Sidearms & Scatterguns OFFICIAL: Ruger released a 5.7x28mm pistol. IT IS AVAILABLE.

[Blue Sky Country]

Predawn email alerts always yield interesting things. Today's edition:

Ruger MAY BE unveiling a handgun chambered in 5.7 FN... Post first appeared on Reddit's r/guns sub-board written by someone who proclaimed himself an 'industry insider'. A screenshot of the post is now making rounds.

DISCUSS...

My personal opinion? On one hand, it looks and sounds fun as all hell. And if true, this Ruger edition may just be cheaper than the current FN pistol in circulation that chambers that same cartridge. And it is not that hard to reload them suckers with 40 grain Hornady VMAX. The gun definitely does not look like it will be an EDC choice for most folks, but plinking the hell out of shit with laser-like straight trajectory sounds pretty dope. With small-medium game potential as well.

On the other hand, 5.7x28mm is a cartridge that has pretty much been 'shelved' by the shooting world for the last several years. It is simply not promoted as much, and it is becoming more of a niche caliber that PS-90 shooters are keeping active. Thus, creating an entire set of tooling and infrastructure for a 5.7 handgun may not be feasible for Ruger's financial success and I am sure the company's decision makers can see that too. But who knows?

What do you think? April Fools is still pretty far off, but the 2020 SHOT Show is right around the corner...

 

[308pirate]

Striker fired pistol + manual safety = mental retardation

 

[Ravenworks]

I'm not ready to give up my FN yet, but if someone was to make another Five-Seven I'd want it to be Ruger

 

[Long Range 338]

Pair it up with a carbine version and maybe they can resurrect the 5.7

 

[Blue Sky Country]

Looks REALLY slick and awesome so far...

The Ruger-57 is NOT a rumor. It is confirmed and it is available at retailers already.

Ruger official data and info sheet.

Page Not Found

ruger.com

40 grain VMAX at 1800 FPS = 287 foot pounds of KE. And that is just ballpark numbers. The FPS can even go higher and bring the FPE to similar levels as a standard 9mm or .45 ACP defensive loading coupled with highly frangible VMAX performance.

And of course, the trademark rock-solid packaging and transport that is supplied with all Ruger firearms...

 

[Supersubes]

Certainly prettier than the five seven. Shows out of stock at a distributor I use. $799 MSRP

 

[Blue Sky Country]

Certainly prettier than the five seven. Shows out of stock at a distributor I use. $799 MSRP

Indeed. I am really digging the looks of this pistol. The FN looked like the whole thing is made out of foam. The Ruger-57 has a basic outline that might remind one of the Kel-Tec PMR-30, another highly popular plinker which can also serve dutifully as a serious defensive handgun if called upon.

Many retailers might be showing OOS's due to small initial shipments from the mfg. as they are pretty recent releases. That price alone gives me the motivation to wait patiently for stock to come back...

 

[Jethro3898]

I hope that the release of this pistol helps bring the cost of 5.7 ammo down.

 

[Wyzrd]

Looks like a fun plinking pistol; Optics ready, cheaper than the FN, but other than that... meh. I’ll stick to 9 and 45 for my pistols.

 

[Bigfatcock]

I’m interested in it. It’s nice to see another 5.7 on the market, and this one looks better than the FN.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

I hope that the release of this pistol helps bring the cost of 5.7 ammo down.

Want to know how I know you got a PS-90?

 

[Cerwinski]

I wish the barrel was threaded...

 

[308pirate]

40 grain VMAX at 1800 FPS = 287 foot pounds of KE. And that is just ballpark numbers. The FPS can even go higher and bring the FPE to similar levels as a standard 9mm or .45 ACP defensive loading coupled with highly frangible VMAX performance.

You can't seriously think this is a viable self defense option............

And of course, the trademark rock-solid packaging and transport that is supplied with all Ruger firearms...

You mean a shitty injection molded plastic box that only looks like a Pelican with an even cheaper plastic liner?

LOL

 

[perttime]

...

40 grain VMAX at 1800 FPS = 287 foot pounds of KE. And that is just ballpark numbers. The FPS can even go higher and bring the FPE to similar levels as a standard 9mm or .45 ACP defensive loading coupled with highly frangible VMAX performance.
...

Would be a cool toy if a Roni conversion appears for it.

 

[steve123]

If you've ever shot small game at 50Y with a 22mag, darn near blows em half?! Always thought of what one of those things would do to my insides at PB!

Plus soft body armor penetration with the 27gr at 2700 fps or so.

