Narcan doesn’t save lives

[sirhrmechanic]

So the big pharma folks pushing opioids on one hand and Narcan with the other… use the slogan “Narcan Saves Lives.”

What utter bullshit. Narcan kills.

It does so in many ways… by prolonging addicts long enough that they can, well, do what addicts do.

— Narcan keeps junkies on the streets so they can Sell more drugs and hook other people to support their habits. Every junkie creates more junkies.

— Narcan Keeps junkies on the street where they turn to violent crime.

— Narcan Gives the impression that fentanyl and opioids are save and risk free, upping the demand and creating bigger markets for violent cartels who are murdering people in the thousands for control of the trade.

— Narcan lets junkies think they can “maintain” a lifestyle of addiction that looks normal… until they drive their car head on into an innocent driver, which has happened multiple times here in the last few years.

— Narcan puts first reponders at risk…

Narcan saves lives… not a chance. It is dramatically prolonging the opioid and fentanyl crisis by making them look safe and risk-free. And the longer it goes on the worse it gets.

Every Worthless pos “saved” by Narcan goes on to kill many more and addict many more… directly or indirectly.

Show me some junkie saved by Narcan who has gone on to win a Nobel Prize or invent a better lightbulb…. Or do anything useful.

Narcan has made everything worse… and made the pharma company selling it… billions. Solving a problem it helped create.

Ban Narcan and the drug epidemic, along with its related secondary effects, goes away in weeks.

Prove me wrong.

Sirhr

 

[pmclaine]

Liberal drug policies AND no personal responsibility.........foolish.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

What was the purpose of the $80 billion war on opiate bill passed for?
Opiate deaths have doubled
Big pharma got paid back the fines they had
Politicians and cronies got more taxpayer money.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

What was the purpose of the $80 billion war on opiate bill passed for?
Opiate deaths have doubled
Big pharma got paid back the fines they had
Politicians and cronies got more taxpayer money.

Once again.. they want an issue not a solution. And it’s killing the little people.

Sirhr

 

[SporterII]

Teenager buys a Valium to experience. Ingests poison unknowingly. Rescue introduces narcan. Lesson learned.
Big pharma did not introduce the teen to fentenal. The swamp did. Does.

 

[wvfarrier]

Ive seen first hand (both as a civilian and as a LEO) what drugs do to kids and families. Big pharma (and the politicians profiting from it) can all suck a bag of dicks

 

[eca7891]

Should be for minors only.

 

[Bullfrog08]

Ive seen first hand (both as a civilian and as a LEO) what drugs do to kids and families. Big pharma (and the politicians profiting from it) can all suck a bag of dicks

Its a personal choice. By saying what you say, youre also making the claim gun manufactures kill.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Teenager buys a Valium to experience. Ingests poison unknowingly. Rescue introduces narcan. Lesson learned.
Big pharma did not introduce the teen to fentenal. The swamp did. Does.

Teen ingests valium as his choice because it's fun, edgy and they want to experience a 'buzz' or a high or be cool among other teens.

Results are:

A. Teen doesn't like it and never does it again. Sure. That probably happens some.

B. Teen Loves it. It all starts somewhere. Sooner or later, they are hooking others or killing people. And they started it because they didn't understand risks or because they thought 'meh, what's the risk, if some thing bad happens, they'll Narcan me, so I can do anything I want. Yup, Narcan is an excuse to push the envelope. Because now all drugs are safe.

C. Teen dies. In which case none of the above matters and it's the fault of bad parenting, easy access to drugs, peer pressure, bad decisions by teen, stupidity, genetics, whatever.

The short version is that Darwin is a fucking merciless bitch. When you cheat Darwin, you are messing with a system that works.

Sort of like bicycle helmets and warning labels. And mainstreaming retards. And thinking that pathological criminals just need more hugs. Or that dosing kids with antibiotics every time they sneeze... is going to end well.

