Starline enters 6.5CM brass market

[davere]

With large and small rifle primer versions... https://www.starlinebrass.com/order-online/new-rifle-calibers.cfm

Any thoughts? I've used Starline extensively in handgun brass, and there, it's been rock solid stuff - out of tens of thousands of cases and hundreds of thousands of rounds (running high pressure loads), I've cracked exactly two. I lose them at lost brass matches before I wear them out, and I've loaded them upwards of 20 times. I have no idea what their rifle brass is like.

 

[beararms]

I would also like some info on Starline rifle brass. They are starting to making 7mm-08 @ $48 per 100 and that would be a good value for those reloading for hunting rifles.

 

[lash]

I spoke with them at the NRA show in Atlanta regarding their new offerings in rifle brass.It is their intent to be considered as a top quality supplier of good rifle brass and they have no interest in the bargain market. Given their record as a supplier of top notch pistol, brass, I'd say that their rifle brass should be good stuff. They did say that they have been supplying early batches to industry rifle shooters in different competitive realms for about a year in order to gain feedback and input for improvements.

When I spoke to them, they had not yet released .260 brass as it was still being tested in the field, though I did see a sample that looked pretty good visually. Not having my inspection tools along with me, that is the most I could do to check it out.

I notice that some of you guys must be ordering the 6.5 Creed already as it is already out of stock and in back order due to high order quantities.

 

[davere]

I didn't order any... ha ha. I wouldn't mind seeing some at some point, though. If the prep work is equivalent to Lapua (that is, no prep required), and it lasts even 2/3 as long, it's a good deal.

 

[1MoreAR]

I probably get some of 6.5 Creedmoor in small rifle primer and compare them to Lapua brass.

 

[lash]

I have to imagine that Starline knows they will be compared to Lspua brass, but time will tell. Once they introduce the.260 brass, I will try it out myself.

 

[jareese]

I just received 250 6.5 Creedmoor SRP brass from Starline. Brass prep is needed as many case mouths are dinged, bodies seem OK on the 100 I took out to process. Length is a little short anywhere from 1.90-1.91". Primer flash hole is "regular" size, not the smaller flash hole as in Lapua or Peterson Brass. Many of the flash holes seemed to me to be off center a little - we'll see if that might affect anything whilst shooting. I have not shot any yet, I'll try to remember to post my findings as I'm loading up several for my Wife's 6.5 CM and mine with 3 sets of 10 rounds with 3 different bullets to find velocity/harmonic nodes.

 

[jareese]

Range update on the Starline 6.5 CM SRP brass. Unfortunately for me, in at least in one of my rifles, the starline brass is a no go. Pressure signs at 40.8gr. of H4350 with Berger Hybrid 140, ELD-M 140, and ELD-M 147. Blew primer at 41.6 with the 147 and 42.6 with the Berger Hybrid 140.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[davere]

Did you get velocities on those, by any chance?

 

[buffybuster]

What are the weight of the empty cases? Compared to weight of Hornady and Lapua?

 

[jareese]

Did you get velocities on those, by any chance?

Ok - bit of a list here - ALL loads shown had Ejector marks and mild cratering at 40.8 grains - got worse from there. Speeds obtained with my LabRadar - shooting in the shade, wind switching from front to back (S to North) Temps around 68-70* - 29.9bar - 70%Hu

Berger Hybrid 140 load/speed
40.8/2725- Ejector Mark
41/2717- Ejector Mark
41.2/2731- Ejector Mark
41.4/2753- Ejector Mark
41.6/2765- Ejector Mark
41.8/2788- Ejector Mark
42/2792 - Ejector Mark- flattened primer
42.2/2806 - Ejector Mark - Crater - flattened primer
42.4/2810- HEAVY crater - flattened primer
42.6/2811- HEAVY crater - flattened primer

ELD-M 140
40.8/2711 - Ejector Mark
41/2711- Ejector Mark
41.2/2724- Ejector Mark
41.4/2737- Ejector Mark
41.6/2753- Ejector Mark
41.8/2766- Ejector Mark
42/2774- Ejector Mark
42.2/2795- Ejector Mark
42.4/2807- LARGE crater - flattened primer
42.6/2815- Pierced primer

