So over the Contrived and Repetitive Nature of Stages today

[EbTac]

Good cut and paste that gives the answer without any personal interpretation.

It also answers your question as to why top shooters will continue to shoot qualifiers even if they have high scores and why there are so many qualifier matches.

How many qualifier matches were held in your region? How many did you shoot? Question I have does it not make sense to limit qualifiers to only two qualifier matches per state? And if you have multiple ranges in a state like most do you can alternate locations every year to spread the love to the MDs. The problem we have here in oklahoma is if 25 people show up to a match, that's considered above average attendance. It's no problem to see only 10 to 15 people show up to a match. So yes in my opinion with the amount of matches and qualifier matches we have in the central region we are getting very watered down.

 

[kthomas]

Here in the states we don't get a vote. PRS has a hand picked committee. My opinion that is part of the problem. Your membership does not give you a voice or a vote.

PRS membership doesn't actually really get you anything, except a national level scoreboard and the chance to qualify for the finale and AG Cup.

And some small discounts.

 

[stanley_white]

If I ever take the time to understand how the PRS match system works, I will be taking it too seriously at that point, and the fun will be gone.

-Stan

 

[EbTac]

PRS membership doesn't actually really get you anything, except a national level scoreboard and the chance to qualify for the finale and AG Cup.

And some small discounts.

Oh I'm fully aware lol. This is my last year doing PRS. I'll be giving my money to OPPS. There atleast I have a voice and a vote and all the money goes towards a scholarship and a prize table.

 

[Dead Eye Dick]

If I ever take the time to understand how the PRS match system works, I will be taking it too seriously at that point, and the fun will be gone.

-Stan

Makes a fellow wonder.

But USA Cyling makes it look like a miracle of simplicity. In my early years of cycling, I always finished last when racing in Time Trials in Cat 5 (where all the 25 year olds raced.

Repeat, always finished in Last Place.

Yet by their miracle of standings, I was usually somewhere in the top 65 to 75 percent of the nation for men in Category 5 Time Trials. Go figure. If I never finished better than last, how did 25 to 35 percent of the cyclists in the nation finish below me??? Guess I should not have complained.

 

[Tx_Aggie]

Qualifiers:

Shooters that have shot at least one Qualifier match are now highlighted in yellow on the PRS website in the standings and also have a checkmark next to their score on their profile. Shooters with this denotation are in the running for an invitation to a year-end finale.
A shooter can still acquire 300 points in the standings, but not be Finale qualified. This means they did not shoot a qualifier.
Shooters that do not choose to shoot a qualifier will not be eligible for a Finale invitation.
This applies to both the PRS Regional Series and the Pro Series.
How Scores Are Calculated:

A shooters season points will be a sum of their three best scores, which may or may not include a qualifier.
A “Qualified” shooters score will be a sum of their top qualifier score and their next two highest scores (the next two highest scores may or may not be qualifiers).
In order to be qualified to shoot in a Regional or Pro series finale a shooter must shoot at least one qualifier as one of their 3 match scores.

This doesn't actually answer the question, other than relating the fact that you must shoot at least one qualifier to be able to shoot the finale (and in a lot of regions it really just gets you priority registration, as the match is eventually opened up to everyone).

But why would the series designate certain matches as being more desirable than others for folks who want to shoot the finale?

 

[EbTac]

But why would the series designate certain matches as being more desirable than others for folks who want to shoot the finale?

I honestly don't know other than range exposure would be my guess.

 

[EbTac]

@Tx_Aggie and to attract more skilled shooters.

 

[Tx_Aggie]

I honestly don't know other than range exposure would be my guess.

Yeah, I think that's pretty much it.

 

[lash]

I’m not an MD!?!? Not sure where that came from. These complaints are from 2012! Over 10 years later, I hope you can see its small noise. If it was true, shouldn’t prs have died after 3 years because that’s the burnout rate?

But now turn it to you and lowlight. Make the change you want to see. You won’t, that’s the main point I’m getting at. If you’re not willing to do it yourself l, why should someone else? Especially when it’s a very small population.

lol. You misread my response. I only pointed out that I’ve been a member since 2012 because you keep insisting that nobody in the sport wants change and it’s only outsiders and new guys (well and now old guys) that are the need for change.

And despite your dedicated ignorance and willingness to believe that no change is needed, I’ll point out that many of the changes that PRS has instituted, albeit slowly, were first brought up and discussed here on Snipers Hide. All the while, those that were blind insisted that no change was needed.

Without input and improvement, no organization can continue for very long. The shooting disciplines discussed in this very thread that have faded away will attest to that. Long range silhouette came about in the 70s and existed for many years. Yet, they did not change and so have faded into the sunset, as have many similar shooting sports.

Your refusal to believe that incremental change is not only needed but necessary is saddening to those of us that know.

Without growth there is death and there can be no growth without change.

 

[lash]

But why would the series designate certain matches as being more desirable than others for folks who want to shoot the finale?

I honestly don't know other than range exposure would be my guess.

