Range Report Testing the 7mm 190’s.

[Steel head]

Well I just ordered a big pile of bullets.
In the end I went with the Berger 190’s.

Consistent, a bit cheaper and my current barrel just seems to like them.

The ATip’s BC is better but honestly I’m a bit gun shy locking myself into a Hornandy bullet at the moment.

 

[Schw15]

I got a good deal on 480 197 smk so gonna burn them up and see how they perform before testing more. What is the load you are using for the 190 bergers? Powder velocity charge weight ect? Really liking the saum

 

[Steel head]

Well I tested them at 2850 with about 60 grains of R26.
Now that I’ve decided on a bullet I’m gonna see if I can get them faster, I do believe my barrel is starting to slow down a bit though.

Initially shot them at mag length and now I’m at a single load length and obviously that has an impact so I’m gonna do a short velocity test above my current load.
I’ll know more Friday.

 

[Schw15]

Awesome. I have long action i was thinking setting bullets out way long and using h1000 with 28inch barrel and see what would happen

 

[Steel head]

 

[jzerfoss]

Well I just ordered a big pile of bullets.
In the end I went with the Berger 190’s.

Consistent, a bit cheaper and my current barrel just seems to like them.

The ATip’s BC is better but honestly I’m a bit gun shy locking myself into a Hornandy bullet at the moment.

If they were closer in price would you still pick the Berger's or would you go A-Tip?

 

[Steel head]

If they were closer in price would you still pick the Berger's or would you go A-Tip?

That’s a tough decision.
The BC on the A Tip is awfully nice.

 

[jzerfoss]

That’s a tough decision.
The BC on the A Tip is awfully nice.

Was the accuracy pretty close to equal? Based on your earlier post it looked like it.

 

[Steel head]

Was the accuracy pretty close to equal?

Yea but honestly I think the Berger might have been more consistent.
I had a few weird shots with the ATips.

 

[b6graham]

@Steel head just man up and go 28 Sherman Magnum. throw those 190s at 3300

 

[Steel head]

@Steel head just man up and go 28 Sherman Magnum. throw those 190s at 3300

Meh.
7 saum is a nice balance of economy and performance.
100-2000 yards is totally doable in my shooting area.

The extra speed ain’t gonna make it a 2500 yard cartridge where I live because spotting can be difficult with the often wet rocks and dirt.

223
260
7SAUM
and hopefully someday 37XC or something similar
All bases available to me would be covered

 

[Bangin]

Any updates?

 

[Steel head]

Any updates?

Well I opted for the Berger’s and they’ve treated me well with excellent performance out to 1.7 miles now.

 

[Bangin]

Very nice. How far off the lands do they like to be?

 

[Steel head]

Very nice. How far off the lands do they like to be?

They don’t seem to care.

 

[Chargerguy]

Have you compared the 190s to the 195s? I was surprised to see the 190 has a 0.030” longer bearing surface.

 

[Steel head]

Have you compared the 190s to the 195s? I was surprised to see the 190 has a 0.030” longer bearing surface.

I haven’t.

 

[30cal user]

N570 in 7-300wsm is nice 66 gr is 2955, 31“bbl

same rifle/bbl RL 25, 62.5 gr is 2852

190 berger, about 17 OTL, sea level and 95f

 

[Bangin]

Any updates on the atips? You ever find any recovered bullets? Wondering if they’d be a good hunting bullet? Did you ever test the 197 smk?

 

[millertime2]

190 Atips got a hit on my second shot at 1760. I’ve been really happy with these things so far except for the price!
7mm Rem Mag
Reloader 26
New Norma brass
CCI 250’s
2955 fps

 

[Bangin]

The bc of .422 holding true?

 

[Chargerguy]

190 Atips got a hit on my second shot at 1760. I’ve been really happy with these things so far except for the price!
7mm Rem Mag
Reloader 26
New Norma brass
CCI 250’s
2955 fps

Is your chamber throated for the 190, or SAAMI? What barrel length?