ELD-M 147
40.8/2685- Ejector Mark
41/2690- Ejector Mark
41.2/2710- Heavy Ejector Mark
41.4/2718 - LARGE crater - flattened primer
41.6/2729 - Pierced primer - did not continue
41.8/ XXXX
42/ XXXX
42.2/ XXXX
42.4/ XXXX
42.6/ XXXX

 

[jareese]

What are the weight of the empty cases? Compared to weight of Hornady and Lapua?

Weights are similar to Lapua - 165-167gr +/-

 

[jareese]

I should also say that this was on a 24" 8 twist heavy barrel

 

[davere]

I'm by no means an expert on rifle reloading, so big grain of salt and all... but, I'd hazard a guess that the Starline stuff isn't as hard as Lapua (prolly obvious), and the larger flash hole is contributing to the pressure signs you're seeing at the primer (which otherwise wouldn't be directly influenced by the brass, other than the starting volume and - to a smaller degree - neck tension).

Two thoughts - you might actually get more performance out of a slower powder (4451, for instance) in that brass, although it's likely a non-starter since Lapua exists and you can drive Lapua like you stole it. And, you might give Starline a call and give them the feedback that for long range competition purposes, their stuff isn't performing any better than any other cheap brass on the market? Maybe they haven't got the heat treat right, yet, or something, and some feedback might steer them in the right direction.

Thanks for posting your results - definitely helps the rest of us pump the brakes on that product until they make some changes!

 

[ocabj]

I just received 250 6.5 Creedmoor SRP brass from Starline. Brass prep is needed as many case mouths are dinged, bodies seem OK on the 100 I took out to process. Length is a little short anywhere from 1.90-1.91". Primer flash hole is "regular" size, not the smaller flash hole as in Lapua or Peterson Brass. Many of the flash holes seemed to me to be off center a little - we'll see if that might affect anything whilst shooting. I have not shot any yet, I'll try to remember to post my findings as I'm loading up several for my Wife's 6.5 CM and mine with 3 sets of 10 rounds with 3 different bullets to find velocity/harmonic nodes.

I have photos that demonstrate what jareese describes.

 

[supercorndogs]

Dented case mouths are normal.

 

[shornik]

Bit of an old thread here, but thought I'd add some info for others that may be looking for it. I recently purchased 250 pcs of Starline Brass (6.5 Creedmoor, small rifle primer brass.) A couple of notes before I list the average specs.

1) case mouths will arrive dented, approx. 40 pcs out of the 250 pcs I received were not perfectly round.
2) Due to the way the mouth is cut to size, a lip forms on the mouth of the neck, stretching over the inside portion, and outside portion. They will need to be chamfered before being resized or loaded up. (inside diameter of the neck before any work was .253"). AFTER chamfering, the ID of the neck was .258"
3) Flash holes looked uniform in my batch, but they are punched, not drilled, and will require some work to make them uniform.

Out of the lot that I received, these were the average figures.

OAL - 1.910"
Neck ID - .258" (AFTER chamferring. Neck ID before chamfering was .253"
Neck OD - .288"
Neck OD w/ bullet seated - .290"
Weight - 161.5 +/- 0.6 grains

I haven't loaded any rounds yet to test, but once I do I'll post my findings on here and will compare them to the Hornady brass that I've also measured. All in all, it LOOKS like pretty good price for half the cost of Lapua (as long as you don't mind some case mouths being dented upon arrival)


NOTE: I contacted Starline Brass directly in regards to the neck ID. I spoke with Hunter there, their ballistician (super nice guy). He was the one that informed me to chamfer the neck before sizing. He mentioned that their brass is checked with .260” Go/.262” No-Go gauges.

 

[padom]

Bit of an old thread here, but thought I'd add some info for others that may be looking for it. I recently purchased 250 pcs of Starline Brass (6.5 Creedmoor, small rifle primer brass.) A couple of notes before I list the average specs.