Follow up speed with the low recoil/muzzle flip is blistering! Think PMR30 with some weight to tame it even more.

Except that 5.7 is a pain to handload, and factory ammo is a bit expensive, I like the cartridge.

 

[RTH1800]

Handloads better than .22 mag. ?

 

[Steelhead]

You can't seriously think this is a viable self defense option............

I have a nephew who trains SF guys with the FN Five Seven and he carries one for his CCW and when he's gone over to the sandbox. He swears by them. So the round must have some validity to self defense if we still have various units using it. I believe the Secret Service still uses it.

 

[RTH1800]

Speed kills. It’s deadly. No question.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

You can't seriously think this is a viable self defense option............





You mean a shitty injection molded plastic box that only looks like a Pelican with an even cheaper plastic liner?

LOL

I currently do not own any pistol or carbine in 5.7x28. However, from comparisons that I have done upon ballistics and distance tests when I had the chance to shoot a 5.7, I would say that it is sufficiently enough to do a job of incapacitating a threat with the right load and bullet type.

I think of that cartridge as the contemporary version of the 7.63 Mauser and the 7.62x25 Tokarev. And both of these are more than reliable during their day. Where they may lack in weight and cross-sectional mass, they got speed. A standard 40 grainer from a 5.7x28 at 2300 or so FPS will probably do a number on soft body armor as well.

Ballistic test on watermelon with both a SS192-JHP bullet (the owner still had some) and current production SS197-SR yielded some dramatic exit and back burst from the watermelon upon impact. My .36 caliber Colt 1851 at it's full potential with a 80 grain ball at 1180 FPS, the control that we used to establish as the baseline for a smallbore defensive load, did not do as much as the 5.7 on a melon of the same size. Took a big chunk out of it front and back still, but not as dramatic as both 5.7 loadings. (If anyone is wondering why I did not compare the 5.7 to lets say, a 9x19mm and instead, used a 160 year old black powder loading that emulated a very hot .380 ACP and a standard .38 Special at best, it is because the .36 can be considered the originator of all subsequent military duty smallbores, and I also happened to have one conveniently carried with me at the time of the testing).

To conclude, if the 5.7 is all I had, I will carry it without hesitation. Even more so in this latest Ruger platform with a 20 round magazine. I am among 4 other guys I know in my old N-SSA group who can trust our safety to an old .36 cap and ball and shoot pretty darn good with it, so I would definitely own and carry a 5.7 comfortably as well. A mass shooter or any other type of active lethal threat getting lasered in the head or lungs with a 5.7-SS197 is not going to be going far.

 

[308pirate]

I currently do not own any pistol or carbine in 5.7x28. However, from comparisons that I have done upon ballistics and distance tests when I had the chance to shoot a 5.7, I would say that it is sufficiently enough to do a job of incapacitating a threat with the right load and bullet type.

I think of that cartridge as the contemporary version of the 7.63 Mauser and the 7.62x25 Tokarev. And both of these are more than reliable during their day. Where they may lack in weight and cross-sectional mass, they got speed. A standard 40 grainer from a 5.7x28 at 2300 or so FPS will probably do a number on soft body armor as well.

Ballistic test on watermelon with both a SS192-JHP bullet (the owner still had some) and current production SS197-SR yielded some dramatic exit and back burst from the watermelon upon impact. My .36 caliber Colt 1851 at it's full potential with a 80 grain ball at 1180 FPS, the control that we used to establish as the baseline for a smallbore defensive load, did not do as much as the 5.7 on a melon of the same size. Took a big chunk out of it front and back still, but not as dramatic as both 5.7 loadings. (If anyone is wondering why I did not compare the 5.7 to lets say, a 9x19mm and instead, used a 160 year old black powder loading that emulated a very hot .380 ACP and a standard .38 Special at best, it is because the .36 can be considered the originator of all subsequent military duty smallbores, and I also happened to have one conveniently carried with me at the time of the testing).

To conclude, if the 5.7 is all I had, I will carry it without hesitation. Even more so in this latest Ruger platform with a 20 round magazine. I am among 4 other guys I know in my old N-SSA group who can trust our safety to an old .36 cap and ball and shoot pretty darn good with it, so I would definitely own and carry a 5.7 comfortably as well. A mass shooter or any other type of active lethal threat getting lasered in the head or lungs with a 5.7-SS197 is not going to be going far.

Ask yourself why no single police department, or specialized unit within any police department, in this country has ever chosen anything chambered in 5.7X28

Do you have any links to documented calibrated gel testing that complies with FBI standards?