 

[millertime2]

I threw .422 in my Kestrel and was about .2 low which is what about 12.5” at a mile. My cold bore shot was just under the plate came up one tenth and held the same spot and got that impact.
It’s chambered for the 180 ELDM’s that’s what I mainly shoot they have been darn good just thought I would try a box of the Atips to keep for longer distances.

28”Bartlein barrel 1:8 twist

 

[Deleted member 110994]

Here's my testing from Saturday.

I think the 190LRHT, 190ATIP, and 183SMK are all very excellent bullets and viable choices. From a statistical perspective, their performance is pretty much identical at the distance I test (1284 yards on paper). My performance measurement is vertical standard deviation.

View attachment 7303492View attachment 7303493

I will likely go with the 190LRHT as it looks like a safe bet. I had good results before with the 184F-open Hybrids, but now with the 190s there is no need to point them myself. The A-TIP is a clear leader in BC, but its interesting to note that the 183 SMK is not very far behind on drops when put in front of the same powder charge. Also, on the LRHT I sorted by length and SMK was sorted by weight and length. I did not sort the ATIPs, so I may be leaving a bit on the table with them - but for their cost and marketing - I shouldn't have to sort them.

My velocity numbers are derived from BC. I found myself playing around too much with the labradar and magnetospeed to get inconsistent results - so I test on paper as the bullet tells the truth.

I had one questionable shot that went into either of the 183SMK groups, the rest of the numbers I'm fairly confident in - although I'll need to re-check my zero with each of these bullets next time I go out to confirm drops.

Target

Powder

Charge

Shots

Bullet

Dialed

Vertical Offset

Actual Drop MOA

Vertical SD

Group Size Inches

Group Size MOA

Mean Radius

DA

G7 BC

Est. Velocity

Notes

2​

H4831SC

61.5​

10​

190 LRHT

33​

-0.723​

33.723​

0.257​

13.5​

1.006​

0.309​

3200​

0.384​

2897​

3​

H1000

64.5​

10​

190 LRHT

30.5​

-1.338​

31.838​

0.238​

12.633​

0.94​

0.27​

4000​

0.384​

2954​

4​

H1000

64.5​

9​

190 ATIP

29​

-0.364​

29.364​

0.382​

16.23​

1.207​

0.405​

4200​

0.422​

2993​

5​

RE23

60.8​

9​

190 ATIP

28​

-1.253​

29.253​

0.26​

11.825​

0.88​

0.317​

3800​

0.422​

2998​

6​

RE23

60.8​

9​

183 SMK

29​

-0.773​

29.773​

0.246​

11.834​

0.88​

0.273​

4000​

0.377​

3046​

questionable shot

7​

RE23

60.8​

9​

190 LRHT

30​

-0.643​

30.643​

0.28​

13.778​

1.025​

0.261​

4000​

0.384​

3003​

8​

H1000

64.5​

10​

183 SMK

30.5​

0.034​

30.466​

0.276​

18.632​

1.386​

0.432​

3800​

0.377​

3017​

questionable shot

Averages	Vertical SD	Group Size Inches	Group Size MOA	Mean Radius
190 ATIP	0.32​	14.03​	1.04​	0.36​
190 LRHT	0.26​	13.30​	0.99​	0.28​
183 SMK	0.26​	15.23​	1.13​	0.35​

*Load data here is over max book loads for 7 SAUM, I use TBN coating and have a custom throat to allow an OAL up to 3.2 - do not attempt to use these loads, I don't take any responsibility for your reloading practices - and would you really trust a guy that shoots MOA?*

Are you on a long action? Or just single feed? Thanks

 

[calshipbuilder]

Are you on a long action? Or just single feed? Thanks

XM, 3.2 max oal

 

[Steel head]

XM, 3.2 max oal

Perfect length action for 7 saum or max with 190’s

 

[Deleted member 110994]

Now I want an XM length action...

 

[Steel head]

Is there such a thing as XM length AI type mags?

 

[jzerfoss]

Is there such a thing as XM length AI type mags?

Yes, MDT makes them

 

[Steel head]

Yes, MDT makes them

Not surprised they came out with them.

 

[jzerfoss]

Not surprised they came out with them.

Nope, not with Scott Satterlee on the team.