1) case mouths will arrive dented, approx. 40 pcs out of the 250 pcs I received were not perfectly round.
2) Due to the way the mouth is cut to size, a lip forms on the mouth of the neck, stretching over the inside portion, and outside portion. They will need to be chamfered before being resized or loaded up. (inside diameter of the neck before any work was 2.253"). AFTER chamfering, the ID of the neck was 2.258"
3) Flash holes looked uniform in my batch, but they are punched, not drilled, and will require some work to make them uniform.

Out of the lot that I received, these were the average figures.

OAL - 1.910"
Neck ID - 2.258" (AFTER chamferring. Neck ID before chamfering was 2.253"
Neck OD - 2.288"
Neck OD w/ bullet seated - 2.290"
Weight - 161.5 +/- 0.6 grains

I haven't loaded any rounds yet to test, but once I do I'll post my findings on here and will compare them to the Hornady brass that I've also measured. All in all, it LOOKS like pretty good price for half the cost of Lapua (as long as you don't mind some case mouths being dented upon arrival)


NOTE: I contacted Starline Brass directly in regards to the neck ID. I spoke with Hunter there, their ballistician (super nice guy). He was the one that informed me to chamfer the neck before sizing. He mentioned that their brass is checked with is .260” Go/.262” No-Go gauges.

your neck OD measured 2.288" and your loaded neck OD was 2.290"??? you loading 20mm??

 

[shornik]

your neck OD measured 2.288" and your loaded neck OD was 2.290"??? you loading 20mm??

oh wow - i must have derped and placed a 2 before all those digits. thanks for the heads up padom. Typo's have been corrected

 

[Cascade Precision]

Following. I am torn between ordering Hornady or Starline.

I just cannot see paying $1.00+ per case at my level of competitiveness.

 

[mojavejim]

I just run it though my expander mandrel then chamfer & load. It seems more consistent than Hornady to me on neck tension & get single digit SD's in my 6 & 6.5CM with the srp brass. Not nearly as good as lapua but good good enough for lost brass match's.
Even with all the cost of match fee & travel, I find it hard to just let my Lapua fly, lol

 

[shornik]

Update* (Starline Small Rifle Primer Brass vs. Hornady Large rifle Primer Brass Reloading Report)

Just got through with my first reloading session of the aforementioned Starline Brass. These are my results.
I also have Hornady brass reloading data I will post here for comparison for *@Cascade Precision. I suppose I should make a new thread for this in the reloading section as well. Feel free to add to my info! I'd love to gather some data from others with the same rifle/powder/bullet combo.

Rifle: Ruger Precision Rifle
6.5 Creedmoor / 1:8 Twist / 24" bbl
Powder: H4350
Bullet: 142gr Sierra Matchking
Location: Houston, TX
Altitude: 177ft
Avg Density Alt: 400-1400

STARLINE BRASS (Small Rifle Primer)
Weight - 161.5 +/- 0.6 grains
Primer Used: CCI 450

HORNADY BRASS (From Precision Hunter ELD-X Factory Ammo)
Weight - 145.5 +/- 3.0 grains
Primer Used: CCI BR2

HORNADY BRASS (from Match Ammo)
Weight - 151.5 +/- 1.0 grains *did not conduct tests w/ match ammo brass

I have 1 reloading session w/ the Starline Brass (first image), and the remainder are Hornady Brass.

Starline Brass

Hornady Brass

Hornady Brass

Hornady Brass

Conclusion: The Starline Brass is heavier, same charge weights yielded a higher velocity. I'm hoping to gain more firings w/ the Starline Small Rifle Primer Brass however, but time will tell.

 

[BigdaddyWSM]

I have bought both the 6.5 and 6mm creedmoor brass from Starline in large primer version ( since I have 1000's of BR2) to be honest all I ever used before was Hornady so here is my comparison.