Narcan has simply turned opoids... that died out in the '70's because they KILLED EVERYONE using them... back into a fun little romp that is perfectly safe for suburban teeny-boppers. It's a safety net. It's the 'excuse' for saying 'no, it's ok, I can take this ride.'

I am not saying it doesn't have its uses... But if one were to really look at the spread, particularly of fentanyl, it is DIRECTLY linked to the availabilty of Narcan. Easy access to a cure... makes people confident that they can play with deadly chemicals.

Narcan kills. Narcan doesn't take lives. It's going to be an underlying cause of millions of deaths. And a lot of them are not going to be the junkies themselves. They will be innocent people who were the bystanders.

Sirhr

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Its a personal choice. By saying what you say, youre also making the claim gun manufactures kill.

Ah... a good comeback. And a worthy argument.

But I will argue back that we know firearms are deadly. It's what they are designed to do. You put one to your head and pull the trigger, you die and/or suffer grevious bodily harm. Known fact.

The drugs are being used recreationally and while dangerous, people 'think' they are not at risk of grevious bodily harm or death.

Now... how about if someone made a supposedly bullet-proof suit. And now people decided that there was no risk from 'getting shot' and so started to shoot each other for fun and recreation. But the suits failed. Or only stopped 'certain' bullets. Or got people to where they accidentally shot people 'not' wearing bulletproof suites. Ok... my argument is theoretical. But the issue would not be with the gun... it would be with the bullet proof suit that encourages stupid behavior that otherwise people would not undertake. That kills people who never would have let themselves be shot at... and whoever happens to catch the stray bullets or get shot while not wearing a suit.

Not blaming the illegal drug makers here.... saying that the 'solution' is making the problem worse. Narcan kills. And, as I said, I bet if one does a correlation study, that they will find Narcan has upped the deaths, both direct and indirect, far in excess of the number of lives it has saved.

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[n0glock]

How about for first responders only, there are literally dopers out there that dose themselves right up to the limit of death to get that rush/high and have a friend or friends standing by with several doses of narcan in case they go to far. Often people need multiple doses especially with fentanyl. We could also go back to the days of sending dealers to prison and I know this is crazy talk, actually close our borders and make stopping the flow of drugs a priority.

 

[supercorndogs]

Teenager buys a Valium to experience. Ingests poison unknowingly. Rescue introduces narcan. Lesson learned.
Big pharma did not introduce the teen to fentenal. The swamp did. Does.

That may be more the mode of operation now, but for almost a decade they were lying about the drugs they designed for end of life treatments, said they were safe and non-addictive, and speed up healing, and prescribed them to everyone for the slightest amount of pain.

 

[SporterII]

Raising children can be -is-tough. Tougher today with schools, education, environment. Not just our kids, their friends. Others in our communities. Protecting our children is our most important mission. If you think pharma is the greatest threat you are wrong. If you are mad about our society being pillaged, good.

 

[Fx51LP308]

So the big pharma folks pushing opioids on one hand and Narcan with the other… use the slogan “Narcan Saves Lives.”

What utter bullshit. Narcan kills.

It does so in many ways… by prolonging addicts long enough that they can, well, do what addicts do.

— Narcan keeps junkies on the streets so they can Sell more drugs and hook other people to support their habits. Every junkie creates more junkies.

— Narcan Keeps junkies on the street where they turn to violent crime.

— Narcan Gives the impression that fentanyl and opioids are save and risk free, upping the demand and creating bigger markets for violent cartels who are murdering people in the thousands for control of the trade.

— Narcan lets junkies think they can “maintain” a lifestyle of addiction that looks normal… until they drive their car head on into an innocent driver, which has happened multiple times here in the last few years.

— Narcan puts first reponders at risk…

Narcan saves lives… not a chance. It is dramatically prolonging the opioid and fentanyl crisis by making them look safe and risk-free. And the longer it goes on the worse it gets.

Every Worthless pos “saved” by Narcan goes on to kill many more and addict many more… directly or indirectly.

Show me some junkie saved by Narcan who has gone on to win a Nobel Prize or invent a better lightbulb…. Or do anything useful.

