Is the 6GT more compelling to YOU now that it has factory ammo?

[DJL2]

Obviously that’s subject to production and availability. I know that for folks like me, that matters. As I think about ordering a barrel, I was considering 6.5 Creed, 6 Creed, .308 Win because they have good factory ammo options. “A man‘s got to know his limitations…” and I know that I won’t be hydro forming brass, or chambering for an exclusively hand loaded cartridge… maybe ever.

 

[kthomas]

No.

But I can definitely see why it would be for some people though.

Pretty happy with 6BRA, and the FF process is painlessly easy.

 

[Jackomason]

Somewhat. But not because I shoot factory ammo. The 6BR variants are well established though. I guess it's another option for when I decide that I need to fill that gap.

 

[Crabcore]

Yes.

It is the 6mm cartridge I am most likely to shoot, coming from a 6.5x47L and 6.5CM. If we continue to have a massive component shortage, and this has ammo available, it would be very tempting to switch. I don't love reloading to begin with, so it wouldn't take a big arm twist to buy factory if there is little savings in reloading.

 

[DJL2]

Yeah, for me it’s just another choice in the pool now potentially. My 6.5 CM leaves a lot of performance on the table - it’s only a 22” barrel and runs on the slow side at that. Factory/hand loads with 140s are around 2675 fps (and shoot well there), I can “hot rod” the 130s to 2850 or so… but they just hang with the 140s (though they do shoot flatter). From pure performance standpoint it’s either hot rod 6.5 CM in a longer barrel, jump up to .260 AI or jump down to a 6mm…

 

[Niles Coyote]

I voted no, but that's coming from someone who has been running a 6GT for two years and will remain a user for the foreseeable future.

 

[kthomas]

Damn, what's it like paying $40 for a box of ammo? Are people really paying $200 in ammo to shoot a single one day club match?

2 years ago there were a bunch of threads about people being proud of themselves for quitting reloading and switching to buying factory ammo. I was just thinking last night where those threads went. Factory ammo seems to have gone to $2 around $2.25 around.

I loaded my own factory ammo for $0.63 a round. Loaded 400rds last night. My cost including ammo cartons and labels $270 for two cases(2x200rds). Street price $800 - $900.

View attachment 7740998View attachment 7740999View attachment 7741002

I load 6 GT on a Dillon 650 using StaBall and Sierra 107's I bought for $135 a box with Hornady brass. Figures it cost me $11 for a loaded box of 20.

It's definitely getting harder and harder to justify buying factory ammo.

However, for those that don't already reload, it's a shitty time to get into reloading. If you don't already own a supply of powders, primers, projectiles and brass, it would be really frustrating and expensive to get into reloading.

 

[The King]

I make around $500 an hour at work. I buy factory ammo for some reason. Even these days.

 

[kthomas]

I make around $500 an hour at work. I buy factory ammo for some reason. Even these days.

Shit maybe I should work with/for you

 

[kthomas]

I bought everything you see there in the last month minus the primers and powder. Powder can still be had for reasonable prices. Maybe not at Brownells or Midsouth. I bought 5000 primers for $550 a couple of months ago. Pretty much triple the price but even still if I calculated the cost of that same ammo at current primer prices it bumps it from $0.63 to $0.72 a round. The same people that are charging those prices for primers are charging $45 a box for factory ammo.

That's fair, honestly I haven't purchased any reloading components in a while, so perhaps the frustration posted by others leaves an unfair impression of what the market is currently like.

And as you state, it's obviously no better or cheaper to buy factory ammo.

 

[Huckmeat]

What is the relative barrel life on the 6GT vs 6CM, vs 6BR?

I've been shooting 6cm because I have no time and there is factory ammo. So 6GT is interesting. I just bought a bunch of 6BR brass thinking that was my next barrel.

 

[kthomas]

What is the relative barrel life on the 6GT vs 6CM, vs 6BR?

I've been shooting 6cm because I have no time and there is factory ammo. So 6GT is interesting. I just bought a bunch of 6BR brass thinking that was my next barrel.

6BR will have greatest, followed by 6GT and then 6CM.

 

[hlee]

I reload, but 'wildcat cartridges' have never appealed to me. Having the option to buy factory ammunition relieves a lot of stress in the whole reloading process. It also gives a benchmark to work against. And, if you do reload but buy factory ammunition, you can cost average the price of factory ammo into your reloading- to reduce the sting of that $2 per round box of ammunition. For me, yes, a factory offering definitely makes the 6mmGT more intriguing.

That said, I hope Hornady puts a rainbow tiger lounging on a couch on the front of the box.

 

[The King]

Shit maybe I should work with/for you

How is your Quantum Physics?