 

[308pirate]

Speed kills. It’s deadly. No question.

LOL, our resident ballistician has spoken

 

[308pirate]

I have a nephew who trains SF guys with the FN Five Seven and he carries one for his CCW and when he's gone over to the sandbox. He swears by them. So the round must have some validity to self defense if we still have various units using it. I believe the Secret Service still uses it.

As an armor penetrator, yes. As anything else, no.

 

[NGCSUGrad09]

There's a reason the P90 and MP7 have fallen out of favor for a first line carbine/SMG replacement (USSS, DEVGRU, etc). While immensely fun and easy to shoot, you need to dump an entire mag to have a stopping effect. With the right ammo the pills will penetrate armor, but that doesn't account for what they do when they get through.

This should be a fun camp type pistol or range toy though. I'm interested in shooting one.

 

[Supersubes]

Handguns are boring and stupid, so anything that spices things up is good imo.

 

[W54/XM-388]

Striker fired pistol + manual safety = mental retardation

I'd strongly disagree.
Each to their own, but if I'm carrying a semi-auto, I prefer it to have a safety if at all possible.
A lot of makers have realized that (such as SIG) and given that option.

Then you don't have to have the "Israeli carry" debate with glock lovers.

 

[Steelhead]

In the past year, I've casually studied this round. There appears to be an equal amount of published data that both supports the terminal effectiveness of the round and data that shows its ineffectiveness. With Ruger entering the market and CMMG recently introducing their Banshee pistol that uses the FN pistol magazine, plus Federal starting to produce a round with their Gold Dot bullet, I think it will be interesting to see where this round goes from here.

 

[308pirate]

Then you don't have to have the "Israeli carry" debate with glock lovers.

I'm not even sure what that means........

Anyway, any handgun with a manual safety falls in the same category as guns with aftermarket nitride, value = $0

 

[RTH1800]

Clearly neither the firearm nor the caliber meets your exalted standards for the targets you shoot at 6 feet. You apparently have no experience with either. Why are you on this thread?

I have no experience with the firearm but did own two FN’s and shot over 1000 rds through them. Quite a few kills on bobcats and coyotes. They kill very well. Accuracy was so so for my use. I moved them on.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

Ask yourself why no single police department, or specialized unit within any police department, in this country has ever chosen anything chambered in 5.7X28

Do you have any links to documented calibrated gel testing that complies with FBI standards?

The US Secret Service actually uses the 5.7x28, in the P-90. Not sure about handguns, but a hot SS190-Duty loading complete with steel or tungsten penetrator will not be anything to sneeze at. The SS190 seems to be specially designed for taking out vehicle-born threats. A full burst from a P-90 will shred an unarmored truck or van and all of it's occupants pretty good. Mexican narco cops also use the 5.7 out of the carbine. FNH also produces a couple of other loadings that are not available to the civilian market either.

Pretty good discussion about the Secret Service's use of this caliber in this (somewhat dated) thread here...

Why's the Secret Service using the 5.7X28 P90

Doing a little leisure reading on the Secret Service, I find the P90 figures prominently in photos of the emergency response team. There's been plenty of debate about the 5.7X28 on these boards. Anyone know anything about the Secret Service's decision process on the P90?

www.thehighroad.org

 

[W54/XM-388]

Ask yourself why no single police department, or specialized unit within any police department, in this country has ever chosen anything chambered in 5.7X28

Do you have any links to documented calibrated gel testing that complies with FBI standards?

Well a very bad guy named Nidal Hasan used a FN in that caliber to kill a lot of decent folks very quickly and the ballistics reports on the victims indicated that the impacts of those rounds had a significant stopping effect on the victims.

I'm not going to say it's the best round ever, especially not the overly bulky and overly priced FN version, but at average handgun ranges, that round seems more than enough to do anything a 9mm will do.

 

[Ravenworks]

Ask yourself why no single police department, or specialized unit within any police department, in this country has ever chosen anything chambered in 5.7X28

Do you have any links to documented calibrated gel testing that complies with FBI standards?

There are a few PD'S that carry it,( Per -FN) and no I am not going to go looking.
There's more people that utilize the platform than you imagine.
When is the last time you saw a pistol that is able to hit its target easily at 75-90 yards?

 

[Blue Sky Country]

Well a very bad guy named Nidal Hasan used a FN in that caliber to kill a lot of decent folks very quickly and the ballistics reports on the victims indicated that the impacts of those rounds had a significant stopping effect on the victims.

