel per 2.13 Sq. Inches of viewing area. On the viewing screen it calculates to 1 Screen Pixel for every 1 FPA pixel.

So the Voodoo has a slight edge on the FPA pixel (Powah) and the Iray RH 25 has a slight edge on the viewing screen (Powah).

Then it boils down to the magic in the software rendering algorithms which I do not have a clue about for either unit.

Is there any info to suggest that the rh25 is running a different sensor or screen than the mh25, or is this just an mh25 in a weapons rated case with an already installed eyepiece?

My understanding is that the mh and rh guts are the same, since the specs are otherwise identical.

If that holds true, then as someone who has owned both an mh25 and a voodoo, I will say the image quality is better on the voodoo. Is it 10k better? That's the better question...

But that's using it as a monocular. Once you start using it as a clip on, the voodoo will quickly out perform the iray. The narrower fov of the voodoo will help it be usable at significantly higher mag ranges than the iray. From the partially rounded image through the iray, I suspect there is already some eyepiece magnification happening that causes clipping off of the corners of the image, which leads me to think it may degrade even more quickly under additional optical mag, but we'll have to see about that.

I think that the use case for both of these units are a bit different. I think the iray is an improvement on the mh25 in regards to usability on a helmet mount. The visible image appears to fill the eyepiece better on the rh25 than it's mh25 counterpart, so I think this will likely be a more pleasing image, especially if trying to run it dual band with a pvs14. Unfortunately, this comes at the expense of extra weight.

Because of the wider fov of the iray as compared to the voodoo, I think it will work better as a helmet mount, but the exact opposite is true when using it as a clip on.

I think the iray will likely work great for someone who primarily plans to helmet mount it, but would like to be able to use it as a close range clip on as well. I think the voodoo will work better as a close to mid range clip on, with the ability to mount it on the helmet

 

[WhereNow&How]

If they also write an algorithm that is really good at encapsulating an animals outline smoothly and then filling in the entire animal with one color that will extend the capabilities of the Nox 18 on PID for critters. The scene on the critter won't look lifelike in the sense of what a human eye normally is used to seeing but it will provide a clear detail of the animal outline such that you can make PID better.

A lot of people judge a thermal by how realistic an image (terrain, etc) it throws compared to what they are used to seeing with normal vision. I judge a thermal mostly on how it can image a live critter.

 

[Totdoc]

I doubt the Knox 18 mm would stack up very well viewing critters further out as it has 1 FPA Pixel for every 5.745 Sq. Inches.

It would probably hold its own with the RH25 and Voodoo S on close up critters/scenery but as you step out it does not appear to technically have the horse power of the other 2 units because of its wider FOV.

It's really hard to have a one does it all device. I adhere to the give me one device that's cheap (cost wise, not build wise) which will detect something is out there. Then switch to a higher power device for PID and shooting. But each to his own.

As much as I love my nox, it would get smoked by either of these units as a clip on. The fov is waaaay too wide.
Honestly, all this multi use stuff for these things is a bit of a bummer, because things that make it excel in one role make it suffer in another.
Helmet mounted gear does great with wide fov and light weight
Clip ons want narrow fov. Weight is less of a consideration, but lighter is always nice for something you need to lug around near the front of your gun.
As far as the nox, I love mine... The fov makes it amazing on the helmet. The weight? Not so much. I'd love a down sized nox strictly for helmet use..I don't need a 1x dedicated weapon sight.
The rh would be really great if they either increased the fov for helmet, or decreased it for clip on use

 

[stefan73]

As much as I love my nox, it would get smoked by either of these units as a clip on. The fov is waaaay too wide.
Honestly, all this multi use stuff for these things is a bit of a bummer, because things that make it excel in one role make it suffer in another.
Helmet mounted gear does great with wide fov and light weight
Clip ons want narrow fov. Weight is less of a consideration, but lighter is always nice for something you need to lug around near the front of your gun.
As far as the nox, I love mine... The fov makes it amazing on the helmet. The weight? Not so much. I'd love a down sized nox strictly for helmet use..I don't need a 1x dedicated weapon sight.
The rh would be really great if they either increased the fov for helmet, or decreased it for clip on use

I think you need to pick your poison.

