Ruger SFAR small frame 308, 6.8 pounds

[45-90]

I don't understand why we have to guess the load, but here are the 150gr .308 loads on Speer's website. One breaks 3k in a 24" barrel, 52.8gr of PP2000MR, is that what you're saying your load is?
View attachment 8222359

Thanks for the parts list on the AR-10, it looks like it would cost me about $1,700 to get all the pieces, but that's not too bad given the weight.

If you look it up you will find the answers for yourself and know that several powders will get 3000 fps in 308 with 150 & 155 gr bullets...including an old manual that gets there with Varget, at least their lot of powder and test barrel. And you would not take my word for it anyway, and sharing information is mostly a waste of time on these sites...opinions seem to outweigh facts.
My total cost for the upper was $1150. Shop the sales, like labor day, free shipping, close outs, I saw deals and heavy discounts while browsing through adds for several months. Even made a phone call to get an additional $50 discount, cause the add said call for details. This setup is functioning 100% with no issues of the small frame Ruger, or tearing up brass, and is getting half moa to one moa 5 shot groups with 3 zippy loads... and working on more. It feels like carrying an AR 15...plus there is a host of parts for the AR 10 platform to build it your way...light or extra sauce like a berger,.. if you choose to do so.
Since you were interested in it enough to look it up...here is the exact chronograph reading just like I said, 155 Lapua 2900 average fps. And I checked primer pockets on the LC brass...still good. But this was not one of the accurate loads, just a max load to see what it would do...the 168 gr Berger, the 150 gr Gold Dot, and the 208 ELDM 2442 fps were .5 to 1 moa for 5 shots at 100 yds, with max powder charges. Have some new 177 SMK and 169 SMK to try, with some different powders...I've used in bolt guns and other AR 10s.

 

[Twinsen]

I'd have to see it to believe you can beat factory ammo by 400fps.

It's about as believable as saying, "My Ruger SFAR works."

 

[MadDuner]

I'd have to see it to believe you can beat factory ammo by 400fps.

It's about as believable as saying, "My Ruger SFAR works."

I would love to show you my SFAR works flawlessly!
I also want to bring my chronograph out the next time I shoot to see what the SuperFormance ammo does in it. My guess is that it’ll be in the 2700 to 2750 FPS range.... but want to see it.

 

[Gtscotty]

I'd have to see it to believe you can beat factory ammo by 400fps.

It's about as believable as saying, "My Ruger SFAR works."

When you sell your new SFAR, I assume you'll include a disclosure in the Ad that it's a broken and dangerous piece of junk right? I might be interested in picking it up for spare parts, assuming it's priced fairly for a non-firing, display only rifle.

 

[45-90]

I'd have to see it to believe you can beat factory ammo by 400fps.

It's about as believable as saying, "My Ruger SFAR works."
There is the load data,... AR 10 16" barrel, ..so load it up... and see for yourself. Factory ammo is beaten all the time in every way... by handloaders.
Your statement says alot...There is so much you do not know... appearing as a lost child in a gigantic forest...and "none so blind, as those who will not see." Typical of many here, and a waste of time to share information. If you saw it you would deny it, especially if you are not capable of accomplishing it.
Your factory ammo is the best...
But I can shoot 9mm AR 15 to over 2600 fps, 358 Win to 3766 fps, or 308 Win 168 gr to 3256 fps, 17 Rem over 4800 fps, or a 6.5 Creedmoor 140 gr RDF to 3152 fps requires hybrid cases...as few examples,...probably beats factory ammo...and many times more than 400 fps...but you know everything...so no further information need to be provided...nothing can beat your factory ammo,..so keep shooting it.
And I hope some of those SFAR Rugers are working to the satisfaction of the buyers, as I find it sad that a major American gun manufacturer would treat customers this way...but several are.
Bill Ruger must be rolling over in his grave...his name and legacy are on the Ruger brand.

 

[LRRPF52]

I just noticed that Suppressed Weapons Systems does integrally-suppressed barrel work for the SFAR:

Might be best to just buy the factory new rifle as a donor, send it to SWS and have them put one of their barrel/suppressors in it.

• Built on Ruger SFAR
• $1850 Barrel/handguard conversion only (customer provides rifle for conversion)
• Rifle and conversion come with SWS 15″Mloc handguard
• Chambered in all 308 family of calibers
• weighs under 7lbs

 

[lash]

I like that.

 

[velocidad247]

I just noticed that Suppressed Weapons Systems does integrally-suppressed barrel work for the SFAR:

Might be best to just buy the factory new rifle as a donor, send it to SWS and have them put one of their barrel/suppressors in it.

