Guessing he’s just looking at the pics. Definitely appears larger in the pics in this thread.
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New Labradar LX
- Thread starter padom
- Start date
So you feel the way about LabRadar the way I feel about you and your products? That's interesting.
The "marketeering" associated with this photo is impressive. The LR-LX is full bright, shows a high velocity, has a full(er) battery, shows Bluetooth connected, and is displayed from the front where size is similar vs. the side where size is a huge disadvantage for the LX. The Garmin Xero is displayed with virtually no backlight, no registered velocity or statistics, a half-full battery, no Bluetooth connection icon, and displayed from the front where the LR-LX doesn't look like a shoe-box to Garmin's match-box size. It's like every sales display for a clock or watch, where the time is always 10:08 ... so the hands look like a "smile" and make you feel better about buying the clock. Bravo to whoever took this photo ... they obviously passed "Marketing 101" in their undergrad work.
It's accurate enough. The slight errors fall well within the normal distribution (over a larger sample size) and the average velocity derived is accurate enough for 99.9% of practical uses in the shooting sports. Anything else is just academic and mental masturbation.
They also have the LR closer to the camera giving it more command or prominence.
Well here’s the thing. Academically I’m sure you’re right. But I think what the other guy is getting at is that the velocity isn’t going to vary super significantly.You can smart ass all you want but a dude that is smarter than both of us and made first rifle mounted radar years before Garmin and Labradar, explained in a post how and why both offset and orientation can influence measurements.
Looking for most consistent measurement you need constant offset and angle , best facilitated by rifle mount
There is no magic compensation going on by Garmin or Labradar its just inept users inducing errors and thinking the magic box does magic things
View attachment 8327751
More importantly, if you’re keeping the relationship between the Garmin and the rifle the same, consistency should be fairly good, which is what most of us are likely after.
I don’t really care THAT MUCH if the bullet is moving 2806 or 2817 or 2830. Hell one chrono to the next has variance like that. What I care about is seeing the general speed and consistency.
In the tests I have seen with Garmin, they’re pretty damn close.
Most importantly, the data from the Garmin is a hell of a lot more useful than missed shots! And I think that’s what the other guy is getting at.
I have an idea for a LR modification that makes it useful in a world where the Garmin just became Emperor ... I wonder if there's a way to "reverse measure" so that I can put my Labradar near, say, a 1,000 yard target, aimed at the firing line, and figure out how to get an actual measurement of velocity at distance. You know ... trick it into thinking the oncoming bullet is really from the muzzle, just going the wrong way. Don't laugh ... I'm serious here ... (sort of, maybe, OK, probably not).
Does this experiment end with the bullet striking the LR? haha
Users have put the Garmin downrange next to their target to get a velocity. Works well. Use a berm or steel target in front to protect the unit, or just shoot accurately.
Probably ... eventually. I might send mine to Scott at Kentucky Ballistics and have him shoot it with one of his elephant guns. That would be fun ... probably more fun than the $30 I'd get for it now on GunBroker.
Also came from the Yanick Sab Facebook page (same as pic below) although the original photo (of the Garmin vs LX size comparison pic)I think came from Ryan Cheney ELR's Facebook page. This is probably the last pic I'll post unless I can find more size comparison pics between the Garmin (or other units) and the LX. I think most of us got a general idea of what the size/form factor of this new LX is.
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Garmin at least reminds the user on the screen at the start of every series of optimal placement .You can smart ass all you want but a dude that is smarter than both of us and made first rifle mounted radar years before Garmin and Labradar, explained in a post how and why both offset and orientation can influence measurements.
Looking for most consistent measurement you need constant offset and angle , best facilitated by rifle mount.
There is no magic compensation going on by Garmin or Labradar its just inept users inducing errors and thinking the magic box does magic things
View attachment 8327751
Still looking for a 360-degree view to tell where the charger plugs in, whether there's a SD Card slot, and if they included a port for an external trigger (or not).
Yanik said it got leaked early. Probably months away from actual in hand user testing. If it’s anything like LR of the past, more frustration incoming. I’ve tried other’s LR units. Royal pain in the ass to use with Rimfire.
I think it's on the bottom. The last pic I posted has a grey cable (power? data cable?) and a trap door on the bottom. If I can find a clear pic of it though, I'll post it up.
If the App still sucks, and they no longer have a SD card ... that would be an even worse combination than they have right now. At least on my existing LR I could always get good data off the SD card, even if the App was useless.
In theory anyway. The old Lab Radar unit wasn't exactly the easiest thing in the world to purchase. Production and marketing wise, even if Infinition had a year's head start, i think Garmin would have quickly caught up and passed them.