I'm not going to say it's the best round ever, especially not the overly bulky and overly priced FN version, but at average handgun ranges, that round seems more than enough to do anything a 9mm will do.

I almost mentioned Nidal Hassan and his abhorrent deeds several times on this thread but restrained myself because I did not want to use the deaths of these soldiers that he had murdered in cold blood as fodder for a caliber/ballistics discussion. To me personally, it would be almost akin to using findings from experiments done on prisoners in Auschwitz or by the IJA Unit-731 in northeast China to complete a medical degree thesis. Just my personal feelings though.

But you are certainly right, Nidal Hassan had used a FN Five-Seven handgun with SS197 ammo and the results had been pretty gruesome. We had a long and very heated thread on Arfcom about it right afterward. One of the victims was a 28 year old reservist who was full term pregnant and was about to give birth. The POS had shot her multiple times through the abdomen and several of the rounds fragged and produced multiple wound channels as they exited. The same effect was observed on the bodies of the other victims. One of the medics who treated the wounded and processed the casualties had claimed that the wound trails produced by that round resembled rifle wounds. So yes, the 5.7 is pretty devastating, especially at close range and on unarmored targets with frangible ammo. On a second note, WHY that son of a bitch terrorist is still breathing oxygen and drawing from the taxpayer dime is beyond me. Further insult to the very ideals of this country that it had to take an OFF-BASE civilian police officer to finally take his ass down and not an armed member of the armed forces right on site... He was shot in the ass and gut though, and to my knowledge, has to shit in a bag for the rest of any days he got left. Hope it is painful to the extreme, every fucking second...

 

[lr123]

Ask yourself why no single police department, or specialized unit within any police department, in this country has ever chosen anything chambered in 5.7X28

Do you have any links to documented calibrated gel testing that complies with FBI standards?

Interesting that you mention this a local FFL and big LE dealer just took in a couple FN 5.7 LE trade ins this past week. From the condition of them they didn't appear to have ever been carried and probably shot very little.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

There are a few PD'S that carry it,( Per -FN) and no I am not going to go looking.
There's more people that utilize the platform than you imagine.
When is the last time you saw a pistol that is able to hit its target easily at 75-90 yards?

----------
When is the last time you saw a pistol that is able to hit its target easily at 75-90 yards?
----------

Springfield Town Square, Missouri. July 21, 1865...

Some of Joseph Wheeler's troopers also used their Leech & Rigdon "Confederate Colts" to make 100+ yard fatal shots at full gallop when they raided the Army of the Cumberland's supply trains during the Battle of Stones River, 1862.

The sights on both Colt's Patent guns and the unlicensed Confederate versions are all regulated to strike POA at 75 yards without any modifications. My new-in-box Pietta .36 Colt cornholed a paper plate dead center at 75 yards on the first test shot. That is my current carry gun right now.

ETA: The success and legendary performance of the .36 cap and ball warhorse is one of the clearest illustrations of how smaller bullets can compensate their low mass with much higher speeds to achieve the same terminal performance as the big bores. The .36 Navy Colt with it's full power loading at around 1200 FPS, using the finest sporting powder available in the 1860's, may have been the highest velocity pistol load in existence until the 7.63 Mauser was introduced in 1896.

 

[308pirate]

Well a very bad guy named Nidal Hasan used a FN in that caliber to kill a lot of decent folks very quickly and the ballistics reports on the victims indicated that the impacts of those rounds had a significant stopping effect on the victims.

I'm not going to say it's the best round ever, especially not the overly bulky and overly priced FN version, but at average handgun ranges, that round seems more than enough to do anything a 9mm will do.

Exceptions do not disprove the rule

 

[308pirate]

The US Secret Service actually uses the 5.7x28, in the P-90. Not sure about handguns, but a hot SS190-Duty loading complete with steel or tungsten penetrator will not be anything to sneeze at. The SS190 seems to be specially designed for taking out vehicle-born threats. A full burst from a P-90 will shred an unarmored truck or van and all of it's occupants pretty good. Mexican narco cops also use the 5.7 out of the carbine. FNH also produces a couple of other loadings that are not available to the civilian market either.

Pretty good discussion about the Secret Service's use of this caliber in this (somewhat dated) thread here...

Why's the Secret Service using the 5.7X28 P90

Doing a little leisure reading on the Secret Service, I find the P90 figures prominently in photos of the emergency response team. There's been plenty of debate about the 5.7X28 on these boards. Anyone know anything about the Secret Service's decision process on the P90?

www.thehighroad.org

I don't know. Some guy on post #23 says USSS is moving them off first line service. Now who to believe?

