Gunsmithing Problems w/ custom rifle

[agsf2010]

Had this gun put together recently and now am having problems... I have shot this gun about 50 times with different optics and this has never happened before but I shot it twice this morning and the second case was stuck in the action. After further inspection the side of the case was blown out in an almost perfect circle. Let me know what you guys think of this one.

<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/user/sfotiades/media/photo1.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy219/sfotiades/photo1.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo photo1.jpg"/></a>

<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/user/sfotiades/media/photo3.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy219/sfotiades/photo3.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo photo3.jpg"/></a>

 

[Nortex]

What did the other cases look like? Was the brass new?

 

[300sniper]

Do you have pictures of other fired cases from that rifle?

 

[agsf2010]

Two different sides of the casing. Brass was new Winchester factory loads I didn't want to put any reloads through it until it was on paper.

<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/user/sfotiades/media/2-1.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy219/sfotiades/2-1.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 2-1.jpg"/></a>

<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/user/sfotiades/media/1-1.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy219/sfotiades/1-1.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 1-1.jpg"/></a>

 

[Elite_KG]

Man I don't know how it can happen, but is that hole the same diameter as the pressure vent in the receiver?

 

[agsf2010]

It looks to be pretty close to that size or the screw holes for the base but I don't know why all of the sudden things would change and start popping holes.

 

[Turd in the Pool]

It looks to be pretty close to that size or the screw holes for the base but I don't know why all of the sudden things would change and start popping holes.

Try using your eyeball. I'd bet if you look in the chamber you'll see a hole in the vicinity of the front base screw :-(

 

[agsf2010]

Try using your eyeball. I'd bet if you look in the chamber you'll see a hole in the vicinity of the front base screw :-(

With that being said if that is the case is the action done for...?

 

[Ballista One]

Is the front screw to long? Not long enough to prevent the bolt from locking but causing the issue when the case obturates.

 

[300sniper]

Try using your eyeball. I'd bet if you look in the chamber you'll see a hole in the vicinity of the front base screw :-(

No, I bet he doesn't.

Granted, there may be, and probably is a mark in the chamber now from this but that wasn't the cause. This has nothing to do with screws touching the bolt or screw holes in the chamber. Either the chamber is out of spec or the brass is. The brass appears bulged way too much in the body. That is why I'd like to see pictures of other cases that didn't sneeze.

Edit: The bulge may be deceiving in the picture also. It may have just been a bad piece of brass.

 

[agsf2010]

Is the front screw to long? Not long enough to prevent the bolt from locking but causing the issue when the case obturates.

That is a good question. I haven't looked at that one yet but I will. Thanks for the tip

 

[nso123]

I know it is probably not the case here, but does that not look like it is about the size of the scribe mark left on brass that was used in a pressure test barrel?

 

[buffybuster]

Try using your eyeball. I'd bet if you look in the chamber you'll see a hole in the vicinity of the front base screw :-(

For this to have occurred, the scope base hole would have to been drilled AFTER the barrel was fitted and then DRILLED all the way or very near all the way to the barrel shank to the chamber. I've never heard of that happening......

 

[jonaddis84]

Agree with 300, the web of both cases appear to be way blown out. Looks like the rear of the chamber is oversize, maybe the whole chamber hard to say. Or the bolt nose counter bore is too deep.

I don't see how the base screw is in question here, unless the Smith for whatever dumbass reason decided to drill down through it and just over shot the depth by a quarter inch.

Either way, that is one weird failure.

What caliber?

If you want it looked at feel free to send it over, can check it out and see what's going on. Though I'd get with the builder first and get his opinion.

Sent from my GS5 on Tapatalk

 

[Turd in the Pool]

With that being said if that is the case is the action done for...?

No and the bbl could be salvaged if you don't mind a plug in the hole.

300 and the rest. Nothing else could cause this. Think about it!

 

[300sniper]

No and the bbl could be salvaged if you don't mind a plug in the hole.

300 and the rest. Nothing else could cause this. Think about it!

Um, yes, something else could cause this. Think about it!

Edit: a hole in the wall of the chamber and there were 50 trouble free rounds fired? Right!

 

[300sniper]

Again, the picture may be deceiving but it really looks like there is two different tapers on the case body and I still think there is too much bulge in front of the case head.

 

[Turd in the Pool]

Um, yes, something else could cause this. Think about it!

Edit: a hole in the wall of the chamber and there were 50 trouble free rounds fired? Right!

Plug let go.

Note the imprint of the hole in the pic. Top, bottom and rt side

 

[Turd in the Pool]

Again, the picture may be deceiving but it really looks like there is two different tapers on the case body and I still think there is too much bulge in front of the case head.

Please point out the 2 tapers. I'm going blind but I can still see a little;-)

Bulge is typical of a factory chamber.

 

[jonaddis84]

Plug let go.