It’s not specifically about the range as much as it is the level of match that a qualifier is intended to be. I know that qualifiers in this region are a step more difficult than the everyday local match.

 

[EbTac]

It’s not specifically about the range as much as it is the level of match that a qualifier is intended to be. I know that qualifiers in this region are a step more difficult than the everyday local match.

Yeah that is generally known knowledge. But for instance oklahoma matches and qualifiers are generally same difficulty given our denominator is generally the wind.

 

[FatBoy]

Without input and improvement, no organization can continue for very long. The shooting disciplines discussed in this very thread that have faded away will attest to that. Long range silhouette came about in the 70s and existed for many years. Yet, they did not change and so have faded into the sunset, as have many similar shooting sports.

I think this may be the progression of all of the different disciplines. I can’t think of one shooting sport that hasn’t grown to a point, then slowly dwindled as people moved to the next best thing.


All of the NRA sports are like this. Our LR state championship used to be 90+ shooters, this year it was like 12. The juniors we would have had went to PRS or 3 gun style matches. F class is maybe prolonging this, but it’s just a matter of time when the average age of a competitor is 60+. Same with small bore, etc. unless you’re trying to get into the Olympics or get a colleges scholarship, who shoots it anymore? Across the course is next. Bullseye pistol. You name it. NRAs corruption didn’t help any either.


I wonder, overall, what the percentage of people who compete is and how it compares over the last 24-30 years.

 

[BurtG]

I wonder, overall, what the percentage of people who compete is and how it compares over the last 24-30 years.

I wonder how much participation in every outdoor activity has declined.

Hunting / sports etc. Everyone is addicted to screens and getting lazier. Playgrounds are empty you hardly see kids outside these days

US population :

 

[FatBoy]

I wonder how much participation in every outdoor activity has declined.

Hunting / sports etc. Everyone is addicted to screens and getting lazier. Playgrounds are empty you hardly see kids outside these days

View attachment 8514119

US population :

View attachment 8514120

There is a bigger issue with hunting, which is accessibility. At least in TN. Public last is shit, and private is so expensive you may just as well buy a side of beef. I haven’t bought a license in 4 years, and I was a Sportsman purchase each year. That said, I shoot more matches in SEP-NOV as I’m not in a tree stand so the shooting has increased, even if my freezer is barren of venison.

You’re on point with people glued to these fucking phones…

 

[clefairy]

lol. You misread my response. I only pointed out that I’ve been a member since 2012 because you keep insisting that nobody in the sport wants change and it’s only outsiders and new guys (well and now old guys) that are the need for change.

And despite your dedicated ignorance and willingness to believe that no change is needed, I’ll point out that many of the changes that PRS has instituted, albeit slowly, were first brought up and discussed here on Snipers Hide. All the while, those that were blind insisted that no change was needed.

Without input and improvement, no organization can continue for very long. The shooting disciplines discussed in this very thread that have faded away will attest to that. Long range silhouette came about in the 70s and existed for many years. Yet, they did not change and so have faded into the sunset, as have many similar shooting sports.

Your refusal to believe that incremental change is not only needed but necessary is saddening to those of us that know.

Without growth there is death and there can be no growth without change.

Tell me a shooting sport that has lasted the test of time. Your optimism in prs is adorable. Why aren’t CD matches and the likes taking over if it’s really the better way?

You won’t see the voice on the hide is small compared to the majority. And you don’t want to do the work yourself.

Work vs complaining; we both know what we like doing more, one’s just more honest.

 

[lash]

Tell me a shooting sport that has lasted the test of time. Your optimism in prs is adorable. Why aren’t CD matches and the likes taking over if it’s really the better way?

You won’t see the voice on the hide is small compared to the majority. And you don’t want to do the work yourself.

Work vs complaining; we both know what we like doing more, one’s just more honest.

I’m an MD. I am doing the work.

 

[Barelstroker]

Tell me a shooting sport that has lasted the test of time.

I can think of a few but, maybe you're right because there are quite a few that haven't & I have to concede that I don't know what the cause was.
If this is the reality, the thinking may have to be that regular changes be introduced or, maybe there's not much can be done & there needs to be a "new Fad".
I know that covid bullshit took a heavy toll on our participation numbers. I'm not sure if the numbers are improving slowly or the rot has set in for good. Time will tell I suppose.

 

[Barelstroker]

I wonder how much participation in every outdoor activity has declined.

Hunting / sports etc. Everyone is addicted to screens and getting lazier. Playgrounds are empty you hardly see kids outside these days

View attachment 8514119

US population :

View attachment 8514120

The hunting numbers graph blows me away. Over 16,000,000 hunters in the 80's.
Mind boggling.

 

[Barelstroker]

You’re on point with people glued to these fucking phones…

Absolutely.....those things have gutted our social structure &, just about everything else that made us Human. Fucking things.
The biggest threat humanity has ever faced, a true scourge.

 

[stanley_white]

Of the shooting sports that have survived the longest, what commonalities do they share?