Starline brass needed to be run in my mandrel die to straighten out necks on the few that were dented slightly.
Starline brass is overall thicker ( necks were about same at .015 but water weight held less so thicker bodies = slightly less charge to achieve same performance.
Starline brass needed pretty much full prep, chamfer/debur, inside flash hole reamed, the primer pockets were also deeper as my PP uniformer would not touch bottom of pocket.
I am on my 4th loading in my 6mm CM brass ( some with heavy charges) & Primer pockets still feel same as when new, snug.
The Starline brass averaged 1.908 to start ( Hornady averaged 1.914) so slightly shorter than minimum ( 1.910 min -1.920 max for trimming ) & still does not need trimming.

Overall, I have been so far happy with Starline brass in 6mm & 6.5. that is my 2 cents.

 

[fdkay]

I just ordered some of the match .308, in order to neck it down to 7mm. I wish they made the 7-08 in SRP.
On review of their website, I noticed a couple of things. One, they tell you up front that the case mouths will likely be out of round.
Two, they tell you that they use the larger flash hole to assist in proper ignition.
Being the skeptic that I am, I think they use the larger flash hole for no other reason than manufacturing.
I am okay with that, as the price is excellent, I hope the brass works out well.

 

[_shawn_]

anybody still using this stuff? how's the brass holding up?

 

[ken4570tc in WY]

Just finished initial prep on 500 pieces of Starline .243 win brass. Of the 500, I culled 3 for visible cracks and 1 for an odd dent below the shoulder. I used a full length Redding bench rest die to uniform the cases, primer pockets and flash holes uniformed/deburred. Case necks were then expanded to 25cal and then partial resized to provide a positive pressure case neck/shoulder/head space fit. I removed the ejector and extractor from my bolt and put a single layer of 1/16th wide chart/art tape around the web of each case. Then fire formed for a close chamber fit using Winchester WLR primers, 15.6 grains of Red Dot, a small square of tissue, crushed walnut shell for filler and a cork plug coated in Danzak and each case coated with case lube. Decapped, cleaned, resized and measured all necks and had a wall thickness variation less than .0025: about 25% were at or less than .0005, about 35% were .0005+ to .0001, about 30% measured .001+ to .0015, and the last 10% were .0015+. Turned all necks to .0145 wall thickness. Weighed all cases, about 85% fell into two groups of not more than 1 grain difference, the rest were evenly heavier or lighter. All cases have been etched at the web with letter codes 'A' through 'D' for initial wall thickness variance, post neck turning visible inspection and weight. Right now, some of the cases are 'AAA' some are 'DDC' and all combinations in between. Next step will be serial numbers for each case, three digits in front of letter codes. All cases will be annealed, then I'll begin test firing with Danzak coated 75 grain TNT HP FB and Accurate 4064 to find which primer gives best ES/SD with a .001 push-in of the anvil. Next test will be primer seating depth (+.002, +.003, etc.) of the selected best primer to see where ES/SD indicates most consistent ignition. Bullet seating depth will be tested next followed by OCW ladder testing and more refined testing/verification. All shots/groups will be tracked by case serial number to look for any common flaws that could account for fliers or unacceptable deviations in MV. That should conclude the first firing of all 496 cases after which I'll ultrasonic clean the cases leaving the primers in so I can check water volume vs case weight variances. I'll then decap, resize and check neck runout for a fourth letter code 'A' through 'D'. Next, I'll be ready to move on to testing with 105's, 108's and 115's with H4350 and H1000. By the end of summer 2019, I hope to have a picture of the remains of a 1,000yd prairie dog to post. If I learn anything about what matters and what doesn't, I'll post it and modify my procedures or equipment accordingly. Over the years, I've read so many differing opinions about things necessary or not for accurate ammo, I have to prove them all, one way or the other. I've never gone to this level of detail before and may never do it again. This is the perfect hobby for OCD rednecks!!!