 

[jzerfoss]

Btw, they have 40% off blems in stock

 

[Bravo6niner]

@Steel head are you liking the 190 Berger’s still? I’ve been running 180eld’s but had a couple come apart so I’m looking at either the Berger’s or atips. Atips look to have good performance but I worry about them coming apart like the 180’s

 

[coolcobra01]

Here's my testing from Saturday.

I think the 190LRHT, 190ATIP, and 183SMK are all very excellent bullets and viable choices. From a statistical perspective, their performance is pretty much identical at the distance I test (1284 yards on paper). My performance measurement is vertical standard deviation.

View attachment 7303492View attachment 7303493

I will likely go with the 190LRHT as it looks like a safe bet. I had good results before with the 184F-open Hybrids, but now with the 190s there is no need to point them myself. The A-TIP is a clear leader in BC, but its interesting to note that the 183 SMK is not very far behind on drops when put in front of the same powder charge. Also, on the LRHT I sorted by length and SMK was sorted by weight and length. I did not sort the ATIPs, so I may be leaving a bit on the table with them - but for their cost and marketing - I shouldn't have to sort them.

My velocity numbers are derived from BC. I found myself playing around too much with the labradar and magnetospeed to get inconsistent results - so I test on paper as the bullet tells the truth.

I had one questionable shot that went into either of the 183SMK groups, the rest of the numbers I'm fairly confident in - although I'll need to re-check my zero with each of these bullets next time I go out to confirm drops.

Target

Powder

Charge

Shots

Bullet

Dialed

Vertical Offset

Actual Drop MOA

Vertical SD

Group Size Inches

Group Size MOA

Mean Radius

DA

G7 BC

Est. Velocity

Notes

2​

H4831SC

61.5​

10​

190 LRHT

33​

-0.723​

33.723​

0.257​

13.5​

1.006​

0.309​

3200​

0.384​

2897​

3​

H1000

64.5​

10​

190 LRHT

30.5​

-1.338​

31.838​

0.238​

12.633​

0.94​

0.27​

4000​

0.384​

2954​

4​

H1000

64.5​

9​

190 ATIP

29​

-0.364​

29.364​

0.382​

16.23​

1.207​

0.405​

4200​

0.422​

2993​

5​

RE23

60.8​

9​

190 ATIP

28​

-1.253​

29.253​

0.26​

11.825​

0.88​

0.317​

3800​

0.422​

2998​

6​

RE23

60.8​

9​

183 SMK

29​

-0.773​

29.773​

0.246​

11.834​

0.88​

0.273​

4000​

0.377​

3046​

questionable shot

7​

RE23

60.8​

9​

190 LRHT

30​

-0.643​

30.643​

0.28​

13.778​

1.025​

0.261​

4000​

0.384​

3003​

8​

H1000

64.5​

10​

183 SMK

30.5​

0.034​

30.466​

0.276​

18.632​

1.386​

0.432​

3800​

0.377​

3017​

questionable shot

Averages	Vertical SD	Group Size Inches	Group Size MOA	Mean Radius
190 ATIP	0.32​	14.03​	1.04​	0.36​
190 LRHT	0.26​	13.30​	0.99​	0.28​
183 SMK	0.26​	15.23​	1.13​	0.35​

*Load data here is over max book loads for 7 SAUM, I use TBN coating and have a custom throat to allow an OAL up to 3.2 - do not attempt to use these loads, I don't take any responsibility for your reloading practices - and would you really trust a guy that shoots MOA?*

 

[Steel head]

@Steel head are you liking the 190 Berger’s still? I’ve been running 180eld’s but had a couple come apart so I’m looking at either the Berger’s or atips. Atips look to have good performance but I worry about them coming apart like the 180’s

Yes, they’ve been consistent with different lots and not a single one has blown up.
I did have a few 190 a tips pop but at a much lower rate than the 180 ELD

 

[Samegawa]

Yes, they’ve been consistent with different lots and not a single one has blown up.
I did have a few 190 a tips pop but at a much lower rate than the 180 ELD