Narcan has made everything worse… and made the pharma company selling it… billions. Solving a problem it helped create.

Ban Narcan and the drug epidemic, along with its related secondary effects, goes away in weeks.

Prove me wrong.

Sirhr

Actually, Narcan can kill directly if you don't administer it properly. I did it a lot when I was PITing. Narcan was part of a series of drugs/tests that we did when coming upon a "unconscious" person where the cause is unknown. After ensuring the ABC's (Airway-Breathing-Circulation), we'd first assume it might be either a diabetic issue or an opioid OD. Therefore, we'd administer what we called the "Bellevue Cocktail," which consists of: 1) a Dextrose stick just to check; 2) a full gram of D50 (Dextrose) which is almost like Syrup, especially in a "Brist-o-ject;" 3) a dose of Thiamine (Vitamin B1) to help digest the D50 we just administered, and then the appropriate dose of Narcan, in the event it was an opioid issue. But when you administered the B1 and the Narcan, you had to be ready to roll the pt over on their side in the event they barf while still unconscious, and have either an emesis basin or a barf bag at the ready. You had to administer it slowly, a portion at a time, until the full dose was done. Otherwise, get ready for them to hurl (which they just might do anyway). And if they choked to death on their own barf, that would be very bad form.

 

[Jethro21]

Hard to say we want to win the war on drugs while removing all consequences of those drugs. Of course the obvious answer is the war on drugs was never made to be won.

 

[ggmanning]

Yes and in my locale Narcan customers are repeat offenders. Same core group every weekend. The addicts line up to see where the one that needed the Narcan got their "good shit"......got to be good if they needed Narcan, right? To the tune of hundreds of dollars per administration with many getting 2 at a time over and over and over. Darwin is not allowed to get rid of the worthless that cannot and do not want to be helped.

 

[cast1]

Its a personal choice. By saying what you say, youre also making the claim gun manufactures kill.

Narcotics are not mentioned in the Bill of Rights IIRC.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

Yes and in my locale Narcan customers are repeat offenders. Same core group every weekend. The addicts line up to see where the one that needed the Narcan got their "good shit"......got to be good if they needed Narcan, right? To the tune of hundreds of dollars per administration with many getting 2 at a time over and over and over. Darwin is not allowed to get rid of the worthless that cannot and do not want to be helped.

This is a good point, at the same time, if my kid does a few things as dumb as I did, I don't want him to die over it.

At the same time, I can recognize this issue but I would bet that if a study was done, it would directly correlate to how open out border is. The shear amount of drugs is one big part of the problem. I know that I would literally do ANYTHING to rid this nation of the massive drug epidemic.

 

[Maggot]

• We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. Thomas Jefferson

Though it seems a radical step, we should just legalize all drugs. As long as you do your work, take care of your family, etc. its really nobody's business what you do. If thats your pursuit of happiness youre as entitled to that as you are to a beer after work. Who wants to bring back alcohol prohibition?

In addition, buying pure, clean drugs at Walgreen;s would eliminate many of the overdoses.

If you rob a store to get money for it, different story, jail time. If you kill yourself, that leaves more for me.

 

[TXAZ]

Singapore does have a drug problem…

(makes you wonder why)…

 

[chevy_man]

Yeah, let's not give it to the first responders exposed accidentally.


I'm all for leaving the junkies to their own ends.

There's still a legitimate use for narcan. It's our overuse to try and save the world.

 

[AngryKoala]

Teen ingests valium as his choice because it's fun, edgy and they want to experience a 'buzz' or a high or be cool among other teens.

Results are:

A. Teen doesn't like it and never does it again. Sure. That probably happens some.

B. Teen Loves it. It all starts somewhere. Sooner or later, they are hooking others or killing people. And they started it because they didn't understand risks or because they thought 'meh, what's the risk, if some thing bad happens, they'll Narcan me, so I can do anything I want. Yup, Narcan is an excuse to push the envelope. Because now all drugs are safe.