-Stan

 

[Dead Eye Dick]

I wonder how much participation in every outdoor activity has declined.

Hunting / sports etc. Everyone is addicted to screens and getting lazier. Playgrounds are empty you hardly see kids outside these days

View attachment 8514119

US population :

View attachment 8514120

I would like to comment on this. I am a child of the 1950’s, a teen of the 1960’s. In 1960, at the age of 11, both my parents worked, I was given free rein. They expected me to be back by supper time. We spent the entire day on the bayou. (If not out in the Chauvin Swamp) Our parents never worried about much, they knew we were excellent swimmers so they did nto fear us on the water. The big thing was child predators, They were hardly, if ever, heard of. Children were safe. I might add that it was one hell of a fun childhood. (Except school, I hated school).

In these days and times we all complain that our children live on a computer. Never go outside. Never play any sports except what they are forced to do in school PE (if the school has pe, everyone is so worried about passing “the Test.”

But laziness may not be the entire problem. We raised our son in the country. It was reasonably safe. But in the city? I would not let him out of my sight. I wonder how many parents, keep their children on very tight reins, for fear of two things. Child predators for some and joining gangs for the other. Keep them safe, because it truly is a very dangerous world out there for children.

Parents who have the time can take thier children to the playgrounds, but in these days of biden economics, who has the time, its work, work work, have to pay the food and rent. I realize parents arn't perfect and in fact some of them arn't worth the cost of the bullet needed to shoot them. Being a former teacher, I’ve seen both, best and worthless.

However, I fear that fear is what is destroying our children. The welfare program, only providing for single parents, cutting off married families has pretty much destroyed the American family.

 

[mark5pt56]

Of the shooting sports that have survived the longest, what commonalities do they share?

-Stan

Off the top of my head I would say ones that allow the most common firearms, maybe broken down into levels of shooters, a consistent organizational structure with a training and vetting system for the match directors?

I don't do much now other than go to a couple local ranges to do my own thing. While I may the time, me personally I don't care to spend the money on the associated fees, travel, etc. I used to shoot IPSC, High Power, local action pistol matches and precision matches, 1K and 300/600 "modern military" I was for over 20 years one of three guys who ran a LE only "duty gear" matches. I can say that it's hard work and nobody gives a shit about helping set up, etc.
I can say that all the above were within 30 minutes from my house which made it easy in regards to time spent and cost.
Any discipline can suffer from a poorly run match, a dishonest MD or group running the match, I never shot IDPA in my area as the club was run by the dad, son and a couple close friends, mainly formed a "club" and if you weren't "in it" you were penalized for anything they could in order for the club to have the top spots.
Does the same thing happen in the PRS circuit? I have no clue.
In my opinion Frank would like to see more of the "spirit" of the Rifleman. It's based on reading here, a game with folks using highly specialized rifles, support equipment, stuff for the most part isn't practical in the real world. Don't get me wrong, gear and technolgy has changed, will continue to and if applicable, take advantage of it if that to enhance your abilities to accomplish a task.
Maybe break it down to Hunter, Tactical and Match classes, adjust the target size, distance, time, type of gear, etc. Let the shooter decide how they would like to compete that way they can control the spending at least with support gear and money spent of a rifle and scope.
The MD that ran the local rifle matches would break down the 300, 600 and 1k matches into Vintage Sniper, Modern Military, Match and Open, so you maybe shooting a 338 whizbang while the shooter next to you would be spanking a Mauser.

Oh well, enough ramble for the night, old man has to sleep, hope the above helps.
One last point to ponder--if there wasn't a prize table--would their be less participation?

 

[clefairy]

I’m an MD. I am doing the work.

Really, where? Let's see these changes! Can you implement any changes?

 

[lash]

Really, where? Let's see these changes! Can you implement any changes?

I do what I can.

Maybe if you payed attention to what you read and stopped being an ass for a bit you’d know. But I feel no compunction to answer to your combative ass. Have a nice day.

 

[Cherokee60]

Take a look at the IWI Gas Gun Challenge...I'm the MD. We run fast stages (90sec), fun, odd props (airplane and such) and engagements that will truly challenge your equipment, your skills and you'll probably make some new friends.

https://www.practiscore.com/clubs/iwi_gas_gun_challenge

Robin Gilmore, MD

 

[stanley_white]

Take a look at the IWI Gas Gun Challenge...I'm the MD. We run fast stages (90sec), fun, odd props (airplane and such) and engagements that will truly challenge your equipment, your skills and you'll probably make some new friends.

https://www.practiscore.com/clubs/iwi_gas_gun_challenge

Robin Gilmore, MD

Added to my list!

Thank you!

-Stan

 

[BurtG]

Take a look at the IWI Gas Gun Challenge...I'm the MD. We run fast stages (90sec), fun, odd props (airplane and such) and engagements that will truly challenge your equipment, your skills and you'll probably make some new friends.

https://www.practiscore.com/clubs/iwi_gas_gun_challenge

Robin Gilmore, MD

You need to ban the transformers. They are a safety hazard in so many ways