Note the imprint of the hole in the pic. Top, bottom and rt side

What plug is this you speak of?

I believe the shape of the failure is an anomaly due to a weakness in that particular piece of brass, betting if you take a unfired round and hand load it into the chamber that you can wiggle the base of it back and forth quite a bit.

Sent from my GS5 on Tapatalk

 

[agbm]

Pretty strange, but just my .02 could just be a bad piece of brass. You did state you recently just put it together, go ahead a tear down to recheck it. Bore scope time!!!

 

[jonaddis84]

Please point out the 2 tapers. I'm going blind but I can still see a little;-)

Bulge is typical of a factory chamber.

That is not normal. it appears the section that blew out is probably .1" diameter oversize

Also the case looks very straight walled, like it is almost that diameter all the way to the shoulder, hard to say for sure on that.

This could have been caused simply by goofing up on pre boring and going too big with it.

Sent from my GS5 on Tapatalk

 

[agbm]

That is not normal. it appears the section that blew out is probably .1" diameter oversize

Also the case looks very straight walled, like it is almost that diameter all the way to the shoulder, hard to say for sure on that.

This could have been caused simply by goofing up on pre boring and going too big with it.

Sent from my GS5 on Tapatalk

Great eye, I see it now. Also All the pieces of brass look the same, I would say do you think if he has a wilson case gauge drop the cases in to see if they fit? Not sure if the brass was on 1 firing or what.

 

[Turd in the Pool]

What plug is this you speak of?

Strictly speculation of course but I'm betting the person that drilled into the chamber plugged the hole with a screw or lead and it let go. You can see the area around the hole shows a void in the chamber.

OP could put this to bed if he'd look in the chamber and post. OR!!!! shoot it again and tell us what happens.

 

[Turd in the Pool]

That is not normal. it appears the section that blew out is probably .1" diameter oversize

Also the case looks very straight walled, like it is almost that diameter all the way to the shoulder, hard to say for sure on that.

????????????????????? What? Go to a range. You will see this all day long. I thought I was going blind. This is clearly a 308 with a normal taper. I would bet the "bulge" is no more than .015 or .02"

 

[300sniper]

Please point out the 2 tapers. I'm going blind but I can still see a little;-)

Bulge is typical of a factory chamber.

 

[Turd in the Pool]

Good eye 300! I missed that. I'd guess the secondary taper was done polishing out the plug.

 

[agsf2010]

Took it to a local smith today and apparently the front base hole was drilled out to accommodate a larger screw. When they drilled it out the went all the way through the barrel into the action. Looks like a get to find a new barrel....

 

[Lumpy Grits]

The dum-shit that drill'd the hole, buys you a new bbl!
LG

 

[Elite_KG]

That's about what I figured. Had to be a hole. After my first comment I remembered the front base screw is actually in the threads where the barrel screws in. I can't believe any "gun smith" would drill though. Is the front scope base screw still in place? If so, the must have been enough pressure differential to pierce the case while equalizing the pressure form the case side to the scope base screw hole side. There might be brass in that hole too if the screw is still in place.

 

[xringaccuracy]

The dum-shit that drill'd the hole, buys you a new bbl!
LG

Seems to be a new one in business everyday.

 

[agbm]

Just talk to Gunsmith that did it, accidents do happen some time. I just hate they did not let you know it got drilled!!!! I'm just thankful no one got hurt or injured.

 

[300sniper]

Took it to a local smith today and apparently the front base hole was drilled out to accommodate a larger screw. When they drilled it out the went all the way through the barrel into the action. Looks like a get to find a new barrel....

Alright, I've got to eat crow on that. Never in a million years would I have expected that to have happened. My bad and I apologize to Turd in the Pool.

 

[buffybuster]

Took it to a local smith today and apparently the front base hole was drilled out to accommodate a larger screw. When they drilled it out the went all the way through the barrel into the action. Looks like a get to find a new barrel....

That is a new level of Stupid. I didn't think that level of incompetence was possible in gun plumbing. Get your money back and find another plumber!

The chamber looked slightly oversized too.

If there is enough shank, the barrel could be setback and rechambered, but the plumber owes you the money for the barrel.

 

[BIPMaster]

Well damn. I would definitely be raising some hell over that kind of shoddy work and the fact that the smith tried to cover it up rather than admit his mistake.

 

[Turd in the Pool]

Alright, I've got to eat crow on that. Never in a million years would I have expected that to have happened. My bad and I apologize to Turd in the Pool.

No apology needed but thanks. I just couldn't see anything else that would cause it ;-)

bbuster, after spending over 25 yrs on the bench in a retail gunshop, I can say I've pretty much seen it all. There used to be some real hacks working in Austin. Fortunately guys that let this kind of stuff out don't last too long in the buis. ;-)

 

[Layton]

Well damn. I would definitely be raising some hell over that kind of shoddy work and the fact that the smith tried to cover it up rather than admit his mistake.