• Built on Ruger SFAR
• $1850 Barrel/handguard conversion only (customer provides rifle for conversion)
• Rifle and conversion come with SWS 15″Mloc handguard
• Chambered in all 308 family of calibers
• weighs under 7lbs

For someone that already has the SFAR, this is an option, but better for Ruger to fix the problem under warranty. For someone considering the SFAR think about this: $1050 for the Ruger SFAR and $1850 for integrally-suppressed barrel & hand-guard conversion equals a $2900 rifle. A rifle with a whole list of other problems not accuracy related. Common problems with this rifle: Failure To Function, Extractor Problems, Feeding Issues, Cycling Issues, and Jamming Problems. IMO better to get a rifle like the Daniel Defense DD5 V3 that weighs 8.3 lbs, accurately shoots all types of ammo (1 MOA or better), doesn't have all the other issues and costs around $2600.

 

[Bendigo78]

Yes, insanely minimal clearance for no perceptible purpose whatsoever. I replaced mine, we'll see if I have to "customize" the hand guard to prevent contact.

Ran another 50 rounds through the sfar. 220ish total. Found out that with that sa gas block all the way backed out in vent mode I'm still over gassed. Suppressed or not. Gun cycled fine and brass looked fine. Everything ejects to 1:00. Accuracy started off promising closer to an inch before ending the day at closer to 2 inches. The only thing changed was opening the gas block up. So either it likes more gas or the barrel is getting fouled out. If it shoots better next weekend after cleaning it may get some final finish bullets.

 

[Twinsen]

When you sell your new SFAR, I assume you'll include a disclosure in the Ad that it's a broken and dangerous piece of junk right? I might be interested in picking it up for spare parts, assuming it's priced fairly for a non-firing, display only rifle.

Why do that? People buy busted garbage, never use it, and go online and say it works great. There isn't even a 1% chance the guy that buys the SFAR will ever use it.

But sure, I'll sell it to you for $20. Because it makes sense to take a $1,000 bath on a sale so I can please you.

"Hur hur, ruger fucked you over. I'ma make fun of you now cuz I eat my own father's ass." -Gtscotty, 2023

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Why do that? People buy busted garbage, never use it, and go online and say it works great. There isn't even a 1% chance the guy that buys the SFAR will ever use it.

Wow... Just wow.

 

[Twinsen]

There's a dude on youtube right now with a bunch of sfar videos reviewing it, talking about how great it is and how best to modify it that doesn't have one molecule of carbon on his muzzle brake.

There's a dude on arfcom in the sfar thread talking about how great his is and posted some high res pics where you can clearly see not one piece of brass has ever seen his brass deflector.

There's also a dude on arf that took pics of the pressure signs on his brass that says there's no pressure signs.

People are ODing on copium over these sfars. Just straight lying. Watch Colion Noir's review of it and tell me he wasn't paid.

 

[Gtscotty]

Why do that? People buy busted garbage, never use it, and go online and say it works great. There isn't even a 1% chance the guy that buys the SFAR will ever use it.

But sure, I'll sell it to you for $20. Because it makes sense to take a $1,000 bath on a sale so I can please you.

"Hur hur, ruger fucked you over. I'ma make fun of you now cuz I eat my own father's ass." -Gtscotty, 2023

Ok Bud, I was just confirming that you're a garbage human being. Good luck with that whole whining endlessly and then fucking over someone else the exact same way plan. Lol.

I could go up to $40 btw, let me know.

 

[MadDuner]

There's a dude on youtube right now with a bunch of sfar videos reviewing it, talking about how great it is and how best to modify it that doesn't have one molecule of carbon on his muzzle brake.

There's a dude on arfcom in the sfar thread talking about how great his is and posted some high res pics where you can clearly see not one piece of brass has ever seen his brass deflector.

There's also a dude on arf that took pics of the pressure signs on his brass that says there's no pressure signs.

People are ODing on copium over these sfars. Just straight lying. Watch Colion Noir's review of it and tell me he wasn't paid.

I certainly don't know what the difference is between yours and mine that makes mine work and not yours.
I would still like to meet up and shoot.
You can shoot my SFAR all you want.
No copium required.

Let's go shooting!

 

[Bendigo78]

I think reviewers had to review the sfar like it was an ak or fal. Blasting ball ammo at silhouette steel targets like it's a battle rifle just to be able to say positive things about it. Did it go bang? Check. Did the target go ping? Check. Can I carry it? Check. Does it work with my suppressor? Check. Nobody's picking up the brass to reload. As long as it made it out of the gun, Check.