C. Teen dies. In which case none of the above matters and it's the fault of bad parenting, easy access to drugs, peer pressure, bad decisions by teen, stupidity, genetics, whatever.

The short version is that Darwin is a fucking merciless bitch. When you cheat Darwin, you are messing with a system that works.

Sort of like bicycle helmets and warning labels. And mainstreaming retards. And thinking that pathological criminals just need more hugs. Or that dosing kids with antibiotics every time they sneeze... is going to end well.

Narcan has simply turned opoids... that died out in the '70's because they KILLED EVERYONE using them... back into a fun little romp that is perfectly safe for suburban teeny-boppers. It's a safety net. It's the 'excuse' for saying 'no, it's ok, I can take this ride.'

I am not saying it doesn't have its uses... But if one were to really look at the spread, particularly of fentanyl, it is DIRECTLY linked to the availabilty of Narcan. Easy access to a cure... makes people confident that they can play with deadly chemicals.

Narcan kills. Narcan doesn't take lives. It's going to be an underlying cause of millions of deaths. And a lot of them are not going to be the junkies themselves. They will be innocent people who were the bystanders.

Sirhr

Can't use the Darwin argument when we don't use it in society to promote a fit species.

 

[Aftermath]

Ban Narcan and the drug epidemic, along with its related secondary effects, goes away in weeks.

No.
There will always be a shitload of dumb fucks abusing drugs of various forms, including alcohol.
To your point, though, if we were to substitute Fentanyl for Narcan.....what about lacing a shitload of the drugs interdicted with a 10-12 times lethal of dose of some interdicted Fentanyl and releasing it back to the streets ala Eric Holder?

 

[theLBC]

just finished a book called The Hard Sell, about pharma pushing fentanyl and other opiates, and how they reward doctors for prescribing them.
extremely enlightening (non-fiction).

did you know that after purdue had already plead guilty and paid a fine for pushing oxycontin in 2007, that company still sold enough pills in west virginia alone in a 5 year period, to give every man, woman and child in the state 433 pills?

 

[SledDog]

The main problem, as with many hot button issues, stems from our society focussing on removing symptoms instead of curing the problem.

 

[wade2big]

Pull the narcan and end the drug problem.

 

[wade2big]

Pull the narcan and take a step towards the end of the drug problem.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Can't use the Darwin argument when we don't use it in society to promote a fit species.

To our detriment, in some ways.

And it begs the question (I am now arguing against myself...) as to how far you go to allow Darwinism to work? Medicine? Antibiotics? Don't cure cancer? Don't pull someone out of a river who is drowning?

Nature is ugly and mean and animals die horrible deaths in an environment where 'pure' Darwinism is often the rule. (That is until we exterminate the wolves or spray for mosquitos or upset the 'balance.') The 'Balance may be balanced. But it is ugly at times.

We have civilized societies that have risen above the law of the jungle (Except in certain areas) because we have evolved concepts like philosophy and religion and ethics (all subject to interpretation and dogmas)... that leave Darwin a good theory for nature... but not necessarily for us.

Or perhaps Darwin Does still apply to us because in the evolution of the species, we have invented these things that give us the ultimate leg up. Until they don't and Darwin takes over again... whether with a giant meteor or a supervolcano or Ebola Mayinga... that wipes the slate. (Note I didn't bring up Climate Change religion). In any case, we have evolved big brains, dexterity and language, etc. and that is evolution, too, is it not?

So what is it to say that we cannot 'evolve' some more Darwin back into our species to cull out the weak, the non-hacking and the destructive? We have done that for 8-10K years of 'history' by banishing people to die in the hinterlind... throwing deformed kids down pits... burning witches and chopping off each others heads and drinking from the skulls of our enemies while the women lament... I digress.

Civilization, like the Constitution, is not a suicide pact. Or maybe it is... and some future civilization will study us like we study the Egyptians and the Mayans and say... They were so advanced, but they imploded and vanished because they let men grow tits, let the retards breed and set up their society for abject failure.