Neither unit has fingers or toes to check, so I don't trust it.
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this is interesting.
Do you know that Garmin doesn't take angle into account? Seems theoretically possible, to determine the angle of the projectile relative to the line of site of the radar by simply having data points on two points in space of the projectile, then being able to use that data to make a calculation that takes into account the angle.
I don't know that they do this. But I do remember the Garmin EE talking about an algorythm they use to normalize the calculated velocity which takes a few seconds - which is why you see the delay in the display.
Do you have any information that indicates Garmin doesn't take this into account?
Do you know that Garmin doesn't take angle into account? Seems theoretically possible, to determine the angle of the projectile relative to the line of site of the radar by simply having data points on two points in space of the projectile, then being able to use that data to make a calculation that takes into account the angle.
I don't know that they do this. But I do remember the Garmin EE talking about an algorythm they use to normalize the calculated velocity which takes a few seconds - which is why you see the delay in the display.
Do you have any information that indicates Garmin doesn't take this into account?
You can smart ass all you want but a dude that is smarter than both of us and made first rifle mounted radar years before Garmin and Labradar, explained in a post how and why both offset and orientation can influence measurements.
Looking for most consistent measurement you need constant offset and angle , best facilitated by rifle mount.
There is no magic compensation going on by Garmin or Labradar its just inept users inducing errors and thinking the magic box does magic things
View attachment 8327751
And 6 months from now the px could be littered with garmins being replaced by owners with the LR units. I doubt it but you never know
Its size alone would have drawn enough sales to put a serious dent in the population of buyers for the garmin. If the price was where it’s at now and introduced at 2023 shot
I’m just assuming based on the old unit and prices that this unit was going to be marketed at a much higher price than $600. Garmin snuffed any hopes of that completely out
In as much as I avoided and disliked Labradar based other’s experiences, I still find this an exciting development.
Whether you end up liking this unit or not, I find the color scheme and the form factor actually impressive.
In the free-market, competition is good and will keep innovation going. Let’s hope this is actually a good faith attempt at Labradar to redeem themselves. In the end that will be good for everyone.
Watching the Garmin completely revolutionized how we deal with chronographs, has been nothing short of inspirational. What an industry upset! WOW! That said, heaven forbid Garmin should corner the market for long.
Even if you hate labradar, if this thing does reasonably well, we could see a Garmin V2 come out this time next year. Also, perhaps some much-needed software updates.
This industry is finicky with a couple of new features on the labradar and those guys getting their act together, this could really be a game changer. It could push Garmin to address some of our collective concerns.
I like the fact that they’re saying “weapons mountable”, up front, unlike Garmin blowing smoke about the issue. “ YES, you can do it, but don’t come crying to us if it breaks under warranty.”
Three cheers for the free market……..!
Whether you end up liking this unit or not, I find the color scheme and the form factor actually impressive.
In the free-market, competition is good and will keep innovation going. Let’s hope this is actually a good faith attempt at Labradar to redeem themselves. In the end that will be good for everyone.
Watching the Garmin completely revolutionized how we deal with chronographs, has been nothing short of inspirational. What an industry upset! WOW! That said, heaven forbid Garmin should corner the market for long.
Even if you hate labradar, if this thing does reasonably well, we could see a Garmin V2 come out this time next year. Also, perhaps some much-needed software updates.
This industry is finicky with a couple of new features on the labradar and those guys getting their act together, this could really be a game changer. It could push Garmin to address some of our collective concerns.
I like the fact that they’re saying “weapons mountable”, up front, unlike Garmin blowing smoke about the issue. “ YES, you can do it, but don’t come crying to us if it breaks under warranty.”
Three cheers for the free market……..!
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I'd be interested to see the resolution when the seen is shining on the screen. I know the Garmin screen sucks and is hard to see when the sun is behind me, shining right at it.
More likely than not it doesn't have any correction for it as you have seen correction factor its in 3rd decimal if radar is placed at close to recomended position.
But same problem happens when you place it a different lenghts. to the muzzle or in elevation difference its a 3 dimensional error
Labradar LX having a sight is probably related.
These are problems unique to super short-range radars ,as the measurement zone is short and angular differences can be larger
But like said these errors are likely of no concern to most users.
Ah, so it doesn't matter at all and the placement differences are irrelevant to the results.
that is up to you ,how much garbage in, garbage out you are comfortable with
At most a 2% error that is constant in the same direction for a data gathering session.