You can have something excel in one area and be mediocre in another i.e. better helmet mounted and still clipon capable or vice versa.
Or,
You can have a jack of all trades and master of none.

I think the nice thing would be to have something that has the capabilities even if it wouldn't be the greatest tool for a specific role. Having options as to a solid clipon performer and an ok helmet mount or a solid helmet mount and an ok clipon or weapon site gives the user some options. Having that flexibility is nice, especially if you do have a primary system go down you still have some redundancies.

I'll add that cost is a big concern for me. How far off is performance for the price? I think that is a personal point based on situations but still something worth bringing up.

Just thinking out loud.

 

[Totdoc]

I think you need to pick your poison.

Sounds about right.
Thinking about this does frustrate me, though..
The skeet irx is old technology by today's standards, yet it NAILED it as a helmet mount sight that was also capable of functioning as a clip on in a pinch.
It was light, had awesome fov, but an all metal construction that felt high quality.
You could use it as a stand alone weapon sight or a clip on
Why is it nobody can match that now, for less money?
There are already solid clip ons in the right price range.... The super yoter is pretty stellar for what you get for your money as a clip, for example.
The helmet mount role is still a little light for options that are high quality, but a little more affordable.
It's the multi role stuff that starts getting expensive....

 

[Crews]

So far, that is the big takeaway for me in this: a whole new way to efficiently mount/dismount from 2 platforms. I like the looks of the RH25, just need to better define the mission.

It’s a pretty easy use case for me. I use an SBR with a dedicated thermal weapon sight. It gets old holding the rifle up to scan all night, but if you’re poor you’d better be strong. Also, it would be nice to have mils available for those longer shots that pop up every now and then.

So, this unit can be helmet mounted for easy button when I’m hunting. Leave the SBR slung and don’t lift it unless I am killing things. I can plop it down in front of my shorty 308 w/ NX8 1-8 for a longer shot if needed, or leave it on there all night if I want to bring a guest.

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

Does every micro come with a complimentary case of batbola/chinese sicken/flu manchu/genghis cough/tiananmen throat tickles/winnie the flu?

I’m not sure if I’m still contagious or not but I’ll cough in the box if your wanting a week off work.

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

Yep, if N-Vison would add the ability to move the margins around and cut the cross-hairs on and off on the nox 18 it would probably make a pretty fair little clip on (from Zero out to 300 yards) in front of the right day optics.

The pvs-14 eyepiece would be the downfall for the NOX as a clip on. I have a nice design for the NOX that I came up with to allow clip on capabilities as well as an optical alignment system to provide perfect collimation but it’s not worth it for me. With little to no help from N Vision on actually getting their products to sell, it would be a waste of time and money to produce the thing. Luckily IRay made the Micro! Problem solved.

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

But that's using it as a monocular. Once you start using it as a clip on, the voodoo will quickly out perform the iray. The narrower fov of the voodoo will help it be usable at significantly higher mag ranges than the iray. From the partially rounded image through the iray, I suspect there is already some eyepiece magnification happening that causes clipping off of the corners of the image, which leads me to think it may degrade even more quickly under additional optical mag, but we'll have to see about that.

I think that the use case for both of these units are a bit different. I think the iray is an improvement on the mh25 in regards to usability on a helmet mount. The visible image appears to fill the eyepiece better on the rh25 than it's mh25 counterpart, so I think this will likely be a more pleasing image, especially if trying to run it dual band with a pvs14. Unfortunately, this comes at the expense of extra weight.

Because of the wider fov of the iray as compared to the voodoo, I think it will work better as a helmet mount, but the exact opposite is true when using it as a clip on.

I think the iray will likely work great for someone who primarily plans to helmet mount it, but would like to be able to use it as a close range clip on as well. I think the voodoo will work better as a close to mid range clip on, with the ability to mount it on the helmet

I do not agree with you here. A narrower FOV is a direct representation of the pairing of the sensor and the objective lens. That has nothing to do with the display and ocular lens. The display and ocular lens however is exactly what changes the useable magnification range when used as a clip on. You did mention this:

“I suspect there is already some eyepiece magnification happening that causes clipping off of the corners of the image”

I could understand why you would think this. But it’s not working the way you think. The display itself is rounded on the sides. So there’s no added magnification to the Eyepiece/display setup like you thought. I will have another video up in the next couple days with a Vortex 1-10. I used it for the first time yesterday and wowsers! I’m more impressed than I thought I’d be. This is easily my new favorite thermal, my previous favorite go to thermal was a UTMX and the Micro knocks the socks off of it.