And even if you're right, that's not a pistol and it's a very specialized role they serve.

Wanna carry one, knock yourself out convincing yourself that it's a great choice.

 

[RTH1800]

The only “rule” is in your mind.

 

[ScarlettRed]

I just recently got a CMMG Banshee 300 in 5.7 with the short barrel. 5" barrel, so it should perform close to the Ruger pistol. I got is as a farm "tractor" gun. I have mixed feelings about it but am rather impressed. 1" groups at 100y, extremely flat shooting, low recoil. Just a real handy gun. However, I have shot a few p.dogs with it off my UTV at 25-45y and not one exploded. My 17 hmr rifle always rips them up at that range. So, I wonder if the velocity is too slow to expand or the bullet is too tough and requires more depth penetration to perform.

 

[Supersubes]

I just recently got a CMMG Banshee 300 in 5.7 with the short barrel. 5" barrel, so it should perform close to the Ruger pistol. I got is as a farm "tractor" gun. I have mixed feelings about it but am rather impressed. 1" groups at 100y, extremely flat shooting, low recoil. Just a real handy gun. However, I have shot a few p.dogs with it off my UTV at 25-45y and not one exploded. My 17 hmr rifle always rips them up at that range. So, I wonder if the velocity is too slow to expand or the bullet is too tough and requires more depth penetration to perform.

You didn’t mention what types of ammo you’ve tried.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

I just recently got a CMMG Banshee 300 in 5.7 with the short barrel. 5" barrel, so it should perform close to the Ruger pistol. I got is as a farm "tractor" gun. I have mixed feelings about it but am rather impressed. 1" groups at 100y, extremely flat shooting, low recoil. Just a real handy gun. However, I have shot a few p.dogs with it off my UTV at 25-45y and not one exploded. My 17 hmr rifle always rips them up at that range. So, I wonder if the velocity is too slow to expand or the bullet is too tough and requires more depth penetration to perform.

Are you shooting commercial SS197-SR rounds? These leave the barrel at around 1800 FPS. That is not nearly tickling the full potential of this cartridge, as the "commercially banned" loadings can achieve almost 2400 FPS. If you can, download or obtain a load chart for this round and work up your own loads until you get desired performance. For small, light bullets, the key to effective performance is getting them going fast. And I mean FAST...

 

[ScarlettRed]

28g fnh rounds with blue tips

 

[TACC]

I'm still not convinced I need one, or have a decent reason to want one at this point. I am curious to see if there are any bugs in it.

 

[myronman3]

The 5.7 holds zero interest for me, and ruger autoloaders really do nothing for me. They have a few decent rimfires, but other than that, i have no interest.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

I'm still not convinced I need one, or have a decent reason to want one at this point. I am curious to see if there are any bugs in it.

I REALLY want to rent one and do a range report on it, after putting it through various tests. The commercial "civilian" loadings of this cartridge are pretty tame by all standards. Getting serviceable performance would be a relatively simple, but calculating project for the handloader.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

28g fnh rounds with blue tips

Yep, those are 197's...

 

[Supersubes]

I'm still not convinced I need one, or have a decent reason to want one at this point. I am curious to see if there are any bugs in it.

There’s a bunch of YouTube reviews on it.

 

[ScarlettRed]

Yep, those are 197's...

Dang, that is a bit slow. May have to look into loading those.

 

[E. Bryant]

I'm going to do that thing where I claim to be disinterested now, and then go buy one in a few months and proclaim it to be the greatest thing ever.

I don't see it as much more than a range toy and occasional varmint-killer, but it'll be fun.

 

[perttime]

I just recently got a CMMG Banshee 300 in 5.7 with the short barrel. 5" barrel, so it should perform close to the Ruger pistol. I got is as a farm "tractor" gun. I have mixed feelings about it but am rather impressed. 1" groups at 100y, extremely flat shooting, low recoil. Just a real handy gun. However, I have shot a few p.dogs with it off my UTV at 25-45y and not one exploded. My 17 hmr rifle always rips them up at that range. So, I wonder if the velocity is too slow to expand or the bullet is too tough and requires more depth penetration to perform.

Looks like a cool gun. I wonder what it would do with a bit more barrel. 12" perhaps.

 

[ScarlettRed]

CMMG makes an 8". 10-12" would be pretty nice though.