LOL
I think they could have kept their dominance if they would have came out with this 6 months ago. But with the volume of people who have already picked up a Garmin, this doesn’t offer enough to get them to jump back.
Maybe if it proves more accurate and maybe if they make it more user friendly, and easier to export data. But it’s mostly too late
I’m glad it’s out though. competition is good for us.
I would love to see them offer a trade in program. Honestly, that’s the only way I’d buy one right now.
Maybe if it proves more accurate and maybe if they make it more user friendly, and easier to export data. But it’s mostly too late
I’m glad it’s out though. competition is good for us.
I would love to see them offer a trade in program. Honestly, that’s the only way I’d buy one right now.
that 2% was from a 10cm shift to the side on an andiscan that is 1m behind the barrel and 20cm from bore line, its not the most error you can have its just one sample
Lets remember posters that went bananas when chrono manufacturer advertised error less than 1%
Like said garbage in garbage out , its up to you.
I doubt they would waste the code on it…in any realistic scenario it’s inconsequential, IMO
Educate me
error went to 2% from 0.5% in 20cm vs 10cm offset from bore line.
So your true MV when Garmin was showing 3000fps was either 3060fps or 3015 fps depending on 10cm difference in offset to the side
Garbage in garbage out.
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Might as well pack up if the MV is 15 FPS off what the screen says.
Hell most people buying the damn things probably have an SD higher than 15.
Also I'm still not clear what is a better option? The Magnetospeed that screws with barrel harmonics?
the error remains constant,SD and ES differences will still be recorded right , just the baseline is slighty skewed. Like i said that is why these small radars predating Garmin were designed to be rifle-mounted to reduce these errors .
The original Labradar, which is the most accurate and precise chronograph ever tested by Litz. And while 15fps may not matter to most people, it really does for me.
It's not accurate at all if it only captures 5% of the time.
Fair, our standards are different.
My largest gripe is that I don't care how great the LR is when half of the data points are missing. Sort of like crap in crap out, except there isn't even crap in, it's just a hole in the dataset. I won't bother belaboring the additional issues with customer support and the apps. I haven't personally owned one so I can't speak as much to those aspects. I was sufficiently scared off by what I saw to just wait. Glad I did.
I'm happy with my Garmin XERO. Too little, too late LabRetards.
Now that LR are so cheap, one can just tape over that dataset hole by using 10 LabRadars in a large circle. An orange ring of fire.
Would be amusing if they all miss the same shots.
LabRetards trying to explain to Garmin XERO owners how consistent the shot detection is on the new LR unit...
There is a post somewhere buried deep in the Xero thread of someone who posted a video taking shots pointing it all over the place at varying distances from the muzzle. It was never that far off compared to when it was set at the recommended distance. If I remember, it was well within the ES. Basically, me and those who saw the post, felt that it didn't matter one damn bit if it was not exactly where Garmin suggests, as long as it got the shot.
As a matter of fact, I can't wait to see someone test both side by side doing the same exact test.
As a matter of fact, I can't wait to see someone test both side by side doing the same exact test.
You got a NIST-traceable certificate of calibration to go with that claim?
I think I said this in the Xero thread, but I would rather have more consistency over a little bit less accuracy another words I don't care if a chronograph thinks 2900 FPS is actually 2910 FPS as long as it always thinks 2910 FPS is 2900 FPS consistently that will make the ES, SD, and the AVG more accurate. I am not saying the Xero is not accurate just using that as an example, but I do feel like it is very consistent I have yet to have any "crazy" fps shots like I have gotten with other chronographs in the past.
Ok I know that was a lot just to say I think as long as you leave the Xero in the same spot during each shooting session it will be consistent and doesn't really matter if it is not exactly where Garmin suggests.
Anyways now everyone trade in the Labradars for 100$ is offering before offer drops to 90$
I am giving trade-in value of $100 for a completely functional LabRadar with the original accessories (and anything else you want to send that you want to include).
I am giving trade-in value of $75 for a completely functional MagnetoSpeed V3 with the original accessories.
www.snipershide.com
I am giving trade-in value of $100 for a completely functional LabRadar with the original accessories (and anything else you want to send that you want to include).
I am giving trade-in value of $75 for a completely functional MagnetoSpeed V3 with the original accessories.
Precision Rifle Gear - Garmin Xero Trade-Up program
Some of you remember when I did this Trade-Up program for MagentoSpeeds from V2 -> V3. Since most of use only need a single well functioning ballistic chronograph I am offering a trade-in for your existing working ballistic Chronograph towards a Garmin Xero C1 Pro Ballistic Chronograph. First...
www.snipershide.com
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