Jay

 

[WhereNow&How]

The pvs-14 eyepiece would be the downfall for the NOX as a clip on. I have a nice design for the NOX that I came up with to allow clip on capabilities as well as an optical alignment system to provide perfect collimation but it’s not worth it for me. With little to no help from N Vision on actually getting their products to sell, it would be a waste of time and money to produce the thing. Luckily IRay made the Micro! Problem solved.

Also the IRay RH 25 calculates on the FPA to 1 pixel per 2.96 Sq. Inch and the Nox 18 calculates on the FPA to 1 pixel per 5.74 Sq. Inch. Accordingly, the RH25 should throw out a much better image at distance than the Nox 18.

Jay, what is the issue with PVS 14 eyepieces not being suitable for clip-ons.

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

Also the IRay RH 25 calculates on the FPA to 1 pixel per 2.96 Sq. Inch and the Nox 18 calculates on the FPA to 1 pixel per 5.74 Sq. Inch. Accordingly, the RH25 should throw out a much better image at distance than the Nox 18.

Jay, what is the issue with PVS 14 eyepieces not being suitable for clip-ons.

Very true. The RH25 will net a much better image at distance compared to a NOX.

The Pvs-14 eyepiece was never meant to focus to a flat surface. The output screen on an Image Intensifier is dished out. I don’t remember the degree in which it’s shaped but it isn’t flat. We’re not talking a major focal problem here but you zoom in on anything that isn’t perfect and the small problem grows with added magnification. I’ve toyed with the pvs-14 eyepiece on various optics for use as a clip on for quite a while and it just doesn’t work well at all.

Jay

 

[WhereNow&How]

Thanks Jay. More knowledge gained for me today.

 

[Totdoc]

This is easily my new favorite thermal, my previous favorite go to thermal was a UTMX and the Micro knocks the socks off

I appreciate the clarification on the screen. If it's looking that good to you, I'm really excited to see your additional video through the 1-10

I do not agree with you here. A narrower FOV is a direct representation of the pairing of the sensor and the objective lens. That has nothing to do with the display and ocular lens. The display and ocular lens however is exactly what changes the useable magnification range when used as a clip on.

Where FOV seems to matter between units with similar res sensors comes down to how much of the sensor is dedicated to each square foot of viewing area.
I'm extremes, if a sensor was presented with a 180 degree fov, the sensor would be capable of collecting the exact same amount of information from the scene as it could if it were presented with a 1 degree fov. The density of information in that 1 degree fov picture would be much much higher than what is collected in the wider fov. It might not matter when viewed at 1x, but as you zoom in, it becomes apparent sooner.
The equivalent would be If you use a DSLR camera with a telephoto lens and a wide angle lens to capture the same object at the same distance. The same sensor is collecting the info, but the telephoto lens is optically narrower in fov. When you look at the object, especially zoomed in on that image, the wider angle image has much less detail than what the telephoto lens captures
The iray does have a minimal edge in sensor resolution vs the voodoo, but the fov is much much wider... As such, I suspect it will not support zoom as well as the voodoo. The posted pics and videos do show, obviously, that it's capable of making a really nice image, though!
Sorry for the piecemeal editing of this post.. Phone did some weird things when I started my reply...

 

[TheHorta]

…my previous favorite go to thermal was a UTMX and the Micro knocks the socks off of it.

Jay

You shut yer filthy mouth, Crymes!

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

You shut yer filthy mouth, Crymes!