Rugers problem is that in the last 20 years consumers expectations for AR accuracy has surpassed any other battle rifle. People reload for and expect 1moa from ars. If ruger had held proper qc on their barrels and gas blocks this thread wouldnt exist.

Mines getting a full load of lapping bullets this weekend. Tired of scrubbing blueberry syrup out of it for a week after shooting. Also the accuracy going sideways after 2-3 groups is ridiculous.

 

[lash]

Ok Bud, I was just confirming that you're a garbage human being. Good luck with that whole whining endlessly and then fucking over someone else the exact same way plan. Lol.

I could go up to $40 btw, let me know.

It’s what he does. If I cared enough to search back multiple years, I could show you at least three more threads about items wherein all his experiences sucked ass and the companies sucked ass and everybody else in the world that doesn’t agree is a suck ass. And he never ever shuts up about it until he gets to the the next product that sucks ass.

I’m beginning to think that maybe the problem isn’t everybody else and he just sucks ass.

Now that I think about it, there’s probably a whole bunch of U-tubers that would probably follow his series of problems that suck ass. There’s a market for everything…hmmm…

 

[doubloon]

Ran another 50 rounds through the sfar. 220ish total. Found out that with that sa gas block all the way backed out in vent mode I'm still over gassed. Suppressed or not. Gun cycled fine and brass looked fine. Everything ejects to 1:00. Accuracy started off promising closer to an inch before ending the day at closer to 2 inches. The only thing changed was opening the gas block up. So either it likes more gas or the barrel is getting fouled out. If it shoots better next weekend after cleaning it may get some final finish bullets.

Are you still running the original buffer and spring?

My original SFAR spring is hella heavy compared to my LR-308 spring and my generic AR-15 spring. I had it all written down on a piece of paper that I seem to have misplaced but the SFAR spring is heavier and longer that both the others I just can't remember if the LR spring is the same or shorter than the AR-15 spring. I want to say the LR spring is carbine length to match the carbine length tube but I'll have to measure it again. The SFAR has a rifle length spring in a carbine tube.

The buffer in the LR is also heavier than the SFAR buffer. The SFAR buffer is a standard light AR-15 weight buffer.

 

[doubloon]

I certainly don't know what the difference

I'd take that opportunity if it was convenient for us both. I'd even switch it back to the original gas block for the comparison.

I think reviewers had to review the sfar li

I think reviewers in general just do reviews for the clicks and ratings. And most of the people who click and give good ratings either never buy the product or never use it.

I think you're spot on for what a majority of the reviewers set as the bar (go bang, rarely jams) but more than one of these reviewers have come back after the initial review to say "the gas block fell off" or some other ridiculously stupid problem that didn't happen on the initial run.

Also, most those guys will never see the kind of problems you're seeing because it requires shooting more than a few boxes of ammo to get there.

It’s what he does.

Twinsen is a picky bastard who seems to have a legendary ability to break anything but that doesn't mean all his observations are wrong.

The SFAR problems are real and have been documented by more than one member of this forum, members on other forums and even a few "everything works" type youtube reviewers.

Sure there are a ton of people out there who say their SFAR "works" but I'd bet good money a fair number of those people either have no idea where their brass is ejecting or don't care as long as it cycles or they don't look at their brass at all because the don't reload or "it must be OK since it didn't blow up (this time)". A lot of these people have no idea how the gun is "supposed" to work just like a lot of people on the road thing a little smoke coming out of the exhaust is "normal" or treads completely missing from only one side of a tire is "normal" or any other number of problem signs people ignore because the car still gets them from point A to point B ... today.

 

[MadDuner]

I wonder if the HK forums ever have anybody complaining about mangled brass on their 7.62x51 rifles?

 

[doubloon]

I wonder if the HK forums ever have anybody complaining about mangled brass on their 7.62x51 rifles?

Probably. Anything built to "extract" no matter fkn wat probably mangles brass.

 

[Bendigo78]

Are you still running the original buffer and spring?

My original SFAR spring is hella heavy compared to my LR-308 spring and my generic AR-15 spring. I had it all written down on a piece of paper that I seem to have misplaced but the SFAR spring is heavier and longer that both the others I just can't remember if the LR spring is the same or shorter than the AR-15 spring. I want to say the LR spring is carbine length to match the carbine length tube but I'll have to measure it again. The SFAR has a rifle length spring in a carbine tube.

The buffer in the LR is also heavier than the SFAR buffer. The SFAR buffer is a standard light AR-15 weight buffer.

I'm running the long factory spring and an h2 buffer (4.5oz) factory was 3.0oz.
The lr308s had a 308 carbine buffer that was shorter with 2 weights instead of three. That's how they squeezed it into an ar15 car buffer tube. The sfars buffer tube is .75" longer, I think called an A5.