 

[Dead Eye Dick]

First, may I ask, you mean there are people, much less factories that actually Load Your Ammo For YOU???

Second, seriously now; I spent some time with my son’s 6GT and I really liked it. And, I have always kicked myself for not having my MPA BA chambered in 6.5 CM rather than 6GT. Until yesterday. Doing most of my shooting on my own, spotting (and hearing) hits out to 800+ yards is much easier with the MPA in 6.5. My son’s rifle is much lighter, but regardless, the 6.5 hits the steel with much harder authority. When I am spotting my own hits, more (up to a point) is better.

Getting back to the point of the OP, having factory ammo available is never a consideration to hunt or shoot at anything in the continental United States. Only, If I was ever to hunt in Africa, would the availability of factory ammo hold any value.

 

[spife7980]

I make around $500 an hour at work. I buy factory ammo for some reason. Even these days.

Shit maybe I should work with/for you

How is your Quantum Physics?

I can push a broom faster than time itself...

 

[just browsing]

What is the relative barrel life on the 6GT vs 6CM, vs 6BR?

I've been shooting 6cm because I have no time and there is factory ammo. So 6GT is interesting. I just bought a bunch of 6BR brass thinking that was my next barrel.

6BR will have greatest, followed by 6GT and then 6CM.

Barrel life is a product of velocity, heat, and pressure. It’s relative.

Pushing a 6 Creed or GT at BR velocities will *gasp* give very similar barrel life to a BR. Same goes for attempting to push a GT at Creed speeds… you’ll get Creed barrel life. Granted they won’t be exactly the same but no 2 barrels are regardless of chambering.

In a vacuum, yes, BR > GT > Creed, but realistically there are so few things that can be looked at in a vacuum anymore. We shot Berger factory 6mm Creed ammo exclusively through a barrel around 2,990 fps. It made it to 1800 rounds before we finally got sick of trying to shoot it out. And it still shoots.

 

[kthomas]

Barrel life is a product of velocity, heat, and pressure. It’s relative.

Pushing a 6 Creed or GT at BR velocities will *gasp* give very similar barrel life to a BR. Same goes for attempting to push a GT at Creed speeds… you’ll get Creed barrel life. Granted they won’t be exactly the same but no 2 barrels are regardless of chambering.

In a vacuum, yes, BR > GT > Creed, but realistically there are so few things that can be looked at in a vacuum anymore. We shot Berger factory 6mm Creed ammo exclusively through a barrel around 2,990 fps. It made it to 1800 rounds before we finally got sick of trying to shoot it out. And it still shoots.

Very true, a lot of nuances to it that I did not bring up.

 

[spife7980]

But 10 extra grains of powder is still 10 extra grains of powder. That creed isnt gonna match a br. Creed may not be half as much life loaded down but its still not going to be the same.

 

[RayRay89]

Any caliber that I can find factory brass for is great. I like the dasher but having to fire form every piece of brass is that much less barrel life

 

[BLKWLFK9]

Nah I'm good.

 

[Milf Dots]

I voted no for one reason: EFF Steve H.

 

[Rob01]

Barrel life is a product of velocity, heat, and pressure. It’s relative.

Pushing a 6 Creed or GT at BR velocities will *gasp* give very similar barrel life to a BR. Same goes for attempting to push a GT at Creed speeds… you’ll get Creed barrel life. Granted they won’t be exactly the same but no 2 barrels are regardless of chambering.

In a vacuum, yes, BR > GT > Creed, but realistically there are so few things that can be looked at in a vacuum anymore. We shot Berger factory 6mm Creed ammo exclusively through a barrel around 2,990 fps. It made it to 1800 rounds before we finally got sick of trying to shoot it out. And it still shoots.

100% true. People base the "bad" barrel life of the 6 Creed on when it first started being used in matches around 2012 or so and people were still pushing bullets at near the max 3200fps in matches and burning out barrels fast. Now with powder puff 6mms you load the 6 Creed down and keep velocities in the 2900-2950 area and you will get much better barrel life than the 1200 rounds number usually thrown around. I actually did that with my .243 back in 2004 for matches and only shot it in matches and at 1880 rounds it was still sub half moa with 115s at 2990fps.

 

[deersniper]

loaded my own factory ammo for $0.63 a round. L

Sure you do lol if your time is worthless.

I don’t have time to shoot enough between business/babies/etc.

Reloading is a hard no. Maybe pay someone like @FCS for increased performance. But to pinch pennies? Hard pass

 

[Dead Eye Dick]

Any caliber that I can find factory brass for is great. I like the dasher but having to fire form every piece of brass is that much less barrel life

A break from the thread, but hen we were shooting 7TCU, fireforming the brass gave match grade accuracy. Sad signs, one would think that the Dasher has enough popularity that one of the boutique brass makers would have a run of it.