It's a complicated question... And I don't think there is a modern philosophy that has yet been created to address it. A new 'Enlightenment' that helps settle some of these questions. Instead, we allow hedonism and anarchy to rise while trying to sweep back the barbarians. @Maggot You have the philosophy degree here!

Are we destined to fail? Yes! All empires do, to be replaced by new and unexpected ones. They seem to have a shelf life. Is ours reached? I'd like to think not. But it is a question for minds greater than my own. Or maybe I just need a couple of beers... always seems to be good for generating ideas.

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[DuneBoer]

I carry Narcan in my vehicle kit. Not for the chance of needing it for a coding addict at a rest stop but for the chance a family/friend gets dosed from fentanyl on accident. This happens more often than you would think. Wasteoid opens his trunk and some fentanyl dust gets blown into someones face across the parking lot. This happened where I used to work and the result was 3 people went down and all needed Narcan. Whole parking lot was cordoned off, hazmat called in and dealt with it. No wastoids went down though.

 

[theLBC]

the problem i have with letting these addicts die is that a great many of them were created by our own systems, not just entirely by the weakness or defect in the individuals themselves. billions are spent to create the market for addiction. this isn't accidental, but a concerted effort of unscrupulous doctors and pharmaceutical companies.

 

[Lawless]

I work in addiction treatment. Narcan can and does save lives but what is being explained here is that secondary results can mean a worse result for society as a whole. Narcan does seem to give addicts a sense of a safety net so they have less motivation to get clean. Lately, many have been telling me that their decision to seek treatment and remain clean is because someone close died from Fentanyl. Some didn’t know Fentanyl was in their Heroine/X/Oxy and for some it is actually their DOC.

One thing for certain, the amount of money spent on the “war on drugs” has been wholly ineffective. I could go on about the wasted time and taxpayer money but I won’t. It’s mind boggling.

 

[candyx]

One shouldn't fight Darwin its there for a reason......

 

[W54/XM-388]

I carry Narcan in my vehicle kit. Not for the chance of needing it for a coding addict at a rest stop but for the chance a family/friend gets dosed from fentanyl on accident. This happens more often than you would think. Wasteoid opens his trunk and some fentanyl dust gets blown into someones face across the parking lot. This happened where I used to work and the result was 3 people went down and all needed Narcan. Whole parking lot was cordoned off, hazmat called in and dealt with it. No wastoids went down though.

This right here

I make that argument often to folks who are all righteous about not wanting there to be Narcan and it seems to go right over their heads.

I guess much like all the self righteous bastards that didn't want to sell Dettol to women they though might have "loose virtues"
Or the religious types who's objection to the HPV vaccine was soley based on they claimed that if kids weren't scared of HPV then they would be having pre-marital sex.

 

[Californio]

The CCP is doing exactly what the British East India Company did to them with Opium. The Fent is manufactured in Chinese Factories, into caplets, the CCP could stop it, but they don't, they ship it to Mexico, Mexico could stop the imports but they don't. My buddy uses it in the OR but in liquid form, all these caplets are made for one reason to bring down America, we are at War with the CCP and Mexico.

 

[fdkay]

Singapore does have a drug problem…

(makes you wonder why)…

Very few repeat offenders.

 

[AngryKoala]

To our detriment, in some ways.

And it begs the question (I am now arguing against myself...) as to how far you go to allow Darwinism to work? Medicine? Antibiotics? Don't cure cancer? Don't pull someone out of a river who is drowning?

Nature is ugly and mean and animals die horrible deaths in an environment where 'pure' Darwinism is often the rule. (That is until we exterminate the wolves or spray for mosquitos or upset the 'balance.') The 'Balance may be balanced. But it is ugly at times.

We have civilized societies that have risen above the law of the jungle (Except in certain areas) because we have evolved concepts like philosophy and religion and ethics (all subject to interpretation and dogmas)... that leave Darwin a good theory for nature... but not necessarily for us.