I guess I would question did he even realize what he did given he actually did it to begin with. Make sense?

L

 

[BIPMaster]

I guess I would question did he even realize what he did given he actually did it to begin with. Make sense?

L

Good point. I read the hypothesis that there was a plug in the hole that blew out and took it as the gospel truth.

 

[powdahound76]

I dont know crap about gunsmithing. I have however drilled a metric shit ton of shaving/chips worth of holes. One would think a guy would know how thick the material he was drilling was and set an apprpriate depth stop, achievable on any drill, but easy as pie on a mill or (shudder) even a drill press.
Suppose he didnt know how deep he drilled and left a little skin of steel there at the bottom. Several applications of significant pressure and "pop". Maybe?
Scary either way. These are the things that keep me from having "guys who have worked at a lot of shops, but want to do it themselves" work on my stuff.

 

[Ledzep]

I dont know crap about gunsmithing. I have however drilled a metric shit ton of shaving/chips worth of holes. One would think a guy would know how thick the material he was drilling was and set an apprpriate depth stop, achievable on any drill, but easy as pie on a mill or (shudder) even a drill press.
Suppose he didnt know how deep he drilled and left a little skin of steel there at the bottom. Several applications of significant pressure and "pop". Maybe?
Scary either way. These are the things that keep me from having "guys who have worked at a lot of shops, but want to do it themselves" work on my stuff.

That's what I was thinking as well. Drilled too deep with the barrel installed, but not all the way through. First several rounds were no biggy, but the week wall beneath the screw hole eventually pressed up and popped through.

I've heard of it before, from home gunsmiths, and one guy who was a "gunsmith" that taught Sig Sauer armorer courses for the free LEO/MIL NRA courses near DC at their headquarters. "I was drilling and tapping a scope mount hole for an 870 sniper rifle (I assume he meant m700 but who knows, probably all a BS story), and accidentally went just a few thousandths too deep and popped through the chamber..." I will never purchase a Sig product because I make the assumption they give (gave?) that guy money.

To the OP, make the gunsmith buy you a new barrel at the very least.

 

[Turd in the Pool]

Purely speculation so take it fwiw. I would guess the driller went all of the way thru and knew it. Hence the 2nd taper 300sniper pointed out. Speculation that the driller polished his plug flush with the chamber creating it.

The only way to know is to look at the hole. I suspect he could have drilled shy as Ledzep suggests but I have doubts. The imprint of the hole in the case suggests threads.

In the spirit of the 460 Rowland thread, how come no one is asking who the driller is? ;-)

 

[Terry Cross]

IF the "driller" tried to plug the hole and blend it back in around the chamber surface . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . There will be all types of drama if some poor unsuspecting soul attempts to remove that barrel and there is any of the plug extending into the juncture of the barrel threads.

I picture a train wreck with everything galling and ripping threads out of the receiver.

You need to have the involved parties replace the barrel right now. I would even want pics of the internal receiver threads before they install a fresh barrel to make sure they aren't giving you a rifle back with compromised threads.

I normally wouldn't promote such paranoia and overwatch but this sample of their work warrants it.

 

[siscoe308]

unbelievable, its a wonder that ppl dont get hurt more often

 

[Kells81]

He needs to have whatever Hack did this refund his money, buy him and new barrel, and the OP needs to send it to a reputable smith. There is no way I would let this guy touch my rifle again.

 

[HodgdonExtreme]

Un-fucking-believable

 

[Layton]

I still bet he didn't realize what he did or he wouldn't of done it to begin with. So I bet there's not a plug there. If there was it would have to of taken out the screw above it to create that kind of void to cause that kind of blowout.

L

 

[Kells81]

I still bet he didn't realize what he did or he wouldn't of done it to begin with. So I bet there's not a plug there. If there was it would have to of taken out the screw above it to create that kind of void to cause that kind of blowout.

L

The only way he wouldn't know it happened is if he farmed out the work. Either way its been pointed out about the fired cases being wonky towards the base which I think someone posted about maybe trying to polish the new plug into place.

 

[Layton]

Maybe, but where did the material go that filled that void previously? It had to flow somewhere. Once pressure builds there's only one direction for that to go and that's out. That screw is still in place so that material would of had to flow sideways if I'm picturing this correctly. Along the receiver/barrel threads possibly? Guess we won't know till they try to spin the barrel off.


L

 

[Jkob60]

My question is this: Why did he even have to D&T the receiver hole in the first place, stripped out maybe? When I first saw this post, my initial reaction was that he had indeed drilled through to the chamber.

Jim

 

[agsf2010]

They had stripped out the front screw, that is why they had to D&T the receiver. The guy that owns the shop is first class he just had a goon working for him, which has sense been fired. He is buying me a new barrel and making it right. Nothing but good things to say about the owner which will remain nameless because he is making it right.