And then there is hydroforming. Not easy but no pressure on the barrel.

 

[deersniper]

What did you do last night between 2100 and 2330

*** and sleep lol.

 

[deersniper]

I work 7 days lol.

 

[spife7980]

For real? What do you do?

 

[deersniper]

For real? What do you do?

Self employed and finding help is extremely difficult these days. Drop down to 5-6 days a week here in a few weeks then back to 7s when spring starts

 

[OREGUN]

I’ve reloaded for a long time and I don’t mind doing it but my time is valuable. Reloading takes time (both doing it and going to the range to check results) and equipment and space and mental energy and in the current environment, even more time and energy because you have to aggressively monitor your supply chain to make sure you don’t run out of/can’t get some critical thing at the worst possible time…so you stock pile which means you need more space…etc.

I’m not going to quit shooting BRA but I‘m probably done rebarreling any chambering I can’t buy ammo for off the shelf.…particularly with Berger, Hornady, Lapus, etc offering ammo that exceeds the needs of the steel-match shooter. I’d try GT if the ammo is available.

 

[220wyo]

No GT. There are several ways to do the same thing. Factory ammo doesn’t change anything for me. My reamers were ground for specific bullets at specific positions in the case and saami didn’t have anything to do with it. I should build a “standard” gun to run factory ammo. It would in all likelihood run with my science experiments but it doesn’t sound like nearly as much fun.

 

[kindabitey]

After 3 GT barrels, hard no.

 

[kthomas]

Took that many barrels to figure it out

 

[DJL2]

@reubenski - cool to see you rolling your own all fancy like. If I get to a point where I'm not making trash, I might get into the box and label bit. Right now, my 6.5 Creedmoor loads just make me sad mostly... not as good as factory... and nothing I've ever loaded has been. My interest in factory ammo is underpinned at least in part by how trash my hand loads are. I can invest some time at the bench and go shoot some home brew... it just isn't really worth doing from a performance standpoint.

@OREGUN - I might not mind the massive investment of my time to do load development if it actually yielded results. Sort of saps the enjoyment when you don't have anything much to show for it.

 

[OREGUN]

@reubenski - cool to see you rolling your own all fancy like. If I get to a point where I'm not making trash, I might get into the box and label bit. Right now, my 6.5 Creedmoor loads just make me sad mostly... not as good as factory... and nothing I've ever loaded has been. My interest in factory ammo is underpinned at least in part by how trash my hand loads are. I can invest some time at the bench and go shoot some home brew... it just isn't really worth doing from a performance standpoint.

@OREGUN - I might not mind the massive investment of my time to do load development if it actually yielded results. Sort of saps the enjoyment when you don't have anything much to show for it.

With all due respect, you might try finding a local mentor and get this straightened out. You should definitely be reloading at least as good as factory….and enjoying the benefits of adjusting the variables to get the perfectly tuned load for your needs. I‘m with you in the sense that if a factory offering shoots as well as you need, reloading becomes a huge time suck for little gain.

I just picked up a 6CM barrel for the express purpose of not reloading. Magically, it shoots Hornady factory at about .5”groups. Not terrific from a bench rest standard but it will hit steel at any distance and also required zero brass prep, zero component shopping, zero load testing, zero trips to the range to figure it out, zero resizing, zero trimming, zero annealing, zero measuring,….and on and on and on.

Thats why I voted yes. Controlling every variable is cool but so is grabbing a box and heading to the range without having started the “have I created enough ammo for a trip to the range“ process three days ago.

Also, great avatar. We had Dachsunds all of through my childhood. Best little dogs on the planet.

 

[CK1.0]

@DJL2 even if you're making trash now, you can just get good at making the same near-exact "trash" round over and over again, as close to the last one and just like the next, and you'll learn a lot more about what you and the rifle are capable of, small groups or not.

Consistency is king, so the same predictable round that shoots the same over and over agin is way better than factory stuff that makes small groups but is different box to box, lot to lot.

Sometimes guys forget that low SD's isn't always about the best recipe or components, and these rifles are built for more fun than paper at 100 yards provides anyway. If you can make ammo that is super consistent, then, much like pizza, even when it's bad it's good.

 

[OREGUN]

What do you shoot? Matches? plinking? Hunting? Experimenting?

If you shoot matches, what are you paying for 6 Creed ammo?

Matches…local…80 rds a day typically.
$30/box or so. I refuse to pay more than $300 for a case.

most recent came to $338 after tax and shipping so…$33.80 a box I guess.

 

[OREGUN]

How many matches a month do you shoot?

Depends….sometimes 3, probably average two. So a case gets me two matches plus some live fire practice.