 

[BigdaddyWSM]

I have used starline in my 6.5 CM, it comes new around 1.907-08 oal, neck thickness .014.5 -.015, neck dia .267, base .467. Primer pockets were very deep, after 4-5 firings I still couldn't use my Primer pocket uniformer. My normal load in Hornady brass showed ejector swipe & slight primer cratering in the Starline brass.
It has held up well after many reloads with trimming only needed after 6th firing. Weights were widely varied though so I switched to Gunwerks premium 6 & 6.5 CM brass which has very consistent weight across all 100 pieces & costs around $71 for 100. all large primer since I have lots of BR-2 to use up & they only have large primer available for now.

Here are some avg weights of 5 random pieces of brass in 6.5 creedmoor;
Norma = 154.4
Hornady = 146.5
Starline = 160.6
Gunwerks = 169.5

I don't have any other brands so maybe others could chime in.

 

[jbmarshtx]

Here are some avg weights of 5 random pieces of brass in 6.5 creedmoor;
Norma = 154.4
Hornady = 146.5
Starline = 160.6
Gunwerks = 169.5

Any idea who makes the gunwerks brass? I'm reloading some 1x and 2x fired Hornady since I've just started, but I'll be buying some Lapua or Peterson soon...likely.

 

[fdkay]

Any idea who makes the gunwerks brass? I'm reloading some 1x and 2x fired Hornady since I've just started, but I'll be buying some Lapua or Peterson soon...likely.

Hornady makes the gunwerks brass, (definitely for the 7LRM anyway)

 

[BigdaddyWSM]

Gunwerks sells hornady brass but their signature premium brass doesn't come in 7mm. Its not hornady.

 

[NamibHunter]

6.5 Creedmoor brass weight can vary quite significantly between different manufacturers. Mostly due to different wall thickness. Of course Large Rifle Primer brass will tend to be lighter than Small Rifle Primer brass.

Here are my earlier weight comparison results, for Large Rifle Primer brass, copied from an earlier post.

Hornady (from different batches): 143.0-154.5 grain, a difference of 11.5 gn, which is a lot. Keep batches separate and weight sort (and cull) your brass. Reconfirm your max load when you change to a different batch.

Norma: 153.8 - 155.2 gn, all from one batch of 50, batch size was small, so might not be representative. There was no need to cull any. For some reason they never shot well, gave up on it.

Winchester brass (factory loaded match ammo) varied from 148.1 to 150.0 gn. [Rumor has it that Hornady makes their Creedmoor brass?]

Prime stamped brass was around 155 gn. with fairly low weight variation.

Nosler: 160 - 161 which is quite a bit heavier than other brands. Weight sorted by Nosler before shipment, which is nice. Loads might need to be reduced.

Sig was around 155 gn. Similar to Hornady.

The heaviest brass was Federal at 172 gn, a very significant difference from Hornady at 143-155 gn. [That is 15% heavier than Hornady. Max Load will almost certainly have to be reduced.]

Alpha SRP brass was similar to Lapua (also SRP) in terms of average weight. BTW: Lapua has less neck thickness variation (0.6 thou delta compared to 1.1 thou). [More brass in the web area, due to smaller primer hole, so not a good comparison. Obvious, i know...] My favorite load recipes worked fine on both of these two brands of brass without modification, and speed was very close, but i am 0.5 gn below the point where ejector marks start to appear. Your results might be different.

Hope this helps.

 

[NamibHunter]

What life span are you guys getting with Starline brass, so number of reloads? And for what caliber.

 

[John Glidewell]

I have been running Starline in multiple guns, 6.5cm, 2 / 6mm cm's and a 223. It all needs to be cleaned up, flash holes, necks - I turned most of mine. If you do not mind doing some work, it runs great. The internal case capacity is very tight and produces very good ES #s in all of them. BUT - it does not like to be run hot. I got about 4-6 loads on the hotter side before I saw signs of case head separation happening. I am running H4350 and RL16 and pushing 140 grain pills at 2900 and 108-110 pills at 3100 in both 28' barreled match guns. I get good life (at 7 or 8 loads now) in my practice rig 6mm but it is running a softer (more of a factory match) load at 2971. I still run some Starline but have switched to Peterson to run the hotter match loads and getting good brass life +6 loads so far on first 50 pieces and no signs of failure.