Or perhaps Darwin Does still apply to us because in the evolution of the species, we have invented these things that give us the ultimate leg up. Until they don't and Darwin takes over again... whether with a giant meteor or a supervolcano or Ebola Mayinga... that wipes the slate. (Note I didn't bring up Climate Change religion). In any case, we have evolved big brains, dexterity and language, etc. and that is evolution, too, is it not?

So what is it to say that we cannot 'evolve' some more Darwin back into our species to cull out the weak, the non-hacking and the destructive? We have done that for 8-10K years of 'history' by banishing people to die in the hinterlind... throwing deformed kids down pits... burning witches and chopping off each others heads and drinking from the skulls of our enemies while the women lament... I digress.

Civilization, like the Constitution, is not a suicide pact. Or maybe it is... and some future civilization will study us like we study the Egyptians and the Mayans and say... They were so advanced, but they imploded and vanished because they let men grow tits, let the retards breed and set up their society for abject failure.

It's a complicated question... And I don't think there is a modern philosophy that has yet been created to address it. A new 'Enlightenment' that helps settle some of these questions. Instead, we allow hedonism and anarchy to rise while trying to sweep back the barbarians. @Maggot You have the philosophy degree here!

Are we destined to fail? Yes! All empires do, to be replaced by new and unexpected ones. They seem to have a shelf life. Is ours reached? I'd like to think not. But it is a question for minds greater than my own. Or maybe I just need a couple of beers... always seems to be good for generating ideas.

Cheers,

Sirhr

That is the question:

Our evolution (biological speciation) allowed for a species with the capacity for advanced cognition (comparatively). Genetic disorders and ailments are allowed to persist because of our innovation.

I've always wrestled with that concept.

 

[357Max]

You already made a pretty good argument against yourself lol. If you want to ban Narcan, why stop there. Let's ban Bicycle Helmets.

I'd wager death toll from Fentanyl would be + 30% min without Narcan. All that would do is further unmask our political leaders abject failure.
Powers that be like Narcan, it enables them to fail harder. They (corrupt class) like the fear of Fentanyl. Just buy from our regulated dispensary & you wont die ($$$$).

Problem is many that get caught up in this are not the stereotype addicts. Rush Limbaugh was hooked on opiates & openly spoke about it. Glad we didn't loose him 10 years sooner. Marry frigging Poppins house wife has surgery, gets scripted for large qty high dose opiates, now she's hooked & starts buying pills. many are laced with Fentanyl. I new the Mary Poppins example. In her case she sought help before an od, after divorce, but many don't. In many cases the Narcan is a wake up call in more ways than one.

IMO if you concealed carry & carry Narcan you are more fully prepared to both protect and save a life. Do you see the parallels with no one needs to be armed & no one should carry Narcan?

We live in a society were someone will go down & 50 people will walk the fuck around them dicking on their phone before that 51st guy will stop to give aid. I always want to be that 51st guy. I try to apply good judgment & yet without judging others. It's not often easy, but I sleep better when successful.

This book should be mandatory reading in schools. It will open your eyes.

Dreamland: The True Tale of America's Opiate Epidemic|Paperback

Winner of the NBCC Award for General NonfictionNamed on Slate's 50 Best Nonfiction Books of the Past 25 Years, Amazon's Best Books of the Year 2015Michael Botticelli, U.S. Drug Czar (Politico) Favorite Book of the YearAngus Deaton, Nobel Prize Economics...

www.barnesandnoble.com

 

[wade2big]

You can’t legislate morality. Hence there is NO government fix.

Correct, although morality can be legislated away.

 

[fdkay]

The majority of folks that I have encountered, that required narcan are addicts by choice.
Are there accidental exposures? Yes. Should narcan be available to them? Yes.
As has been said, big pharma is directly responsible for much of the opiate problems now facing the nation.
What to do?
Some exposures are accidental, some addiction was caused by pharma and the doctors prescribing opiates.
But again, the vast majority are drug users by choice. Many prefer meth, when they can't get it, they use heroin. A lot of the heroin is mixed with fentynal, but they still ingest by choice.
I remember going to one OD call, guys third time in two months or so. This time, it was more important for him to shoot up his heroin then to attend his 5 year Olds birthday party.
Third time was a charm.