If you’re doing the math on cost versus components, don’t bother. It’s not about the money, it’s about the time.

 

[AznTactical]

I loaded my own factory ammo for $0.63 a round.

This is stupid unless you get free brass. Need to avg out that $X amount of times you use that brass.

 

[AznTactical]

I did. 40 cents a piece. 2 reloads at least. $0.20 a firing for brass. $0.24 per bullet. $0.16 per powder charge. $0.03 per primer.

Are those prices from 1998?

 

[ma smith]

I did. 40 cents a piece. 2 reloads at least. $0.20 a firing for brass. $0.24 per bullet. $0.16 per powder charge. $0.03 per primer.

 

[OREGUN]

Guessing you keep it pretty simple too. In terms of the number and variety of guns and cartridges you have or shoot regularly

Why do I feel like I’m being teed up here? You do you. I’m glad you like reloading. Me too.

 

[AznTactical]

Seriously? Math much?

Want me to lay it out for you?

I'm genuinely interested. I'm at $1.97 (all new components) or $0.60 (not including brass). I haven't updated my prices since spring of 2020.

 

[Feniks Technologies]

I'm genuinely interested. I'm at $1.97 (all new components) or $0.60 (not including brass). I haven't updated my prices since spring of 2020.

Buy hornady brass for $0.40/ea.

That’s where the price difference is.

 

[AznTactical]

View attachment 7741476

I tried their blem 140's and never had luck. Always about 1moa but high ES. SPS sells their blem 220gr Nosler comps that make excellent subsonic .300 Blackout .

 

[AznTactical]

I had to jump them .135 to get them to shoot.View attachment 7741489

Tikka or less than 18.5" barrel for only 2700fps?

 

[OREGUN]

I could see where a guy that shoots one gun, once a month in a cheaper cartridge could justify $120 a month to shoot $30 matches. A lot of guys own few precision rifles and keep it slim and simple. They're all about competing. But it's hard to extrapolate that same model to multiple guns and cartridges. Some are really expensive. Want to shoot ELR matches? What's 300PRC cost? Want to have a .223 trainer? Going to pay $1.50 a round for trainer ammo? See what I mean?

I couldn't possibly buy factory ammo for all these
View attachment 7741483

Yeah. I hear you. I wouldn’t buy factory for anything other than this 6CM. It was an experiment of sorts. I hadn’t purchased factory ammo in ten years prior to this. I have components for years for all the calibers I own that can be reloaded I do find myself focusing primarily on PRS style matches for which I shoot mostly 6BRA. I don’t hunt four or two legged critters, don’t shoot ELR, don’t shoot anything that isn’t based on the same bolt face/action length. I just got sick of reloading and I’ve been pleased that, so far, any loss in accuracy or precision has been so small as to be inconsequential for my current needs.

Point being that there’s no way in hell I’d have considered 6GT if it required fireforming some other case and then committed you to reloading. If there’s factory ammo available, I would at least include it on a list of “possible” choices next time I burn out a barrel and want to try something new.

At ”current” prices, without having paid more than .10 for primers or about $40/pound for powder, my 6BRA loads are running about 1.05 assuming at least five reloads on the brass. So, my time, to me, is apparently worth about $.50 a shot.

 

[CK1.0]

Buying 1500+ rounds of the same factory stuff at one time these days is damn near impossible.

But buying a barrel, a few hundred cases, a couple thousand primers, a couple jugs of powder, and 1500-2000 projectiles, is actually fairly easy by comparison.

I kind of see reloading as a necessary part of the equation since it's so hard to find ammo in bulk these days.

If I could reliably find ammo in bulk, I guess I'd consider just buying factory stuff, but I'd only do it if I could buy enough of the same stuff to shoot out a whole barrel (which is what I do now: when I buy a barrel, I buy enough components to smoke it). Ideally, in 6CM, that'd mean something like: 150 rounds of burner stuff to to get the barrel's speed to stabilize, then 1-3 boxes of 3-4 different types of stuff to try and get an idea of what shoots, then 1200-1500rds of the stuff I decide to go with. No problem

I was a "buy it cheap and stack it deep" guy for years... until there was no such thing as cheap anymore, or stacking it deep when you're only allowed to buy (2) 20rd boxes at a time.

 

[generalzip]

Until factory ammo returns to sane prices, it does not even play into my consideration for selecting a cartridge. If you are shooting in any amount of volume in todays market and not reloading, you’re either so wealthy your time is worth more than ammo costs or you’re just an idiot that can’t do math.

 

[Smokin7s]

I slept 6 hours. Left the house for work at 7. I usually stay up late on Sunday nights because I don't want the weekend to end.

Amen brother.. I feel that Sunday scaries.