I used to know all this off the top of my head but I've slept since then. Our state dnr threw a fit over ar pistols for hunting and to fit my grendel in the 26" oal they came up with I had to cut .75" off my buffer tube, rethread, and cut the buffer down to the 308 carbine buffer length.

 

[Bendigo78]

Technically, you should be able to run a ar15 buffer tube and a 308 carbine buffer (I think the two tungsten weight buffers were 3.5oz) and it would have enough room to function. You'd need an extra extra power spring to mimic the original and it would probably have to be a flat wound one to fit compressed in the tube but I dont know if that exists.

I found myself looking at heavy hydraulic buffers today. Nope, gotta get it shooting how I want before I start really messing with it.

The day I see someone selling 12" 8.6 and 308 barrels for it is the day I file the sbr paperwork.

 

[Twinsen]

Ok Bud, I was just confirming that you're a garbage human being. Good luck with that whole whining endlessly and then fucking over someone else the exact same way plan. Lol.

I could go up to $40 btw, let me know.

No, you had the sole intention of being a prick and I returned the favor.

 

[doubloon]

Technically

Ouch, I bought a heavier buffer, 4 oz because that was close to the weight of my LR buffer ... maybe should have bought heavier.

Sounds like it's going to be more work than I anticipated based on what you've done so far. Still over gassed at full bleed ... I wonder what happens if you just remove the set screw entirely.

Makes me wonder if it's just going to be a nightmare to tame that original 1/8"+ port in the barrel. Might be better off drilling and tapping a bigger hole then flush mounting a smaller ported set screw ... an idea that was tossed out by a guy on another forum who knows more about all this than I'll ever figure out.

I looked really hard at the flat springs, I assume it's possible to clip coils on those too but then you're changing the spring math so it could turn into a rabbit hole.

 

[Bendigo78]

The adjustment set screw has some sort of stop built it. I dont know how you'd need to trim a spring.

 

[doubloon]

The video below should show how to remove the adjustment screw completely, I have no idea if it would make any difference. I assume the minimum setting in restrictive mode was still over gassed?

You mentioned a possible problem getting a spring to fit, clipping it might help it fit but I don't know if you'd be able to get a heavy enough spring to provide the desired pressure/response once clipped. There's a resource out there somewhere that goes in depth into spring weight, number of coils and how to tune them but I haven't experimented much with springs.

Primary Arms has a couple carbine length buffers in the 5 oz range.

 

[Bendigo78]

The video below should show how to remove the adjustment screw completely, I have no idea if it would make any difference. I assume the minimum setting in restrictive mode was still over gassed?

I didn't try restrictive mode. You shouldn't have a problem tuning it on that side since it goes down to zero gas.

 

[LRRPF52]

Doesn’t the SFAR use an A5 RET?

If it doesn’t, that would be my first update to it, with a quality longer spring and 4.6 - 5.4oz buffer.

I think it would be cool in 7mm-08 with that integrally-suppressed pipe.

 

[AXMC]

Doesn’t the SFAR use an A5 RET?

If it doesn’t, that would be my first update to it, with a quality longer spring and 4.6 - 5.4oz buffer.

I think it would be cool in 7mm-08 with that integrally-suppressed pipe.

It's basically an A5 (but is about 1/8 in shorter,) so is "proprietary".

 

[Vynz]

I shoot a copper 50 gr bullet in 358 win AR 10 16" barrel at almost 3800 fps. A short range affair, with velocity like a 22-250, out of the 358 Win and accurate at 50 yds for varmints...don't know about hogs, with respect to penetration but copper stays together better than lead.

Every time I read one of 45-90’s posts my shoulder starts to hurt; I’ll massage it with my purse after I post this.

 

[45-90]

Well keep massaging that shoulder...here is a 45-90 500 gr lead 1810 fps, or 350 Jacketed at 2362fps & 4300 plus ft/lbs in an 20" 1886 Winchester Short Rifle...with the crescent steel butt plate. The 50BMG is kinder to the shoulder.

 

[LRRPF52]

It's basically an A5 (but is about 1/8 in shorter,) so is "proprietary".

Has someone pulled theirs and measured it?

I know BIGDAWG who does the wildcats broke his all down to measure the receivers and BCG, but I didn’t recall seeing anything about the RET length.

That’s weird if they did create yet another RET length to add to the fray when A5 will do everything you need it to for a .308 carbine.

 

[BCP]

Has someone pulled theirs and measured it?

I know BIGDAWG who does the wildcats broke his all down to measure the receivers and BCG, but I didn’t recall seeing anything about the RET length.