 

[AngryKoala]

The majority of folks that I have encountered, that required narcan are addicts by choice.
Are there accidental exposures? Yes. Should narcan be available to them? Yes.
As has been said, big pharma is directly responsible for much of the opiate problems now facing the nation.
What to do?
Some exposures are accidental, some addiction was caused by pharma and the doctors prescribing opiates.
But again, the vast majority are drug users by choice. Many prefer meth, when they can't get it, they use heroin. A lot of the heroin is mixed with fentynal, but they still ingest by choice.
I remember going to one OD call, guys third time in two months or so. This time, it was more important for him to shoot up his heroin then to attend his 5 year Olds birthday party.
Third time was a charm.

The initial decision is but once dependence is experienced then it is now a disease and should be treated as such.

 

[357Max]

The initial decision is but once dependence is experienced then it is now a disease and should be treated as such.

And in many many cases that initial decision was made under the care of a Doctor!

 

[AngryKoala]

And in many many cases that initial decision was made under the care of a Doctor!

Yup, or as young kids/adults. I try not to demonize the user but rather the drug. That is not to say the drug user isn't a problem for the community.

 

[Sean the Nailer]

First off, I've been saying it for years. The fact that it is a 'new topic' today is disheartening from the outset.

Secondly, the problem boils down to society, and the absolute removal of "PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY".
Which is tantamount to "here, let me do your thinking for you...."

When we were children, we learned how to climb trees, ride bikes, play in fields, etc. In the DUE PROCESS thereof, we learned that while we can jump down from a tree's lower branches, if we did so from higher up or the top.... consequences. Pain, broken bones, etc. So now the 'village' just simply states 'don't climb trees'.

Are you seeing a correlation here? So YES, 'ban narcan'. ONLY for use on First Responders and such caregivers for unintended contact with said poisons. But anyone CHOOSING to take drugs laced with 'bad shit'... or anyone CHOOSING to take 'bad shit'...... Have A Nice Day.

It will be a SHORT amount of time where the streets, alleys, parks, sidewalks, and malls will be cleaned up because there won't be near-as-many sprawled out/dead on them. Others will start to see/realize that there are potential REPERCUSSIONS of and from their actions. If they CHOOSE to continue, they are also choosing to remove themselves from viability, civility, usefulness, and assistance.
I'm not going to do the thinking for them. But I'm going to think for myself, in what I want my efforts, my tax dollars, and my attention to be spent on. There are things in this world, and this life, that are FAR more important than a junkie, or some asshole (pick-a-title) that wants to get stoned.

Far too much time, energy, funds, efforts, and infrastructure are wasted IN THIS CONTINENT on 'junkies' and their multitudes of issues. And it affects almost everyone in one manner or another. First Responders everywhere are 'overworked' because of the multitudes of calls for assitance, theft, notifications, investigations, Emergency Room triage (etc)..... wherein if you simply STOP administering this stuff to those who CHOSE to do this.... it'd be better for everyone.

Yeah, I've been saying this for years..... and today it is getting talked about?

 

[357Max]

So the big pharma folks pushing opioids on one hand and Narcan with the other… use the slogan “Narcan Saves Lives.”

What utter bullshit. Narcan kills.

It does so in many ways… by prolonging addicts long enough that they can, well, do what addicts do.

— Narcan keeps junkies on the streets so they can Sell more drugs and hook other people to support their habits. Every junkie creates more junkies.

— Narcan Keeps junkies on the street where they turn to violent crime.

— Narcan Gives the impression that fentanyl and opioids are save and risk free, upping the demand and creating bigger markets for violent cartels who are murdering people in the thousands for control of the trade.