All in all Starline is very good brass, so long as you don't run it hard.

 

[NamibHunter]

I have been running Starline in multiple guns, 6.5cm, 2 / 6mm cm's and a 223. It all needs to be cleaned up, flash holes, necks - I turned most of mine. If you do not mind doing some work, it runs great. The internal case capacity is very tight and produces very good ES #s in all of them. BUT - it does not like to be run hot. I got about 4-6 loads on the hotter side before I saw signs of case head separation happening. I am running H4350 and RL16 and pushing 140 grain pills at 2900 and 108-110 pills at 3100 in both 28' barreled match guns. I get good life (at 7 or 8 loads now) in my practice rig 6mm but it is running a softer (more of a factory match) load at 2971. I still run some Starline but have switched to Peterson to run the hotter match loads and getting good brass life +6 loads so far on first 50 pieces and no signs of failure.

All in all Starline is very good brass, so long as you don't run it hard.

Good to know! I presume you would recommend Peterson brass over Starline. How does Peterson and Lapua compare, which is best?

So far i have used Hornady (workable, ok for plinking loads, but not suitable for match quality ammo, got 3-5 reloads before primer pockets opened up), Nosler (very consistent, rather expensive, 8-9 reloads, primer pockets eventually gave up), Norma (i got bad results, but maybe i gave up too quickly ot i was just unlucky to get a bad batch), Lapua (very good, over 25 reloads because of small primer pocket and good metallurg, could have continued to use them but chosen to retire them anyway, but rather pricy), and recently Alpha (very good, less internal volume, seems to last, still going strong after 7 reloads, but had to cut the primer pockets deeper).

So far (at least for the batches that i measured) Lapua beats Alpha by a narrow margin. Maybe I should give Peterson a try as well.

 

[padom]

Good to know! I presume you would recommend Peterson brass over Starline. How does Peterson and Lapua compare, which is best?

So far i have used Hornady (workable, ok for plinking loads, but not suitable for match quality ammo, got 3-5 reloads before primer pockets opened up), Nosler (very consistent, rather expensive, 8-9 reloads, primer pockets eventually gave up), Norma (i got bad results, but maybe i gave up too quickly ot i was just unlucky to get a bad batch), Lapua (very good, over 25 reloads because of small primer pocket and good metallurg, could have continued to use them but chosen to retire them anyway, but rather pricy), and recently Alpha (very good, less internal volume, seems to last, still going strong after 7 reloads, but had to cut the primer pockets deeper).

So far (at least for the batches that i measured) Lapua beats Alpha by a narrow margin. Maybe I should give Peterson a try as well.

Ive loaded thousands and thousands of match quality reloads on Hornady brass. They have zero issues. Are they the best, no. Only thing is they dont last as long as Lapua, Peterson, Norma.

 

[John Glidewell]

I recommend them both. I am running both on 2 different 6mm rigs. One is a practice and the other is the wife's long range rig. 108 ELDs running high 2900-3040 ish speeds and he's pushing 110 Atips at 3100. They both perform well but Starline does not handle the 41.1 load on Atips very well. It is a pick your poison choice. I use Peterson for hotter loads for the brass life. They are both on load #8 and doing fine. Starline needs some TLC out of the box. Peterson can be run out of the box. I have used many types of brass. I settled on Starline and Peterson for a few reasons. Made in USA being one. Cost for Starline and internal case capacity #s on both. They both shoot very well.

 

[NamibHunter]

Thanks much, this was helpful.

Not really anti-Hornady. Use many of their bullets and it gives good results, at very reasonable prices. For some reason, i could not get their brass to shoot well, even after neck turning, and weight sorting. Maybe i was just unlucky to get a less than steller batch, or my brass prep was incomplete: Did not have a tool at the time for flash hole beburring. That could have been an issue. That was not needed on the Nosler, Lapua or Alpha batched i got. Had a quick look with a bore scope, no issues. Now that i have the tool i barely ever use it. ?