That’s weird if they did create yet another RET length to add to the fray when A5 will do everything you need it to for a .308 carbine.

I suppose sticking a wooden dowel into it, marking it with a pen and then checking against a known “a5” would be one way.

It’s probably not any different just because these companies use a lot of the same OEM suppliers for little parts.

 

[mtrmn]

Has ANYbody just said the hell with all the lightweight stuff and consulted Heavybuffers.com about one of these SFARs to see if he has any solutions? I don't have a dog in this hunt, just curious.

 

[doubloon]

I've seen their stuff, haven't ordered anything yet, Primary arms has a 5+ oz carbine buffer.

What does "consulted" mean? Shopped? Do they have some kind of buffer weight calculator?

 

[mtrmn]

I've seen their stuff, haven't ordered anything yet, Primary arms has a 5+ oz carbine buffer.

What does "consulted" mean? Shopped? Do they have some kind of buffer weight calculator?

Actually contact Slash via email on the website. In my experience he'll respond well within 24 hrs. I have a 8.5 oz buffer in my 308 carbine with an Armalite rifle spring.

 

[doubloon]

Cool, it would at least be interesting to know if he's messed with one.

 

[Twinsen]

Has ANYbody just said the hell with all the lightweight stuff and consulted Heavybuffers.com about one of these SFARs to see if he has any solutions? I don't have a dog in this hunt, just curious.

I consulted him when I had a DPMS G2. He sold me an a5 and buffer, which did nothing, so I told him so and requested a refund. He denied me the refund and called me and tried to argue about it. I didn't want to argue or get berated by a retailer so I hung up. But then he repeatedly called and kept trying to get a rise out of me.

It was fucking creepy.

 

[Gtscotty]

I tried H, H2 and H3 in my SFAR. H3 had reliability problems, both H and H2 worked, but I wound up settling on H.

 

[mtrmn]

I consulted him when I had a DPMS G2. He sold me an a5 and buffer, which did nothing, so I told him so and requested a refund. He denied me the refund and called me and tried to argue about it. I didn't want to argue or get berated by a retailer so I hung up. But then he repeatedly called and kept trying to get a rise out of me.

It was fucking creepy.

Hasn't been my experience at all...

 

[Twinsen]

That checks out. If he did it often, he wouldn't have a business.

Then again, in the end he kept the product and my money. It was... what's the phrase? Oh yeah,

Theft.

 

[AXMC]

That checks out. If he did it often, he wouldn't have a business.

Then again, in the end he kept the product and my money. It was... what's the phrase? Oh yeah,

Theft.

Wait, you requested a refund, or sent the product back without authorization and demanded a refund?

 

[Twinsen]

Wait, you requested a refund, or sent the product back without authorization and demanded a refund?

The second one. He lied to make a sale. I shipped it back. He went schizo.

 

[MAHLMAN]

My dealings with Slash have been trouble free and what he sold me has worked as promised. Regarding your comments I wonder about you not Slash.

 

[Bendigo78]

Would anyone know the size of the screws that clamp the handgaurd to the barrel nut? Managed to lose both of them while working on some clearance issues inside of it.

On a positive note, ran the 50 final finish bullets through it this morning along with another 70 other rounds. Took some chrono readings on everything from 125 to 190 grain loads. Barrel definately feels smoother and looks better with the scope. Group size shrank but I didnt kick the issue with the first round going a different place than the next 4.

 

[Bendigo78]

The best of the 4 round groups but had several 4 rounders that were similar.

 

[doubloon]

size of the screws that clamp the handgaurd

I don't have a thread gauge, I can take one measure some external dimensions.

But I'd have to haul it to a hardware store and try it in a bolt display to get any idea of what the thread pitch might be.

 

[Bendigo78]

I don't have a thread gauge, I can take one measure some external dimensions.

But I'd have to haul it to a hardware store and try it in a bolt display to get any idea of what the thread pitch might be.

I went looking for screws last night and for giggles pulled one out of the psa handgaurd I had run on the sfar before changing the gas block. It fit perfectly. So I've got an email to psa to ask them what size their screws are. Sad to say but you could probably get an rma, send a rifle to them and get it back from psa before ruger would answer your email.

 

[doubloon]

There is a parts list in the SFAR manual, you can probably order them direct from Ruger somehow.

Part #45 I think.

 

[Twinsen]

My dealings with Slash have been trouble free and what he sold me has worked as promised. Regarding your comments I wonder about you not Slash.

That's to be expected. People love to lie on the internet, especially if they can profit from it.

Slash lied to me, freaked out on me, and then stole from me. I'm glad he didn't steal from you. It doesn't change the fact that he's a thief.