— Narcan lets junkies think they can “maintain” a lifestyle of addiction that looks normal… until they drive their car head on into an innocent driver, which has happened multiple times here in the last few years.

— Narcan puts first reponders at risk…

Narcan saves lives… not a chance. It is dramatically prolonging the opioid and fentanyl crisis by making them look safe and risk-free. And the longer it goes on the worse it gets.

Every Worthless pos “saved” by Narcan goes on to kill many more and addict many more… directly or indirectly.

Show me some junkie saved by Narcan who has gone on to win a Nobel Prize or invent a better lightbulb…. Or do anything useful.

Narcan has made everything worse… and made the pharma company selling it… billions. Solving a problem it helped create.

Ban Narcan and the drug epidemic, along with its related secondary effects, goes away in weeks.

Prove me wrong.

Sirhr

In your narrative, replace Narcan with Methadone & Saboxone. I then agree 100%

Big Pharma causes the problem (steels your wallet), and then offers to solve it (lets look for that wallet).

Vivitrol is a different story, effective but no long term residual money in it for them.

Addiction is insidious & so are the recovery options currently. Big Pharma is profiting just as much from recovery efforts via drug replacement therapy. It's fucking criminal!!

 

[fdkay]

The initial decision is but once dependence is experienced then it is now a disease and should be treated as such.

Bullshit.
The whole "it's a disease" narrative is nothing more than denying responsibility.
Is there anyone that believes meth, heroin or fentynal are good for you, with no serious consequence?
Then don't do the shit.

 

[JR_77]

After watching the movie My Son Hunter he must have had a case of Narcan available at all times.

I’m assuming you need doctors orders to acquire Narcan?

 

[357Max]

Bullshit.
The whole "it's a disease" narrative is nothing more than denying responsibility.
Is there anyone that believes meth, heroin or fentynal are good for you, with no serious consequence?
Then don't do the shit.

One does not absolve the other.

It is a disease, but addicts are not victims. Personal responsibility is always required.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

In your narrative, replace Narcan with Methadone & Saboxone. I then agree 100%

Big Pharma causes the problem (steels your wallet), and then offers to solve it (lets look for that wallet).

Vivitrol is a different story, effective but no long term residual money in it for them.

Addiction is insidious & so are the recovery options currently. Big Pharma is profiting just as much from recovery efforts via drug replacement therapy. It's fucking criminal!!

Not to mention much of the Fentanyl is coming from Chicoms... by way of Mexico. Or the Chicoms are making the precursor chemicals...

So big Pharma isn't all of it. We are having chemical warfare waged on us by our enemies.

Sort of payback for the British and their Opium wars...

Big Pharma's responsibility for the opoid crisis (pain mediation) was/is criminal. The fines they paid were a fraction of what they profited. There was an excellent documentary on either HBO or PBS on the roots of it... and it truly was criminal.

The issue, however, is not the underlying cause. It's that there is a good argument to be made that the 'wake up' cure is causing more deaths than it's saving. And Pharma is using the slogan "Narcan saves Lives." Which is utter BS.

"Narcan prolongs addiction" may well be a better slogan...

Sirhr

 

[RickyRodney]

Correct, although morality can be legislated away.

And in many many cases that initial decision was made under the care of a Doctor!

True. However with reimbursement to hospitals and medical systems being tied to patient satisfaction was the real root of the problem. Medicare did this and other private medical systems model their reimbursement like medicare. Sometimes what was best for patients isn't what people want, so they go against their own judgement to satisfy the patient. Personally seen it countless times, when practicing in a litigious environment. I believe this definitely came from the top, and then big pharma capitalized.

 

[theLBC]

Bullshit.
The whole "it's a disease" narrative is nothing more than denying responsibility.
Is there anyone that believes meth, heroin or fentynal are good for you, with no serious consequence?
Then don't do the shit.

You're ignoring the fact that doctors got paid to prescribe stronger prescriptions when they weren't needed, even when exponentially more addictive, because the kickbacks were bigger.
They literally got people addicted on purpose.