Hi, could you please tell me what barrel, twist and BC you are using? I'm plagued with bullet blow-up problems in the 7mm Practical. My plan is to go with 7mm Blaser and a Bartlein barrel 1-7.7" 5R. Got 500pc 190 A-TIP but I'm scared to have the same results as with the 180 ELD-M... Reading your posts it seems that Berger 190 LRHT is a safer bet? But the A-TIP BC is so tempting )

 

[Schw15]

Hi, could you please tell me what barrel, twist and BC you are using? I'm plagued with bullet blow-up problems in the 7mm Practical. My plan is to go with 7mm Blaser and a Bartlein barrel 1-7.7" 5R. Got 500pc 190 A-TIP but I'm scared to have the same results as with the 180 ELD-M... Reading your posts it seems that Berger 190 LRHT is a safer bet? But the A-TIP BC is so tempting )

Another good option for that practical i have a 7mm-300 win mag barrel on its way and made it around 197 smk. Had great luck with them just a heads up. I think we all had the dreaded 180 eldm blow ups!!!

 

[Steel head]

Hi, could you please tell me what barrel, twist and BC you are using? I'm plagued with bullet blow-up problems in the 7mm Practical. My plan is to go with 7mm Blaser and a Bartlein barrel 1-7.7" 5R. Got 500pc 190 A-TIP but I'm scared to have the same results as with the 180 ELD-M... Reading your posts it seems that Berger 190 LRHT is a safer bet? But the A-TIP BC is so tempting )

Brux 1-8.
I’m using the Applied ballistics CDM but the BC on the box is GTG with very minor tweaks as needed.

The Berger 190 LRHT is fantastic, and I can count on it getting to it’s destination.

If you have the horsepower the 197 looks like a good option as well.

 

[Schw15]

Brux 1-8.
I’m using the Applied ballistics CDM but the BC on the box is GTG with very minor tweaks as needed.

The Berger 190 LRHT is fantastic, and I can count on it getting to it’s destination.

If you have the horsepower the 197 looks like a good option as well.

Who did your brux 7mm saum barrel for your nucleus?

 

[Steel head]

Who did your brux 7mm saum barrel for your nucleus?

Keystone

 

[Schw15]

Keystone

Does he do shoulder or barrel nut?

 

[Steel head]

Does he do shoulder or barrel nut?

Mine are barrel nut.

Considering trying a shouldered K-P from LRI next.

 

[Schw15]

Mine are barrel nut.

Im learning those are better options than shoulder. Do you know free bore from your barrel?

 

[Steel head]

Im learning those are better options than shoulder. Do you know free bore from your barrel?

.090
Not sure on better but certainly convenient.

 

[Schw15]

.090
Not sure on better but certainly convenient.

Not to many places off more freebore. Yeah that is what i was meaning

 

[Steel head]

Not to many places off more freebore. Yeah that is what i was meaning.

Just a throating reamer away from whatever you want

 

[Schw15]

Just a throating reamer away from whatever you want

I guess i could buy one and do it myself. Not to handy lol but cant be that hard i guess

 

[Samegawa]

Brux 1-8.
I’m using the Applied ballistics CDM but the BC on the box is GTG with very minor tweaks as needed.

The Berger 190 LRHT is fantastic, and I can count on it getting to it’s destination.

If you have the horsepower the 197 looks like a good option as well.

Thank you for info, not familiar with Brux barrels. What kind of rifling are they using?
5R? something similar?
Had a lilja 1-8” that blew up the 197 SMK :-(
But hoping the Bartlein 1-7.7” 5R Will treat bullets better

 

[Schw15]

Thank you for info, not familiar with Brux barrels. What kind of rifling are they using?
5R? something similar?
Had a lilja 1-8” that blew up the 197 SMK :-(
But hoping the Bartlein 1-7.7” 5R Will treat bullets better

How fast you running the 197?

 

[Steel head]

Thank you for info, not familiar with Brux barrels. What kind of rifling are they using?
5R? something similar?
Had a lilja 1-8” that blew up the 197 SMK :-(
But hoping the Bartlein 1-7.7” 5R Will treat bullets better

Just a regular 4 groove.