Be nice or the box gets the business

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

I appreciate the clarification on the screen. If it's looking that good to you, I'm really excited to see your additional video through the 1-10

Where FOV seems to matter between units with similar res sensors comes down to how much of the sensor is dedicated to each square foot of viewing area.
I'm extremes, if a sensor was presented with a 180 degree fov, the sensor would be capable of collecting the exact same amount of information from the scene as it could if it were presented with a 1 degree fov. The density of information in that 1 degree fov picture would be much much higher than what is collected in the wider fov. It might not matter when viewed at 1x, but as you zoom in, it becomes apparent sooner.
The equivalent would be If you use a DSLR camera with a telephoto lens and a wide angle lens to capture the same object at the same distance. The same sensor is collecting the info, but the telephoto lens is optically narrower in fov. When you look at the object, especially zoomed in on that image, the wider angle image has much less detail than what the telephoto lens captures
The iray does have a minimal edge in sensor resolution vs the voodoo, but the fov is much much wider... As such, I suspect it will not support zoom as well as the voodoo. The posted pics and videos do show, obviously, that it's capable of making a really nice image, though!
Sorry for the piecemeal editing of this post.. Phone did some weird things when I started my reply...

I am indeed impressed with the micro in front of a 1-10 and as I said before the video will be done soon. I got some good video from last night.

You are exactly right on the amount of viewing area that the sensor has to analyze. The more FOV the unit has, the harder the sensor has to work. I do feel like this isn’t as important with the advancement in resolution and sensitivity nowadays vs the older 320 units and 25 micron 640 units from years ago. Still a valuable thing to factor in however, it will be interesting to see the difference in the FOV side by side.

Jay

 

[stefan73]

View attachment 7824748
Be nice or the box gets the business

You won't do it, chicken

 

[stefan73]

 

[WhereNow&How]

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

If y’all knew what was in this box you wouldn’t want me to shoot it , even knowing it’s hortas lol

 

[rlsmith1]

If y’all knew what was in this box you wouldn’t want me to shoot it , even knowing it’s hortas lol

I assumed it was his 7000 FOM DTNVS he let swan dive to gravel. Do tell @TheHorta

 

[TheHorta]

I assumed it was his 7000 FOM DTNVS he let swan dive to gravel. Do tell @TheHorta

No. It’s way (way) better than that.

 

[rlsmith1]

No. It’s way (way) better than that.

What a time to be alive

 

[stefan73]

I assumed it was his 7000 FOM DTNVS he let swan dive to gravel. Do tell @TheHorta

That makes me sick to my stomach just thinking about something like that happening.

 

[WhereNow&How]

If y’all knew what was in this box you wouldn’t want me to shoot it , even knowing it’s hortas lol

I hope it is some "Midget G Men In Suits"

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

Here’s a little video of the IRay Micro in front of a 1-10 Vortex!

 

[rlsmith1]

Here’s a little video of the IRay Micro in front of a 1-10 Vortex!

Nice! How far was the second dog you shot? Looks to be 5x or so? Lots of performance there wow

 

[Jgunner]

I need to step up my mouth call game. Been stagnant, although still calling in. Im just winging it. Making small animal in distress noises. Cool video!

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

Nice! How far was the second dog you shot? Looks to be 5x or so? Lots of performance there wow

That was about 275. I tried to get him closer for a better shot at him in the taller grass but the wind wasn’t great, plus I just killed his buddy right in front of him haha. Then the bastard layed down! Tried everything to get him to stand up and it wasn’t happening. So I put it where his body should have been in the grass and let it fly. The 69grain smk smacked him, don’t know where but it hit something. He bled a good bit but I wasn’t about to wade through those briars looking for him. That was about 5-6x yes.

Jay

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

I need to step up my mouth call game. Been stagnant, although still calling in. Im just winging it. Making small animal in distress noises. Cool video!

Thanks for the kind words sir! I’ve actually never owned a fox pro, I’ve used them but never got one. I’ve always been pretty successful without it so figured I’d stick to my old ways.

Jay

 

[rlsmith1]

That was about 275. I tried to get him closer for a better shot at him in the taller grass but the wind wasn’t great, plus I just killed his buddy right in front of him haha. Then the bastard layed down! Tried everything to get him to stand up and it wasn’t happening. So I put it where his body should have been in the grass and let it fly. The 69grain smk smacked him, don’t know where but it hit something. He bled a good bit but I wasn’t about to wade through those briars looking for him. That was about 5-6x yes.

Jay

Based on the image I thought he was sitting! Dang that's a great little unit. Great shot for just shy of 300!